Electric Bikes - Electric bikes for commuting?

Check out the Stokemonkey. http://cleverchimp.com/

It is one of the few electric bikes that utilizes the bike's gears.
For example, to go faster, shift to a higher gear, the rpm's stay relatively constant, at the motors most efficient speed.
Somewhere on the website it says only the more fit riders on regular bikes could keep up with a Stokemonkey over a 50 mile distance.

I am not against electric bikes.
But I hope everybody still remember the old days, when our cellphones and notebook computers were still OK, but batteries went dead. it was because nicads or nimhs were bad.
until litium-ion came along.

so, until there is a conversion kit for 'normal' bikes that uses li-ion, and not expensive, I think I'll better wait.

and yes, I believe, even though have not any experience yet, that kits from largo scooters, that uses brushless electric motors in the front wheel will be best for me.

when running out of juice, the other part of the bike is still your old bike, pedalling and shifting is just the same.(only heavier,though)

and they say it costs only 250 dollahs.......

Saw this on the Worksman Industral Bicycle (http:/http://worksmancycles.com/) site. $1,700.00 worth of bike on sale for $460.00.
http://worksmancycles.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/media/estelle.jpg
They are Estelle City Electric Bikes (http://www.estelle.de/e/index.shtm) that Worksman acquired when they bought the assets of another company.

Here's the link so you won't waste 5 minutes looking for it like me.

http://worksmancycles.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/page18.html

I just finished reading this entire thread, and I found it quite fascinating. I would really like to be able to commute to work on a bike comfortably in the future, although where my work is currently located, that wouldn't be so easy/safe. I plan to move in the future to Colorado, and it'd be nice to be able to commute to work and enjoy the beauty of that state.

Electric bikes sound like they could have quite a good future. It's ashame the battery technology isn't there today to make it more feasable. It sounds like the weight of these motors/batteries needs to go down, the range needs to increase, along with some additional speed. Also, obviously cost needs to go down, and the amount of rechargable cycles needs to go up. There's a lot of work for engineers, but let's hope some technology comes forward from the folks working on better, more efficient hybrid cars.

I am not exactly an environmentalist, but I would love to see America's dependence on oil decline substantially with alternative energy, and means of transportation and manufacturing, not to mention drilling for more oil, etc.

There's no reason for America to have such a lack of public transportation, or to have room for bikes on the road (safely). It's a shame Americans are so dependant on the car today. It may not be a luxury we will always have.

I just finished reading this entire thread, and I found it quite fascinating. I would really like to be able to commute to work on a bike comfortably in the future, although where my work is currently located, that wouldn't be so easy/safe. I plan to move in the future to Colorado, and it'd be nice to be able to commute to work and enjoy the beauty of that state.

Electric bikes sound like they could have quite a good future. It's ashame the battery technology isn't there today to make it more feasable. It sounds like the weight of these motors/batteries needs to go down, the range needs to increase, along with some additional speed. Also, obviously cost needs to go down, and the amount of rechargable cycles needs to go up. There's a lot of work for engineers, but let's hope some technology comes forward from the folks working on better, more efficient hybrid cars.

I am not exactly an environmentalist, but I would love to see America's dependence on oil decline substantially with alternative energy, and means of transportation and manufacturing, not to mention drilling for more oil, etc.

There's no reason for America to have such a lack of public transportation, or to have room for bikes on the road (safely). It's a shame Americans are so dependant on the car today. It may not be a luxury we will always have.

Get an optibike if you can afford one. You won't regret it.

http://www.optibike.com

It'll help you maintain 20+ mph on most streets which I think is essential for safety and saving time. There's a huge difference in the amount of time a car sees you before the pass and the number of cars that do pass between going 15 and 20mph. And even more so at 25mph. Also because you can get down a few blocks of a street before cars can catch up, you'll likely be more inclined to take the streets instead of the sidewalk -- another time saver and safety factor.

The bike also has nice fat tires (compared to road bicycle tires) that'll help you feel safe going over all the dirt, pebbles, potholes, debris usually found on the shoulders. Usually, to go fast you have to make a trade off with the tires. Not this this one.

It also has lights for biking at night and it's got range.

I don't own one, but I do have a bionx system. Riding around with that for a year helped me see the benefits of an electric bike. But I found its limitation in terms of speed and power.

I just ordered an Estelle from Worksman for my father.
I'll post pics when it comes in.

Get an optibike if you can afford one. You won't regret it.

http://www.optibike.com

It'll help you maintain 20+ mph on most streets which I think is essential for safety and saving time. There's a huge difference in the amount of time a car sees you before the pass and the number of cars that do pass between going 15 and 20mph. And even more so at 25mph. Also because you can get down a few blocks of a street before cars can catch up, you'll likely be more inclined to take the streets instead of the sidewalk -- another time saver and safety factor.

The bike also has nice fat tires (compared to road bicycle tires) that'll help you feel safe going over all the dirt, pebbles, potholes, debris usually found on the shoulders. Usually, to go fast you have to make a trade off with the tires. Not this this one.

It also has lights for biking at night and it's got range.

I don't own one, but I do have a bionx system. Riding around with that for a year helped me see the benefits of an electric bike. But I found its limitation in terms of speed and power.

Believe me, I wish I could afford one of those bikes. Honestly, they are just too rich for my blood right now. There would be two things I'd really need to see for me to get a bike like that. First, 57 pounds is just too heavy. Secondly, the price would have to be below $2k, at the very least. Third, the range would have to be better than 30 miles--more like 200 miles with a couple of hour recharge.

If they can come out with a bike like that, I'd be all over it. How long does anybody think before that'd be possible? Are we talking decades, or a few years?

Believe me, I wish I could afford one of those bikes. Honestly, they are just too rich for my blood right now. There would be two things I'd really need to see for me to get a bike like that. First, 57 pounds is just too heavy. Secondly, the price would have to be below $2k, at the very least. Third, the range would have to be better than 30 miles--more like 200 miles with a couple of hour recharge.

If they can come out with a bike like that, I'd be all over it. How long does anybody think before that'd be possible? Are we talking decades, or a few years?

Even if the battery weighed nothing, the bike would still be at least 35-40 lbs since you have to carry the motor around and the frame would be heaver to handle the higher speeds.

A range of 60 miles would be sufficient for almost everyone's daily biking needs. If those bikes were based on Lithium-Ion batteries, they'd probably get about 40 miles and weigh a few pounds lighter. To get to 200 miles on a 40 lb bike, you'd need a battery 10x lighter with 10x the range. That would be a battery with the same energy density as gasoline. Laptops could run for 300 hours and ipods would last all year!

Here's a list of energy densities and you can see how far above regular batteries gasoline is.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_density

I think within a couple of years you'll see batteries that will recharge in a few minutes.
The Optibike is expensive, $5500 to $8000, but I don't like it at all.
The Optibike, like the Stokemonkey, powers the crank, not the wheels. This is the way to go.
The Stokemonkey kit costs $1350. You also need to buy an Xtracycle, $399.
Add these to a Kona Smoke bicycle, $349, and you're good to go.

I'm seriously considering getting a Stokemonkey and Xtracycle conversion for my rigid mtn bike commuter, but the thing holding me back is the risk of theft/vandalism. The length/weight would probably defer most theft, but wouldn't stop people from destrying it. I'm also unsure how long a Stokemonkey will last given the envionrmental exposure of salt/freezing temps and continual abuse. If the thing won't work in temps of 0-10F over my 10 mile round trip, it wouldn't be worth the expense. That, plus that I only really would want the thing on when I was feeling sick or otherwise under the weather, and its weight would add significantly to the otherwise weight of the bike. I think I'll just stick with my 90-110 watt motor that I'm using right now....(me).

I think within a couple of years you'll see batteries that will recharge in a few minutes.
The Optibike is expensive, $5500 to $8000, but I don't like it at all.
The Optibike, like the Stokemonkey, powers the crank, not the wheels. This is the way to go.
The Stokemonkey kit costs $1350. You also need to buy an Xtracycle, $399.
Add these to a Kona Smoke bicycle, $349, and you're good to go.
The Giant Lite/Twist is also powered via the chain. I love mine, and have to fight both my father and brother for it. I get 25 miles to the charge and can haul 150+ pounds of stuff on it and a trailer with no problem.
They are no longer produced by Giant but Electric Vehicles North West (http://www.electricvehiclesnw.com/main/lite.htm) still has some in stock. They are the lightest in weight e-bikes I've seen (42 lbs). They run about $1,200.

http://www.myebike.com/img/bikes/lite-stand.jpg

Is anyone concerned with the servicability of a lot of these bikes?

They don't seem to stay in production long. I guess you can always rebuild a battery pack, but what if the motor dies or something?

Even if the battery weighed nothing, the bike would still be at least 35-40 lbs since you have to carry the motor around and the frame would be heaver to handle the higher speeds.

A range of 60 miles would be sufficient for almost everyone's daily biking needs. If those bikes were based on Lithium-Ion batteries, they'd probably get about 40 miles and weigh a few pounds lighter. To get to 200 miles on a 40 lb bike, you'd need a battery 10x lighter with 10x the range. That would be a battery with the same energy density as gasoline. Laptops could run for 300 hours and ipods would last all year!

Here's a list of energy densities and you can see how far above regular batteries gasoline is.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_density

It sounds like what you are saying is that what I want will take decades to develop. ;)

Is anyone concerned with the servicability of a lot of these bikes?

They don't seem to stay in production long. I guess you can always rebuild a battery pack, but what if the motor dies or something?

The service problems I've have had involved the bike's regular components and not the electric parts. I've 5k miles on the frame so far. The battery has about 80% of the range as it did when new. I'll need a new battery in a few thousand more miles. The electric bikes Giant still makes use the same battery as the Lite, so at least for now they are in production.
The dropouts take a lot of wear and have stripped somewhat, allowing the hub to slip on its axle unless it's cranked down. Aluminum may not be the best frame material for internal hubs. I'm going to put an XtraCycle trailer on the frame when the dropouts give up the ghost.
When the motor goes south I'll have to find another one off the web somewhere or have it rebuilt. Fortunately small electric motors are relatively simple and not hard to service.
It's an uncommon vehicle and I expect to have some difficulty with it, but I expect to have at least 20K miles on it before a major overhaul.

--A

Mongoose Update:
Commuting for about 16 weeks now with the Mongoose electric bike from Walmart.
Averaging about 4 days per week of use so far, so about 65 round trips (around 7.3 miles round trip).
Usually use full power going in to work with walking-effort pedalling.
Coming home probably half the time I just use pedal power, half the time full electric +more vigorous pedalling.
Initially this was probably draining the battery about 30% on a daily basis, but over the past few weeks, it is markedly more slugish. I did a timed run with no pedalling to see how the battery was holding up.
Last month, at around 50 trips/ 50 charges, overall performance was not appreciably changed from initial performance over this 7.3 mile range.
Range has definitely taken a big hit since initial testing of the fresh battery pack.
Going in - 3.45mi, 13:08 minutes, avg speed 15.8 mph - this is right on par with all previous runs.
Coming home, ran out of juice.
Went 1 mile fine (at around 15 mph). Then over then next 0.5 mile, dropped down to 10 mph, at which point I relented and pedalled it in. So current range, battery only, is about 4.5 miles.
Initial testing with fresh battery in January showed 14 mile range at around 16 mph, with death over the next mile (=dropping down to 10mph).
So after 65 charges, range is down almost 70%.
I guess I need to start looking into replacing the batteries. Currie sells a pair of batteries for $80, but I'm thinking there may be better options.

Lithium ion polymer batteries are the only way to go. They are light, they pack a huge amount of energy in a small package, and they are getting cheaper. I've been using the same battery for 3 years. It gets recharged everyday, and it's still going strong. Yes it costs more upfront, but you don't have to replace it every six months or so. Check it out:
http://www.ecospeed.net/

Lithium polymer is a bit dangerous with high current draws. They can explode if they get too hot.
I don't have enough mileage on my Li-ion Bion-x yet so I can't really say how they'll hold up.

When it comes time to replace those batteries, I'm sure I'll be looking at LiPos as well.

Lithium polymer is a bit dangerous with high current draws. They can explode if they get too hot.
I don't have enough mileage on my Li-ion Bion-x yet so I can't really say how they'll hold up.

When it comes time to replace those batteries, I'm sure I'll be looking at LiPos as well.

Lithium batteries owe their very high performance to highly reactive and lightweight lithium metal. That reactivity causes safety issues that users need to be aware of.

However, the lithium in a lithium ion polymer battery is embedded in a polymer matrix where it is perfectly safe in use. Even physical damage to the battery, as in a crash, will not result in a safety issue. Furthermore, lithium ion polymer batteries are not as prone to thermal runaway as conventional lithium batteries such as used in laptops. You may be confusing laptop lithium batteries with lithium ion polymer.

In many ways, these batteries are much safer than even conventional lead acid batteries, However, any large energy storage device, wheter it's a battery or a gasoline tank should be treated with caution and respect.

Er no.. LiPos are dangerous. I had one in my RC plane and the motor just drew too much current. As I was flying it one day... BANG!, the front part of the foam body just blew up and the plane came crashing down.

My RC helicopter has a LiPo as well but its doing just fine. But that's because it's a micro-heli with a small electric motor.

Y'all made the New York Times today (http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/06/business/yourmoney/06bikes.html?ref=yourmoney).

Here's how it starts:

A Two-Wheeled Option (With a Battery) for Commuters

By BARRY REHFELD
Published: May 6, 2007

JEFF BAUM has a breathtaking daily commute. He travels 10 miles each way from his home in Frisco, Colo., to his office in Breckenridge — up and down winding roads that eventually climb to 9,800 feet in the Rockies — to his job as the executive director of the Breckenridge Music Festival.

For most of his 10 years with the festival, he had driven a standard gasoline-powered sport utility vehicle. Last September, though, he started leaving it at home for something cheaper, quieter and cleaner: an electric bicycle.

It takes him a little longer to get to work, but the bike is more dependable, more nimble, more invigorating and just more fun than the S.U.V., he said.

* * *

Those ecospeed batteries (and bikes too, for that matter) look great, but $1200 for a battery is too much for me to justify.
Any suggestions for, say, under $300?

Those ecospeed batteries (and bikes too, for that matter) look great, but $1200 for a battery is too much for me to justify.
Any suggestions for, say, under $300?

Hoofer,
Thanks for your informative posts. I'm taking the plunge on the walmart bike! This is my first foray into the world of ebikes. I probably won't be posting such detailed info as you since you've probably covered much of what I'll be doing. We have similar commutes. Keep us updated on your replacement batteries search since I will probably run into that down the road.

One question: Have you looked into an extra charger to keep at work now that range is going down? How much would those go for?

Thanks.

Check out the Stokemonkey. http://cleverchimp.com/

It is one of the few electric bikes that utilizes the bike's gears.
For example, to go faster, shift to a higher gear, the rpm's stay relatively constant, at the motors most efficient speed.
Somewhere on the website it says only the more fit riders on regular bikes could keep up with a Stokemonkey over a 50 mile distance.
Slight correction, thats keep up with a loaded Xtracycle/stokemonkey combo over 50 miles. for example, see the pic top left of the home page. As for serviceability of the stokemonkey ( someone else was asking ) The frame on the stokemonkey is anything you make it, good ol' steel MTB are favorite. The components are very high quality all the way thru, read his blog. As for batteries, there is a company down in texas who claim to be on the verge of shipping an ultra capacitor with 3 times the power density of NiMH at half the cost of Lead Acid with pretty much unlimited recharges. Not sure it will come true, but if it does....

I am in the process of buying an Xtracycle, with a stokmonkey to follow shortly after.

Currie sells chargers for $50, so not overly expensive. Using it would be a little bit of a hassle, but the main reason I haven't done so is that I don't care that much if the battery is dead when I ride home.

I have heard that letting the battery sit all day in a partially charged state is not good for it, so maybe if I had charged it at work every day it might have lasted longer, but again more hassle than I would like.

As long as I can maintain around 15 mph with easy pedalling on the way in to work, it is serving the purpose.

With SLA batteries every time you drain them deeply (basically more than 50%) you reduce their life span and capacity.
If the batteries were regularly topped up at work I bet the batteries would still be like new.
Re the discussion on longer ranges in the future one of the riders at the endless sphere forum from memory calculated that the recumbent trike he has if run at 35 mph would have in excess of 100 mile range using LiPo or LiIon (can't remeber which) batteries that he is using.

Mongoose update:
I took the Walmart mongoose electric bike for a test run to see what the range is now, after about 20 weeks, averaging about 4 days per week, so around 80 round trips (around 7.3 miles round trip).
Last month the range was down to 4.5 miles, but the speed / performance over the 3.5 mile ride to work was not reduced from initial testing. Trip time was 13:08 last month.
Today's run to work, 3.5 miles, in 14:30. The time was significantly down from earlier runs, and clearly the speed was tailing off by the time I got there. I continued only another 0.1 mile before speed dropped below 10 mph.
So at 80 trips/ 80 charges, range is about 3.6 miles.
Initial testing with fresh battery in January showed 14 mile range at around 16 mph, with death over the next mile (=dropping down to 10mph).
So after 80 charges, range is down 76%.
I'm thinking I'm going to replace the batteries with a NiCad pack form batteryspace.com that goes for about $160. Supposed to be back in stock in a couple weeks.

Mongoose update:
I took the Walmart mongoose electric bike for a test run to see what the range is now, after about 20 weeks, averaging about 4 days per week, so around 80 round trips (around 7.3 miles round trip).
Last month the range was down to 4.5 miles, but the speed / performance over the 3.5 mile ride to work was not reduced from initial testing. Trip time was 13:08 last month.
Today's run to work, 3.5 miles, in 14:30. The time was significantly down from earlier runs, and clearly the speed was tailing off by the time I got there. I continued only another 0.1 mile before speed dropped below 10 mph.
So at 80 trips/ 80 charges, range is about 3.6 miles.
Initial testing with fresh battery in January showed 14 mile range at around 16 mph, with death over the next mile (=dropping down to 10mph).
So after 80 charges, range is down 76%.
I'm thinking I'm going to replace the batteries with a NiCad pack form batteryspace.com that goes for about $160. Supposed to be back in stock in a couple weeks.


I'm not sure if it's the battery or the bike, but even with an old LA battery, you should be doing better than that. I bought a brushless hub kit from Wilderness Energy that came with a 36 volt LA battery. I still have it but, wow is it heavy compared with the NiCads I bought. I found that during my 24 km (each way) run, the LA was pretty much done. I'd take the charger to work each time, but I know that's not good for a LA battery. When I got the NiCads the improvement was spectacular, the only thing is the batteries heat up with continuous use, so I have to keep them cool. I run them all the way down once a week. I've been doing this since late February and it seems to work. Now I just use the LAs as back up.

With the current bike I'm running I have a top speed of about 35 km/hr. It takes me just under an hour to travel the 24 kms.

SLAs will run down a bit and stay at a steady level for a while before they die down completly. I noticed this with my older eBike as well. Great performance the first few months and then it started degrading.

You also have to be careful with NiCads since they may develop a memory. I won't have this issue with my Li-Ions in my Bionx. But it's a bit early to tell.

.. you should be doing better than that..

I'm not sure about that.
The brochure says expected battery life is 3 months or 100 charges.


.. I'd take the charger to work each time, but I know that's not good for a LA battery..

Actually, I think with lead acid batteries, the less deeply they are discharged, and the quicker you recharge them, the better. So you really should recharge them at work. I don't do so, because that would be a hassle.

SLAs will run down a bit and stay at a steady level for a while before they die down completly... Great performance the first few months and then it started degrading.
.

My impression was that the performance (range) has been falling pretty linearly from the start - about 1% per charge, although I didn't do enough testing early in the first couple months to really say for sure.

I have heard that NiCads should be deeply discharged at least once a month.

I was thinking that the NiCads would have a similar, or maybe even a little better number of recharges/ lifespan as LiIons - perhaps 500. NiCads are bigger, heavier and worse for the environment, but significantly cheaper. Also the NiCad I'm looking at is rated at 7 amp hours, while the original SLA was rated at 12 Amp hours. I'm thinking that this is the best/ cheapest way to get the job done for the next year or so.

I'm not sure if it's the battery or the bike, but even with an old LA battery, you should be doing better than that. I bought a brushless hub kit from Wilderness Energy that came with a 36 volt LA battery. I still have it but, wow is it heavy compared with the NiCads I bought. I found that during my 24 km (each way) run, the LA was pretty much done. I'd take the charger to work each time, but I know that's not good for a LA battery. When I got the NiCads the improvement was spectacular, the only thing is the batteries heat up with continuous use, so I have to keep them cool. I run them all the way down once a week. I've been doing this since late February and it seems to work. Now I just use the LAs as back up.

With the current bike I'm running I have a top speed of about 35 km/hr. It takes me just under an hour to travel the 24 kms.

That's the same kit that I have. Did you get the 7Ah battery pack, or the 12Ah pack? I'm still using the 12Ah SLA battery pack that came with my kit. I ride 6.75 miles each way to work, recharging at home & office, so they don't get a deep discharge. I have noticed that my unassisted top speed is down maybe 1 mph, but it's hard to say for sure because it's been windy here the last month or so. I have ~1500 miles on these batteries so far.

Heavy? Yeah, these things define "heavy". I broke a couple of spokes on the rear wheel (I'm 195 pounds) then I rebuilt the rear wheel with DT Alpine III spokes and a Mavic A719 rim. No problems now. Still, when these batteries die I'll probably switch to NiMH batteries. If I do, I'll go with a lower capacity battery pack, too.

That's the same kit that I have. Did you get the 7Ah battery pack, or the 12Ah pack? I'm still using the 12Ah SLA battery pack that came with my kit. I ride 6.75 miles each way to work, recharging at home & office, so they don't get a deep discharge. I have noticed that my unassisted top speed is down maybe 1 mph, but it's hard to say for sure because it's been windy here the last month or so. I have ~1500 miles on these batteries so far.

Heavy? Yeah, these things define "heavy". I broke a couple of spokes on the rear wheel (I'm 195 pounds) then I rebuilt the rear wheel with DT Alpine III spokes and a Mavic A719 rim. No problems now. Still, when these batteries die I'll probably switch to NiMH batteries. If I do, I'll go with a lower capacity battery pack, too.

What's the current weight difference between your current SLAs and the nimhs you're planning to get?

Mongoose update:
I got my NiCad pack from batteryspace last week. I just got back from vacation, so I havent done anything with it yet. Hopefully over the next few days I will get it installed and have some data.

Mongoose update:
Well, I did get the new battery pack installed yesterday, and charged it overnight.
Seemed to charge ok. Had a red light in the afternoon, which had changed to a green light by morning. The instructions indicate this should mean that it has charged fully.
Commute to work was a bit disapointing
Rather than the mostly 16 mph cruise speed that the original SLA gave me, the NiCads topped out at 15 mph, and were notably more sluggish in acceleration than fully charged SLA. There was more traffic than normal this morning, so I had to wait at a couple stop signs that I usually can blow through, and I also dropped off a letter at the post office, which is on the route, but had to stop for a second for that.
Still, time in to work was 16:16, with average 12.9 mph speed, distance 3.50 miles. Not very good.
Also, at around the 3 mile marker point, I lost power entirely. This lasted about 50 seconds. I could still pedal fine, which I did, without much enthusiasm, at about 11 mph.
I'm not sure what had caused this. My soldering iron wasn't working right, so I could barely melt the solder and therefore my installation was rather shoddy, so maybe something was loose. I think there is a temperature probe built into the pack, so maybe that was the problem.
The battery was going flat on the way home, and I ended up going a total of another 4.5 miles before speed dropped to below 10 mph.
This was a more gradual decline in speed than I had seen with the SLA batteries, which would maintain 15-16 mph until the end, then drop to 10 mph over about a mile.
With the NiCads, my average speed each mile was 13.2, 13.1, 12.5, 11.6, 10.0, so tailed off slower.
Total range was therefore 8 miles.
I'm hoping things will improve after a couple charges.

My soldering iron wasn't working right, so I could barely melt the solder and therefore my installation was rather shoddy, so maybe something was loose. I think there is a temperature probe built into the pack, so maybe that was the problem.
If the connection is shoddy it can really drop the voltage (making it perform like a discharged LA battery) and heat up at the connection (significantly decreasing range). Is the location of your connections overheating when you run? If it is really poor it could start melting stuff which isn't so good.
Might contact those that sent you the new battery. Maybe it needs a few cycles before it gets really solid performance. Even if it does need some cycles under the belt make sure your connections are good or it could destroy stuff down the road.
Of course it could just be the lower capacity of the new pack if you really did go from 12AH to 7AH.

Mongoose update:
Second day with the 24v, 7 AH Nicad pack.
To work 3.45mi. in 14:02, avg speed 14.7mph
Better than yesterday, but this was about a technically perfect ride (kept throttle nailed the whole time, didn't need to slow down for stop signs or lights, no wind), and still almost a minute longer than what I saw with the SLA pack.
Home - it went 3.5miles (of 3.75 mile trip) before falling to 10 mph
average speed per mile 12.2mph, 12.6mph, 11.7mph
So range today only = 7 miles.
I was hoping for slightly better peformance, but I guess that is the price I pay for going from the 12 AH SLA to a 7 AH battery.
If this performance is maintained over at least a few hundred charge cycles, I guess it will be adequate.

Mongoose update:
Sixth day with the 24v 7 AH NiCad pack.
Fortunately performance figures are looking up after a few recharge cycles.
To work 3.45 miles in 13:10, 15.7 mph avg
Home (longer route) 3.84 miles in 15:28
Total range ( =speed dropping to 10 mph) 9.8 miles

I ride my ebike through a local tunnel where regular cyclists have to use a shuttle which has a limited schedule, and does not run year round.

http://www.th.gov.bc.ca/popular-topics/driver_info/route-info/massey/massey.htm

as petrol price rises and cities become more clogged up on the roads ebike will definantly grow,they are booming in sydney now,we have the most shocking public transport system at the moment,petrol is $1.50 per litre,rego is $1000,insurance another $1000, road tolls are become a silly price too,my ebike is my main mode of transport.price is not really an issue most folk will pay a good price for a good ebike as they do want an alternative to cars and slow public transport.owning a car these days just isnt the best option,we should also be looking at making hydrogen and electric cars now,its time to get off that oil treadmill and force the govs around the world to follow.we can make a difference today,not in 50 years time.

I have been trying to read through this whole thread but have not been able to yet. Can anyone recommend a good place to buy a motor? Not a hub motor, but a motor that requires a belt or a chain? I am looking for a 350watt or greater that will run on anything from 36 volts to 72 volts