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-   -   Passing (http://www.bikeforums.net/advocacy-safety/873691-passing.html)

Chris516 02-19-13 01:42 PM

Passing
 
1 Attachment(s)
I was surfing CommuteOrlando's website, and saw this image: http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=300238

kmv2 02-19-13 01:57 PM

It doesn't say which one is an annoying child, or which one is married with kids?? I can't tell who is who.

Myosmith 02-19-13 02:05 PM

I'm a little unsure of just what is being illustrated. Was there any text explanation to go with this?

One thing I noticed is that their measurement of 2.56 feet from the car to the cyclist didn't include the mirror. On a car the mirror can extend eight inches to a foot beyond the body panels, on some trucks and other vehicles it can be even more. Being most mirrors will strike a cyclist somewhere between the hip and the shoulder (or the head in the case of larger trucks/delivery vehicles) I don't see why they wouldn't be included in the total width of the vehicle and the calculated distance being from the rightmost point, not necessarily the front fender.

Chris516 02-19-13 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Myosmith (Post 15292234)
I'm a little unsure of just what is being illustrated. Was there any text explanation to go with this?

One thing I noticed is that their measurement of 2.56 feet from the car to the cyclist didn't include the mirror. On a car the mirror can extend eight inches to a foot beyond the body panels, on some trucks and other vehicles it can be even more. Being most mirrors will strike a cyclist somewhere between the hip and the shoulder (or the head in the case of larger trucks/delivery vehicles) I don't see why they wouldn't be included in the total width of the vehicle and the calculated distance being from the rightmost point, not necessarily the front fender.

Yes, I should have included the website. Here is the website: http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/...d-the-3ft-law/

I noticed the thing about mirrors, too.

Even though that is Orlando, I think that would be accurate for the DC-Metro area. In that, the closer to the gutter pan, the less room a motorist feels' they need to use when passing a cyclist.

Notso_fastLane 02-19-13 04:10 PM

Considering I've been hit by the mirror sticking out rather far on one of those Metro Vans that some cities have for handicap transport, it should definitely be included. I was in a marked bike lane at the time, 2 way road with a middle left turn left turn lane.

mrt2you 02-19-13 05:44 PM

i got hit by a extended mirror on a dual rear wheel truck towing a bobcat 5 years ago.
it was on a 4 lane divided highway with a 3' paved shoulder on the right of the white line on the side of the road. i was riding on the paved shoulder and the truck driver, according to witnesses, swerved toward me. i think he was trying to get really close to me to scare me, but misjudged distance of the mirror. he clipped me on the shoulder with the mirror, knocked me over and i went down hard. i got knocked out, could have been much worse but i had helmet on, and spent the next 3 days in hospital. the truck driver never stopped.
a cop was patrolling the road and showed up 30 seconds after the accident. he picked up pieces of his broken mirror, got a description of the truck from 3 witnesses of the accident who were right behind the truck but changed lanes to give me room.
the cop saw the truck 2 miles away and busted the driver because the glass matched his broken mirror. the DA threw the book at him and the trucking company that owned the truck. after pleading out the driver he got 1 year in work release jail, revoked driver license for 2 years and a big fine. the trucking company also got a big fine.
i really wasn't hurt bad just shook up. i got all of my hospital bills taken care of and a 5K check for pain and suffering.

Chris516 02-19-13 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Notso_fastLane (Post 15292776)
Considering I've been hit by the mirror sticking out rather far on one of those Metro Vans that some cities have for handicap transport, it should definitely be included. I was in a marked bike lane at the time, 2 way road with a middle left turn left turn lane.

Your experience reminded me of, the large mirrors put on the doors of pickup trucks for pulling fifth-wheel trailers. I am not referring to horse trailers but, the big family trailers.

-=(8)=- 02-19-13 07:04 PM

One thing I experienced in Florida was cars/trucks towing boats -- some of the trailers sway wildly. Im OK with bike lanes, stayed in them, and still had issues with this. Rear view mirror :thumb:

cderalow 02-20-13 07:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by -=(8)=- (Post 15293480)
One thing I experienced in Florida was cars/trucks towing boats -- some of the trailers sway wildly. Im OK with bike lanes, stayed in them, and still had issues with this. Rear view mirror :thumb:

have you towed a trailer behind a vehicle before?

trailers have a great tendency to follow the crown of the road and get greatly effected by crosswinds.
at any sort of real speed, its pretty much impossible for a driver to have any real control over the location of a trailer.

nelson249 02-20-13 07:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrt2you (Post 15293171)
i got hit by a extended mirror on a dual rear wheel truck towing a bobcat 5 years ago.
it was on a 4 lane divided highway with a 3' paved shoulder on the right of the white line on the side of the road. i was riding on the paved shoulder and the truck driver, according to witnesses, swerved toward me. i think he was trying to get really close to me to scare me, but misjudged distance of the mirror. he clipped me on the shoulder with the mirror, knocked me over and i went down hard. i got knocked out, could have been much worse but i had helmet on, and spent the next 3 days in hospital. the truck driver never stopped.
a cop was patrolling the road and showed up 30 seconds after the accident. he picked up pieces of his broken mirror, got a description of the truck from 3 witnesses of the accident who were right behind the truck but changed lanes to give me room.
the cop saw the truck 2 miles away and busted the driver because the glass matched his broken mirror. the DA threw the book at him and the trucking company that owned the truck. after pleading out the driver he got 1 year in work release jail, revoked driver license for 2 years and a big fine. the trucking company also got a big fine.
i really wasn't hurt bad just shook up. i got all of my hospital bills taken care of and a 5K check for pain and suffering.

Yikes. Glad to see the cops were on top of it and most epecially that you weren't that badly injured.

nelson249 02-20-13 07:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cderalow (Post 15295066)
have you towed a trailer behind a vehicle before?

trailers have a great tendency to follow the crown of the road and get greatly effected by crosswinds.
at any sort of real speed, its pretty much impossible for a driver to have any real control over the location of a trailer.

The driver is still obligated to pass in a safe manner. If this means reducing speed well there it is.

Redfire 02-20-13 08:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cderalow (Post 15295066)
have you towed a trailer behind a vehicle before?

trailers have a great tendency to follow the crown of the road and get greatly effected by crosswinds.
at any sort of real speed, its pretty much impossible for a driver to have any real control over the location of a trailer.

While trailers are effected by crosswinds (either naturally occurring or from another vehicle) it is the drivers responsibility to maintain control over the trailer they are pulling. The main reason a trailer sways is because it is improperly loaded or the tow vehicle is not large enough or does not have the proper equipment, another common problem is having the hitch at the wrong height. If a trailer is equipped with brakes you can quickly regain control just by applying light pressure to the trailer brake controller located inside the tow vehicle. If the trailer is fairly large/heavy the tow vehicle should be equipped with weight distribution and sway control to aid in keeping the trailer on the same path as the tow vehicle. This is not just for the safety of cyclist but also other vehicles on the road as well as the people located in the tow vehicle.

johnin 02-20-13 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cderalow (Post 15295066)
have you towed a trailer behind a vehicle before?

trailers have a great tendency to follow the crown of the road and get greatly effected by crosswinds.
at any sort of real speed, its pretty much impossible for a driver to have any real control over the location of a trailer.

Surely you must be joking - if you can't control your vehicle you really shouldn't drive - and yes I have towed trailers - in heavy crosswinds - and on icy roads - appropriate speed is the secret. I don't know what you mean by "real speed" - please define.

ItsJustMe 02-21-13 02:16 PM

That looks fine to me. The closest pass was 2.58 feet which is a little close but I probably wouldn't even blink or notice at that distance.

That's about what I see too. Most people pass with WAY more space than is needed.

noisebeam 02-21-13 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ItsJustMe (Post 15300822)
That's about what I see too. Most people pass with WAY more space than is needed.

That is very true when sharing a lane, but if you are in a bike lane you never can tell. It's like the passing motorist is satisfied they 'on their side of the stripe', even if they are too close to the cyclist in the bike lane.

wphamilton 02-21-13 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redfire (Post 15295194)
While trailers are effected by crosswinds (either naturally occurring or from another vehicle) it is the drivers responsibility to maintain control over the trailer they are pulling. The main reason a trailer sways is because it is improperly loaded or the tow vehicle is not large enough or does not have the proper equipment, another common problem is having the hitch at the wrong height. If a trailer is equipped with brakes you can quickly regain control just by applying light pressure to the trailer brake controller located inside the tow vehicle. If the trailer is fairly large/heavy the tow vehicle should be equipped with weight distribution and sway control to aid in keeping the trailer on the same path as the tow vehicle. This is not just for the safety of cyclist but also other vehicles on the road as well as the people located in the tow vehicle.


Or the driver is over-controlling when he tries to correct it. I agree with Johnin. If a driver can't control his trailer, he needs to slow down to the speed he can handle, or else stay off the road entirely. Controlling the vehicle is the first priority and everything else, including a presumed right to travel from point A to B at any speed, is secondary.

Chris516 02-21-13 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nelson249 (Post 15295131)
The driver is still obligated to pass in a safe manner. If this means reducing speed well there it is.

Not just passing in a safe manner, and reducing speed. Also not breaking the speed limit to pass a cyclist. There is the exclusion in the traffic code of crossing the double-yellow line to pass a cyclist. But not breaking the speed limit to do it.

I was on a two-lane blacktop, in a 20mph zone earlier today, when an aggressive motorist was behind me. I was actually going 5mph ABOVE the speed limit, because of the guy practically tailgating me. When the guy crossed the double-yellow line to pass me, he was probably going 30mph. Too bad there wasn't a camera on that section of road.

Notso_fastLane 02-21-13 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris516 (Post 15301435)
Not just passing in a safe manner, and reducing speed. Also not breaking the speed limit to pass a cyclist. There is the exclusion in the traffic code of crossing the double-yellow line to pass a cyclist. But not breaking the speed limit to do it.

I was on a two-lane blacktop, in a 20mph zone earlier today, when an aggressive motorist was behind me. I was actually going 5mph ABOVE the speed limit, because of the guy practically tailgating me. When the guy crossed the double-yellow line to pass me, he was probably going 30mph. Too bad there wasn't a camera on that section of road.

The road coming to the plant where I work has a 20 mph speed limit, and because it's a slight downhill, then level, I'm usually doing about 22-23 mph as I'm approaching the gate. My fellow employees are some of the rudest, most aggressive drivers, and will often zoom around me at well over this speed, only to cut back in front of me and have to stop, since it is a single lane to go through the gate where the security guard is checking ID.... The really obnoxious ones, I just peddle on by, and pull back in front of them.

Chris516 02-21-13 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Notso_fastLane (Post 15301463)
The road coming to the plant where I work has a 20 mph speed limit, and because it's a slight downhill, then level, I'm usually doing about 22-23 mph as I'm approaching the gate. My fellow employees are some of the rudest, most aggressive drivers, and will often zoom around me at well over this speed, only to cut back in front of me and have to stop, since it is a single lane to go through the gate where the security guard is checking ID.... The really obnoxious ones, I just peddle on by, and pull back in front of them.

LOL:thumb:

Three cheers for you, and three smears for the offending driver.


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