hypocrisy

[wasted weasel]

And speaking of penis fixations, isn't hummer some kind of slang for oral sex?


i think it's 'gummer'... something involving the removal of dentures....

ok back on topic

[Roody]

Keep it clean people!

<edit> Sorry--I thought I was posting to the "Butt Hygeine" thread.

[Trek Al]

This tread seems a little like those drivers that pass a bicycle, honk their horn and yell "GET OFF THE ROAD". A bigot is a bigot. If they want to drive a $50,000 vehicle that gets 8 mph and has crappy off-road performance, I don't care. Just don't run over me with that thing.

Al

[sestivers]

One would also assume that the owner of the H2 also pays a lot more in taxes each year and IS supporting wildlife in that manner!

The glass is half-full.

That's not really true in some places (Washington state). Those morons who paid $75,000 for their hummer only have to pay $35 per year for vehicle registration, just like the poor college kid with a $750 car.

All that money lost causes us to have the highest sales tax in the nation to compensate.

[JohnKn]

That's not really true in some places (Washington state). Those morons who paid $75,000 for their hummer only have to pay $35 per year for vehicle registration, just like the poor college kid with a $750 car.

All that money lost causes us to have the highest sales tax in the nation to compensate.

WA has a high sales tax because there isn't an income tax, although the democrats do their best to try and get one, it has nothing to do with license fees. The sales tax has nothing to do with the previously overpriced license fees. It's not like the sales tax goes towards fixing the roads. Wa does have the second highest gas tax which does go towards roads, soon to be the highest now that King count election officials managed to install their govenor to sign their raft of new taxs into law.

[slagjumper]

I hate hummers and think that the folks who drive them are making up for their's or their husbands' small Gherkins but lets get real-- if there are 6 people in there that's more people miles per gallon than a crx with one. A bus with less than 9 people? Better for the environment if they all drove reasonable cars. And lastly I've heard that 2 tablespoon of spilled raw fuel (ATV. lawnmover, weedwacker,etc) is as harmful to the environment as a gallon or more of burned fuel.

[FOG]

Freedom isn't real unless the other guy is free to make choices which you dislike.

[pilar]

you're right slagjumper, i went on a camping roadtrip with 5 of my roommates and we were in a suburban... we were definitely more efficient than packing into to two civics. but whenever i'm in stop&go traffic, it really irks me to look around and see 9 out of 10 cars (in general, not just SUVs) with just one passenger. of course i'm not saying freedom is a bad thing, fog, but i think we as americans are so caught up with freedom, self reliance, and all that great idealistic stuff that we inherently refuse to carpool and make sacrifices which are on the whole, better for society. we don't want to depend on other people and make accomodations for them, so instead we exercise our "freedom" to drive alone in a car that gets 15 or less mpg.

[billh]

Don't worry. I just saw an ad for the new "H3: same DNA, smaller chromosomes" . . . so I'm sure it will be much more environmentally conscious . . . grrrrrrr. :( Maybe they will make a Hybrid Hummer one day . .. yeah, that's the ticket! . . . DOH!!!

[closetbiker]

I think just about everyone is missing the point of the thread. Hummers being good or bad, I don't think is the point.

Hypocrisy means an expression of agreement that is not supported by real conviction.

The license plates feature a picture of some birds in a marsh or something, labeled "wildlife conservationist" and the numbers on the plate were "8 MPG"

Is driving that Hummer an expression of real conviction of a conservationist? Maybe it was used in the bush and was on a rare trip on the road and the owner had a sense of irony about him or at least he could see how a Hummer not used in the conditions it was meant for looked, very much, liked the opposite of what it was.

[randya]

Freedom: Being able to build, buy and drive planet-killing vehicles. :rolleyes:

By this definition, corporations should just be able to dump toxic waste wherever they want. True freedom is not about egotistical self-gratification, consideration must be given to care of the commons, too. The commons includes the air, water, public lands and public infrastructure (roads, water and sewer systems, etc.) we all share. The frontier is closed and the American Cowboy is just a myth perpetuated by Hollywood. Get over it.

Oregon's got no sales tax but does have a hefty income tax. I'd personally prefer it the other way around. Washington used to have much higher vehicle registration fees, but they were voted out during the tax revolts of the 80s and 90s. The condition of their roads is starting to show it.

[thelung]

As long as someone can say they use their Hummer for work, they get a tax rebate on the whole thing. People driving inefficient tanks are good for the oil companies, and the US government is the oil companies.

[mooncricket]

hello people

bird conservation plate/8mpg

it's a backhanded slap sarcasm

if only folks would stop ohhing and ahhhing at every ferrari, monster size mansion, million dollar jewlery, hummer, etc, and instead just shake their heads sadly at such flagrant and small-minded abuse of the planet's resources

maybe some day, such ugliness would no longer be "cool"

i'm not holding my breadth

[FOG]

Freedom: Being able to build, buy and drive planet-killing vehicles. :rolleyes:

By this definition, corporations should just be able to dump toxic waste wherever they want. True freedom is not about egotistical self-gratification, consideration must be given to care of the commons, too. The commons includes the air, water, public lands and public infrastructure (roads, water and sewer systems, etc.) we all share. The frontier is closed and the American Cowboy is just a myth perpetuated by Hollywood. Get over it.

Oregon's got no sales tax but does have a hefty income tax. I'd personally prefer it the other way around. Washington used to have much higher vehicle registration fees, but they were voted out during the tax revolts of the 80s and 90s. The condition of their roads is starting to show it.The economics of the commons is a well-discussed topic in economics, and the overuse of commons is one of the classic arguments for private ownership of resources. The implication of calling the pollutable air and water commons is very interesting, and suggests that the best way to preserve them is to create private ownership, so that the adverse impacts would accrue to an owner, who then would have great incentive to avoid pollution.

As to Oregon having no sales tax, but an income tax, I would like to point out that in general income tax is deductible on your Federal Taxes, while sales tax is not, although the tax code has recently been changed to let residents in low income tax states deduct some of their sales taxes. I would bet that Oregon residents get back a higher portion of their taxes in the form of deductions on their Federal taxes than do Wasington residents. Of course, you could live near the Oregon border in Washington (for example Vancouver,WA) and shop in Oregon, and avoid a lot of taxes.

[tomcat]

here is another way to view hypocrisy......people who drive a hybrid vehicle thinking how cool, smart and environmentally friendly they are. But....this person is commuting from their home that is 30 miles from where they work and who live in a big ol house that they don't need all that extra space cause they don't have children. I have friends who consider themselves liberal conservationists (no children) but who also own two homes (one in town and their weekend get-a-way in the mountains). Over consumption at it's best. I'm just trying to make a point that there are many variables to throwing stones in this discussion.


tommy

ps: We live in a small home in a historic district that is only 3 miles from our work place in the downtown area. I wonder how that compares to some of the people on this thread.

[randya]

here is another way to view hypocrisy......people who drive a hybrid vehicle thinking how cool, smart and environmentally friendly they are. But....this person is commuting from their home that is 30 miles from where they work and who live in a big ol house that they don't need all that extra space cause they don't have children. I have friends who consider themselves liberal conservationists (no children) but who also own two homes (one in town and their weekend get-a-way in the mountains). Over consumption at it's best. I'm just trying to make a point that there are many variables to throwing stones in this discussion..
There's certainly all sorts and levels of hypocrisy out there...but all things considered, someone with this lifestyle driving a hybrid is better for the planet than someone living the same lifestyle and driving a Hummer... :)


We live in a small home in a historic district that is only 3 miles from our work place in the downtown area. I wonder how that compares to some of the people on this thread.
I live in an older section of Portland about 2.5 miles from where I work downtown, and cycle year round. I went from living in Texas where I used to drive 20K miles per year to, from and for work, to driving that same truck (22 years old now) less than 2K miles per year.

[skanking biker]

[QUOTE=randya]Freedom: Being able to build, buy and drive planet-killing vehicles. :rolleyes:

By this definition, corporations should just be able to dump toxic waste wherever they want. True freedom is not about egotistical self-gratification, consideration must be given to care of the commons, too. The commons includes the air, water, public lands and public infrastructure (roads, water and sewer systems, etc.) we all share. The frontier is closed and the American Cowboy is just a myth perpetuated by Hollywood. Get over it.
[QUOTE]



Ok Chomsky

[jakemoffatt]

I've just ordered a Dummer shirt.

As for taxes... well folks with big vehicles like the H2 are getting their cake and eating it too.

The H2 is a tax loophole. Under Bush's new tax plan, business owners can deduct the entire cost of their $55,000 H2. If you are in the highest tax bracket, that's a tax savings of nearly $20,000! The government rewards you more savings for buying an H2 than you'd get for buying an electric car.

Note that anyone who claims this as a business expense for whatever reason is getting the tax break. Since the vehicle is so heavy, it qualifies as a commercial vehicle.

I remember also reading that there is a (Aha!, Found It here on Slate (http://slate.msn.com/id/2104755/)) California Law that bans vehicles over 6000 pounds from residential roads and perhaps others as well.

http://img.slate.msn.com/media/1/123125/123085/2093812/2104640/040804_Sign-6K2.jpg

Unfortunately, in most places this law is not enforced, so the H2 owners get a tax break on their H2 and they get to drive around in my neighborhood and park there without any repurcussions.

*******s.

[Feldman]

Which in the case of Hummers would be... fighting wars for oil? Just guessing here. :p
Well........It must take either no brain or no sense of shame to put an American flag on something that's guzzling more oil than needed. The only motorists who should be putting the Stars and Stripes on their cars are the Geo Metro drivers.

[rs00]

One would also assume that the owner of the H2 also pays a lot more in taxes each year and IS supporting wildlife in that manner!

The glass is half-full.

I don't understand what you mean. Are you joking?