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  1. #1
    Super Moderator no1mad's Avatar
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    I'm about tempted...

    To contact a reporter because of this line in her story: "Experts say you should be able to sit on the seat with your feet flat to the ground." You'll find it about mid-way down the page.

    EMSA Offers Bike Safety Tips After Fatal Tulsa Accident - NewsOn6.com - Tulsa, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports - KOTV.com |

    And here is the story on the event that spurred EMSA (the local ambulance/EMT outfit) to remind people about bike safety.
    Tulsa Police Identify Bicycle Rider Killed In Crash On Riverside - NewsOn6.com - Tulsa, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports - KOTV.com |

    The follow-up to the one immediately above- Tulsa Man's Death Has Family Grieving, Cyclists Rallying For Saf - NewsOn6.com - Tulsa, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports - KOTV.com | Note that the cyclist interviewed in this story has ownership interest in Lee's Bicycles and Trek of Tulsa.
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  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by no1mad View Post
    To contact a reporter because of this line in her story: "Experts say you should be able to sit on the seat with your feet flat to the ground." You'll find it about mid-way down the page.
    That is odd. It wouldn't hurt to send an email. Certain bicycles (like cruisers) can be set up so that set-up is correct (but I wouldn't call it common).

  3. #3
    Not quite there yet Matariki's Avatar
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    The article also says
    Helmets reduce injury crashes by 85 percent
    . Nice to know that you can avoid crashing if you wear a helmet.
    Any information, no matter how good, will always under-represent reality.
    -paraphrasing J a r o n L a n i e r

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matariki View Post
    The article also says . Nice to know that you can avoid crashing if you wear a helmet.
    Read your quote again. It says "injury crashes" not crashes.

  5. #5
    Not quite there yet Matariki's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rogan View Post
    Read your quote again. It says "injury crashes" not crashes.
    Subject of the sentence is "helmets", verb is "reduce", object is "crashes". In this poorly constructed sentence, injury is used like an adjective. The sentence should have said that "helmets reduce injuries due to crashes".

    I am amazed at how badly some of these (professional?) journalists construct their sentences. One wonders how the articles get past the copy editors.

    Your own post is a good example of ambiguous writing. Because you did not use a subject in the sentence you could be saying either that you read my quote again or instead that I should read my quote again.
    Any information, no matter how good, will always under-represent reality.
    -paraphrasing J a r o n L a n i e r

  6. #6
    Senior Member rydabent's Avatar
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    It is amazing who the press comes up with as being "experts" these days!!!!

    Wasnt it Mark Twain that said ------------if you dont read the newspapers you are not informed, and if you do read the newspapers, you are uninformed!!!
    Last edited by rydabent; 05-10-14 at 09:15 AM.

  7. #7
    Senior Member italktocats's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matariki View Post
    I am amazed at how badly some of these (professional?) journalists construct their sentences. One wonders how the articles get past the copy editors.
    .
    something i like to do on my morning trainrides to work; grab a morning paper and use a red pen to circle out all of the spelling errors and false conclusion in the articles im reading

  8. #8
    Senior Member daihard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by italktocats View Post
    something i like to do on my morning trainrides to work; grab a morning paper and use a red pen to circle out all of the spelling errors and false conclusion in the articles im reading
    Just kidding.

    I find it strange that they don't even run the spell check on their articles.
    Badly-behaved cyclists are usually just cyclists with inadequate infrastructure. Or none at all. - Mikael Colville-Andersen

  9. #9
    24-Speed Machine Chris516's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by no1mad View Post
    To contact a reporter because of this line in her story: "Experts say you should be able to sit on the seat with your feet flat to the ground." You'll find it about mid-way down the page.

    EMSA Offers Bike Safety Tips After Fatal Tulsa Accident - NewsOn6.com - Tulsa, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports - KOTV.com |

    And here is the story on the event that spurred EMSA (the local ambulance/EMT outfit) to remind people about bike safety.
    Tulsa Police Identify Bicycle Rider Killed In Crash On Riverside - NewsOn6.com - Tulsa, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports - KOTV.com |

    The follow-up to the one immediately above- Tulsa Man's Death Has Family Grieving, Cyclists Rallying For Saf - NewsOn6.com - Tulsa, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports - KOTV.com | Note that the cyclist interviewed in this story has ownership interest in Lee's Bicycles and Trek of Tulsa.
    The news story at the first link's second paragraph, mentions using reflectors along with horn or bell. Really stupid advice in my opinion from my experience. Also, Define the 'middle of the street' as mentioned in the fourth paragraph of the first link. To me, that could mean anything from crossing on the double-yellow line(not smart at all), to 'taking the lane'(I do that all the time).

    The second link, makes me thankful for constantly looking and listening to the traffic on the road.

  10. #10
    Senior Member italktocats's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by daihard View Post
    Just kidding.

    I find it strange that they don't even run the spell check on their articles.
    conclusionS



    at least i can pass the blame on my nationality

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris516 View Post
    The news story at the first link's second paragraph, mentions using reflectors along with horn or bell. Really stupid advice in my opinion from my experience.
    I have a horn and bell on my bikes, and find them very useful, especially on MUT's. The bell works great for announcing passes, and the horn gets through to those with ear buds or are otherwise clueless. A horn seems to be the only thing effective for cars, yelling is typically ignored or taken as an insult.
    Unless you wait till the last second when already you're next to them, there isn't a down side, and many folks express gratitude for the warning.

    Reflectors increase night time visibility, I don't see any down side to that.

  12. #12
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    I don't really see how the training or the experience of paramedics gives them any particular expertise on how to outfit bicycles or cyclists. It might have been more useful to get a report on the type/frequency of injuries seen when responding and maybe (though this assumes some investigation training/experience) some opinion as to cause of injury (contact with another vehicle, contact with road/road furniture, contact with rider's bicycle).

    scott s.
    .

  13. #13
    24-Speed Machine Chris516's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kickstart View Post
    I have a horn and bell on my bikes, and find them very useful, especially on MUT's. The bell works great for announcing passes, and the horn gets through to those with ear buds or are otherwise clueless. A horn seems to be the only thing effective for cars, yelling is typically ignored or taken as an insult.
    Unless you wait till the last second when already you're next to them, there isn't a down side, and many folks express gratitude for the warning.

    Reflectors increase night time visibility, I don't see any down side to that.
    Using them on the trails is not the problem. Using them on the road is the problem. They arern't bright enough, or loud enough.

  14. #14
    20+mph Commuter JoeyBike's Avatar
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    The Townie introduced Electra’s patented Flat Foot Technology® to the world and it was love at first sight. - See more at: Townie | Electra Bikes

    Electra Townie bikes and all of the copy-cats are properly adjusted with feet flat on the ground. Also it's a good idea to have a recumbent so you can rest flat footed (joking). So on one hand, they are correct. For more serious riders, this is incorrect.
    "For all we know his skills may be excellent, allowing him to ride like an idiot without actually being one." - FBinNY

  15. #15
    Cycle Year Round CB HI's Avatar
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    Using this Single Witness Suicide Swerve (SWSS) death to promote how cyclists are at fault for not having reflectors during the day, bells, horns, helmets, etc. is a load of crap.

    I was willing to accept the claim in the first and second link that the cyclist was trying to cross the street mid block by suddenly turning from the grass into the street.

    But then I watched the video in the second link as the cops are photographing the bicycle against the car as though it was T-boned. Does anyone see any damage to the bicycle other than the rear wheel. A T-boned bicycle normally falls to the ground and gets run over. The rider sometimes gets run over and other times rolls onto the hood and falls off the side.

    All I saw in the video was severe rear wheel damage, no other bicycle damage and the windshield of the car smashed on the right side. Same type of damage when a car hits a cyclist from behind and flip the bike up backwards and rider into the windshield.

    I really want to see close up photos of the bicycle and know if the cyclist left leg was broken or not.
    Land of the Free, Because of the Brave.

  16. #16
    Senior Member mrodgers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CB HI View Post
    Using this Single Witness Suicide Swerve (SWSS) death to promote how cyclists are at fault for not having reflectors during the day, bells, horns, helmets, etc. is a load of crap.

    I was willing to accept the claim in the first and second link that the cyclist was trying to cross the street mid block by suddenly turning from the grass into the street.

    But then I watched the video in the second link as the cops are photographing the bicycle against the car as though it was T-boned. Does anyone see any damage to the bicycle other than the rear wheel. A T-boned bicycle normally falls to the ground and gets run over. The rider sometimes gets run over and other times rolls onto the hood and falls off the side.

    All I saw in the video was severe rear wheel damage, no other bicycle damage and the windshield of the car smashed on the right side. Same type of damage when a car hits a cyclist from behind and flip the bike up backwards and rider into the windshield.

    I really want to see close up photos of the bicycle and know if the cyclist left leg was broken or not.
    I don't see anywhere in the articles that state the cyclist was crossing the road.

    Link #2 original news report

    ...also riding a bike north in the grass, swerved in front of the car.
    Link #1 follow up report

    Police say Garry Domres was riding his bike in the grass, then, suddenly, turned onto the road.
    I read the original article as the cyclist swerved from the grass to the lane in front of a car. Hence, the car struck the back wheel of the bicycle. They first show a shot of an officer carrying the bike supposedly from where it ended up at and another shot of the bike laying on the front of the car where you can see the wheel damage. Nothing is stating that the cyclist was crossing the road. It states he swerved onto the road from the grass.


    The follow up article quote, if you swerve onto the roadway, you have turned onto the road. It doesn't say turned across the road, just onto the road.
    Ride no faster than your Guardian Angel can fly!

  17. #17
    Cycle Year Round CB HI's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrodgers View Post
    I don't see anywhere in the articles that state the cyclist was crossing the road.

    Link #2 original news report
    Link #1 follow up report

    I read the original article as the cyclist swerved from the grass to the lane in front of a car. Hence, the car struck the back wheel of the bicycle. They first show a shot of an officer carrying the bike supposedly from where it ended up at and another shot of the bike laying on the front of the car where you can see the wheel damage. Nothing is stating that the cyclist was crossing the road. It states he swerved onto the road from the grass.

    The follow up article quote, if you swerve onto the roadway, you have turned onto the road. It doesn't say turned across the road, just onto the road.
    You left out link 3
    Tulsa Man's Death Has Family Grieving, Cyclists Rallying For Saf - NewsOn6.com - Tulsa, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports - KOTV.com |
    the one most indicative of the crossing claim.

    Admittedly, the articles are poorly written. But clearly the police lead the family to the belief that the cyclist was crossing the road. And the other articles imply such. Some comments came to the same conclusion.

    Police say a car hit Domres when he crossed into traffic from the grassy shoulder near 81st Street.

    Domres' family may never know why he crossed into traffic ... Family members believe he tried to ride over to the Casino across the street.

    You shouldn't cross the road in the middle of the street somewhere.

    Police say Garry Domres was riding his bike in the grass, then, suddenly, turned onto the road.

    Cyclist Mark Haynes said, "The signal light right here, I always cross. I don't ever cross straight across. I always go to the stop light and hang to the left, wait until my walking sign."
    25470135_BG1.jpg
    riding a bike north in the grass, swerved in front of the car.
    With a 8-10 foot shoulder, how does a cyclist go instantly from the grass to riding with traffic in the travel lane?
    Land of the Free, Because of the Brave.

  18. #18
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    "He should of been safe riding his bicycle," said Gordon.
    *facepalm* And these people work in a writing profession?

  19. #19
    Senior Member RPK79's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spivonious View Post
    *facepalm* And these people work in a writing profession?
    Well, if it was a direct quote the incorrect grammar is not the writers fault. (not the fault of the writer.... whatever...)

  20. #20
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    As a free-lance writer myself, I would say, absolutely call the paper and tell them what an asinine article it was, and tell them where they can find some 'real' experts to interview. I would vigorously insist on them printing a retraction, or failing that, to print my rebuttal article (which they would be required to, by law, if it is sent as a Letter To The Editor).

    Most newspaper writers are writing for newspapers because they couldn't make it the real world of writing.

    Quote Originally Posted by no1mad View Post
    To contact a reporter because of this line in her story: "Experts say you should be able to sit on the seat with your feet flat to the ground." You'll find it about mid-way down the page.

    EMSA Offers Bike Safety Tips After Fatal Tulsa Accident - NewsOn6.com - Tulsa, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports - KOTV.com |

    And here is the story on the event that spurred EMSA (the local ambulance/EMT outfit) to remind people about bike safety.
    Tulsa Police Identify Bicycle Rider Killed In Crash On Riverside - NewsOn6.com - Tulsa, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports - KOTV.com |

    The follow-up to the one immediately above- Tulsa Man's Death Has Family Grieving, Cyclists Rallying For Saf - NewsOn6.com - Tulsa, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports - KOTV.com | Note that the cyclist interviewed in this story has ownership interest in Lee's Bicycles and Trek of Tulsa.

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