Twaddle on this forum

[EriktheFish]

This is an open letter to Koffee Brown and the rest that run this board.
I thought I'd join this board and be able to chat and learn about recumbents. But what from I've seen, several characters such as "Spuds" and "The Professor" (are they the same person?) seem to just have private axes to grind and wish to lower the level of this board to the garbage that ARBR has become.
I've had enough, which means they've "won", I guess, as their game seems to be to turn folks off from recumbent discussion. I'll never be turned off from recumbents, but I'm turned off from this board that seems to let this crap run free. I just don't understand these "monkey-heads" and why they seem to have so much time to waste on ruining recumbent discussion groups. Are they really DF riders that have something against bents?

[twahl]

There is an ignore feature. You click on the user name and scroll down on the left side of the screen. Koffee is in transit at the moment, just got off the phone with her at the airport.

[Trsnrtr]

I've had enough, which means they've "won", I guess, as their game seems to be to turn folks off from recumbent discussion. I'll never be turned off from recumbents, but I'm turned off from this board that seems to let this crap run free. I just don't understand these "monkey-heads" and why they seem to have so much time to waste on ruining recumbent discussion groups. Are they really DF riders that have something against bents?

In case you haven't noticed, they are already gone and the forum has already returned to its boring sluggish state.

[bentcruiser]

This is an open letter to Koffee Brown and the rest that run this board.
I thought I'd join this board and be able to chat and learn about recumbents. But what from I've seen, several characters such as "Spuds" and "The Professor" (are they the same person?) seem to just have private axes to grind and wish to lower the level of this board to the garbage that ARBR has become.

It appears from the posts they have posted that they have in fact been banned. Of course, if you're indeed off the forum now and not reading, I am typing to myself.

[lala]

I would encourage all to use the 'ignore' option if some user(s) is distracting you from your normal bikeforums enjoyment. I myself have used it and found it provides a wonderful piece of mind. I believe the above mention ban is temporary.

Thanks, Lala, moderator.

[toybox]

This is an open letter to Koffee Brown and the rest that run this board.
I thought I'd join this board and be able to chat and learn about recumbents. But what from I've seen, several characters such as "Spuds" and "The Professor" (are they the same person?) seem to just have private axes to grind and wish to lower the level of this board to the garbage that ARBR has become.
I've had enough, which means they've "won", I guess, as their game seems to be to turn folks off from recumbent discussion. I'll never be turned off from recumbents, but I'm turned off from this board that seems to let this crap run free. I just don't understand these "monkey-heads" and why they seem to have so much time to waste on ruining recumbent discussion groups. Are they really DF riders that have something against bents?


I agree!

Hopefully there will be some meaningful discussion again.

[sukispop]

This is an open letter to Koffee Brown and the rest that run this board.
I thought I'd join this board and be able to chat and learn about recumbents. But what from I've seen, several characters such as "Spuds" and "The Professor" (are they the same person?) seem to just have private axes to grind and wish to lower the level of this board to the garbage that ARBR has become.
I've had enough, which means they've "won", I guess, as their game seems to be to turn folks off from recumbent discussion. I'll never be turned off from recumbents, but I'm turned off from this board that seems to let this crap run free. I just don't understand these "monkey-heads" and why they seem to have so much time to waste on ruining recumbent discussion groups...


I would encourage all to use the 'ignore' option if some user(s) is distracting you from your normal bikeforums enjoyment. I myself have used it and found it provides a wonderful piece of mind. I believe the above mention ban is temporary.

Thanks, Lala, moderator.

Hi Lala,

Thanks for "coming in" and commenting on this.

I completely agree with EriktheFish. Imho, this individual, who may very well post here under other personas as well(The Professor?), has decided to take residence here on this forum, for the sole purpose of bringing down this forum with volumes of useless postings, ridiculing and insulting recumbent cycling, recumbent bikes, and even some fellow members here, in the process. It's one thing when a member posts an opposing view or opinion on a topic relevant to recumbent cycling; it's usually done with a sense of mutual respect, and most of us here welcome a different and fresh perspective on the topic at hand. But, with this individual, there isn't that sense of mutual respect, and there's rarely an honest exchange of ideas to consider. In short, it is imho that this individual's presence here, in this recumbent forum, is a nuisance, and is unhealthy and counter to the friendly and supportive environment of this good forum community.

I'm aware of the "ignore" option(thanks for that feature, by the way), and it's a welcome tool to have, for that rare chance when I, myself, might have an individual problem with a particular member's postings. But, in this case, where there may well be a growing consensus of "concern", regarding this particular individual, perhaps there's another course to take for resolution....

Lala, Koffee, and Joe,

If I may ask, why just a temporary ban?

Thanks for your time, attention, and consideration.

[lala]

I am going to defer to the folks involved. (Koffee is unavailable at the moment.) I believe this was a warning/cooling off period. It would be interesting what would happen if everyone ignored the perceived troublemakers -- would they wander off, bored?

Please don't feed the trolls! :)

[EriktheFish]

I appreciate the words of reason from senior members written in response to my post. I have noticed the ignore button and was tempted to use it. But to me, allowing the type of postings that have become not just juvenile and self-centered, but offensive and insulting is a reflection of the board overall. Many can choose to ignore certain posters, which I might do if someone personally confronted me and I wanted no future communication with that person, but allowing a continuous stream of detrimental comments to be allowed both condones that activity and provides a public forum for it. If a ban (temporary or otherwise) seems to curtail free-form-verbal-diarhea tlhen I'm happy to return as a visitor and contributor. For I feel there are totally unmoderated forums on the internet (such as ARBR) where anyone can be as verbally destructive as they wish. I thought this wasn't such a place.
Thanks for your attention. EtF

[bentcruiser]

I agree, Erik.

I personally think it is the best thing ever that the moderators stepped in and dealt with this situation. I hope it is not just a temporary ban as one poster already acknowledged.

The ignore feature is okay but not great. If you are reading a forum, you really do not know what is going on if someone is responding to an ignored user, because you cannot see their post.

[bentcruiser]

I am going to defer to the folks involved. (Koffee is unavailable at the moment.) I believe this was a warning/cooling off period. It would be interesting what would happen if everyone ignored the perceived troublemakers -- would they wander off, bored?

Please don't feed the trolls! :)

Unfortunately a few of us who used to be on A.R.B.R. thought that way too. It did not help. Now a.r.b.r. is as trashed out as it ever thought possible. Many of us are looking for a safe haven to post where we will not be ridiculed or subjected to childish banter.

[MsMittens]

I hope it is not just a temporary ban as one poster already acknowledged.

If I may offer some insight from a geeky over-worked moderator (at another forum that has well over 60,000 members) about this kind of tactic. Bans, whether temporary or permanent, can be useless to a degree. Largely because of multiple IP addresses (through proxies or use of larger ISPs like AOL, RoadRunner, et al) and the use of temporary email addresses (e.g., hotmail, gmail, etc.). The only true way to get rid of someone like this is to not give them a reason to be here. Their only source of enjoyment is seeing you squirm and get upset.

The trick is to do some of the following (and there is no final, permanent solution for these kinds of "trolls"):

1. Ignore them (whether using the ignore option or "being the better man/woman"): trolls thrive on attention. Don't respond to them and they have no reason to exist (so to speak).

2. Report them immediately to a mod. That little "SPAM!" option at the bottom of every post is there for you to report questionable, offensive type posts. If someone is "spamming" (posting nonsense, extreme vulgarity, etc.) use that to notify the mods. By default it automatically gets sent to all moderators (usually by email). Whoever happens to be on at the time can then deal with it (this forum is lucky that it has a variety of mods from a variety of countries and timezones).

3. As hard as it is, don't let it get to you. If they truly had intelligence they would understand the power to using different kinds of bikes and the advantages of each (I presently have a MTB, am waiting for my Rock Tour 3rd world touring bike to arrive, want a single speed for winter and a recumbent at some point when the knees can't handle upright as much as they used to). Note I said.. IF (this is a big IF).

4. Most of all don't let them ruin the forum. If you let "them" control it, the forum will be ruined. But.. if you take control and remain active, then nothing "they" do can ruin it.

edit: what's ARBR?

[JohnCub]

ARBR = alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent

[MsMittens]

alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent <-- ah. Newsgroups are near impossible to moderate. They are an earlier form of "forums", so to speak. The term "wild" comes to mind.

If you truly want control, start a mailing list. The upside is that posts can be moderated before they are sent through (approved) and thus, a certain amount of control is maintained. The downside is that it can become "cliqueish". New members will feel somewhat like outsiders, assuming they are able to find the list. (I'm not suggesting that this would be intentional but tends to be a side-effect of mailing lists). Additionally, mailing lists tend to see specifically people answering and others being more "shy" about responding.

[twahl]

MsMittens and lala speak the gospel. Whiles it's tempting to argue with trolls, they will only drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience. And they will find a way back if they choose to do so, regardless of any kind of ban you may place on them. Unfortunately the people that post on a forum infrequently, as well as new people, will sometimes dredge up old posts that the regular users have managed to ignore into oblivion. That's not their fault, they come in and want to catch up before they post (which is good) and don't realize that they are digging up an argument or other sludge that had settled to the bottom four years ago.

So I hereby offer two rules of engagement:

1. Please read the original date of any drawn out argument. If it's original date is more than 3 months old, and there was a significant break in it, please leave it alone, even if someone else has unwittingly brought it back to the surface and you have an excellent point to make.
2. If a post if fairly obviously made just to draw negative attention, leave it alone. Pointing out that it is a troll still gets it the attention it was intended to get.

[sukispop]

Lala, MsMittens, and twahl,

you all raise excellent points...thanks for your tips!

From what I've heard, "S.M." was banned from BROL, and he apparently hasn't resurfaced there. From what some of the veteran members have said, he apparently goes from place to place. If he gets banned, then he moves on, looking for another place to continue his "work".

My hope is that his banishment, and the banishment of his "cronies", will be permanent here. If he finds a way to get back in, we'll soon recognize his posting style and nature and realize that it's him...then we should follow your advice, and ignore him until he leaves on his own. But-if you permanently ban him, and he can't get back in...if "they" can't get back in... problem solved!

[Trsnrtr]

The fact that my post makes the 17th one in this thread shows that 'the boys' are still controling this forum even in their absence. :)

[megaman]

The fact that my post makes the 17th one in this thread shows that 'the boys' are still controling this forum even in their absence. :)

And this wasn't the only discussion about them. In the communitee assistance forum someone asked that the problems be banned.
Sure just ignoring is the way to go, but, some days when your mood isn't too good it's hard ignore a mosquito.

[lowracer1]

Good grief, is it safe to come back to this forum yet?

[aikigreg]

The ignore feature is great for those who are veterans of the forum, but for those considering becoming a member here, or are new to the recumbent world and want honest advice and opinions, this place has sucked lately.

Had I been one of those newbies when I joned in January, I would have never bought a recumbent, and never joined this forum. I wouldn't have consequently bought my new racing road bike nor cometed in my first triathalon after reading the tri forum here.

Ignoring someone is useful only for those who many consider useful contributing members of a board. For trolls, there is no option but banning. You can ignore a hangnail, but if you ignore gangrene, you have to cut off the arm. Thanks to the mods for making the appropriate decision.

[twahl]

Well I'll have to confess that I don't have a 'bent...but my wife does! Some of the true car haters in the Safety and Advocy forum think I'm nothing more than a troll, but I've not encountered any negative feelings anywhere else. If you guys will have me as an honorary 'bent rider (I have been eyeballing one) I'll try to keep ya'll company.

[sukispop]

If you guys will have me as an honorary 'bent rider (I have been eyeballing one) I'll try to keep ya'll company.

You're welcome here anytime, Tom!

:)

[mominboots]

Don't encourage him too much. I keep catching him drooling on my bent or panting over the pics on-line of better bents. ;)

[sukispop]

Don't encourage him too much. I keep catching him drooling on my bent or panting over the pics on-line of better bents. ;)

:lol:

[twahl]

I'm not drooling, I'm cleaning a dirty spot for you, dear.

[aikigreg]

I don't think anyone here minds if anyone is posting, even giving dissenting opinions, so long as they're not trolling and trying to drive people away. Have fun!

[bentrox!]

The fact that my post makes the 17th one in this thread shows that 'the boys' are still controling this forum even in their absence. :)
Nope. I'm just dancing at "the boys'" wake.
There was nothing more confusing, misleading and totally worthess to those exploring bents or new to bents than the recent meaningless pablum "the boys" spewed, which is hopefully now exiled to wastelands like A.R.B.R. has become.
Moderators are here for a reason and they made the right call.
I can't even look at a PBJ sandwich without disdain now. :p

[KrisPistofferson]

I must admit, "Spuds" trolls made me absolutely bust a gut when he first got here, then it just got old.

[Trsnrtr]

Post #29! Spuds Lives!!! :D

[Wheel Doctor]

YAWN...... :rolleyes:

[Guest]

Ignore ignore ignore.

I think there's only so much we can do as moderators. If someone doesn't seem to literally be violating forum guidelines, our hands are kind of tied.

I think if people just ignored trolls, they go away. I mean, how much fun would it be if you posted and absolutely no one responded? Don't give the people who irritate you the power over you to control how you act and respond on the forums. You guys determine how long these trolls will be around, and the more you respond, it seems the more you encourage them to continue posting in such a manner.

I don't use the ignore feature on anyone (can't as a mod anyway), but I would find it annoying to have someone ignored. The curiousity would get the better of me and I'd end up checking anyway. The best thing I think I could do is just not respond.

Please, just ignore the trollers. Eventually, they'll go away. I did notice that you guys started pretty much doing that and things seem to be starting to die down, but you've got to continue doing exactly that- ignoring the trollers. They'll go away. And we'll keep a sharp eye out too. If they do something overt, let us know and we'll be on it.

Koffee B.

Mod

[vrkelley]

I am going to defer to the folks involved. (Koffee is unavailable at the moment.) I believe this was a warning/cooling off period. It would be interesting what would happen if everyone ignored the perceived troublemakers -- would they wander off, bored?

Please don't feed the trolls! :)

Lala is correct, this is a temporary ban. Hopefully, their new posts will be constructive and helpful to other 'bent' riders.