"The 33"-Road Bike Racing - stage 19: SAVIGLIANO- SESTRIERE (Le Valli Olimpiche)

stage 19: SAVIGLIANO- SESTRIERE (Le Valli Olimpiche), 190 km

http://www.gazzetta.it/Speciali/Giroditalia/2005/upload/alt/alt19.jpg

Holy crap! Has anyone checked out this climb tomorrow? 18.5k AVERAGE 9.5%! To make matters worse (or better, depending on how you look at it) the last 7.9k is unpaved.

RAI just had a piece with Cunego and Simoni training on it. It's wild looking - just a one-lane road. The unpaved section looks more like a path through the woods than a road. With a big Saturday crowd up there it's gonna be crazy.

Salvoldelli got himself a cushion today, but if someone blows on the Colle della Finestre they'll lose a bunch of time.

C

That film was taken in the winter, when they reccied it with Davide Cassani for RAI.

See the thread "Are they really going to ride this?" for what I think is news.

Ciao...Gary

Holy crap! Has anyone checked out this climb tomorrow? 18.5k AVERAGE 9.5%! To make matters worse (or better, depending on how you look at it) the last 7.9k is unpaved.

Yes, this is the climb this year. Even bigger than the Stelvio, closer to the finish and less descending for Savoldelli to gain/regain time on.

http://www.gazzetta.it/Speciali/Giroditalia/2005/upload/tap/Tappa19_1_Finestre.jpg

But Savoldelli has a nice descent before this climb to gain some extra time. I think it's going to be a historic battle tomorrow.

Man, that's a ludicrous finish. I'll be enjoying it from a safe distance in my recliner under a ceiling fan with a cold beer at my side. :)

But Savoldelli has a nice descent before this climb to gain some extra time. I think it's going to be a historic battle tomorrow.

True, but most of it is a pretty gentle grade (dropping 800 metres in 36 kilometres) and a rather big (by Alpine standards) so probably not very technical -> bad for Savoldelli. The GC (top 4) is almost perfectly balanced after today for a spectacular stage tomorrow.

True, but most of it is a pretty gentle grade (dropping 800 metres in 36 kilometres) and a rather big (by Alpine standards) so probably not very technical -> bad for Savoldelli. The GC (top 4) is almost perfectly balanced after today for a spectacular stage tomorrow.

However, this means that any attack on the first climb can be easily neutralized, so I would expect the climbers not to spend themselves much until they get to the Finestre climb. Are we going to see Rujano waste his energy attacking the first climb, and then get swallowed on the descent? I hope not, now that the mountain jersey is securely his.

Maybe Basso will take it, and whichever contender can stick to his wheel wins the GC.

True, but most of it is a pretty gentle grade (dropping 800 metres in 36 kilometres) and a rather big (by Alpine standards) so probably not very technical -> bad for Savoldelli. The GC (top 4) is almost perfectly balanced after today for a spectacular stage tomorrow.


most of that descent isn't that steep is it... which means that if one of the leaders can get some team mates over that climb with him.. or if the team mates where in an early break so they can meet up with him on the other side, he has a chance at staying away and getting to the Finestre climb with a gap without doing that much work... that's really only an option for Simoni i think... or Basso might try that to take some glory... i have a feeling the leaders are going to completely ignore Basso like they did on Thursday though... he is 40mins down so who cares what he does. if he or his team is there they can be opportunistic, but they are not going to bet the farm on using Basso... plus Basso is going to expect you to do some work too... if you depend on your own team they are going to go until they drop for you. This is being pretty bold though and I think the Finestre climb is well suited to Simoni especially and Rujano so they will likely wait and use the 1st Sestriere climb to soften everyone up and make a move on the Finestre... i can't believe they are going to wait 'til the go back up the Sestriere climb again to attack Salvodelli. Salvodelli needs to just hang on. It's been a nice ride, but it looks as if the writing is on the wall for Di Luca... what's up with Cioni not helping him on Thursday? you know, Garate has an outside chance too...

I say Simoni takes the stage, Basso challenges him for the stage, but Savoldelli will do enough to cover his losses and keep the maglia rosa. Rujano will collect the points on the first climb and recede into the peloton before the Finestre. Just as well he'll lock up the maglia verde.

http://www.gazzetta.it/Speciali/Giroditalia/2005/upload/tap/Tappa19_1_Finestre.jpg
That image reminds me of The Price is Right's Cliff Hanger game. You just need some ambient yodelling in the background to make it right. :D

most of that descent isn't that steep is it... which means that if one of the leaders can get some team mates over that climb with him.. or if the team mates where in an early break so they can meet up with him on the other side, he has a chance at staying away and getting to the Finestre climb with a gap without doing that much work... that's really only an option for Simoni i think... or Basso might try that to take some glory... i have a feeling the leaders are going to completely ignore Basso like they did on Thursday though... he is 40mins down so who cares what he does. if he or his team is there they can be opportunistic, but they are not going to bet the farm on using Basso... plus Basso is going to expect you to do some work too... if you depend on your own team they are going to go until they drop for you. This is being pretty bold though and I think the Finestre climb is well suited to Simoni especially and Rujano so they will likely wait and use the 1st Sestriere climb to soften everyone up and make a move on the Finestre... i can't believe they are going to wait 'til the go back up the Sestriere climb again to attack Salvodelli. Salvodelli needs to just hang on. It's been a nice ride, but it looks as if the writing is on the wall for Di Luca... what's up with Cioni not helping him on Thursday? you know, Garate has an outside chance too...

Cunego up the road waiting on the Finestre would be nice, maybe together with Ivan Parra.. The attacks from Simoni and Rujano must come on the Finestre, there is no way to put enough time on Savoldelli on Sestriere if he is with them on the top of Finestre.



I say Simoni takes the stage, Basso challenges him for the stage, but Savoldelli will do enough to cover his losses and keep the maglia rosa. Rujano will collect the points on the first climb and recede into the peloton before the Finestre. Just as well he'll lock up the maglia verde.

Yes, Simoni must be hungry for a stage by now, but Rujano is probably the better sprinter if they are together (as on Tenda). My wild guess for the GC after tomorrow is Simoni, Rujano, Garate and Savoldelli :).

The only way (literally) for Rujano to lose Green is if he crashes out of the race, he has more than twice the points than team mate Parra in second, so no wasted efforts for GPM's.

I say Simoni takes the stage, Basso challenges him for the stage, but Savoldelli will do enough to cover his losses and keep the maglia rosa. Rujano will collect the points on the first climb and recede into the peloton before the Finestre. Just as well he'll lock up the maglia verde.


I agree but switch Simoni w/Basso. He's on great form....too bad he got sick or this thing would already be over.

I agree but switch Simoni w/Basso. He's on great form....too bad he got sick or this thing would already be over.
I'm with you on that, it's a darn shame he got ill. Hey at least he's sticking it out to the finish. I have to admit that I am rooting for Savoldelli now that Basso's out of contention.

...Basso might take the stage just because none of the lead really cares what he does and rightly so... they shouldn't let the lure of winning a stage cloud what they have to do and that is to put time into the other contenders, not a rider that is 40 mins down. I have a feeling that it is going to be close but i think Simoni might just pull it off... solvadelli, from his interviews, it seems that he's resolved to the fact that he's going to get dropped and it's bad that it has happened twice already... a rider can get too use to letting go... each time it has been progressively worse and this time the attacks will come earlier and this is it, no holding back now for anyone in contention... if solvadelli lets go on the Finestre.. he's going to loose really big time... and i think thats what just might go down.

Good analyses by everyone. My view is that Simoni must attack from far out because of his deficit. I don't think he can depend on letting Salvodelli sit on him until the ultimate climb...he would be hoping he could take 2'09" out of Salvodelli, but Salvodelli has shown resiliency under attacks in the mountains. He bends but doesn't break. So Simoni must attack on the first climb if he has any real aspirations for the maglia rosa. Salvodelli's job will be to stick with Simoni or within 2" of Simoni and thus far, Salvodelli has shown that is within his capabilities. So the key for Simoni is if he tries to escape from Salvodelli on the first climb. If he doesn't Salvodelli will remain in pink.

Just as well he'll lock up the maglia verde.

He did that three stages ago.

Is anyone watching this on the web? What an awesome race...

Live on TV (sorry :)). It's brilliant, and Finestre was :eek:.

That was amazing and Savoldelli holds the Pink Jersey What a ride by Rujano. Now the question is: is, like the TdF the last day mearly a parade or will they race?

Likewise - live on RAI 3 and EuroSport FR, but I am not sorry at all. ;)

However, I have a similar question. If it is close enough - a few seconds - do the second placers try to win it? Is there a rule in the race that disallows such a thing? Or is it just understood? Same holds for the TdF, and maybe the Vuelta.

In the first two cases, the stage is easy enough that the leading team should be able to control the race, but ...

In any case, as Auro Bulbarelli and Davide Cassani kept saying - it is unforgettable!

It's in "bad form" to attack withhout hope of winning or using misfortune as motivation. If the former, when the attacking rider is reeled in, he's the butt of abuse for disrupting the race. If the latter, no one will help him and he will lose fan support. If there was a realistic chance a rider could win, if this were an ITT for example, that's one thing. Tomorrow's stage is a procession for the sprinters.

I'm really glad that Paolo was able to win a second Giro. After all his TERRIBLE luck for the past few years, he really deserves this one. Great showings by Gibo and Rujano too. I think Simoni's still got it - he could win it next year.

that was one amazing race... a classic... people will be talking about that one years from now... when a saw Rujano's splits i thought... damn!!! he can take it the whole thing, then i say red flag and was like damn, he ran out of road. no stategy today just a horse race.. go as hard as you can and try and get time on the other guys was the only strategy.

kind of sad that only one person can win... i was routing for Salvodelli and Simoni. Salvodelli 'cause he's had to come back from adversity and Simoni because i think he really re-dedicated himself this year and deserves something... guess 2nd place at the Giro IS something but...

as for Basso.. i guess nothing has really been answered there... 20mins down today. he was obviously going for it too with all the work that CSC did. guess he just shut it down when he saw he didn't have the legs.. he shut it down pretty fast though. was he able to win on thurday because no one was looking at him?

Di Luca is the man though... guess as the classics specialist of the group a dirt climb is nothing compared to a cobled one... but what a dirt climb that was!! he paced that whole stretch and didn't look back once.. wonder if he and Simoni had some sort of arrangement.. it's too bad he cramped on that last stretch... but there was no way even if he didn't cramp that he was going to get past Simoni or Rujano... his only hope to get on the podium was for for Salvodelli to die and that didn't happen...

this is the most excited i've ever been watching a stage of the Giro. It was epic, it was beautiful, it was everything a race should be.

Applause to Simoni for laying it all out there and doing everything he could to take this race. No one can say anything negative about his Giro.

Applause to Basso for hanging in there and fighting until the penultimate climb.

Applause for Selle Italia and particulary Rujano for making such an impressive showing against the bigger teams.

Applause to Salvodelli for a strong and steady effort that won him the Giro.

You said it best, Crack'n'Fail. Chapeau to an elite courageous group. They should hold a reunioun next year. ;)

I was surprised Cunego and Basso weren't somewhere in the mix. What an epic stage! Kudos to Rujano and Columbia-Selle Italia. I bet if the South American teams could get a little more sponsorship and visibility, we'd be hearing about a lot more of them on mountainous stages.

As good a day of racing as you could hope for!

I thought the Finestre was going to be too much for Rujano. He's only 23. I thought Simoni would measure it right and take the stage, but he maybe went off a little early. He had to. Here's hoping for many more races like this one for Rujano. I'm impressed.

Great, great setting. Any time the grand tour organizers want to schedule a race in a place where hundreds of people look like they could fall off the edge of the world is fine by me. The grittiness of the Finestre really punctuated the stakes of the race today. Bravo!

Congratulations to Savoldelli. Smart, savvy, and tough bike rider that fellow. A well deserved win. What a race!

This was on Cyclingnews this morning:

At the top of the Finestre, 33 year-old Simoni must have surely thought victory was his as he climbed his way into the maglia rosa virtuale. But one thing he did not foresee was both he and Di Luca becoming the victim of cramps on the final ascent to Sestrières, which ultimately cost him the race.

Wasn't Savoldelli already about 20 seconds ahead again after the descent from Finestre? I kept seeing his progress, and he passed Simoni not too far down the descent. I also did not see any evidence of cramps by Simoni during the last section (as opposed to DiLuca - too bad).

OTOH, I did see him issue a wry smile, then remove his earphone before starting the last climb to Sestriere. I figured his car had told him it was over given Savoldelli's recoup of the time.

On PEZ following stage 19:

Gilberto Simoni (Lampre-Caffita):
"On the Colle delle Finestre, Paolo understood that he wouldn't be able to keep our pace, so we tried to go harder. At the end with Di Luca we collaborated, but then unluckily he got troubles with cramps. I had some cramps too, on the downhill. I was at my limit, as it wasn't easy at all. I thought we would have Parra on our side but he wasn't there today. I lost my Giro maybe because Cunego wasn't there. I thought he could help me a lot. So I had to ride differently [than I would have otherwise]."

Ouch. That'll help the relationship between Simoni and Cunego for sure.

I dont get OLN at home, but stopped at my parents yesterday and was able to change the channel fron golf to cycling.What a great race... Even my 91 year old dad got excited watching it....Btw he grew up in Newark NJ[Italian parents]and reminesced about going to the Old Newark Velodrome.. Claimed way back when it was a center for cycling..

On PEZ following stage 19:

Gilberto Simoni (Lampre-Caffita):
"On the Colle delle Finestre, Paolo understood that he wouldn't be able to keep our pace, so we tried to go harder. At the end with Di Luca we collaborated, but then unluckily he got troubles with cramps. I had some cramps too, on the downhill. I was at my limit, as it wasn't easy at all. I thought we would have Parra on our side but he wasn't there today. I lost my Giro maybe because Cunego wasn't there. I thought he could help me a lot. So I had to ride differently [than I would have otherwise]."

I'm sorry, but Simoni is a punk. A few days ago, he was spouting off about how he was going to win this year's Giro. (also remember a few years ago, he was going to "dominate Armstrong in the mountains of the TdF?) Now, after Cunego supported him the entire race, he BLAMES Cunego for his obvious crack 3k from the finish.

Bottom line ...... punk.

I'm sorry, but Simoni is a punk. A few days ago, he was spouting off about how he was going to win this year's Giro. (also remember a few years ago, he was going to "dominate Armstrong in the mountains of the TdF?) Now, after Cunego supported him the entire race, he BLAMES Cunego for his obvious crack 3k from the finish.

Bottom line ...... punk.
Agreed, I wish he would have shown a little more class. But I can't help but wonder if he's just "getting back" at Cunego in the media for making him look like an idiot last year. Who knows. Cunego did all he could to help Simoni. It's clear that Simoni was their guy for the Giro and Cunego their guy for the Tour (the Lampre DS even said it!), I'm sure Simoni didn't expect Cunego to be in his best form.

Savoldelli won without much support from his team. Simoni could not. Actions > words.

Some of the stuff Simoni says comes off pretty bad. here is a quote i like a lot that i saved from some cyclingnews.com from last year:

Simoni seems to have become more humble, and even if he has not come to love Armstrong's personality, he accepts the American's dominance in the Tour.
"I envy Armstrong, like I envied Pantani for what he did," Simoni said. "Those two are bigger than me.


Also, I thought what Savoldelli said was pretty amazing:
'Now I'll go to the Tour, but just to support Lance. I've been training with him and I know how much stronger he is than me."

Savodelli deserves this win as he has has zero help from his team. This was a solo victory and I believe that if Discovery had sent a better team to support him he wouldn't have had fight so hard on the desent to regain the lost time. Then again if Basso hadn't got sick this would all be wishfull thinking. But 'IF' is the biggest word in the english language.

After this Giro and the emergence (or re-emergence) of Basso and Di Luca and of course Cunego, Simonni has been demoted down the list of top Italian cyslist.

The bonus seconds for 1st, 2nd, and 3rd (20, 12, 8) almost ended up deciding the race. If they had, it would have detracted from the race in my opinion. Was anyone else thinking of this as they kept showing the time checks? Anyone else care to share an opinion?

Something funny is going on with that Simoni translation with regards to Cunego. Is Jaco around to properly translate what Simoni said?

Koffee

Something funny is going on with that Simoni translation with regards to Cunego. Is Jaco around to properly translate what Simoni said?

Koffee

Where's the quote?

EDIT:

Actually...I did find this quote from Simoni after finishing at Sestriere.

"Speravo di avere una mano da Cunego in questo Giro, ma Cunego è stato inesistente".

Basically, it's says...

"I had hoped to have a hand from Cunego in this Giro, but Cuengo was non-existant."

http://www.gazzetta.it/Ciclismo/Primo%20Piano/2005/05-Maggio/28/28ghisa.shtml

A cool (I think) quote from Savoldelli from the same article. He talks about the harshness of the stage followed by the elation of realizing that he was going to win the Giro.

"In questa tappa ho perso dieci anni di vita. Ho cancellato in tre settimane due anni di tormenti".

It says...

"In this stage I lost ten years of my life. I cancelled in three weeks two years of torment."

I dont get OLN at home, but stopped at my parents yesterday and was able to change the channel fron golf to cycling.What a great race... Even my 91 year old dad got excited watching it....Btw he grew up in Newark NJ[Italian parents]and reminesced about going to the Old Newark Velodrome.. Claimed way back when it was a center for cycling..

Yes, in the early decades of the 20th century, NEWARK, of all places, was the center of Pro cycling in the USA. And, in that era, the very top Pro cyclists were the highest paid athletes in the world, making double or triple the earnings of folks such as Babe Ruth.

So, folks living in Newark will able to see the best cyclists in the world on a regular basis and more than a few cyclists from that era remained in the Newark area after retiring from racing. "Bicycling" did a profile last year on a champion cyclist from that era who is still riding every day at age 90 plus.

Italian cyclists run the whole spectrum don't they? You have the Good (Savoldelli, Petacchi, Basso, Di Luca), the Bad (Bettini's "bruto" display after relegation and enough with the gold helmet and bar tape already), and the Ugly (Simoni). They're beautiful when they win, and damned ugly when they lose.

You missed Cunego, Pozzovivo, Sella, ...

Savodelli deserves this win as he has has zero help from his team. This was a solo victory and I believe that if Discovery had sent a better team to support him he wouldn't have had fight so hard on the desent to regain the lost time. Then again if Basso hadn't got sick this would all be wishfull thinking. But 'IF' is the biggest word in the english language.

After this Giro and the emergence (or re-emergence) of Basso and Di Luca and of course Cunego, Simonni has been demoted down the list of top Italian cyslist.

not to take anything from Salvodelli... it was a great win.. and you're right, he did it basically without a team... but a little luck goes a long way too. he had all those riders that got dropped from the Simoni, Di Luca, Rujano group that were all looking to up their GC standing helping him on the descent and especially to pace him on a ascent... he should seriously slide Wim Van Huffel some change. he paced the Salvodelli's group up most of the final climb... him and Garate jumped away at the end, but the way old Wim was working there he looked like he was on the Discovery pay roll or something... he helped himself too going from 29th to 11th of GC in one stage..

Simoni road an amazing race and missed out but only 28 seconds!!! he came really close... he should just keep quiet and be happy with that it's a great finish.. i agree with a lot of the posters... it actually reminded me a little of Lance Armstrong on the mountain stage where Basso won... he just had to mention to the world that the only reason Basso won was because he let him win... buddy... you're winning the TdF, you're doing a great thing, why not just let someone else have some of the light too.. man... Armstrong has some ego issues too..

it actually reminded me a little of Lance Armstrong on the mountain stage where Basso won... he just had to mention to the world that the only reason Basso won was because he let him win...

That was actually Pantani on le Mont Ventoux, I think. He praised Basso in the win you mention.

But in any case, there is luck - good and bad - in everything. re Savoldelli, learning from his cramps in the ITT, and having a team worker positioned way up on Finestre to give him water was not luck. He also knew what he could do on the ascent, what he probably could do on the descent, did it, and was right overall, gaining him the win.

That was actually Pantani on le Mont Ventoux, I think. He praised Basso in the win you mention.

But in any case, there is luck - good and bad - in everything. re Savoldelli, learning from his cramps in the ITT, and having a team worker positioned way up on Finestre to give him water was not luck. He also knew what he could do on the ascent, what he probably could do on the descent, did it, and was right overall, gaining him the win.

here's Armstrong's quote after the race.. he says he pulled more than Basso... and he let him win.. and yes he did the same thing to Pantani as well. great bike rider, but a bit of an A**.. he goes on and on about the cancer thing, but he just has to put in those little digs in at Basso as well... i don't get it?? pretty weird??

http://www.velonews.com/tour2004/details/articles/6581.0.html

"Perhaps I pulled more, but he is in super form," Armstrong continued. "He is a hell of a good guy. It is a bit of a long story right now with his mother, with what is going on with her. Ivan and I have been friends for a long time. So now, off the bike, we are working a little bit with his mom's situation and trying to see if she can win her fight against cancer.


"It was pretty special for me to be out there with him. In the last week, we don't talk about the race, but about his mom. It was a pleasure for me to let him win."

I stand corrected.

Armstrong is full of pride, that's what motivates him to win when he can't find motivation from the others in the peloton. Unfortunately that spills over into his interviews after stages. I'm sure the interviewer pressed him about if he had "gifted" Basso the win. He danced around it a bit, but finally he let his pride get through. It's what makes him the force he has been in Tour for the last few years.

Armstrong is full of pride, that's what motivates him to win when he can't find motivation from the others in the peloton. Unfortunately that spills over into his interviews after stages. I'm sure the interviewer pressed him about if he had "gifted" Basso the win. He danced around it a bit, but finally he let his pride get through. It's what makes him the force he has been in Tour for the last few years.

i don't know about that... i think it's what makes him have NO CLASS...

i don't know about that... i think it's what makes him have NO CLASS...


Maybe. I'm not making a judgement, just putting out there what I think are the facts. Not saying whether it's right or wrong.

Maybe. I'm not making a judgement, just putting out there what I think are the facts. Not saying whether it's right or wrong.

me too...