Double file riding...
03-10-12, 07:59 PM
#301
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sharing a lane is up to the passee; positioning yourself and your group only as far to the right as safe could be a foot or two feet or four feet from the edge of the road depending on road and surface conditions.if the lane is wide, riding to the right safely can sometimes allow passing entirely within the lane; in a 13 foot wide lane perhaps the passee may have to partially cross the lane line to pass.
NOT sharing the lane is cyclists operating doubled up full in a lane and unnecessarily impeding passing.
If john thinks sharing the lane means riders have to ride to the 'far right' I suggest some remedial bike safety courses.
As I've said more than once, most of the roads that I ride on have lanes that are too narrow to safely share, and riding your recommended 1', 2' or 4' from the right edge of the road would put one either in the middle of the lane or over in left had side tire track.
03-10-12, 09:14 PM
#302
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you're talking about group riding, right? double file, right?
partial lane changes to pass bicyclists are legal in your state.
somehow, the absolutist nature of digital cowboy's responses lacks a certain element of road courtesy that is easy for groups of riders to exercise safely.
excerpted from the florida bicycle associations advice for riding single file versus two abreast
I used to live in pensacola and tallahassee, when me and my friends would ride together we had none of the problems with road sharing that curse other members of the forum seem cursed by.
partial lane changes to pass bicyclists are legal in your state.
somehow, the absolutist nature of digital cowboy's responses lacks a certain element of road courtesy that is easy for groups of riders to exercise safely.
excerpted from the florida bicycle associations advice for riding single file versus two abreast
Originally Posted by FBA
By Florida law, bicyclists may ride two abreast unless impeding traffic. State law is difficult to interpret, and left to the law officer’s discretion as to what impeding traffic means. It is also unclear as to whether a rider may pass two riders abreast, although logic would dictate that this practice is legal.
While on a two lane road with wide lanes, if continual oncoming traffic prevents motorists from easily passing, ride in single file or consider splitting the pack into smaller groups. On a two lane road with narrow lanes, be aware that unsafe passing by motorists can happen frequently when riding single file. Depending on the lane width, ride far enough from the right edge of the road to be visible, to have adequate maneuvering space, to avoid surface hazards, and to discourage overtaking motorists from attempting unsafe passes.
Riding single allows better maneuverability around surface hazards. On roads with bad pavement or poor sight-lines it is sometime safer to remain single file.
Riding to the Right
With exceptions (e.g., to make a left turn or to avoid hazards), Florida law requires bicyclists to ride to the right when going slower than other traffic.
While on a two lane road with wide lanes, if continual oncoming traffic prevents motorists from easily passing, ride in single file or consider splitting the pack into smaller groups. On a two lane road with narrow lanes, be aware that unsafe passing by motorists can happen frequently when riding single file. Depending on the lane width, ride far enough from the right edge of the road to be visible, to have adequate maneuvering space, to avoid surface hazards, and to discourage overtaking motorists from attempting unsafe passes.
Riding single allows better maneuverability around surface hazards. On roads with bad pavement or poor sight-lines it is sometime safer to remain single file.
Riding to the Right
With exceptions (e.g., to make a left turn or to avoid hazards), Florida law requires bicyclists to ride to the right when going slower than other traffic.
I used to live in pensacola and tallahassee, when me and my friends would ride together we had none of the problems with road sharing that curse other members of the forum seem cursed by.
03-10-12, 09:27 PM
#303
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you're talking about group riding, right? double file, right?
partial lane changes to pass bicyclists are legal in your state.
somehow, the absolutist nature of digital cowboy's responses lacks a certain element of road courtesy that is easy for groups of riders to exercise safely.
excerpted from the florida bicycle associations advice for riding single file versus two abreast
I used to live in pensacola and tallahassee, when me and my friends would ride together we had none of the problems with road sharing that curse other members of the forum seem cursed by.
partial lane changes to pass bicyclists are legal in your state.
somehow, the absolutist nature of digital cowboy's responses lacks a certain element of road courtesy that is easy for groups of riders to exercise safely.
excerpted from the florida bicycle associations advice for riding single file versus two abreast
I used to live in pensacola and tallahassee, when me and my friends would ride together we had none of the problems with road sharing that curse other members of the forum seem cursed by.
a) riding/skating on a road with a substandard width lane
b) riding/skating pretty much single file
Because we were stretched out over such a long stretch of road the motorist was NOT able to safely pass us. It had nothing to do with whether or not we were riding/skating two-abreast. We were a large enough of a group that no matter how we riding/skating that there wasn't any way for the motorist in question to have safely pass us before encountering another motorist in the oncoming lane.
03-10-12, 09:29 PM
#304
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real large group, eh?
Florida bicycle association recommends in that case considering splitting the group up.
in lineskaters and bicyclists, eh? what was it, critical mass?
Florida is one of the twenty one states that riding two abreast is illegal if it impedes traffic.
can't simply follow ONE traffic rule ( substandard width lanes prevent lane sharing), must follow the entirety of traffic law, and be courteous to others with the standard duty of care.
recall how club riders begat florida's mandatory bikelane law. you should be thankful you don't live in Virginia.
to the rest of the folks continuing to read this thread, operating two abreast is a nuanced traffic skill, legal without restriction in some states, and regulated in many. Despite the legal requirements, operating safely single file when traffic behind you is impeded can go a long way fomenting good will on the roads.
moving to single file when safe to do so is a courtesy cyclists ought to consider, regardless of state or statute. Whats the frequently played out alternative, in every state? Honks and aggressive passing.
Safely moving single file to allow traffic to pass isn't a sign of 'inferiority,' it's a sign of maturity and mutual road respect. Show some maturity and respect out on the roads, your group is likely to get some respect in return.
on the contrary, Flipping motorists the virtual bird while exercising your 'right' to ride two abreast when operating single file momentarily doesn't endanger your group while mitigating perceived impeding passing won't get you or fellow riders the same good will down the road, so to speak, as mature road sharing will.
Florida bicycle association recommends in that case considering splitting the group up.
in lineskaters and bicyclists, eh? what was it, critical mass?
Florida is one of the twenty one states that riding two abreast is illegal if it impedes traffic.
can't simply follow ONE traffic rule ( substandard width lanes prevent lane sharing), must follow the entirety of traffic law, and be courteous to others with the standard duty of care.
recall how club riders begat florida's mandatory bikelane law. you should be thankful you don't live in Virginia.
to the rest of the folks continuing to read this thread, operating two abreast is a nuanced traffic skill, legal without restriction in some states, and regulated in many. Despite the legal requirements, operating safely single file when traffic behind you is impeded can go a long way fomenting good will on the roads.
moving to single file when safe to do so is a courtesy cyclists ought to consider, regardless of state or statute. Whats the frequently played out alternative, in every state? Honks and aggressive passing.
Safely moving single file to allow traffic to pass isn't a sign of 'inferiority,' it's a sign of maturity and mutual road respect. Show some maturity and respect out on the roads, your group is likely to get some respect in return.
on the contrary, Flipping motorists the virtual bird while exercising your 'right' to ride two abreast when operating single file momentarily doesn't endanger your group while mitigating perceived impeding passing won't get you or fellow riders the same good will down the road, so to speak, as mature road sharing will.
Last edited by Bekologist; 03-10-12 at 10:36 PM.
03-11-12, 02:53 AM
#305
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real large group, eh?
Florida bicycle association recommends in that case considering splitting the group up.
in lineskaters and bicyclists, eh? what was it, critical mass?
Florida is one of the twenty one states that riding two abreast is illegal if it impedes traffic.
can't simply follow ONE traffic rule ( substandard width lanes prevent lane sharing), must follow the entirety of traffic law, and be courteous to others with the standard duty of care.
recall how club riders begat florida's mandatory bikelane law. you should be thankful you don't live in Virginia.
to the rest of the folks continuing to read this thread, operating two abreast is a nuanced traffic skill, legal without restriction in some states, and regulated in many. Despite the legal requirements, operating safely single file when traffic behind you is impeded can go a long way fomenting good will on the roads.
moving to single file when safe to do so is a courtesy cyclists ought to consider, regardless of state or statute. Whats the frequently played out alternative, in every state? Honks and aggressive passing.
Safely moving single file to allow traffic to pass isn't a sign of 'inferiority,' it's a sign of maturity and mutual road respect. Show some maturity and respect out on the roads, your group is likely to get some respect in return.
on the contrary, Flipping motorists the virtual bird while exercising your 'right' to ride two abreast when operating single file momentarily doesn't endanger your group while mitigating perceived impeding passing won't get you or fellow riders the same good will down the road, so to speak, as mature road sharing will.
Florida bicycle association recommends in that case considering splitting the group up.
in lineskaters and bicyclists, eh? what was it, critical mass?
Florida is one of the twenty one states that riding two abreast is illegal if it impedes traffic.
can't simply follow ONE traffic rule ( substandard width lanes prevent lane sharing), must follow the entirety of traffic law, and be courteous to others with the standard duty of care.
recall how club riders begat florida's mandatory bikelane law. you should be thankful you don't live in Virginia.
to the rest of the folks continuing to read this thread, operating two abreast is a nuanced traffic skill, legal without restriction in some states, and regulated in many. Despite the legal requirements, operating safely single file when traffic behind you is impeded can go a long way fomenting good will on the roads.
moving to single file when safe to do so is a courtesy cyclists ought to consider, regardless of state or statute. Whats the frequently played out alternative, in every state? Honks and aggressive passing.
Safely moving single file to allow traffic to pass isn't a sign of 'inferiority,' it's a sign of maturity and mutual road respect. Show some maturity and respect out on the roads, your group is likely to get some respect in return.
on the contrary, Flipping motorists the virtual bird while exercising your 'right' to ride two abreast when operating single file momentarily doesn't endanger your group while mitigating perceived impeding passing won't get you or fellow riders the same good will down the road, so to speak, as mature road sharing will.
Some of the skaters were two-abreast, but I would be willing to bet that even you realize that skaters skating two-abreast take up even less room than do cyclists riding two-abreast.
My road position was slightly left of the right hand tire track, and there wasn't anyone to my right. Neither cyclist nor skater. There is one thing about this road that I failed to mention earlier, at random places there are small/short medians, usually located not too far from an intersection. And we'd passed at least one with said car (and other cars in the past) behind us. And thanks to said medians it is impossible for one car to pass another car let alone an cyclist or skater.
To hopefully make the record clear, this is a road that when I am riding by myself I ALWAYS take the lane because it is TOO narrow to safely share the lane.
But you keep on reading things the way that you want to read them instead of how they're actually written, and make your snap judgements about what the person did that was "wrong."
As for your interpertation of F.S. 316.2065 Subsection 6, this is what it actually says:
Originally Posted by F.S. 316.2065
(6) Persons riding bicycles upon a roadway may not ride more than two abreast except on paths or parts of roadways set aside for the exclusive use of bicycles. Persons riding two abreast may not impede traffic when traveling at less than the normal speed of traffic at the time and place and under the conditions then existing and shall ride within a single lane.
Which is the same language from subsection 5 the roadway position, and most people I know interpret that to mean that if the cyclist(s) are the only traffic on a given road that they're the one(s) setting the speed of the traffic at the time and place and under the conditions then existing. And it is pretty much accepted that if there are more bicycles than cars present that again they're the one's who are setting the speed of the traffic present, etc.
Just as when there are more cars present than bicycles that they're the one's who are setting the speed of traffic present, etc.
Likewise, most of us all agree that when we're riding and we see that there is another vehicle approaching from behind and that if we can do so safely that we'll move over as far to the right as is needed without compromising our safety.
Now granted sadly there are always going to be those who will take the position that they don't have to move over for anyone and they're the one's who need to be educated or re-educated the most.
And before you tell me that I'm interpreting the law I have spoken with a couple of lawyers who specialize in traffic law and they agreed with my interpretation. With one recommending that I ride close to the white line to facilitate moving back into the bike lane as needed.
Last edited by Digital_Cowboy; 03-11-12 at 03:03 AM.
03-11-12, 08:07 AM
#306
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yawn.
the rules for riding two abreast vary by state. groups of riders vary, road speeds vary, oncoming traffic varies.....
insisting in every 'substandard width' lane a cyclist or group of cyclist should take the entire lane is a vast oversimplification of a nuanced traffic skill, road use in the midst of other traffic
Last edited by Bekologist; 03-11-12 at 08:10 AM.
03-11-12, 08:41 AM
#307
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.......Which is the same language from subsection 5 the roadway position, and most people I know interpret that to mean that if the cyclist(s) are the only traffic on a given road that they're the one(s) setting the speed of the traffic at the time and place and under the conditions then existing. And it is pretty much accepted that if there are more bicycles than cars present that again they're the one's who are setting the speed of the traffic present, etc.
Just as when there are more cars present than bicycles that they're the one's who are setting the speed of traffic present, etc........
Just as when there are more cars present than bicycles that they're the one's who are setting the speed of traffic present, etc........
So you are saying that the posted speed limits, and weather and road conditions do not set the acceptable speed of traffic on a road, but that that speed is set by which type of vehicle is the represented majority, and that vehicles with a minority representation must then comply with whatever that speed limitation may be?
You funny!!!!!
03-11-12, 08:41 AM
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Safely moving single file to allow traffic to pass isn't a sign of 'inferiority,' it's a sign of maturity and mutual road respect.
I feel the EXACT same way... (especially with a single rider)
In my opinion, most feel as if their "giving in", by "allowing" other drivers the ability to pass more safely for the "overtakers"...
Don't even get me started on how most cyclists I see, think the rules of the road (ALL of the rules), should only apply to everyone ELSE.. LOL
And I agree that there is a "gray" area about the "normal flow of traffic"..
If there are 30 of you and 5 cars, the 30 are the normal flow of traffic....
If there are 5 of you and 30 cars, I would think the opposite would hold true...
However, I also think, it's a matter of the "time and place"...
If you're on a 25mph road and there's 2 of you and 2 cars and you're doing 20mph, I don't see the problem as you are the normal flow of traffic (within 5 mph of TOP speed limit). I am usually in the entire lane in that situation, as every week I go to a place where there is a 3 mile stretch of a 25mph road..
However, if it's a 50mph road and there is 2 of you and 40 cars, you are NOT the normal flow of traffic...
Common sense prevails..
Any discussion to the contrary is, in my opinion, just silly...
P.S. I don't know about the rest of Florida, but skating of any kind on the roadway, is illegal here in South Florida... (I think even in the bicycle lanes, but I'm not sure. I'm sure I'll be corrected, if I'm wrong..
)
Last edited by Sangesf; 03-11-12 at 08:50 AM. Reason: Added "P.S."
03-11-12, 11:20 AM
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sharing a lane is up to the passee; positioning yourself and your group only as far to the right as safe could be a foot or two feet or four feet from the edge of the road depending on road and surface conditions.if the lane is wide, riding to the right safely can sometimes allow passing entirely within the lane; in a 13 foot wide lane perhaps the passee may have to partially cross the lane line to pass.
NOT sharing the lane is cyclists operating doubled up full in a lane and unnecessarily impeding passing.
If john thinks sharing the lane means riders have to ride to the 'far right' I suggest some remedial bike safety courses.
Bek's argument is that cycling in double file "unnecessarily impede[s] passing." Overtaking would be impeded only if the lane were wide, so that singling up would allow overtaking within the same lane. This is a rare condition that must not be the basis of a general argument. In the general case of lanes that are not wide, single file and double file cycling have exactly the same effect on the opportunities for safe overtaking, which are controlled by the traffic in the adjacent lane and not by the lateral position of the cyclists.
03-11-12, 11:35 AM
#310
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...john conveniently overlooks partial lane changes to pass, legal in most if not all states and commonplace in all. oncoming traffic does play a part in when and where to ride doubled up versus single file, as do individual state's laws.
to quote a fella I know quite involved in bike education, "it depends"
to quote a fella I know quite involved in bike education, "it depends"
03-11-12, 03:21 PM
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Okay, over 300 posts in and we still have a pissing contest between Bek and John. Here's a fun game: Each of you list the points on which you agree. It looks like there is quite a lot of agreement beneath all the smoke, like if the lane is wide enough to be safely passed within the lane when singled up, then cyclists should single up and move to a position that permits such passing. Also, in states that restrict double-file riding, cyclists are obliged, rightly or wrongly from an engineering standpoint, to be single-file.
Come on, gentlemen. Let's see where you can agree. After that, please continue pissing.
Come on, gentlemen. Let's see where you can agree. After that, please continue pissing.
03-11-12, 03:30 PM
#312
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naw, some of the posters seem more interested in being disagreeable to sensible bicycling advice than finding common ground about road bicycling.
the inferiority complex don'tchaknow?
the inferiority complex don'tchaknow?
03-11-12, 06:52 PM
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...john conveniently overlooks partial lane changes to pass, legal in most if not all states and commonplace in all. oncoming traffic does play a part in when and where to ride doubled up versus single file, as do individual state's laws.
to quote a fella I know quite involved in bike education, "it depends"
to quote a fella I know quite involved in bike education, "it depends"
Bek argues the way he does because he desires to support the motorists' superstition that cyclist's far right lateral position creates more opportunities for overtaking than does using the lane in normal manner for drivers. That is, supports the motorists' view that motorists are more important than cyclists.
03-11-12, 07:17 PM
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i do not support motorists 'superstitions' about a 'far right lateral positon' by cyclists as i do not suggest riding to the far right. what a crock of artifice.
far right is what john repeatedly suggests.
with suggestions that cyclists should at times ride far right, john is supporting cyclist inferiority and motorist superiority?
I guess we disagree about how to ride in the presence of faster traffic, john suggests to the far right, i suggest a lateral position only as far to the right as is safe, which includes the entirety of a lane when merited by the cyclists. even as a group. sometimes single file is courteous, safe and mature behavior by groups of cyclists, yet well in the lane, still allowing motorists to pass partially in the lane or straddling the lane and not forcing full lane changes to pass riders operating single file.
The nuance involved in double file riding are that different states regulate riding doubled up differently, yet riders should always ride safe and choose lateral lane positions that are safe and allow for passing if passing is unduly impeded, out of courtesy, not inferiority.
some states prohibit riding doubled up, many states regulate riders single file if traffic is otherwise impeded.
British Columbia, for example, prohibits riding double file. there's no discussion of when to ride doubled up in BC as it is against the law. yet riders can still choose safe lane positions for their safety in BC. NEVER 'far right' for the convenience of superior motorists.
far right is what john repeatedly suggests.
with suggestions that cyclists should at times ride far right, john is supporting cyclist inferiority and motorist superiority?
Originally Posted by john forester
.... cyclists should stay far right when that enables a new opportunity for safe overtaking....
The nuance involved in double file riding are that different states regulate riding doubled up differently, yet riders should always ride safe and choose lateral lane positions that are safe and allow for passing if passing is unduly impeded, out of courtesy, not inferiority.
some states prohibit riding doubled up, many states regulate riders single file if traffic is otherwise impeded.
British Columbia, for example, prohibits riding double file. there's no discussion of when to ride doubled up in BC as it is against the law. yet riders can still choose safe lane positions for their safety in BC. NEVER 'far right'
for the convenience of superior motorists.
Last edited by Bekologist; 03-11-12 at 07:25 PM.
03-11-12, 08:32 PM
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IF.. one could total the score for all bike 
riders... compare that to score of ALL motor vehicle drivers...
for COURTESY.. COMMON SENSE.. SAFETY and realizing the road belongs to ALL..
The motorists would win that one by miles... many many MILES.
By MILES. Even skimming this thread one can see so many helmets inserted where the SUN NEVER SHINES>
riders... compare that to score of ALL motor vehicle drivers... for COURTESY.. COMMON SENSE.. SAFETY and realizing the road belongs to ALL..
The motorists would win that one by miles... many many MILES.
By MILES. Even skimming this thread one can see so many helmets inserted where the SUN NEVER SHINES>
03-11-12, 10:05 PM
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i do not support motorists 'superstitions' about a 'far right lateral positon' by cyclists as i do not suggest riding to the far right. what a crock of artifice.
far right is what john repeatedly suggests.
with suggestions that cyclists should at times ride far right, john is supporting cyclist inferiority and motorist superiority?
I guess we disagree about how to ride in the presence of faster traffic, john suggests to the far right, i suggest a lateral position only as far to the right as is safe, which includes the entirety of a lane when merited by the cyclists. even as a group. sometimes single file is courteous, safe and mature behavior by groups of cyclists, yet well in the lane, still allowing motorists to pass partially in the lane or straddling the lane and not forcing full lane changes to pass riders operating single file.
The nuance involved in double file riding are that different states regulate riding doubled up differently, yet riders should always ride safe and choose lateral lane positions that are safe and allow for passing if passing is unduly impeded, out of courtesy, not inferiority.
some states prohibit riding doubled up, many states regulate riders single file if traffic is otherwise impeded.
British Columbia, for example, prohibits riding double file. there's no discussion of when to ride doubled up in BC as it is against the law. yet riders can still choose safe lane positions for their safety in BC. NEVER 'far right' for the convenience of superior motorists.
far right is what john repeatedly suggests.
with suggestions that cyclists should at times ride far right, john is supporting cyclist inferiority and motorist superiority?
I guess we disagree about how to ride in the presence of faster traffic, john suggests to the far right, i suggest a lateral position only as far to the right as is safe, which includes the entirety of a lane when merited by the cyclists. even as a group. sometimes single file is courteous, safe and mature behavior by groups of cyclists, yet well in the lane, still allowing motorists to pass partially in the lane or straddling the lane and not forcing full lane changes to pass riders operating single file.
The nuance involved in double file riding are that different states regulate riding doubled up differently, yet riders should always ride safe and choose lateral lane positions that are safe and allow for passing if passing is unduly impeded, out of courtesy, not inferiority.
some states prohibit riding doubled up, many states regulate riders single file if traffic is otherwise impeded.
British Columbia, for example, prohibits riding double file. there's no discussion of when to ride doubled up in BC as it is against the law. yet riders can still choose safe lane positions for their safety in BC. NEVER 'far right'
for the convenience of superior motorists. for the convenience of superior motorists." That means that Bek rules out the use of wide lanes to facilitate motorist overtaking, which can happen only when the lane is wide and the cyclist is far right. By stating that condition, I never recommend that the cyclist ride far right in a typical lane, because that won't facilitate overtaking, and in no case should the cyclist ride further to the right than is safe. Bek's argument that that is my recommendation is false. Therefore, all of the motorist overtaking movements that Bek allows must be made by using the adjacent lane, which cannot be safely and lawfully done unless that lane is clear of traffic. The condition of traffic in that lane is what controls the motorist's overtaking opportunities; the lateral position of the cyclist is irrelevant.
Since the motorist cannot overtake unless he has a full clear lane in which to do it, he might just as well use all of that lane as use only a part of it. Bek's entire argument is advocacy of straddle overtaking instead of full lane overtaking, and to accomplish this he has to denounce double-file cycling.
03-11-12, 10:15 PM
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Bek now argues that cyclists should ride: "NEVER 'far right' for the convenience of superior motorists." That means that Bek rules out the use of wide lanes to facilitate motorist overtaking, which can happen only when the lane is wide and the cyclist is far right. By stating that condition, I never recommend that the cyclist ride far right in a typical lane, because that won't facilitate overtaking, and in no case should the cyclist ride further to the right than is safe. Bek's argument that that is my recommendation is false.
Therefore, all of the motorist overtaking movements that Bek allows must be made by using the adjacent lane, which cannot be safely and lawfully done unless that lane is clear of traffic. The condition of traffic in that lane is what controls the motorist's overtaking opportunities; the lateral position of the cyclist is irrelevant.
Since the motorist cannot overtake unless he has a full clear lane in which to do it, he might just as well use all of that lane as use only a part of it. Bek's entire argument is advocacy of straddle overtaking instead of full lane overtaking, and to accomplish this he has to denounce double-file cycling.
for the convenience of superior motorists." That means that Bek rules out the use of wide lanes to facilitate motorist overtaking, which can happen only when the lane is wide and the cyclist is far right. By stating that condition, I never recommend that the cyclist ride far right in a typical lane, because that won't facilitate overtaking, and in no case should the cyclist ride further to the right than is safe. Bek's argument that that is my recommendation is false. Therefore, all of the motorist overtaking movements that Bek allows must be made by using the adjacent lane, which cannot be safely and lawfully done unless that lane is clear of traffic. The condition of traffic in that lane is what controls the motorist's overtaking opportunities; the lateral position of the cyclist is irrelevant.
Since the motorist cannot overtake unless he has a full clear lane in which to do it, he might just as well use all of that lane as use only a part of it. Bek's entire argument is advocacy of straddle overtaking instead of full lane overtaking, and to accomplish this he has to denounce double-file cycling.
03-12-12, 05:28 AM
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john's glib insistence motorists 'might just as well use the full lane for passing' does not alleviate bicyclists from riding safely right when required, riding single file or allowing partial lane changes to pass.
learn the laws where you live and consider riding single file as a group when it will facilitate passing and riding double file unduly delays motorists. this is the law in many states,
moving to single file when safe to do so is a sign of considerate road use and a sign of maturity, not foresterian inferiority complex when riding in a group.
learn the laws where you live and consider riding single file as a group when it will facilitate passing and riding double file unduly delays motorists. this is the law in many states,
moving to single file when safe to do so is a sign of considerate road use and a sign of maturity, not foresterian inferiority complex when riding in a group.
Last edited by Bekologist; 03-12-12 at 09:10 AM.
03-12-12, 09:09 AM
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what?video of 'pros' riding on the shoulder of the PCH (with a chase car) and not preventing passing via partial lane changes is hardly germane to the discussion of when operating double file impedes passing.
your video does show considerate, mature group bicycling however.
03-12-12, 12:19 PM
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Between 10 - 20 people this particular night, the number of members present varies week-to-week/ride-to-ride. When we meet to ride we have not only scheduled rest brakes, but places where we regroup as we tend to brake up into various groups to chit-chat while skating/riding. And again, I'm guessing that you had somehow missed that this is a road with SUBSTANDARD width lanes for each direction of travel.
Which is the same language from subsection 5 the roadway position, and most people I know interpret that to mean that if the cyclist(s) are the only traffic on a given road that they're the one(s) setting the speed of the traffic at the time and place and under the conditions then existing.
The idea of the "move to the right" law is to facilitate fair use of the road. That is, to preclude especially-slow vehicles from co-opting the resource.
==================
As far as I can tell, one of the general ideas behind the traffic law is to provide reasonable rules for reasonable people to tend-towards using the roadways in an efficient and fair manner.
Some people here seem to think that the traffic law needs to explicitly list every action (for drivers!) in precise detail.
It doesn't and it shouldn't.
Last edited by njkayaker; 03-12-12 at 12:40 PM.
03-12-12, 12:50 PM
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Much of where they are riding is in the shoulder and often there are two same direction lanes. That is, there's no evidence that other traffic is being impeded.
Last edited by njkayaker; 03-12-12 at 03:36 PM.
03-12-12, 12:51 PM
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The video affirms my suggestions for riding two abreast in a considerate manner, and not the suggestion riders should always take the entirety of 'substandard' width lanes doubled up and require motorists change lanes fully to pass since they 'might as well'.
Hilarious attempt to salvage, but an affirmation of considerate road sharing and riding in a manner that allows partial lane changes -if at all- by passing motorists.
Riding two abreast while one rider utilizes the shoulder is considerate road use. (At least one rider using the shoulder if choosing to ride doubled up is the law in several states. )
the only time riders in BC are allowed to ride two abreast is on the shoulders of roads.
so rich!
Hilarious attempt to salvage, but an affirmation of considerate road sharing and riding in a manner that allows partial lane changes -if at all- by passing motorists.
Riding two abreast while one rider utilizes the shoulder is considerate road use. (At least one rider using the shoulder if choosing to ride doubled up is the law in several states. )
the only time riders in BC are allowed to ride two abreast is on the shoulders of roads.
so rich!
Last edited by Bekologist; 03-12-12 at 01:08 PM.