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-   -   Couple berate cyclist for reporting illegaly-parked van (http://www.bikeforums.net/advocacy-safety/923316-couple-berate-cyclist-reporting-illegaly-parked-van.html)

CB HI 11-23-13 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FBinNY (Post 16272148)
In this case, the cyclist can make the maneuver properly with a long angled lane shift, or come up to the van and wait for a break in traffic, which wasn't heavy in the video, and swing around, or if extremely timid, cursed th A-hole who parked there, and walked around the van on the sidewalk.

Seems so many here are ignoring that the van was located immediately after a left turn the cyclist made. Hard to judge from the keyboard how difficult that left was in relation to having to transition to a sudden lane change around an illegally parked van. Sounds to me the cyclist did not have a long angled lane shift. From the ladies comments, it sounds like the van owner repeatedly illegally parks there.

Thus I have a hard time why so many other cyclist here have a beef with this cyclist simply reporting an illegally parked vehicle.

B. Carfree 11-23-13 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CB HI (Post 16272997)
Seems so many here are ignoring that the van was located immediately after a left turn the cyclist made. Hard to judge from the keyboard how difficult that left was in relation to having to transition to a sudden lane change around an illegally parked van. Sounds to me the cyclist did not have a long angled lane shift. From the ladies comments, it sounds like the van owner repeatedly illegally parks there.

Thus I have a hard time why so many other cyclist here have a beef with this cyclist simply reporting an illegally parked vehicle.

I suspect it's because the "cyclists" here do many more miles as motorists than as cyclists. Motorists generally seem to think the law is a rough guideline (see speed limits) and cyclists have skin in the game that is best protected by having everyone play by the rulebook.

Sure, I would likely have seen the problem early enough to deal with it safely without any issues. The point is that everyone has let-down moments when they are not at the top of their game and the top of some riders' games isn't all that high to begin with. Should they be put at risk by someone who is breaking the law for his/her own convenience? That should be a simple question to answer and those who are dismissing the risk presented are missing something.

dynodonn 11-23-13 10:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by B. Carfree (Post 16273027)
Sure, I would likely have seen the problem early enough to deal with it safely without any issues. The point is that everyone has let-down moments when they are not at the top of their game and the top of some riders' games isn't all that high to begin with.

With the cyclist's headlight on strobe at night, could have aided in obscuring his judgement of distance, and seeing the van much later in the left turn.

FBinNY 11-23-13 10:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CB HI (Post 16272997)
Thus I have a hard time why so many other cyclist here have a beef with this cyclist simply reporting an illegally parked vehicle.

While you mk i out as a cyclist/safety thing, I make it as a reporting a minor violation thing out of a misplaced sense of entitlement. Most of don't report every parking, double parking or other traffic violation. Likewise we wouldn't report this one either.

I don't like or respect zealots of any stripe, and would only report something if there was a clear and present danger. Back when I drove and had a cell phone, I would sometimes call in to report a drunk driver who I thought was an immediate hazard to himself and others, but I wouldn't bother reporting others.

The plain fact is that I'd rather live with some minor "crime" than live in 1937 Berlin.

dynodonn 11-23-13 10:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FBinNY (Post 16273039)
I make it as a reporting a minor violation thing out of a misplaced sense of entitlement. Most of don't report every parking, double parking or other traffic violation. Likewise we wouldn't report this one either.

...and one wonders why a number of motorists will continue blocking cycling infrastructure. I not sure why you sense entitlement from the cyclist's right in reporting a traffic hazard.

FBinNY 11-23-13 11:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dynodonn (Post 16273050)
...and one wonders why a number of motorists will continue blocking cycling infrastructure. I not sure why you sense entitlement from the cyclist's right in reporting a traffic hazard.

First of all I don't see it as a hazard, just an annoyance. Secondly I don't report minor stuff of every type, I'm much more of a MYOB person, and would only report crimes in process or serious issues.

For parking violations like this, or double parking, or parking in front of fire hydrant, I'd leave it to fate and cruising police cars. I'd also venture that the cyclist in the video doesn't report every violation he sees, just the ones that violate his sense of entitlement, ie a car parked in a lane for bikes.

In simple terms I have a higher threshold for what's reportable. If I see a couple of vagrants who've built a fire in a trash can or oil drum, I MYOB. But if I see smoke pouring out of a building window, I call the fire department.

dynodonn 11-23-13 11:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FBinNY (Post 16273059)
First of all I don't see it as a hazard, just an annoyance.

I'm sure if the van was parked in the adjacent traffic lane with no hazard lights flashing, I'm sure that many motorists would feel the same and mind their own business.

B. Carfree 11-23-13 11:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FBinNY (Post 16273039)
While you mk i out as a cyclist/safety thing, I make it as a reporting a minor violation thing out of a misplaced sense of entitlement. Most of don't report every parking, double parking or other traffic violation. Likewise we wouldn't report this one either.

I don't like or respect zealots of any stripe, and would only report something if there was a clear and present danger. Back when I drove and had a cell phone, I would sometimes call in to report a drunk driver who I thought was an immediate hazard to himself and others, but I wouldn't bother reporting others.

The plain fact is that I'd rather live with some minor "crime" than live in 1937 Berlin.

If someone parks on a two-lane each way freeway, especially if it was done just around a bend, would you report it? After all, motorists can simply change lanes. How about a two-lane highway? It's certainly easy enough to wait for a gap in oncoming traffic and go around. At what point would it get your attention? Would one be over-zealous to call those in?

Look, it's obvious that the van posed a danger to a lesser-skilled rider than yourself. Should we all just let such riders fend for themselves and let might be right for fear of being called bad names by you? (By the way, you've already lost the argument by Godwin's law.)

FBinNY 11-23-13 11:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by B. Carfree (Post 16273071)
If someone parks on a two-lane each way freeway, especially if it was done just around a bend, would you report it? After all, motorists can simply change lanes. How about a two-lane highway? It's certainly easy enough to wait for a gap in oncoming traffic and go around. At what point would it get your attention? Would one be over-zealous to call those in?

Look, it's obvious that the van posed a danger to a lesser-skilled rider than yourself. Should we all just let such riders fend for themselves and let might be right for fear of being called bad names by you? (By the way, you've already lost the argument by Godwin's law.)

If you read one of my earlier posts, you'd see I characterized the video as showing 3 jerks who deserved each other. Your hazard is my inconvenience, and well below my threshold of what's reportable. The analogy to the freeway doesn't hold for a dozen reasons, but lets face it, you think what you think and I think what I think, and readers here will think what they think.

I don't see threads on a forum as who wins or loses, we post what we think and readers can draw their own conclusions.

unterhausen 11-24-13 07:18 AM

apparently the guy with the van does this because he's trying to stick it to the man. So there are definitely 3 jerks. If you count the cyclist, 4. If I lived in a place with mandatory bike lanes, I would be organizing people to call in scofflaws

DnvrFox 11-24-13 07:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FBinNY (Post 16273039)
The plain fact is that I'd rather live with some minor "crime" than live in 1937 Berlin.

Wow, a true false dichotomy!! To compare an illegally parked van with Berlin in 1937 - :eek:

rydabent 11-24-13 07:57 AM

Kind of interesting that the couple are singled out as "conservative" in that newspaper. Like that has anything to do with the situation. Do liberal car drivers NEVER block a bike lane? It is also like pickup drivers are also singled out.

rumrunn6 11-24-13 07:58 AM

love how the old guy takes out his camera like that's gonna do anything. I too would have not reported it unless it was a repeat offender. but I must commend the cyclist for standing up for our rights. that's a blatantly bad parking job by a clueless driver with no perception about parking rules. I wonder what exactly he was thinking when he parked there ... I won't be long, I can't figure out these rules and paint markings and I'm old so no one will care, or bicycle stuff? pasha!

bikemig 11-24-13 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DnvrFox (Post 16273464)
Wow, a true false dichotomy!! To compare an illegally parked van with Berlin in 1937 - :eek:

No. 1.

bikemig 11-24-13 08:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rydabent (Post 16273470)
Kind of interesting that the couple are singled out as "conservative" in that newspaper. Like that has anything to do with the situation. Do liberal car drivers NEVER block a bike lane? It is also like pickup drivers are also singled out.

I thought it was more a way of identifying the couple as political activists. Certainly the language they used sounds like that of a good many conservative activists. Whether you agree with that or not is another issue.

dmac49 11-24-13 03:22 PM

OP- What was the final disposition of the vehicle complaint ?

dynaryder 11-24-13 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CB HI (Post 16272997)
Seems so many here are ignoring that the van was located immediately after a left turn the cyclist made. Hard to judge from the keyboard how difficult that left was in relation to having to transition to a sudden lane change around an illegally parked van. Sounds to me the cyclist did not have a long angled lane shift.

Unfortunately,Google Street View is old and doesn't show the cycle track(it starts where the green umbrellas are in the pic),but you can kind of see that there's trees,trashcans,paper boxes,and other stuff that can block your view. I can see how if you take the turn at speed you could miss a parked vehicle.

dynaryder 11-24-13 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FBinNY (Post 16273039)
While you mk i out as a cyclist/safety thing, I make it as a reporting a minor violation thing out of a misplaced sense of entitlement. Most of don't report every parking, double parking or other traffic violation. Likewise we wouldn't report this one either.

Quote:

Originally Posted by FBinNY (Post 16273059)
First of all I don't see it as a hazard, just an annoyance. Secondly I don't report minor stuff of every type, I'm much more of a MYOB person, and would only report crimes in process or serious issues.

For parking violations like this, or double parking, or parking in front of fire hydrant, I'd leave it to fate and cruising police cars.

Not being from around here,you don't know how big of an issue it's been to keep the track clear of illegally parked vehicles. If people weren't constantly calling in complaints and pressuring the police,the track would be useless.

FBinNY 11-24-13 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dynaryder (Post 16274796)
Unfortunately,Google Street View is old and doesn't show the cycle track(it starts where the green umbrellas are in the pic),but you can kind of see that there's trees,trashcans,paper boxes,and other stuff that can block your view. I can see how if you take the turn at speed you could miss a parked vehicle.

This is urban riding, not a closed race track. IMO there's no excuse for anybody, not being in control for any reason. If not a van, there could be a pedestrian crossing, garbage that was blown into the road (or bike path), diasbled vehicle, or whatever on the track.

If a motorist came around a corner and hit something unseen before he made the turn, I'm sure everyone here would be speaking about driving with control and consistent with conditions. I'm not excusing the van's driver who parked illegally, but don't see blowing this up to a cause celebre, and as I said earlier, I'm not a fan of those who feel compelled to call police for simple traffic, parking, or other minor "nuisance" violations.

And though I have no way of knowing, my gut feeling is that the cyclist here would not have called in any parking violation, only those which offended his sensibilities.

CB HI 11-24-13 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FBinNY (Post 16273039)
While you mk i out as a cyclist/safety thing, I make it as a reporting a minor violation thing out of a misplaced sense of entitlement. Most of don't report every parking, double parking or other traffic violation. Likewise we wouldn't report this one either.

I don't like or respect zealots of any stripe, and would only report something if there was a clear and present danger. Back when I drove and had a cell phone, I would sometimes call in to report a drunk driver who I thought was an immediate hazard to himself and others, but I wouldn't bother reporting others.

The plain fact is that I'd rather live with some minor "crime" than live in 1937 Berlin.

Thus the entitlement of NYC motorist to park any dam place they please.

CB HI 11-24-13 08:53 PM

^^

Even the NYPD cop who parked in the bike lane and then ticketed any cyclist who was not riding in the bike lane he was blocking.

FBinNY 11-24-13 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CB HI (Post 16275239)
Thus the entitlement of NYC motorist to park any dam place they please.

No actually the police in NYC do an amazing job citing cars for all sorts of parking violations, from overtime on meters (often within minutes of time expired) to fire hydrant, general no parking, alternate side of the street, double parking, loading zone, and so on.... In fact NYC police, and parking enforcement, generate enough dough from illegally parked cars to the extent that it's a significant source of revenue when budgets are decided.

And the most amazing thing is that they somehow manage to do this very effectively without any meaningful help from the public.

IMO- if parking violations are a problem in DC, either generally or bike lanes specifically, the better remedy is to work through the community boards to raise the priority for these issues. I can assure you that there are more cars on patrol, and patrolmen (or women) out there than individuals likely to report these issues case by case.

Don't believe me? Come to NYC and park illegally for 5 minutes. (Bring cash).

FBinNY 11-24-13 09:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CB HI (Post 16275266)
^^

Even the NYPD cop who parked in the bike lane and then ticketed any cyclist who was not riding in the bike lane he was blocking.

Don't know about the incident, but it wouldn't surprise me at all. Parking and traffic infractions are serious business in NYC.

CB HI 11-24-13 10:46 PM

Glad you guys are getting so much love from NYPD.

http://gothamist.com/2010/10/27/cop_...icket_cycl.php

http://www.streetsblog.org/2013/10/1...ng-bike-lanes/

http://copsinbikelanes.tumblr.com/

FBinNY 11-24-13 10:52 PM

You're right. I absolutely adore cops and policies where code enforcement is a revenue raising endeavor. Maybe this is why I have so much respect for anybody who calls police to report parking violations.


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