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  1. #1
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    A man on the MUP, carrying a big stick...

    I was on foot, walking my German shepherd and as we got close, I reassured him that my beast wouldn't attack him. His reply: "It's not the dogs I'm afraid of! It's all the $%^ cyclists! This keeps them from passing too close"

    Discuss.

  2. #2
    Senior Member kalliergo's Avatar
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    I think we need a better description of the "big stick".

    In general, I've found that non-cyclists on MUPs hate close (high-speed, w/o warning. etc.) passing by cyclists as much as cyclists hate close passing by auto drivers. Some have developed various strategies for discouraging it or responding to it.

    When I'm on a MUP on foot, I often walk with my own big stick, a walking stick. I never know when my left knee is going to decide to go wonky, yet again. Since the walking stick is big and obvious and in my left hand -- and clearly a hazard to close passing -- I find that the speed demons tend to give me a wider berth.

    So, are we talking cane or walking stick or caveman club or baseball bat or. . . what?
    Last edited by kalliergo; 05-02-13 at 12:35 PM. Reason: Remove random extra words. Duh.
    "What if we fail to stop the erosion of cities by automobiles?. . . In that case, we Americans will hardly need to ponder a mystery that has troubled men for millennia: What is the purpose of life? For us, the answer will be clear, established and for all practical purposes indisputable: The purpose of life is to produce and consume automobiles."

    ~Jane Jacobs, The Death and Life of Great American Cities

  3. #3
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    Does this man also jog in the center of the path, with earphones on?
    馬好き

  4. #4
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    Yesterday, I rode on the bike path the first time this year. Joggers running side by side, jogger in the middle had a visible reaction when I didn't give him and his compatriot extra room even though I wasn't going particularity fast and gave plenty of room. The moron peds on this path far outnumber the cyclists. My favorite last fall was a woman jumping back and forth as I approached until I slowed to a walking pace, but from the looks of her she was just a sociopath. Path is 10' wide right there, no reason not to pass at speed, which again was not all that high.

  5. #5
    Senior Member kalliergo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by unterhausen View Post
    The moron peds on this path far outnumber the cyclists. My favorite last fall was a woman jumping back and forth as I approached until I slowed to a walking pace, but from the looks of her she was just a sociopath. Path is 10' wide right there, no reason not to pass at speed, which again was not all that high.
    In my experience, they outnumber the cyclists on most MUPs outside of truly rural areas. And when there are more than a few of them, a MUP becomes a very slow bike path, unless you are willing to act like a jerk yourself, further endangeroing everyone. I think it's just a fact of life on a MUP.
    "What if we fail to stop the erosion of cities by automobiles?. . . In that case, we Americans will hardly need to ponder a mystery that has troubled men for millennia: What is the purpose of life? For us, the answer will be clear, established and for all practical purposes indisputable: The purpose of life is to produce and consume automobiles."

    ~Jane Jacobs, The Death and Life of Great American Cities

  6. #6
    Senior Member kmv2's Avatar
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    people hate passing, people hate bells, people hate "on your left".

    maybe they should just stfu

  7. #7
    Senior Member kalliergo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kmv2 View Post
    people hate passing, people hate bells, people hate "on your left".
    Nah. People hate being startled or feeling intimidated.

    maybe they should just stfu
    They won't, so maybe we should consider dealing with reality in ways that might realistically address the problem.

    So far, I don't see much discussion developing here that seems all that relevant to the OP's request.
    "What if we fail to stop the erosion of cities by automobiles?. . . In that case, we Americans will hardly need to ponder a mystery that has troubled men for millennia: What is the purpose of life? For us, the answer will be clear, established and for all practical purposes indisputable: The purpose of life is to produce and consume automobiles."

    ~Jane Jacobs, The Death and Life of Great American Cities

  8. #8
    24-Speed Machine Chris516's Avatar
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    This is why, I don't like biking on MUPs', or the sidewalk.

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    To clarify: Big pointy stick most likely salvaged from the edge of the bayou. Looks like it might have been a part of a picket fence. Not a walking stick.

    And no, the guy was not jogging with headphones on. He was hyperalert for rogue cyclists.

    I do sympathize with him. I also get annoyed by the bikers on this trail. No warning, ever, from 90% of them. And I keep an ear out for them and I always make sure to pull my dog out of the way (he's on a regular 6 foot lead).

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    If I ever got whacked with stick while biking, I would kick the ever loving tar out of the person wielding that stick. If bikes are coming too close, it's probably because the person is too stupid to realize that you're supposed to walk and run facing bike traffic, not with it. It helps walkers avoid walking into a bad situation, which is normally the case in my experience.

    People ignore that, usually posted, rule and then get pissed when they get 'buzzed', which is anything within 3 feet.

  11. #11
    Senior Member Consularrider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneGoodLeg View Post
    ... If bikes are coming too close, it's probably because the person is too stupid to realize that you're supposed to walk and run facing bike traffic, not with it. It helps walkers avoid walking into a bad situation, which is normally the case in my experience.

    People ignore that, usually posted, rule and then get pissed when they get 'buzzed', which is anything within 3 feet.
    Not the rule in the DC area. Posted trail use guidelines are that all MUP users are to stay to the right. Bike and those on foot need to travel in the same direction, much safer on busy trails. That's been the norm everywhere I have ridden, although I've never ridden in MA.

  12. #12
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    Less worried about the peds than the rec.riders on "bmx-esque" bikes wandering all over the path. Was following the son on his lowracer and we'd slow down and do a "beep-beep" (voiced) for the peds- no problems. We pull up behind some guy and his GF on whatever you call those heavy, full suspension, knobby tired bikes give them a beep-beep and she swerves straight across the path as she tries to look over her shoulder. Heard the boyfriend telling her that she needs to stay right on the path-
    Lightning P-38 / M5 M-Racer/Ryan Vanguard

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    OneGoodLeg, MUP rules vary as much as states do; there ARE no hard-and-fast rules. Having said that, I also agree -- someone whacks me with a stick, they've just put a pricetag on their future. I make DAMN sure I don't buzz peds, I make plenty of noise before I pass, don't pass quickly with less than 6-8 feet of space; so, if the theoretical 'you' have a problem with me passing you, and use a stick to make the point, I hope you like wood enemas.

  14. #14
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    There are certainly good MUP's and bad MUP's. There is one by me (2 mile loop, that is way to busy, and nobody pays attention. Its just not safe on a bike, unless you are with your kids and traveling less than 10 mph. There is another MUP that is a rail to trail bike path that is 70+ miles. There are probably as many cyclist as pedestrians, and its not to uncommon to see a cyclist traveling 18+mph, so people follow the rules, are also more spread out.

    I think for a lot of there MUP's making them one way, and requiring people to keep to the right except to pass would solve a lot of problems.

  15. #15
    Senior Member squirtdad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kalliergo View Post
    In my experience, they outnumber the cyclists on most MUPs outside of truly rural areas. And when there are more than a few of them, a MUP becomes a very slow bike path, unless you are willing to act like a jerk yourself, further endangeroing everyone. I think it's just a fact of life on a MUP.
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    Senior Member squirtdad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneGoodLeg View Post
    If I ever got whacked with stick while biking, I would kick the ever loving tar out of the person wielding that stick. If bikes are coming too close, it's probably because the person is too stupid to realize that you're supposed to walk and run facing bike traffic, not with it. It helps walkers avoid walking into a bad situation, which is normally the case in my experience.

    People ignore that, usually posted, rule and then get pissed when they get 'buzzed', which is anything within 3 feet.
    That is completely wrong for MUP's (ok any that I have ever seen), traffic for all uses of MUP goes in same direction.
    Last edited by squirtdad; 05-02-13 at 06:59 PM. Reason: clarification
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  17. #17
    Senior Member shipwreck's Avatar
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    When threatened or attacked by some one with a stick, cane, staff, board, whatever, the trick is to get inside the swing radius of their weapon as fast as possible. Unless it has an edge it then becomes almost useless to them, actually a hinderence as it takes up at least one of their hands. You might have to take a wack or so getting close, but once in go for soft tissue, eyes, throat, below the belt.
    You asked for discussion. I am in the if anyone takes a swing at me with a weapon like that its on camp. If I encountered them like you did on foot then avoidance would be the ticket.

    On another note, I have no MUPs near me, but have used them when visiting larger citys. My impression from what I have seen is that I would rather do a brisk ride on the road, and as a utility cyclist, unless its a shortcut from one useful road to another MUPs should be left to peds with their children and dogs.

  18. #18
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    When out walking ,I carry an ash rake handle rubber tip on the round end brass pipe nipple epoxied into the rake end wrapped 40 foot of paracord. Walking stick, helps with balance, moves snakes, check places where I don't want my hands, tarp pole , etc .. It has detoured a dog once .
    Only time I could see using it against a cyclist would be a jerk hitting one of my grandkids or kids then it would be a brake through the spokes only if his was trying to not stop
    Every breath I Have ever taken as a Free man was paid for with the blood of an American Soldier

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by kalliergo View Post
    I think we need a better description of the "big stick".

    In general, I've found that non-cyclists on MUPs hate close (high-speed, w/o warning. etc.) passing by cyclists as much as cyclists hate close passing by auto drivers. Some have developed various strategies for discouraging it or responding to it.

    When I'm on a MUP on foot, I often walk with my own big stick, a walking stick. I never know when my left knee is going to decide to go wonky, yet again. Since the walking stick is big and obvious and in my left hand -- and clearly a hazard to close passing -- I find that the speed demons tend to give me a wider berth.

    So, are we talking cane or walking stick or caveman club or baseball bat or. . . what?
    Sorry for the blockheadedness here, but what in the bloody blue heck is a "MUP"?

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    Quote Originally Posted by barnabyjames View Post
    Sorry for the blockheadedness here, but what in the bloody blue heck is a "MUP"?
    Multi Use Path.

    A trail used by cyclist, joggers with headphones, dogs without leashes, etc.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneGoodLeg View Post
    If bikes are coming too close, it's probably because the person is too stupid to realize that you're supposed to walk and run facing bike traffic, not with it. It helps walkers avoid walking into a bad situation, which is normally the case in my experience.
    That's the opposite of what people are supposed to do around here. Most joggers and even casual walkers around here have no problem understanding the etiquette. Slower traffic keeps right, and faster traffic--runners or cyclists-- pass on the left. You get the occasional MUP first timer, or gaggle of tourists taking up the entire path, but other than that, most have no problem and don't seem startled.

  22. #22
    Senior Member rydabent's Avatar
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    There is an old story---probably based in truth---that said that in a newspaper letter to the editor someone said that walkers should carry sticks and jam them in the front wheel of cyclist A cyclist wrote back into the newspaper suggesting that the person with the stick should make sure the stick was very smooth and splinter free considering what the cyclist would do with the stick when he got up.

  23. #23
    Senior Member rydabent's Avatar
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    People have touched on a few good points here. First of all walkers NEED to walk on their half of the trail on the right hand side. Cyclist should ride at a prudent speed, slow down, ring a bell or call out "on your left". There is no reason that everyone using a little common sense cant all use the trails.

    One last thing. I know it will raise the ire of those doing it, but the head down racer boy wannabes are the worst offenders I see. They ride as if they own the trail. If they want to ride at a higher speed, they should get on the roads and streets.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by rydabent View Post
    One last thing. I know it will raise the ire of those doing it, but the head down racer boy wannabes are the worst offenders I see. They ride as if they own the trail. If they want to ride at a higher speed, they should get on the roads and streets.
    I see complaints like this on these forums all that time, but I've never actually seen anyone like this using the MUPs in Boston. I guess they stick to the roads around here. Or maybe they're extremely conscientious, so I don't notice them.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by rydabent View Post
    People have touched on a few good points here. First of all walkers NEED to walk on their half of the trail on the right hand side. Cyclist should ride at a prudent speed, slow down, ring a bell or call out "on your left". There is no reason that everyone using a little common sense cant all use the trails.

    One last thing. I know it will raise the ire of those doing it, but the head down racer boy wannabes are the worst offenders I see. They ride as if they own the trail. If they want to ride at a higher speed, they should get on the roads and streets.
    Indy's main trail is full of strollers and dog walkers, and racers with their heads down. Bells don't help since the headphones counteract them. The racers of course don't have a bell because it adds weight, and to say something before passing would interrupt their breathing pattern. Nothing worse than on a nice ride and getting buzzed by another cyclist. the less traveled trails here are much better - the other cyclists use their bells and the walkers/runners are much more aware.
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