Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Advocacy & Safety Cyclists should expect and demand safe accommodation on every public road, just as do all other users. Discuss your bicycle advocacy and safety concerns here.

View Poll Results: Helmet wearing habits?
I've never worn a bike helmet 178 10.66%
I used to wear a helmet, but have stopped 94 5.63%
I've always worn a helmet 648 38.80%
I didn't wear a helmet, but now do 408 24.43%
I sometimes wear a helmet depending on the conditions 342 20.48%
Voters: 1670. You may not vote on this poll

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 10-18-11, 07:45 AM   #201
mconlonx 
Nobody
 
mconlonx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Bikes:
Posts: 7,000
Quote:
Originally Posted by rando View Post
it almost boils down to a religious belief; you believe in the power of the helmet. you believe biking is so dangerous that you HAVE to wear one. those who don't believe are infidels! you must slay them! or at least insult and ridicule them.
Views on helmet use once they've got as far as this thread are mainly political in nature, rather than religious.

Only reason helmet threads don't get banished to P&R, or even better, Trollheim, is the lack of humor.
__________________
I know next to nothing. I am frequently wrong.
mconlonx is offline  
Old 10-18-11, 11:14 AM   #202
closetbiker
Senior Member
 
closetbiker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Vancouver, BC
Bikes:
Posts: 9,596
Quote:
Originally Posted by mconlonx View Post
Views on helmet use once they've got as far as this thread are mainly political in nature, rather than religious.

Only reason helmet threads don't get banished to P&R, or even better, Trollheim, is the lack of humor.
I sure few will be surprised to hear that I think the helmet issue has all to do with advocacy.

Helmet promoters paint cycling as more dangerous than it is, and when they push helmets to counter the danger they portray, they promote one of the most ineffective methods of improving safety for people riding bicycles.
closetbiker is offline  
Old 10-18-11, 11:30 AM   #203
mconlonx 
Nobody
 
mconlonx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Bikes:
Posts: 7,000
Quote:
Originally Posted by closetbiker View Post
I sure few will be surprised to hear that I think the helmet issue has all to do with advocacy.

Helmet promoters paint cycling as more dangerous than it is, and when they push helmets to counter the danger they portray, they promote one of the most ineffective methods of improving safety for people riding bicycles.
Was responding to the post regarding helmet use being belief based, i.e. religious in nature.

But your response proves both the political and humorless nature of this thread...

Are MHLs more a political or advocacy issue...?
__________________
I know next to nothing. I am frequently wrong.
mconlonx is offline  
Old 10-18-11, 11:40 AM   #204
closetbiker
Senior Member
 
closetbiker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Vancouver, BC
Bikes:
Posts: 9,596
I'd say MHL's encapsulate both issues
closetbiker is offline  
Old 10-18-11, 01:41 PM   #205
sudo bike
Bicikli Huszár
 
sudo bike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Fresno, CA
Bikes: '95 Novara Randonee
Posts: 2,116
Quote:
Originally Posted by mconlonx View Post

Are MHLs more a political or advocacy issue...?
Both. Actually, a lot of advocacy subjects are, which is why so many threads always seem to walk the line between A&S and P&R. Hard to separate the two with some issues.
sudo bike is offline  
Old 10-18-11, 02:47 PM   #206
closetbiker
Senior Member
 
closetbiker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Vancouver, BC
Bikes:
Posts: 9,596
I had to hold back a laugh once when listening to a lobbyist for our helmet law complaining of another provinces helmet law being rescinded as a result of politics.

I wonder just how he thought the law he managed to get passed, got passed?

Can I guess he thought he was above political maneuvering even as he lobbied politicians to pass his law?

I also talked to a politician who had sat on a provincial bi-partisan committe that was struck to decide if proposing a helmet law was a worth-while persuit.

The committe decided against legislation and the politician (who was in favor of such a law) was upset that consultation with the public, that showed an opposition to such a law, was given weight.

Imagine that; a politician who doesn't like or want to follow his constituents wishes. I guess he thought he knew what was good for them, even if they disagreed with them and elected him to represent their interests.

Last edited by closetbiker; 10-19-11 at 06:01 AM.
closetbiker is offline  
Old 10-19-11, 07:18 AM   #207
mconlonx 
Nobody
 
mconlonx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Bikes:
Posts: 7,000
Quote:
Originally Posted by closetbiker View Post
I'd say MHL's encapsulate both issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by sudo bike View Post
Both. Actually, a lot of advocacy subjects are, which is why so many threads always seem to walk the line between A&S and P&R. Hard to separate the two with some issues.
Bzzt, wrong.

MHLs are political in nature, only. Nothing to do with advocacy.

Want me to show you studies of how MHLs decrease ridership...? Since this is the case, MHLs are hardly advocacy; if anything, they are anti-advocacy.

Trick question.

Haha.
__________________
I know next to nothing. I am frequently wrong.
mconlonx is offline  
Old 10-19-11, 07:38 AM   #208
closetbiker
Senior Member
 
closetbiker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Vancouver, BC
Bikes:
Posts: 9,596
Quote:
Originally Posted by mconlonx View Post
Bzzt, wrong.

MHLs are political in nature, only. Nothing to do with advocacy.

Want me to show you studies of how MHLs decrease ridership...? Since this is the case, MHLs are hardly advocacy; if anything, they are anti-advocacy.

Trick question.

Haha.
of course that's your perspective.

others say,

Advocacy is a political process

Last edited by closetbiker; 10-19-11 at 03:12 PM.
closetbiker is offline  
Old 10-19-11, 06:15 PM   #209
sudo bike
Bicikli Huszár
 
sudo bike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Fresno, CA
Bikes: '95 Novara Randonee
Posts: 2,116
Quote:
Originally Posted by mconlonx View Post
Bzzt, wrong.

MHLs are political in nature, only. Nothing to do with advocacy.

Want me to show you studies of how MHLs decrease ridership...? Since this is the case, MHLs are hardly advocacy; if anything, they are anti-advocacy.

Trick question.

Haha.
Pish-tosh. They are obviously an advocacy issue. The study I posted previously showed that there was a marked decrease in ridership with the implementation of the MHL. That alone makes it an advocacy issue.
sudo bike is offline  
Old 10-21-11, 07:21 AM   #210
rydabent
Senior Member
 
rydabent's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Lincoln Ne
Bikes: RANS Stratus TerraTrike Cruiser
Posts: 5,528
I see this thread is rapidly climbing due to the anti helmet trolls. Why they think it is their duty to talk people out of wearing helmets is beyond me.

I still maintain there are two reasons to wear a helmet. One as with most sports there is safety equiptment, and for cycling a helmet is one of ours. Second, do to lawyers and courts, if a cyclist is not wearing a helmet, they will blame the cyclist even tho he is run down from behind.
rydabent is offline  
Old 10-21-11, 07:58 AM   #211
chasm54
Banned.
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Uncertain
Bikes:
Posts: 8,657
Quote:
Originally Posted by rydabent View Post

I still maintain there are two reasons to wear a helmet. One as with most sports there is safety equiptment, and for cycling a helmet is one of ours.
When riding to the shops, or to visit a friend, or on tour I am not engaging in a sporting activity.

Quote:
Second, do to lawyers and courts, if a cyclist is not wearing a helmet, they will blame the cyclist even tho he is run down from behind.
This is very unlikely in this country. At worst, it might have an impact on the damages awarded to the cyclist if the judge is persuaded that a helmet would have limited the injuries. So far, medical experts here have been very reluctant to testify that a helmet would have made a significant difference in any specific case.
chasm54 is offline  
Old 10-21-11, 08:37 AM   #212
closetbiker
Senior Member
 
closetbiker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Vancouver, BC
Bikes:
Posts: 9,596
Quote:
Originally Posted by chasm54 View Post
... it might have an impact on the damages awarded to the cyclist if the judge is persuaded that a helmet would have limited the injuries. So far, medical experts here have been very reluctant to testify that a helmet would have made a significant difference in any specific case.
Although there have been motions made to reduce or deny damages as a result of a cyclist not wearing a helmet, none have been successful. The reason of course is the protection a helmet can provide is minor in nature, the type of injury that wouldn't qualify for compensation (and if anyone knows of a case that differs, link it)
closetbiker is offline  
Old 10-21-11, 10:43 AM   #213
mconlonx 
Nobody
 
mconlonx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Bikes:
Posts: 7,000
Quote:
Originally Posted by sudo bike View Post
Pish-tosh. They are obviously an advocacy issue. The study I posted previously showed that there was a marked decrease in ridership with the implementation of the MHL. That alone makes it an advocacy issue.
You'd advocate for something that decreases ridership...? I dunno, I guess I just assumed that on this particular forum, advocacy is assumed to mean pro-bike political stance...
__________________
I know next to nothing. I am frequently wrong.
mconlonx is offline  
Old 10-21-11, 03:34 PM   #214
hagen2456
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Copenhagen
Bikes: A load of ancient, old and semi-vintage bikes of divers sorts
Posts: 1,827
Quote:
Originally Posted by rydabent View Post
I see this thread is rapidly climbing due to the anti helmet trolls. Why they think it is their duty to talk people out of wearing helmets is beyond me.
"Anti helmet trolls". Right. Pointing out that the benefit of wearing a helmet is doubtfull makes one a troll. Or is it pointing out that the helmet wearing campaigns make cycling seem dangerous that makes one a troll?
hagen2456 is offline  
Old 10-21-11, 04:09 PM   #215
ZmanKC
Senior Member
 
ZmanKC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Overland Park, KS
Bikes: 1999 Giant TCR 2T 2009 Giant Cypress DX 2015 Giant Anyroad 1
Posts: 775
Quote:
Originally Posted by closetbiker View Post
Although there have been motions made to reduce or deny damages as a result of a cyclist not wearing a helmet, none have been successful. The reason of course is the protection a helmet can provide is minor in nature, the type of injury that wouldn't qualify for compensation (and if anyone knows of a case that differs, link it)
Why link when you can make things up?
ZmanKC is offline  
Old 10-21-11, 05:48 PM   #216
Hippiebrian
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Long Beach, Ca.
Bikes: Raleigh Sojourn, '67 Raleigh Super Course, old Gary Fisher Mamba, and a generic Chinese folder
Posts: 576
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZmanKC View Post
Why link when you can make things up?
When there have been no cases, there can be no links. The statement is not made up, but you cannot supply a link for something that didn't happen. If you can provide a link where an award was removed or reduced due to a cyclist not wearing a helmet, please post it. However, if you cannot find one, I guess you could say that this wasn't made up...
Hippiebrian is offline  
Old 10-22-11, 01:21 AM   #217
sudo bike
Bicikli Huszár
 
sudo bike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Fresno, CA
Bikes: '95 Novara Randonee
Posts: 2,116
Quote:
Originally Posted by rydabent View Post
I still maintain there are two reasons to wear a helmet. One as with most sports there is safety equiptment, and for cycling a helmet is one of ours. Second, do to lawyers and courts, if a cyclist is not wearing a helmet, they will blame the cyclist even tho he is run down from behind.
The former isn't really valid. On my old steel bike, I'm no more engaging in a sport than my Dad driving his jalopy down to the store is engaging in NASCAR. One wears a helmet, the other doesn't.

Second, that's your assessment and your choice. Go for it. That doesn't mean everyone else will choose the same thing, that's the point. Based on the lack of this having been an issue in the past, I'm not too concerned.
sudo bike is offline  
Old 10-22-11, 01:32 AM   #218
sudo bike
Bicikli Huszár
 
sudo bike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Fresno, CA
Bikes: '95 Novara Randonee
Posts: 2,116
Quote:
Originally Posted by mconlonx View Post
You'd advocate for something that decreases ridership...? I dunno, I guess I just assumed that on this particular forum, advocacy is assumed to mean pro-bike political stance...
No? You asked how MHL's are an advocacy issue. I cited a study that shows they decrease ridership. Because they are an advocacy issue doesn't mean it's something I advocate for; I advocate against them... thus making them an issue.

Regardless of if you are for or against them, they are still an issue of advocacy since having a pro or con stance seems to directly effect ridership. Therefore speaking out against MHL's are an advocacy issue. QED.

Last edited by sudo bike; 10-22-11 at 01:37 AM.
sudo bike is offline  
Old 10-22-11, 01:54 AM   #219
LesterOfPuppets
cowboy, steel horse, etc
 
LesterOfPuppets's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Rock Springs, WY
Bikes: My War
Posts: 26,361
I voted Used to but stopped. Even though I still put one on for races and when I go out to hit some sweet jumps and when I go riding high speed on snow and ice. So I guess my perfect answer is I used to for every single bike ride but now only do so for certain ones. Hmmm, from about 1974-1987 I never wore a helmet either. So my perfect answer was I started out never wearing one, then wore one for every single bike ride for about 10 years and now only wear one for special occasions.

Sorry haven't read the rest of the thread, I'll do so now, though.

Oh, I did get a "You need a helmet!" from a passing cyclist a couple of weeks ago. Pretty darn funny. I was chuckling inside but kept a straight face and said "I don't think I do." I should have added "You need elbow pads!"

Dude must have put the hammer down to catch me because I kept my same average speed up this long grind of a hill and passed him about a half mile later.

Last edited by LesterOfPuppets; 10-22-11 at 02:00 AM.
LesterOfPuppets is offline  
Old 10-22-11, 05:29 AM   #220
The Chemist
Senior Member
 
The Chemist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Shanghai, China
Bikes: Giant FCR3500
Posts: 503
As far as I'm concerned, a helmet isn't uncomfortable, is simple to use, and the potential benefits of wearing one, in my view, outweigh the potential downsides by a fair margin. That's good enough reason for me to wear a helmet. Others may make a different judgement, but that's mine.
The Chemist is offline  
Old 10-22-11, 05:45 AM   #221
LesterOfPuppets
cowboy, steel horse, etc
 
LesterOfPuppets's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Rock Springs, WY
Bikes: My War
Posts: 26,361
Have you ever pulled a "You need a helmet!" ?
LesterOfPuppets is offline  
Old 10-22-11, 06:22 AM   #222
rydabent
Senior Member
 
rydabent's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Lincoln Ne
Bikes: RANS Stratus TerraTrike Cruiser
Posts: 5,528
the chemist +1

You posted my point exactly. There is virtually no down side of wearing a helmet.
rydabent is offline  
Old 10-22-11, 07:05 AM   #223
LesterOfPuppets
cowboy, steel horse, etc
 
LesterOfPuppets's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Rock Springs, WY
Bikes: My War
Posts: 26,361
Styrofoam helmet. Bad for the environment. (to paraphrase Randy Quaid in Freaked)

When I wore one for every single ride I'd need a new one every year or two. Now that it's a special occasion item I've had the same one since 2000.
LesterOfPuppets is offline  
Old 10-22-11, 07:51 AM   #224
chipcom 
Infamous Member
 
chipcom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Ohio
Bikes: Surly Big Dummy, Fuji World, 80ish Bianchi
Posts: 24,366
Quote:
Originally Posted by rydabent View Post
the chemist +1

You posted my point exactly. There is virtually no down side of wearing a helmet.
There is virtually no down side to wearing one at the dinner table, walking, running, etc. either...so I don't see how the point is relevant to anything other than as a "duh" moment.
__________________
"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey
chipcom is offline  
Old 10-22-11, 07:56 AM   #225
RazrSkutr
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Bikes:
Posts: 922
Quote:
Originally Posted by LesterOfPuppets View Post
Have you ever pulled a "You need a helmet!" ?
Yes, from someone wearing one backwards.

Oh.... nearly forgot ... and also from a cop in Nova Scotia shortly after they brought in their mandatory helmet law.

And also from some dicks driving a beat-up old car belching smoke.

And from friends.

And from ride-organizers.

And from family.

Last edited by RazrSkutr; 10-22-11 at 08:00 AM. Reason: add a few more of the instances
RazrSkutr is offline  
Closed Thread


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:47 AM.