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  1. #76
    Senior Member JonnyHK's Avatar
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    I found a set of technical drawings for the tram stop "superstop".

    http://www.manlymania.net/Tramway/Ap...VJULY%2003.pdf

    The raised platform for the tram stop is 3 metres wide. Part of that gets eaten up by the handrail, shelters, ticket machines and so on - but it is still very generous when you consider how jammed up the roadway has become for cars and bikes. Given the huge number of bikes in the city you'd think that the town planners would have made a different compromise. Perhaps a 2.5m tram stop and an extra half metre for traffic?

  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by JonnyHK View Post
    I found a set of technical drawings for the tram stop "superstop".

    http://www.manlymania.net/Tramway/Ap...VJULY%2003.pdf

    The raised platform for the tram stop is 3 metres wide. Part of that gets eaten up by the handrail, shelters, ticket machines and so on - but it is still very generous when you consider how jammed up the roadway has become for cars and bikes. Given the huge number of bikes in the city you'd think that the town planners would have made a different compromise. Perhaps a 2.5m tram stop and an extra half metre for traffic?
    As a matter of fact, I was half-asleep going about 40mph when 2 of my wheels went up the 'tram stop divider' on a regular tram stop - I did a sideways 720 in my Mitsubishi before landing on my wheels right next to the sidewalk. Just realized the superstop is built differently.

    Thankfully no one was hurt, cos I could very easily have killed someone. It still makes me shudder.

  3. #78
    Senior Member JonnyHK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by keyven View Post
    As a matter of fact, I was half-asleep going about 40mph when 2 of my wheels went up the 'tram stop divider' on a regular tram stop - I did a sideways 720 in my Mitsubishi before landing on my wheels right next to the sidewalk. Just realized the superstop is built differently.

    Thankfully no one was hurt, cos I could very easily have killed someone. It still makes me shudder.

    I've seen the aftermath of a few folks driving up the old school yellow concrete ramp things (example here from an old news article) and I almost had an accident on the new layout of High Street, Northcote last year. That is really weird and you've really got to watch it - but it was new to me as I'm no longer a 'local' and I was jet-lagged from flying home, so I turned into this road and almost drove right up the damn ramp onto the pavement (where there was once a traffic lane). Good thing the brakes on the rental car were nice and responsive!

    055885-taxi-flip.jpg
    (for you non-melbourne folks - there is another couple of metres of yellow concrete ramp off the left edge of this shot. It's a perfect ramp to flip a car. These were about 70-90cm wide and protected the end of a basic tram stop. You can see the basic hand rail)

  4. #79
    Senior Member delcrossv's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JonnyHK View Post

    Taking the lane would obviously be the best plan, especially if traffic was flowing.

    Watch this journalist take the lane as he rides down this exact bit of road as part of a report:
    Think you know your bike and road rules? Take the quiz

    However, with the traffic slowing and coming to a halt at the traffic light, her choice to filter is not unexpected.
    From "the Age" article you posted a link to:

    Bikes are encouraged to pass at the left and stop at the front of traffic at intersections because that considerably reduces the risk of being struck by left-turning and right-turning vehicles,” he said.

    Read more:[url] http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/think-you-know-your-bike-and-road-rules-take-the-quiz-20140320-3548k.html#ixzz2wc8UsAua[url]
    Just like passing on the right here-and just as dumb. I can't believe the local advocqcy group promotes this.
    Lightning P-38 / M5 M-Racer/Ryan Vanguard

  5. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by JonnyHK View Post
    I've seen the aftermath of a few folks driving up the old school yellow concrete ramp things (example here from an old news article) and I almost had an accident on the new layout of High Street, Northcote last year. That is really weird and you've really got to watch it - but it was new to me as I'm no longer a 'local' and I was jet-lagged from flying home, so I turned into this road and almost drove right up the damn ramp onto the pavement (where there was once a traffic lane). Good thing the brakes on the rental car were nice and responsive!

    055885-taxi-flip.jpg
    (for you non-melbourne folks - there is another couple of metres of yellow concrete ramp off the left edge of this shot. It's a perfect ramp to flip a car. These were about 70-90cm wide and protected the end of a basic tram stop. You can see the basic hand rail)
    Yeah that is exactly what I'm talking about - that yellow ramp. I was lucky I only escaped with a minor cut on my forehead.

  6. #81
    Senior Member JonnyHK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by delcrossv View Post
    From "the Age" article you posted a link to:

    Bikes are encouraged to pass at the left and stop at the front of traffic at intersections because that considerably reduces the risk of being struck by left-turning and right-turning vehicles,” he said.
    Just like passing on the right here-and just as dumb. I can't believe the local advocqcy group promotes this.

    I think they mean 'filter' as in Bikes are encouraged to FILTER on the left and stop at the front of traffic at intersections because that considerably reduces the risk of being struck by left-turning and right-turning vehicles,” he said.

    I guess we could argue about the meaning or intent of 'passing' or 'filtering' - they are effectively the same thing - but you have a different aim or mindset for each. Getting to the bike box at the intersection is something you do by 'filtering'.

  7. #82
    Senior Member JonnyHK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by keyven View Post
    Yeah that is exactly what I'm talking about - that yellow ramp. I was lucky I only escaped with a minor cut on my forehead.
    Whoops!

    I had trouble with one of these:
    4--easy-access-stop.jpg

    The raised tram stop is in what used to be the first lane of the road. The car parked just past the stop shows how far out the platform is.

    If you don't notice the grey paving rising up against the grey road, then you find yourself either fully or half up the ramp! Presumably this is why they've added the flex-pole things to this particular example.

    The one I almost put the passenger wheels up was closer to this one (and was I think the next stop along from here!) and didn't have the warning poles:
    high_st_tram_stopw.jpg

    The Bicycle Network has a bit to say about the new designs:
    https://www.bicyclenetwork.com.au/ge...futures/94731/

  8. #83
    Senior Member delcrossv's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JonnyHK View Post
    I think they mean 'filter' as in Bikes are encouraged to FILTER on the left and stop at the front of traffic at intersections because that considerably reduces the risk of being struck by left-turning and right-turning vehicles,” he said.

    I guess we could argue about the meaning or intent of 'passing' or 'filtering' - they are effectively the same thing - but you have a different aim or mindset for each. Getting to the bike box at the intersection is something you do by 'filtering'.
    Well, filtering between lanes of traffic is one thing, and "filtering' up against the kerb is another. Not a fan of the first, but I can see why people do it; the second seems really dumb.
    Lightning P-38 / M5 M-Racer/Ryan Vanguard

  9. #84
    Senior Member JonnyHK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by delcrossv View Post
    Well, filtering between lanes of traffic is one thing, and "filtering' up against the kerb is another. Not a fan of the first, but I can see why people do it; the second seems really dumb.

    I would have thought that most filtering would be done on the curb side since that is the 'normal' position for a rider to be on.

    However, we hope that most of the time there is either a proper bike lane or a full width traffic lane.

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