"Turn your ********** light off!"
#126
Banned
I actually found Texans in big trucks much easier to deal with than people in Maine, Florida and New York. But, again, I don't have any hard data. I found that people in Texas really could control their dualies quite well compared to SUVs in the New England or caddy's in Florida.
#127
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If I want to ride safely, I emulate the German, Dutch, Danish infrastructure system. The technologies/rules have been evolving for roughly 100 years. The reason that strobes aren't allowed is that it's very hard to measure distance (otherwise motorcycles would use them as they share just about every issue that a densely populated road network). It's not about being noticed, unless you're in the sticks, it's about interacting with traffic flow.
#128
Banned
Germany has a completely different cycling infrastructure and attitude twords cycling in general, they can disallow strobes because strobes arn't necessary there. I'm not advocating 1000 lumen flashing strobe lights, but the drivers here require more drastic measures to get their attention. As great as that all sounds for Germany, it's not applicable here and not fair to judge cyclists by standards from other countries.
#129
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Let me expound upon the quoted coment. It appears you have taken it out of the context in which I intended it to be taken. There are motorists who are annoyed at the mere presence of bicycles operating on roadways. There are motorists who are annoyed by my "Lance Armstrong" shorts. There are a multitude of petty reasons for motorists to be annoyed by bicycles on the road. For that reason, I make a distinction between and annoyance and something that is unsafe. If I let the annoyance of motorists dictate my actions, I'd never ride on the road. I will not create an unsafe condition for other motorists. If I use flashing lights, I use low intensity flashing lights where they are legal.
It was generally a very good post and I would have had no problem with it if you had ended that there will always some people that will be annoyed regardless of what you do and you were not prepared to compromise anyones safety including your own just to avoid annoying some people .
What you said was "I don't care if other road users become annoyed with my light array as long as it doesn't create a safety hazard for them." This inferred to me, that you don't care about annoying people and so long as your lighting doesn't create an unsafe condition, you have no intent to change it or even consider ways it could be equally safe while being less annoying to other people.
#130
Banned
What you said was "I don't care if other road users become annoyed with my light array as long as it doesn't create a safety hazard for them." This inferred to me, that you don't care about annoying people and so long as your lighting doesn't create an unsafe condition, you have no intent to change it or even consider ways it could be equally safe while being less annoying to other people.
#131
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Me, I just try to stay off the road and stay on the bike network as much as possible, but a lot of people don't have that luxury.
#132
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One poster mentioned that buoys have flashing lights to help them stand out from the background lights. It can indeed be helpful to have them flashing. It must be noted though that they have a comparatively low luminous intensity. I spent 20 years running boats professionally. I know there is value to low intensity lights flashing to make them stand out from the background.
Combine that with super bright clothes with reflectors and I think I have found a good balance between visibility and annoyance.
Thoughts?
#133
Senior Member
One poster mentioned that buoys have flashing lights to help them stand out from the background lights. It can indeed be helpful to have them flashing. It must be noted though that they have a comparatively low luminous intensity. I spent 20 years running boats professionally. I know there is value to low intensity lights flashing to make them stand out from the background.
The same applies to bikes, in that a steady headlight is much easier to track and judge distance than a strobe. A strobe will get your attention, but at night, I think they are much worse than a steady light.
#134
Banned
FIFY: "There are jerks out there, for sure. Try to let their jerkitude roll off your back."
>dont be an online jerk, whining and posting about it for 6 pages , here, < "It's the best thing you can do."
>dont be an online jerk, whining and posting about it for 6 pages , here, < "It's the best thing you can do."
#136
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This isn't quite accurate. Aids to navigation have flashing lights to distinguish them from vessels, which have fixed lights. Also, aids to navigation can be distinguished from one another with different colors (red, green and white) and by varying the flashing period. Fixed lights on vessels are much easier to track.
The same applies to bikes, in that a steady headlight is much easier to track and judge distance than a strobe. A strobe will get your attention, but at night, I think they are much worse than a steady light.
The same applies to bikes, in that a steady headlight is much easier to track and judge distance than a strobe. A strobe will get your attention, but at night, I think they are much worse than a steady light.
You are right that a steady light will be easier to track and judge distance, but only if it is distinguishable from other lights. There are some really good bicycle lights available these days. There are plenty of lights however, that aren't bright enough to stand out. In those cases, if they were flashing, it'd help them stand out without them being a safety hazard to other road users.
#137
Banned
I am aware of the whole of the purpose of aids to navigation and their respective color and charactersistic, but I was speaking only to the point of the poster in that in practical application flashing helps distinguish them from background lights. Entering a busy port, with all of the lights of the city in the background, if the lights didn't flash, they'd be nearly impossible to discern from background lights. If you can't distinguish them from background lights, you certainly can't determine their distance.
You are right that a steady light will be easier to track and judge distance, but only if it is distinguishable from other lights. There are some really good bicycle lights available these days. There are plenty of lights however, that aren't bright enough to stand out. In those cases, if they were flashing, it'd help them stand out without them being a safety hazard to other road users.
You are right that a steady light will be easier to track and judge distance, but only if it is distinguishable from other lights. There are some really good bicycle lights available these days. There are plenty of lights however, that aren't bright enough to stand out. In those cases, if they were flashing, it'd help them stand out without them being a safety hazard to other road users.
In close perpendicular proximity as a bicycle is approaching (at a 90deg angle to, on the same side of the street) a car waiting to pull into traffic ... a blinky is horrible compared to a solid beam. The driver will notice both but can't judge distance of the approaching cycle as well.
#138
commuter and barbarian
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This morning I stopped on the highway, out in the middle of nowhere (good and dark), and leaned my bicycle up against a signpost so I could walk ahead and turn and look at it. I was looking at my Nightrider Lumina 700 on continuous low beam, which is tilted down to shine 6 to 8 feet on the road ahead. I was surprised at how hard it was on my eyes from that perspective (though no motorist is going to be coming directly at me). As a result of that observation, I now have the light tilted even more, so it is just over the front tire.
Most of my commute is on MT200, a 2 lane highway with vehicles traveling 60mph and faster. In the morning these days it is dark, especially lately with all the smoke we have from the fires in Idaho, Oregon and California that obscure any moon or star light. I have to be able to see the junk on the shoulder -- shredded tires, wood dropped from logging trucks, etc. I can't use a dim headlight.
This weekend I will dig out my old Planet Bike light and install it to use when I need a low-light blinkie.
These are my concessions. The world will just have to try to get by with them.
Most of my commute is on MT200, a 2 lane highway with vehicles traveling 60mph and faster. In the morning these days it is dark, especially lately with all the smoke we have from the fires in Idaho, Oregon and California that obscure any moon or star light. I have to be able to see the junk on the shoulder -- shredded tires, wood dropped from logging trucks, etc. I can't use a dim headlight.
This weekend I will dig out my old Planet Bike light and install it to use when I need a low-light blinkie.
These are my concessions. The world will just have to try to get by with them.
#139
Senior Member
"I didn't notice him until I was 20 feet away - too late to stop. Yes, I'm sure it was 20 ft!"
If drivers could judge cyclists distance and speed on a sunny day, I might be concerned about a strobe impairing this ability. Many drivers seem to lack this ability when it comes to cyclists.
If drivers could judge cyclists distance and speed on a sunny day, I might be concerned about a strobe impairing this ability. Many drivers seem to lack this ability when it comes to cyclists.
#140
Banned
This morning I stopped on the highway, out in the middle of nowhere (good and dark), and leaned my bicycle up against a signpost so I could walk ahead and turn and look at it. I was looking at my Nightrider Lumina 700 on continuous low beam, which is tilted down to shine 6 to 8 feet on the road ahead. I was surprised at how hard it was on my eyes from that perspective (though no motorist is going to be coming directly at me). As a result of that observation, I now have the light tilted even more, so it is just over the front tire.
Most of my commute is on MT200, a 2 lane highway with vehicles traveling 60mph and faster. In the morning these days it is dark, especially lately with all the smoke we have from the fires in Idaho, Oregon and California that obscure any moon or star light. I have to be able to see the junk on the shoulder -- shredded tires, wood dropped from logging trucks, etc. I can't use a dim headlight.
This weekend I will dig out my old Planet Bike light and install it to use when I need a low-light blinkie.
These are my concessions. The world will just have to try to get by with them.
Most of my commute is on MT200, a 2 lane highway with vehicles traveling 60mph and faster. In the morning these days it is dark, especially lately with all the smoke we have from the fires in Idaho, Oregon and California that obscure any moon or star light. I have to be able to see the junk on the shoulder -- shredded tires, wood dropped from logging trucks, etc. I can't use a dim headlight.
This weekend I will dig out my old Planet Bike light and install it to use when I need a low-light blinkie.
These are my concessions. The world will just have to try to get by with them.
#141
Banned
"I didn't notice him until I was 20 feet away - too late to stop. Yes, I'm sure it was 20 ft!"
If drivers could judge cyclists distance and speed on a sunny day, I might be concerned about a strobe impairing this ability. Many drivers seem to lack this ability when it comes to cyclists.
If drivers could judge cyclists distance and speed on a sunny day, I might be concerned about a strobe impairing this ability. Many drivers seem to lack this ability when it comes to cyclists.
Why make a poor situation worse (i.e. just let some more air of that under-inflated tire?)
#142
Senior Member
I was looking at my Nightrider Lumina 700 on continuous low beam, which is tilted down to shine 6 to 8 feet on the road ahead. I was surprised at how hard it was on my eyes from that perspective (though no motorist is going to be coming directly at me). As a result of that observation, I now have the light tilted even more, so it is just over the front tire.
#143
For The Fun of It
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I disagree here.
In close perpendicular proximity as a bicycle is approaching (at a 90deg angle to, on the same side of the street) a car waiting to pull into traffic ... a blinky is horrible compared to a solid beam. The driver will notice both but can't judge distance of the approaching cycle as well.
In close perpendicular proximity as a bicycle is approaching (at a 90deg angle to, on the same side of the street) a car waiting to pull into traffic ... a blinky is horrible compared to a solid beam. The driver will notice both but can't judge distance of the approaching cycle as well.
#144
Senior Member
I run a flashing front light ALL the time in the daytime, and at night if I'm riding in traffic or stopped at intersections. At night on the MUP or in low traffic areas, I'll run the lights on steady.
Last winter as I was coming home, there were some pedestrians crossing up ahead of me - I had my lights on steady. When they had crossed and I was passing by, I heard one of them exclaim "That's not a car - that's a bike"!
#145
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This morning I stopped on the highway, out in the middle of nowhere (good and dark), and leaned my bicycle up against a signpost so I could walk ahead and turn and look at it. I was looking at my Nightrider Lumina 700 on continuous low beam, which is tilted down to shine 6 to 8 feet on the road ahead. I was surprised at how hard it was on my eyes from that perspective (though no motorist is going to be coming directly at me). As a result of that observation, I now have the light tilted even more, so it is just over the front tire.
Most of my commute is on MT200, a 2 lane highway with vehicles traveling 60mph and faster. In the morning these days it is dark, especially lately with all the smoke we have from the fires in Idaho, Oregon and California that obscure any moon or star light. I have to be able to see the junk on the shoulder -- shredded tires, wood dropped from logging trucks, etc. I can't use a dim headlight.
This weekend I will dig out my old Planet Bike light and install it to use when I need a low-light blinkie.
These are my concessions. The world will just have to try to get by with them.
Most of my commute is on MT200, a 2 lane highway with vehicles traveling 60mph and faster. In the morning these days it is dark, especially lately with all the smoke we have from the fires in Idaho, Oregon and California that obscure any moon or star light. I have to be able to see the junk on the shoulder -- shredded tires, wood dropped from logging trucks, etc. I can't use a dim headlight.
This weekend I will dig out my old Planet Bike light and install it to use when I need a low-light blinkie.
These are my concessions. The world will just have to try to get by with them.
#146
Senior Member
I get what you are saying, but I think I need to once again expound upon my previous post to better qualify it. If that steady bike light was of lesser intensity than typical motor vehicle lights, AND there was a good bit of motor vehicle traffic in the area, then the risk of that light not being seen at all COULD be greater than the risk of a motorist misjudging the distance. While not a guarantee, my belief is that a motorist who is having a hard time judging the distance of something they DO see, will wait more often than they will proceed. So much of this is situational, that we could go back and forth indefinitely. I am straddling the fence on this one. I believe there are times flashing lights are better and there are steady lights are better. That may be why many lights have both functions.
#147
Banned
I think that given this situation the different lights approaching at different speeds is much more useful than a blinky. The human brain will process three lights (at a minimum), two from the car and one from the bike, much more easily.
#148
Senior Member
Not even anecdotal - just imaginary. My point is simply that my first priority is to be seen. If the driver doesn't see me, they can't judge distance, apply brakes, change lanes, etc.
#149
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If you scroll to the bottom of the BQ story you’ll find a link: Visual Expert Human Factors: Is The Moth Effect Real? . Near the bottom of that linked page is a list of references.