Vigilante Attack May Increase Hit-and-Runs
04-06-14, 04:11 PM
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Vigilante Attack May Increase Hit-and-Runs
Two arrests made in case of man beaten in Detroit street after his truck accidentally hits boy | MLive.com
A driver stopped to help the kid who ran in front of his truck. A mob beat him. His injuries are life-threatening.
A driver stopped to help the kid who ran in front of his truck. A mob beat him. His injuries are life-threatening.
04-06-14, 07:10 PM
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It's a pity this incident likely won't be used to increase the penalties for careless driving instead of being used as an excuse for irresponsible car use. When/if the driver recovers, will he think back and wish he hadn't stopped after running down the child, or will he wish he had been paying proper attention to his responsibilities while driving so that he never hit the child in the first place?
04-06-14, 07:37 PM
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It's a pity this incident likely won't be used to increase the penalties for careless driving instead of being used as an excuse for irresponsible car use. When/if the driver recovers, will he think back and wish he hadn't stopped after running down the child, or will he wish he had been paying proper attention to his responsibilities while driving so that he never hit the child in the first place?
04-06-14, 08:21 PM
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On what basis do you folks call the driver careless? Watch the video and tell me what he could have done differently.
LiveLeak.com - Kid hit by car
LiveLeak.com - Kid hit by car
04-06-14, 08:25 PM
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It's a pity this incident likely won't be used to increase the penalties for careless driving instead of being used as an excuse for irresponsible car use. When/if the driver recovers, will he think back and wish he hadn't stopped after running down the child, or will he wish he had been paying proper attention to his responsibilities while driving so that he never hit the child in the first place?
In general I agree that we need tougher driving laws, but let's not just assume that this guy was careless. Based on the article, we don't know much of anything related to the incident.
Edit: I just saw the video. From that angle, I can't tell if the kid was on the sidewalk or not, or how much room the truck would have had to maneuver. So I still say we don't know enough to pin the blame on the driver.
Last edited by El Cid; 04-06-14 at 08:28 PM.
04-06-14, 08:40 PM
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In general I agree that we need tougher driving laws, but let's not just assume that this guy was careless. Based on the article, we don't know much of anything related to the incident.
Edit: I just saw the video. From that angle, I can't tell if the kid was on the sidewalk or not, or how much room the truck would have had to maneuver. So I still say we don't know enough to pin the blame on the driver.
Edit: I just saw the video. From that angle, I can't tell if the kid was on the sidewalk or not, or how much room the truck would have had to maneuver. So I still say we don't know enough to pin the blame on the driver.
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04-06-14, 09:30 PM
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On what basis do you folks call the driver careless? Watch the video and tell me what he could have done differently.
LiveLeak.com - Kid hit by car
LiveLeak.com - Kid hit by car
04-06-14, 09:49 PM
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I can't tell if he was going too fast or not, not from this video. He doesn't seem to be going any faster than the car going the other way a second before the collision. But certainly, the kid seems to have given him no time to react -- it looks like the collision could have easily happened if the driver was going 10 mph (to pick an arbitrary but really low speed.)
That said, these incidents are unfortunate -- they give those who would commit hit and runs ammo for defending their actions, ala "I was afraid that if I stopped and rendered assistance, I'd be beaten even though I did nothing wrong" -- which is likely to lead to more hit and runs for all of us.
Hopefully they'll catch all the guys who beat him up and robbed him.
That said, these incidents are unfortunate -- they give those who would commit hit and runs ammo for defending their actions, ala "I was afraid that if I stopped and rendered assistance, I'd be beaten even though I did nothing wrong" -- which is likely to lead to more hit and runs for all of us.
Hopefully they'll catch all the guys who beat him up and robbed him.
04-06-14, 10:13 PM
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The injured child was nothing more than an excuse for thugs to beat and rob a man.
If the motorist was exceeding the speed limit, he has most of the fault. If not exceeding the speed limit, he has no fault.
If the motorist was exceeding the speed limit, he has most of the fault. If not exceeding the speed limit, he has no fault.
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04-06-14, 10:14 PM
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Family Wants Answers After Angry Mob Puts Dad in Coma - NBC News
Steve Utash accidentally struck a 10-year-old boy who stepped off the curb and into the path of his pickup on Wednesday, Detroit Police Officer Jennifer Moreno told NBC News. The boy suffered a broken leg and has since been released from the hospital.
...
But, when Utash stopped his vehicle to check on the boy, at least ten "juveniles" rushed to the pickup and brutally beat him — leaving the man so critical that doctors induced a coma, Moreno said.
...
Authorities have determined that the accident was fairly unavoidable.
"The gentleman (Utash) had no chance of stopping," said Moreno.
...
But, when Utash stopped his vehicle to check on the boy, at least ten "juveniles" rushed to the pickup and brutally beat him — leaving the man so critical that doctors induced a coma, Moreno said.
...
Authorities have determined that the accident was fairly unavoidable.
"The gentleman (Utash) had no chance of stopping," said Moreno.
04-06-14, 10:40 PM
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I guess no one here ever took driver's ed in school (yes, I'm that old). He was clearly driving too fast for the conditions. Those conditions included having young children at the curb and positioned such that they were likely to be stepping off that curb. The "I kept my tires on the road" approach to driving is why we have over two million injuries and thirty thousand deaths on our roadways each year.
That was careless driving. Sadly, our police and to a large extent our legislators have allowed this dangerous behavior to become the norm. While I don't condone it (in fact, I condemn such violence), some push back is inevitable. The tension between prioritizing the speed of motorists over the lives of others is coming to a head in some ugly ways.
On the up-side, the car behind the incident did manage to stop in a timely fashion. I have read of too many of these sort of incidents where the victim would have likely survived but for the second car running over them as they lay helplessly in the roadway.
That was careless driving. Sadly, our police and to a large extent our legislators have allowed this dangerous behavior to become the norm. While I don't condone it (in fact, I condemn such violence), some push back is inevitable. The tension between prioritizing the speed of motorists over the lives of others is coming to a head in some ugly ways.
On the up-side, the car behind the incident did manage to stop in a timely fashion. I have read of too many of these sort of incidents where the victim would have likely survived but for the second car running over them as they lay helplessly in the roadway.
04-07-14, 01:33 AM
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I guess no one here ever took driver's ed in school (yes, I'm that old). He was clearly driving too fast for the conditions. Those conditions included having young children at the curb and positioned such that they were likely to be stepping off that curb. The "I kept my tires on the road" approach to driving is why we have over two million injuries and thirty thousand deaths on our roadways each year.
That was careless driving. Sadly, our police and to a large extent our legislators have allowed this dangerous behavior to become the norm. While I don't condone it (in fact, I condemn such violence), some push back is inevitable. The tension between prioritizing the speed of motorists over the lives of others is coming to a head in some ugly ways.
On the up-side, the car behind the incident did manage to stop in a timely fashion. I have read of too many of these sort of incidents where the victim would have likely survived but for the second car running over them as they lay helplessly in the roadway.
That was careless driving. Sadly, our police and to a large extent our legislators have allowed this dangerous behavior to become the norm. While I don't condone it (in fact, I condemn such violence), some push back is inevitable. The tension between prioritizing the speed of motorists over the lives of others is coming to a head in some ugly ways.
On the up-side, the car behind the incident did manage to stop in a timely fashion. I have read of too many of these sort of incidents where the victim would have likely survived but for the second car running over them as they lay helplessly in the roadway.
Had that been a driveway with a car pulling into traffic. Instead of the 10yr.-old boy. It would not have been far-fetched that, the driver in the SUV would have had a side-impact collision with another motorist. Potentially killing the motorist.
04-07-14, 03:45 AM
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Just heard a report that the kids were playing a game of punching cars as they drove by and sticking their legs out, then pulling them back just before the cars reached them.
B. Carfree and I have always agreed on the point he posted, but this case is a borderline for me. It was not in a residential area (right next to a gas station), kids playing dangerously stupid game. Again, for me - if the motorist was exceeding the speed limit, he has most of the fault. If not exceeding the speed limit, he has no fault.
B. Carfree and I have always agreed on the point he posted, but this case is a borderline for me. It was not in a residential area (right next to a gas station), kids playing dangerously stupid game. Again, for me - if the motorist was exceeding the speed limit, he has most of the fault. If not exceeding the speed limit, he has no fault.
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04-07-14, 07:11 AM
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OK, we're talking about a "pedestrian" who was standing at the curb punching cars, and who stumbled in front of a truck before being hit. I'm totally comfortable with putting, oh, 110% of the culpability on the kid in this situation. That's not a tragic case of inattentive driving. That's Darwinism at work.
To those who say that the driver was exceeding due to "conditions": I'd say that, if you're driving in a dangerous neighborhood and delinquents are attempting to punch your car, you might want to actually accelerate through those "conditions".
The fact is, the driver broke no laws, whereas the kid was punching moving cars in the street. I'm pretty sure that action brakes a couple of laws, and is about as foolish as one can get.
Now, if this does indeed become a high-profile case, the flip-side is that ppl may view hit-n-run differently. But anyone examining this case will have to see that this is a rather extreme example, both the specifics surrounding the accident and the crwod's response to the accident. It's unlikely that situations like this will occur frequently.
To those who say that the driver was exceeding due to "conditions": I'd say that, if you're driving in a dangerous neighborhood and delinquents are attempting to punch your car, you might want to actually accelerate through those "conditions".
The fact is, the driver broke no laws, whereas the kid was punching moving cars in the street. I'm pretty sure that action brakes a couple of laws, and is about as foolish as one can get.
Now, if this does indeed become a high-profile case, the flip-side is that ppl may view hit-n-run differently. But anyone examining this case will have to see that this is a rather extreme example, both the specifics surrounding the accident and the crwod's response to the accident. It's unlikely that situations like this will occur frequently.
04-07-14, 07:28 AM
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04-07-14, 02:24 PM
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Just heard a report that the kids were playing a game of punching cars as they drove by and sticking their legs out, then pulling them back just before the cars reached them.
B. Carfree and I have always agreed on the point he posted, but this case is a borderline for me. It was not in a residential area (right next to a gas station), kids playing dangerously stupid game. Again, for me - if the motorist was exceeding the speed limit, he has most of the fault. If not exceeding the speed limit, he has no fault.
B. Carfree and I have always agreed on the point he posted, but this case is a borderline for me. It was not in a residential area (right next to a gas station), kids playing dangerously stupid game. Again, for me - if the motorist was exceeding the speed limit, he has most of the fault. If not exceeding the speed limit, he has no fault.
04-07-14, 02:46 PM
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It's a pity this incident likely won't be used to increase the penalties for careless driving instead of being used as an excuse for irresponsible car use. When/if the driver recovers, will he think back and wish he hadn't stopped after running down the child, or will he wish he had been paying proper attention to his responsibilities while driving so that he never hit the child in the first place?
Pity you didn't bother to check.
04-07-14, 04:03 PM
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Updated news reports:
2 arrests made in Detroit mob attack on driver who accidentally hit boy with pickup | Fox News
Fund for man beaten in Detroit hits $96K | The Detroit News
2 arrests made in Detroit mob attack on driver who accidentally hit boy with pickup | Fox News
Fund for man beaten in Detroit hits $96K | The Detroit News
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04-07-14, 04:43 PM
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It's a pity this incident likely won't be used to increase the penalties for careless driving instead of being used as an excuse for irresponsible car use. When/if the driver recovers, will he think back and wish he hadn't stopped after running down the child, or will he wish he had been paying proper attention to his responsibilities while driving so that he never hit the child in the first place?
Though I don't know the details, it's entirely possible that the boy ran out at a corner (or between parked cars --- ), and the driver couldn't stop. Dash out accidents are very common in cities, and can happen to anybody, no matter how careful they are, including bicyclists.
BTW- in most jurisdictions, a driver who leaves the scene because of crowd fear will not be charged with leaving the scene if he drives to a police station and reports the incident. This is common practice in poor or dangerous neighborhoods (read Bonfire of the Vanities), and depending on circumstances drivers are well advised to do just that.
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04-07-14, 05:22 PM
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This is looking to be out of control feral youth and has nothing to do with the drivers actions. If they were bold enough to physically taunt a truck, I hate to imagine what they may have done to a cyclist or motorcyclist.
04-07-14, 06:10 PM
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This is an unfair characterization unless you have some kind of evidence about the specifics of the accdent.
Though I don't know the details, it's entirely possible that the boy ran out at a corner (or between parked cars --- ), and the driver couldn't stop. Dash out accidents are very common in cities, and can happen to anybody, no matter how careful they are, including bicyclists.
Though I don't know the details, it's entirely possible that the boy ran out at a corner (or between parked cars --- ), and the driver couldn't stop. Dash out accidents are very common in cities, and can happen to anybody, no matter how careful they are, including bicyclists.
The video seems to support the stupid kid report.
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04-07-14, 06:35 PM
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The police will no doubt investigate the accident, and the driver and/or his liability ins. carrier will make a settlement with the accident victim. But that's a separate and distinct issue than the mob violence which ensued.
Sadly, this kind of thing isn't all that rare, and leads to complicated racially charged trials afterward.
A quick search for "racial mob violence following car accident" brings up many similar incidents in various cities including Brooklyn NY Atlanta and Miami. (search past the first page of results which are mostly about this incident). One of the most famous incidents occurred some years back in Brooklyn, with a murder afterward. It was one of those rare cases where the Justice Department stepped in with a civil rights prosecution against a black man after an acquittal in state court.
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04-07-14, 06:39 PM
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It's detroit, you don't stop at red lights in certain parts of that city. This isn't gonna increase anything, because you have to be paying attention to this stuff, and most people aint.