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  1. #1
    Senior Member Shimagnolo's Avatar
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    Cyclist who refused to run red light punched in face


  2. #2
    20+mph Commuter JoeyBike's Avatar
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    Maybe the assailant wanted to turn right on red? I try to position myself on my bike as to never block that action by motorists. But a punch in the face is a bit overboard regardless.
    "For all we know his skills may be excellent, allowing him to ride like an idiot without actually being one." - FBinNY

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    Video clearly showed a sign for no right turn on red.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeyBike View Post
    Maybe the assailant wanted to turn right on red? I try to position myself on my bike as to never block that action by motorists. But a punch in the face is a bit overboard regardless.
    That becomes a bit harder to do when they stripe the bike lanes all the way to the intersection. If the victim had taken the lane to accommodate right turns, other motorists would have been angry that he left the bike lane, door zone and all.

  5. #5
    20+mph Commuter JoeyBike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by B. Carfree View Post
    That becomes a bit harder to do when they stripe the bike lanes all the way to the intersection. If the victim had taken the lane to accommodate right turns, other motorists would have been angry that he left the bike lane, door zone and all.
    I just stop in the lane-splitting position. Sometimes I have to wave the turning car past me on my right. Not sure the victims situation tho. I have dealt with this hundreds of times, but then again I stay keenly aware of my actions and how it effects other road users. If I am in a position to be polite it is not very hard to do so. But perhaps the victims situation was a hopeless one. I would have pointed at the light same as he did if I were trapped in the lane with some @hole honking behind me. If I get punched they had better knock me out cold too.
    "For all we know his skills may be excellent, allowing him to ride like an idiot without actually being one." - FBinNY

  6. #6
    Senior Member daihard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by otg View Post
    Video clearly showed a sign for no right turn on red.
    +1.

    I see that the behaviours of some cyclists invoke anger in motorists, whether or not those behaviours are legal or courteous. However, that should never justify any violence against the cyclists. Even if the "no turn on red" sign wasn't there, the motorist had no business of yelling at the cyclist, much less punching him.
    Badly-behaved cyclists are usually just cyclists with inadequate infrastructure. Or none at all. - Mikael Colville-Andersen

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    Boston is a very interesting place to drive, even for someone used to the free for all of NYC. When driving there, I've been honked at for stopping for red lights, been passed on the shoulder of highways, and god forbid taking too long to find an acceptable opening for a left.

    While it's never led to violence, I suspect the only difference is that bicyclists lack the protective cage.
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    I think the saying is.... "An ounce of prevention is better than a pound of cure".... just sayin

  9. #9
    Senior Member Shimagnolo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FBinNY View Post
    Boston is a very interesting place to drive, even for someone used to the free for all of NYC. When driving there, I've been honked at for stopping for red lights, been passed on the shoulder of highways, and god forbid taking too long to find an acceptable opening for a left.

    While it's never led to violence, I suspect the only difference is that bicyclists lack the protective cage.
    I have a friend who does not *live* in Boston, but has spent much of his career commuting to jobs there.
    He regards Boston motorists as a sub-human species.
    I've put the link on his FB page, but haven't seen a response yet.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by FBinNY View Post
    Boston is a very interesting place to drive, even for someone used to the free for all of NYC. When driving there, I've been honked at for stopping for red lights, been passed on the shoulder of highways, and god forbid taking too long to find an acceptable opening for a left.

    While it's never led to violence, I suspect the only difference is that bicyclists lack the protective cage.
    Not only Boston. I was once very glad to have that protective cage when the driver behind me at a busy intersection in NJ became enraged that I refused to enter the intersection just because it was already full of traffic. He jumped out of his car and started pounding on my window while uttering various profanities. Ironically when traffic later cleared I was able to move across the intersection and the light turned red before he could get back in his car.

  11. #11
    Senior Member Mr. Hairy Legs's Avatar
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    The chances of getting punched in the face are basically nil if you just don't make eye contact with anyone. I've been a cocky jerk for nearly 40 years and the technique has yet to fail me.

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    As a Boston rider/commuter this comes as absolutely no surprise except that it made the news- which I count as a positive, BTW.

    Right now, though, I am working (and riding/commuting) in San Diego. It's a whole other ball game here. I get the opportunity to ride in a lot of different locales and anyone who thinks all the same rules apply to every region/city might want to rethink that theory. I'm still adjusting to the SD culture of bike/car relations.

    And Dorchester is it's own particular world within the world of Boston. While this rider did nothing wrong, in fact, I'd very likely have behaved exactly the same- including pointing out the red light- you've got to read just how aggressive that driver is anywhere in the Boston area because Boston drivers are tough. And Dorchester has its own breed of angry and it ain't pretty when it rears its ugly head.

    I managed to commute through Dorchester for about 3 months a couple of years ago, often really late at night, and had not one negative incident- in fact, some surprisingly positive ones. I'm not sure if I was lucky or particularly savvy but I was pretty guarded the whole time.

    The fact that the guy read his gestures to indicate he "wanted to fight" might make an odd kind of sense to some Dorchester residents.

    I'm really relieved the bicyclist wasn't hurt any worse but it sounds like he got clocked pretty badly. That's the kind of hit that can kill someone.

  13. #13
    I STILL miss East Hill :) Rollfast's Avatar
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    It's an assault case. Why do you have to look like you 'wanted it'-doesn't that open up a lot of other wretched parallels of wrong thinking?

    How does posting this kind of stuff actually promote bicycle safety? If it's just some National Enquirer kind of sensational thing it's really not helping.

    I don't need to read the OP to see what has happened. The topic has probably strayed into a mud bog.
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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rollfast View Post
    It's an assault case. Why do you have to look like you 'wanted it'-doesn't that open up a lot of other wretched parallels of wrong thinking?

    How does posting this kind of stuff actually promote bicycle safety? If it's just some National Enquirer kind of sensational thing it's really not helping.

    I don't need to read the OP to see what has happened. The topic has probably strayed into a mud bog.
    No one is forcing you to read the OP or even post in the thread.

    Some cyclist find the information helpful.

  15. #15
    ---- buzzman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rollfast View Post
    It's an assault case. Why do you have to look like you 'wanted it'-doesn't that open up a lot of other wretched parallels of wrong thinking?

    How does posting this kind of stuff actually promote bicycle safety? If it's just some National Enquirer kind of sensational thing it's really not helping.

    I don't need to read the OP to see what has happened. The topic has probably strayed into a mud bog.
    And your point is....?

    Lost on me.

  16. #16
    24-Speed Machine Chris516's Avatar
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    The reporter mentioned, what the state cycling advocate had said. About cyclists' being accused of breaking the law. But then, also yelled at for obeying the law.
    Last edited by Chris516; 06-15-14 at 11:53 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeyBike View Post
    Maybe the assailant wanted to turn right on red? I try to position myself on my bike as to never block that action by motorists. But a punch in the face is a bit overboard regardless.
    No turn on red. (Trying to figure out what that sign has to do with an assault btw.)

    Quote Originally Posted by B. Carfree View Post
    That becomes a bit harder to do when they stripe the bike lanes all the way to the intersection. If the victim had taken the lane to accommodate right turns, other motorists would have been angry that he left the bike lane, door zone and all.
    See above - the bike lane is dashed on approaching the intersection. BTW, on Blue Hill Avenue they put sharrows at the Franklin Park/Columbia Road intersection. Does that style of infrastructure meet your approval? (I'm trying to figure out how paint had *ANYTHING* to do with this assault btw.)

    Quote Originally Posted by FBinNY View Post
    Boston is a very interesting place to drive, even for someone used to the free for all of NYC. When driving there....
    So you've never ridden a bicycle in Boston. Thank you for sharing. (Trying to figure out what this has to do with this assault, btw.)

    Quote Originally Posted by buzzman View Post
    As a Boston rider/commuter this comes as absolutely no surprise except that it made the news- which I count as a positive, BTW.
    While this rider did nothing wrong [emphasis mine], in fact, I'd very likely have behaved exactly the same- including pointing out the red light...
    Bingo. Full stop.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rollfast View Post
    It's an assault case....

    I don't need to read the OP to see what has happened. The topic has probably strayed into a mud bog.
    Near as I can tell, a few people take very little time before they blame the victim. Thank you for not blaming the victim

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    Last edited by mr_bill; 06-16-14 at 08:54 AM.
    Don't blame me, I'm from Massachusetts.

  18. #18
    Senior Member work4bike's Avatar
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    I don't know what happened here; info just too scant. However, seems like the state bicycle advocacy group suffers too much from victim-mentality, based on the group saying: We can't win no matter what we do. If riders follow the rules motorists get angry; if riders break the rules motorists get angry...


    This was probably some a$$hole, period. No need to agitate "War between motorists and cyclists".
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  19. #19
    Senior Member RPK79's Avatar
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    I dunno... Let me play devil's advocate here. The driver stated:

    Rodriguez said that he was behind him and when Nguyen said the light was red, he made a motion like he wanted to fight, and that's when he punched the victim.


    Clearly the cyclist made a fight motion and the driver was then obligated to get out of their car and punch them.

  20. #20
    Senior Member Gallo's Avatar
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    To call this a car vs bike seems a bit unfair. This I think is best described as road rage or even just rage. According to the victim. "this guy could just hurt anybody anytime for any reason" eloquently described I think
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  21. #21
    rugged individualist wphamilton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gallo View Post
    To call this a car vs bike seems a bit unfair. This I think is best described as road rage or even just rage. According to the victim. "this guy could just hurt anybody anytime for any reason" eloquently described I think
    Thank you. I can't help but think the same thing - the cyclist was the target of road rage and that's about the extent of it.

  22. #22
    Senior Member CommuteCommando's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by B. Carfree View Post
    That becomes a bit harder to do when they stripe the bike lanes all the way to the intersection. If the victim had taken the lane to accommodate right turns, other motorists would have been angry that he left the bike lane, door zone and all.
    I looked at the video, and the striping goes from a solid line to a dashed line about 100' before the intersection. This is done (and it is spelled out in my states VC, and probably in the MA VC as well) so that vehicles may "change lanes". That is the bikes traveling straight may move left, out of the bike lane-when safe- to allow cars to move over into the bike/right turn lane.
    Freedom is free. It's included in democracy. Democracy is hard. It involves dealing rationally with people you disagree with.

  23. #23
    Senior Member squirtdad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeyBike View Post
    I just stop in the lane-splitting position. Sometimes I have to wave the turning car past me on my right. Not sure the victims situation tho. I have dealt with this hundreds of times, but then again I stay keenly aware of my actions and how it effects other road users. If I am in a position to be polite it is not very hard to do so. But perhaps the victims situation was a hopeless one. I would have pointed at the light same as he did if I were trapped in the lane with some @hole honking behind me. If I get punched they had better knock me out cold too.
    +1 (and for once I agree with Joeybike) get in lane split area, and if car is behind seem to be hesitant, indicate lots of room and wave them on.

    Of course it is funny that people who will wait for cars in front of them get irate when it is a bike in front of them.
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  24. #24
    rugged individualist wphamilton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by squirtdad View Post
    +1 (and for once I agree with Joeybike) get in lane split area, and if car is behind seem to be hesitant, indicate lots of room and wave them on.

    Of course it is funny that people who will wait for cars in front of them get irate when it is a bike in front of them.
    So do I. But you know what, there's no law that says I can't wait for the green light, in a car, motorcycle or bike, and if in those rare occasions my judgment is to wait then I will. If some hothead gets out of his car to confront me physically over that, then in all likelihood he's going to jail. So it's hard for me to understand some of the comments about Boston drivers. Do they get special dispensation to be idiots in Boston?

  25. #25
    Senior Member Northwestrider's Avatar
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    I look forward to hearing of a follow up on this. I'm glad there seem to have been many witnesses .

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