Bicycle Mechanics - Butted spokes with 17 guage center sections

How difficult is it to work these spokes?

I'd imagine that spoke twist might be a problem.

Im using these type of spokes now, its not the easiest thing and you probably wont want them to be your first build. Truing and just tensioning overall takes longer since you have to keep on pre stressing them since they do twist. You can buy those "twist resist" tools or something of the like but i wouldnt bother. If you dont mind pre stressing very often, they are no different,

Im using these type of spokes now, its not the easiest thing and you probably wont want them to be your first build. Truing and just tensioning overall takes longer since you have to keep on pre stressing them since they do twist. You can buy those "twist resist" tools or something of the like but i wouldnt bother. If you dont mind pre stressing very often, they are no different,

Is it hard to see the twist in the round 17 guage spokes?

I actually think oval spokes might be easier to work with because detecting twist would be pretty easier with a flat section.

I found a place called Wheelbuilder.com that has the Sapim cx-rays for $2 each (other Sapims are much more reasonable and under a dollar each)

Wheelsmith sells a much cheaper 17 guage (before shaping) oval spoke (less than a dollar each), but it has 15 guage ends (not 14 guage )

The 15-gauge ends could be a problem at the hub, if it is drilled for 14-gauge.

The 15-gauge ends could be a problem at the hub, if it is drilled for 14-gauge.

I think there are some washers that can be used that can help this problem. To be honest with you I'm too hot on using spokes with 15 guage ends. I'd rather have 14 guage ends especially at the nipple (more thread surface area)

I found a place that sells spokes pretty reasonably http://www.wheelbuilder.com/thumbnail.asp?offset=0&deep=2&cid=99

Oddsandendos is another source for good spoke prices.

2 bucks a spoke for CXrays? Thats pretty good.
You can see the spoke if you look very carefully but usually you dont. You can feel it if you lightly pinch the spoke your working on.

The 17 gauge spokes aren't bad to work with, you just have to take your time and prep them before you install. Use wheelsmith's spoke prep (or similar) so the nipple and spoke don't bind up when the tension gets high. I use DT Revolutions all the time. They're great spokes and well worth the small, extra effort.

Just one question: WHY?

Just one question: WHY?
They are a nice way to shave a fairly decent amount of grams

Last year I built some wheels with DT Revolution 14/17/14. I had no problems.

I've built three sets with all Revolutions. As the tension gets high, I hold each spoke with pliars. On 8, 9, and 10-speed rear wheels there is a big tension differential from driveside to non-driveside. Revolutions on the driveside tend to stretch and the wheel may need to be re-tuned after a couple of rides. 14-15-14 spokes may be a better choice on the rear drive-side. The only Revolution spoke I've had break was on the non-driveside in the "J" bend at the hub due to insufficient tension. To get enough tension in the non-driveside and a centered rim you really need to crank up the tension on the driveside.

Al

Just one question: WHY?

Butted spokes make a more durable wheel because the skinny center portions of the spokes are more elastic, absorbing more shock, and preserving the critical "J" bends and threads near the ends of the spokes.