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  1. #76
    20+mph Commuter JoeyBike's Avatar
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    Several MUP's in my city were paid for with matching highway funds as dedicated bike paths. Even though TWO parallel sidewalks exist, peds still take great pleasure blocking the BIKE PATH with their rude "hands across the path for peace" mindless drone antics.

    Theoretically, foot traffic could be banned from those bike paths.

  2. #77
    Been Around Awhile I-Like-To-Bike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeyBike View Post
    Several MUP's in my city were paid for with matching highway funds as dedicated bike paths. Even though TWO parallel sidewalks exist, peds still take great pleasure blocking the BIKE PATH with their rude "hands across the path for peace" mindless drone antics.

    Theoretically, foot traffic could be banned from those bike paths.
    Are those MUPs, Multi Use Paths or are they "dedicated bike paths", and dedicated by whom, you? Any signs posted indicating this "dedication"? Source of funding is irrelevant.

    Theoretically monkeys might fly, I saw it on the Wizard of Oz. But don't count on it.

  3. #78
    Senior Member kalliergo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by genec View Post
    This one has a well signed "adjacent pedestrian facility," with a split rail fence between the two. Peds don't care.
    Ah, not just a granite dust shoulder, then. Pretty rare. Do your peds know where they're supposed to be? How is it signed?

    Map location?
    "What if we fail to stop the erosion of cities by automobiles?. . . In that case, we Americans will hardly need to ponder a mystery that has troubled men for millennia: What is the purpose of life? For us, the answer will be clear, established and for all practical purposes indisputable: The purpose of life is to produce and consume automobiles."

    ~Jane Jacobs, The Death and Life of Great American Cities

  4. #79
    24-Speed Machine Chris516's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GP View Post
    USACE put in bike paths next to most if not all of the rivers in the LA District when they made improvements. It's a relatively cheap way to add east/west paths.
    A minor accident could end up killing one or both riders. Because of falling into that thing, after the crash.

  5. #80
    Senior Member Notso_fastLane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by genec View Post
    If folks are not reacting to an Air Zound, they are either very hearing impaired or zombies.
    I had a roller blader on my way home last night that even shouting as loud as I could, and blasting my Airzound at full volume from less than two feet behind him, didn't notice. He was wearing those large factory grade earphones and obviously had his music going loud. And of course, being that he was on rollerblades, he was all over the MUP.

  6. #81
    20+mph Commuter JoeyBike's Avatar
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    I use a helmet mirror when i skate on the paths. I have no problem with cyclists. I am aware and considerate - the key to path happiness for everyone.

  7. #82
    20+mph Commuter JoeyBike's Avatar
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    Are those MUPs, Multi Use Paths or are they "dedicated bike paths", and dedicated by whom, you? Any signs posted indicating this "dedication"?
    Like i said...parallel sidewalks - two - for walkers. Path was built as a bike path because the roadway is very busy. Sidewalks are under shade trees, path is exposed to sun. No signs. Wouldn't do a lick of good. No one back in the 1980's when paths were conceived ever suspected people would want to walk there.

    Our newest path has a dividing line down the middle with a stenciled walker and bike graphic on each side. Walkers step right on the bike symbols with no concern. Stupid.
    Last edited by JoeyBike; 05-17-13 at 09:54 AM.

  8. #83
    genec genec's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kalliergo View Post
    Ah, not just a granite dust shoulder, then. Pretty rare. Do your peds know where they're supposed to be? How is it signed?

    Map location?
    It is a granite trail... so no doubt one reason peds use the bike trail side, it is also shared with horses, which they want to keep away from the bikes (which spook horses). http://goo.gl/maps/xsViy It eventually runs beside a major freeway... and the ped path discontinues where the homes stop.

    Here is another one... with a paved ped path, and in the link you can clearly see the arrows for peds and cyclists. http://goo.gl/maps/fTxh4

    This is beside Seaworld and it is quite nice.

    The path reaches from one area of town to another, and connects to other paths... which unfortunately end up going nowhere. (maybe someday they will parallel Interstate 8 for some distance) There is also a bike lane in the 50MPH adjacent road, for those cyclists, that for some reason refuse to ride on the path... And ironically there is yet another "road" (Old Seaworld Road) that parallels this... which means one can ride as fast as you want without having to ride on the arterial road... yet there are those cyclists who for some reason, still want to mix it up with motor traffic... and here's the most ironic part, the bike path provides short cuts past dreaded on ramp circles to the arterial roads, yet some cyclists STILL use the road.

    The bike paths are highlighted in green. http://goo.gl/maps/LhFTe SeaWorld Drive is a high speed arterial road (50MPH). Note the circular on/off ramps, note the bike path bypasses. When I go down to this area, I vastly prefer to bike, rather than drive, just so I avoid those on/off ramps. (drivers have a hard time merging correctly on those... yet another hazard if you were to bike them)

  9. #84
    Been Around Awhile I-Like-To-Bike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Notso_fastLane View Post
    I had a roller blader on my way home last night that even shouting as loud as I could, and blasting my Airzound at full volume from less than two feet behind him, didn't notice. He was wearing those large factory grade earphones and obviously had his music going loud. And of course, being that he was on rollerblades, he was all over the MUP.
    Were you able to get around the rollerbladder or did you crash into him to teach him a lesson? Or worse yet, did you have to slow down in order to pass.

  10. #85
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    Nearly 100% of motorists who are involved in injury accidents are driving cars with radios in them - why don't we pass a law against any distracting things in motor vehicles? Pedestrians walking with a phone very rarely cause injury to others, we need to focus efforts on those who think that they can multitask when one of those tasks threatens the lives of others.

    Slow down, enjoy the ride.

  11. #86
    Senior Member kalliergo's Avatar
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    Thanks, Gene.

    Quote Originally Posted by genec View Post
    It is a granite trail... so no doubt one reason peds use the bike trail side, it is also shared with horses, which they want to keep away from the bikes (which spook horses). http://goo.gl/maps/xsViy It eventually runs beside a major freeway... and the ped path discontinues where the homes stop.
    Well, except on wet trails where the horses churn the surface into impassable muck (doesn't happen on well-made decomposed granite trails), peds and horses get along just fine. If I were on foot, I'd use that sidepath.

    OTOH, a common problem that we don't usually consider is that, in warm & dry weather, lots of peds on paths like that are wearing sandals or other open shoes. I've noticed, when walking in sandals on the sidepath of the local MUP that I've talked about recently, that pebbles and random crud getting between foot and shoe can be pretty uncomfortable. Last time I was out there on foot, I ended up walking on the paved area.

    [QUOTE]Here is another one... with a paved ped path, and in the link you can clearly see the arrows for peds and cyclists. http://goo.gl/maps/fTxh4

    This is beside Seaworld and it is quite nice.

    The path reaches from one area of town to another, and connects to other paths... which unfortunately end up going nowhere. (maybe someday they will parallel Interstate 8 for some distance)
    From what I can see in the satellite and street views, I'd follow the pedestrian signage. And, cycling, I'd probably be annoyed by peds who didn't.

    There is also a bike lane in the 50MPH adjacent road, for those cyclists, that for some reason refuse to ride on the path... And ironically there is yet another "road" (Old Seaworld Road) that parallels this... which means one can ride as fast as you want without having to ride on the arterial road... yet there are those cyclists who for some reason, still want to mix it up with motor traffic... and here's the most ironic part, the bike path provides short cuts past dreaded on ramp circles to the arterial roads, yet some cyclists STILL use the road.
    Different strokes, Gene. I'd probably, under normal circumstances, choose one of the less carmageddonish options, but I can easily imagine good reasons to ride the right lane of the arterial. I wouldn't feel endangered doing that, particularly; but I'm sure I'd be as disgusted as I always am by our nasty, car-brain-designed built environment. An now and then, I'd probably be angry enough to yell at some moron -- and then be angry at myself for stressing my system.

    The bike paths are highlighted in green. http://goo.gl/maps/LhFTe SeaWorld Drive is a high speed arterial road (50MPH). Note the circular on/off ramps, note the bike path bypasses. When I go down to this area, I vastly prefer to bike, rather than drive, just so I avoid those on/off ramps. (drivers have a hard time merging correctly on those... yet another hazard if you were to bike them)
    Yeah. I don't think any American cyclists are in love with that situation. I have to say though that, in the Marin portion of my life, we have a few of those ramp-crossing situations (no bike lanes, but good shoulders/WOLs) that were just awful ten years ago, but have vastly improved since. Cyclists have learned proper lane positioning and signaling, drivers have mostly learned to yield to cyclists. The changes, in these particular spots, are mostly that the are many, many more cyclists, there are prominent Share the Road signs on the approaching streets, and traffic is more atrocious than ever. Now I want sharrows.
    "What if we fail to stop the erosion of cities by automobiles?. . . In that case, we Americans will hardly need to ponder a mystery that has troubled men for millennia: What is the purpose of life? For us, the answer will be clear, established and for all practical purposes indisputable: The purpose of life is to produce and consume automobiles."

    ~Jane Jacobs, The Death and Life of Great American Cities

  12. #87
    Senior Member kalliergo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Notso_fastLane View Post
    I had a roller blader on my way home last night that even shouting as loud as I could, and blasting my Airzound at full volume from less than two feet behind him, didn't notice. He was wearing those large factory grade earphones and obviously had his music going loud. And of course, being that he was on rollerblades, he was all over the MUP.
    Map location?
    "What if we fail to stop the erosion of cities by automobiles?. . . In that case, we Americans will hardly need to ponder a mystery that has troubled men for millennia: What is the purpose of life? For us, the answer will be clear, established and for all practical purposes indisputable: The purpose of life is to produce and consume automobiles."

    ~Jane Jacobs, The Death and Life of Great American Cities

  13. #88
    genec genec's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kalliergo View Post
    Thanks, Gene.



    Well, except on wet trails where the horses churn the surface into impassable muck (doesn't happen on well-made decomposed granite trails), peds and horses get along just fine. If I were on foot, I'd use that sidepath.

    OTOH, a common problem that we don't usually consider is that, in warm & dry weather, lots of peds on paths like that are wearing sandals or other open shoes. I've noticed, when walking in sandals on the sidepath of the local MUP that I've talked about recently, that pebbles and random crud getting between foot and shoe can be pretty uncomfortable. Last time I was out there on foot, I ended up walking on the paved area.

    Here is another one... with a paved ped path, and in the link you can clearly see the arrows for peds and cyclists. http://goo.gl/maps/fTxh4

    This is beside Seaworld and it is quite nice.
    From what I can see in the satellite and street views, I'd follow the pedestrian signage. And, cycling, I'd probably be annoyed by peds who didn't.



    Different strokes, Gene. I'd probably, under normal circumstances, choose one of the less carmageddonish options, but I can easily imagine good reasons to ride the right lane of the arterial. I wouldn't feel endangered doing that, particularly; but I'm sure I'd be as disgusted as I always am by our nasty, car-brain-designed built environment. An now and then, I'd probably be angry enough to yell at some moron -- and then be angry at myself for stressing my system.



    Yeah. I don't think any American cyclists are in love with that situation. I have to say though that, in the Marin portion of my life, we have a few of those ramp-crossing situations (no bike lanes, but good shoulders/WOLs) that were just awful ten years ago, but have vastly improved since. Cyclists have learned proper lane positioning and signaling, drivers have mostly learned to yield to cyclists. The changes, in these particular spots, are mostly that the are many, many more cyclists, there are prominent Share the Road signs on the approaching streets, and traffic is more atrocious than ever. Now I want sharrows.
    In the very latter situation... the bike paths offer shorter routes and avoid the merges altogether... they are loads better than the road. The path is quite wide as it used to be a road... so the advantages of the path far far outweigh "sharing the road." The path is a far superior ride.

    This latter situation was one I also found when I visited Oulu Finland many years ago... their bike path network was far far superior an experience for cyclists... in that the routes were shorter (more direct) and motorists were "routed around" so to speak. The bike path network was just so much better and easier to use than driving, it just flat out encouraged cycling, and walking.

    The locals in Oulu had separate sidewalks in and around town... so the mixing of peds and cyclists was kept to a minimum.

    This vid shows the bike path next to the sidewalk.


  14. #89
    Senior Member Notso_fastLane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kalliergo View Post
    Map location?
    It was on the interurban trail in Everett. The stretch that runs behind Everett Mall.

  15. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by spare_wheel View Post
    errr...not sure how what his head phones have anything to do with his failure to look back.

    PS: i've been riding with headphones since the days of the very first sony walkman.
    To be honest, I think the wearing of headphones is just a symptom of the real issue. People just aren't paying attention, doesn't matter if they've got a cell phone/mp3 player or not. I ride with headphones all the time (on a bicycle, its only in one ear) on my motorcycle. The bike is loud enough that I doubt having ear buds in is really going to affect anything. Same with my car, the interior is quiet enough that when the stereo is going it gets hard to hear the sirens on emergency vehicles, and I still usually see them in the mirrors way before I'll hear them.


    Quote Originally Posted by agent pombero View Post



    (Hey photo wizards: how was this picture taken to look like that??)

    Looks like an HDR photo. Basically you take a few exposures and layer them on top of each other.

  16. #91
    Senior Member edotomato's Avatar
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    I've had friends try and plug in when we go on a ride and I damn near rip them out. You will be safety conscious and engage me in conversation, squab!

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