Training & Nutrition - How Long Do I Need To Ride?

I bought a mountain bike in order to get into shape. My goal is to lose 25-30 pounds.

Assuming I can ride 4 or 5 times a week, how long should I aim to stay on the bike (at a MINIMUM) in order to see some reasonable results. I'm not expecting to lose 15 pounds a month or anything, but I would like to see a noticeable difference by September.

I will be riding a relatively flat, packed-gravel trail, with a goal of maintaining a good cadence, rather than a particular speed.

So, when I head out the door, how long should I expect to ride before I can return home without feeling guilty?

Not to be a wise ass...this kind of depends an where you are starting from. I started as a old fat git and even 40min every two or three days made weight loss a treat...but if you are last years' decathalon champ...uhhh ramp it up!!! There are some really smart people on this forum (other than me) and maybe give them some details...

uhhhh just one more thing, this riding bit is really fun. If you do it from that perspective (ie. not a forced march into hell) you will achieve whatever your goal happens to be. make it fun, do it when it is fun, find places/people that are fun

Well, I chose cycling because it is fun for me. The thing is that I don't want to head home before I've even started burning calories.

Where am I starting from? An out of shape, overweight 30 year old who wants to lose 25-30 pounds.

Try an hour, I'm fat'n'out of shape myself and that's a basic rule for me, although I'm often riding more than an hour, an hour's a good guideline. A nice ride for me is here to Palo Alto, a few towns over, which takes an hour, then have some coffee etc in downtown Palo Alto then take the train back. (I take my bike on the train, the ticket's cheap, then bike from the train station home, which is a short hop.)

An hour sounds good to me. And if you don't feel like you did much in that hour, then maybe it's not the time but how hard you rode during that time. Get a computer if you don't already have one, and set mileage and/or cadence goals for yourself. Start off at whatever pace you feel comfortable with and go from there. Keep bumping the mileage goal up every time/every few times you ride while keeping the time the same.

two cents from the new kid :D

Ride as long as you can. You should be sore for a day or two. Do it again. If you're not sore for a day after, then ride longer. RIde every day, by feel. It will get easier and easier.

Answer: as much as you can, without hurting yourself.

General information to help your calculations.

Figure 35-50 calories per mile depending on wind resistance from riding faster/slower or from head/tailwinds. This starts the first mile, calories are energy/heat, like kilowatt hours or BTU.

4,100 calories in a pound of fat, 1,800 in a dry pound of carbs, or 9 calories per gram of fat and 4 calories per gram of carbs.

In-muscle carbs are stored with water, which is released when the carbs are burned, the storage ratio is 1 ounce of carb with 4 ounces of water, this water is where most of the one day weight loss comes from and will quickly be replaced, the body's muscles can hold up to a pound of carbs. Once fully stocked the muscles will turn away carbs which will then be converted into fat.

Fat burn is maximum at a medium to medium-high intensity(med is relaxed conversations can be had maybe a heart rate of 120, med-high involves some solid huffing and puffing). When you get to very high intensity fat burn drops off(very high meaning, close to race pace/ can't say more than a couple words). These ranges are general because the specific intensities are highly variable from person to person.

In the end it comes down to total calories in, verses total calories burned. Burned being, base metabolism(1500-2000 cal per day depending on person) plus exorsize burn. Basically if you burn fat great, if you burn carbs that clears space for carb storage. Both are always being burned to some extent.

Thanks for the replies so far.

Some questions...

1) Do I really have to be sore after a ride to know that I've done good work? It seems to me that if I'm running for an hour at a medium heart-rate (to burn fat), then that shouldn't make me sore, as opposed to pedaling up a hill for an hour, where I can see how my thighs would be dead the next day.

2) If the rate is around 35-50 calories a mile, how can I translate this into cadence? I'm not really sure of my mileage (actually, kilometerage). I attempt to maintain a steady pedaling pace, regardless of whether I'm going up, down or flat. I assume, that more important is maintaining my HR in that 120+ zone? (that ability to talk is a good simple measure)

3) It seems to me, that your body will start burning carbs first (easiest to burn). So, given all the above info, how long of a store of carbs would I have before my body would turn to burning more fat than usual? This is really my original question in a different form.

I really meant at first. I assumed you were just starting out. You don't have to be really sore. I think my point is... do as many miles as you can. Listen to your body.

You burn fat at a pretty constant rate, I think. And as anyone that has ever tried to ride in Ketosis will tell you... that isn't enough energy for cycling. Once you run out of carbs, protein is converted to glucose... that means you're losing muscle, not fat. So carb up before you ride.

The key here is metabolism maintenance. The more you carb up, the more you can ride, the faster your metabolism goes, the more you can eat without gaining weight, etc. I'd focus on being able to really spin some miles before I focused on cutting cals and burning fat. Your body will thank you for it. If your metabolism is high... you burn calories while sitting on the couch. That is your goal.

In my own training, I had made the mistake of not eating enough, and to be honest I JUST started carbing up heavily the night/morning before a ride, and its made all the difference in the world in my training. I'm adding miles, and thats the best way to lose fat.

I bought a mountain bike in order to get into shape. My goal is to lose 25-30 pounds.

Assuming I can ride 4 or 5 times a week, how long should I aim to stay on the bike (at a MINIMUM) in order to see some reasonable results. I'm not expecting to lose 15 pounds a month or anything, but I would like to see a noticeable difference by September.

I will be riding a relatively flat, packed-gravel trail, with a goal of maintaining a good cadence, rather than a particular speed.

So, when I head out the door, how long should I expect to ride before I can return home without feeling guilty?

Congratulations on having a goal. It's not just the riding. What are you eating?
If Dominoes delivers 4 nights out of 7, the cycling isn't going to make a dent

A bike is extremely effecient - see Ivan Illich about this. However, say I ride 10 miles and at 35 calories a mile it's 350 calories. One nice iced latte will take care of that right? Especially because unless I remember to tell them not to, they always put whipped cream on top, and those jimmies. I swear, chocolate flavored jimmies! Anyway, what I find is that an hour's brisk ride is very good exercise, I feel like I really exercised when I do an hour against the wind, and it's because I did - that's a fair old ride for someone just getting back into it. Well, I find I actually want to eat less. Yep, exercise for a lot of people has a certain appatite-suppressent effect for a lot of people - look up a file on the net called "Adiposity 101" for that. And, since me no se hable "take it easy" when riding, even when done and when sleeping, my leg muscles are busy recovering and rebuilding, and building up, in response to the stimulus. This is why exercise puts you into a fat-burning mode that's higher than for a nonexerciser that's continuous.

So: That hour's ride burns calories, makes me inclined to actually eat a bit less, and raises my resting metabolism.

Now keep in mind, you really don't want to lose more than one lb a week. It's just not healthy to lose weight faster than that, so you need to treat exercise as a lifestyle change not a band-aid. Likewise with diet. I think in terms not of dieting but as changing habits - out went beer, except occasionally, in came sparkling water, which still feels like a treat. A while back, out went chips, since a small 99-cent bag of fritos is 700+ calories, read the label! Ouch! But I like salad and nuts and things, so those are the new munchies. Frankly I love to sit and crunch through a bag of..... salad fixings (lettuce, carrots, etc that comes in bags) from the store. Yum!

All of this takes CONSISTANCY and TIME so it's a good thing biking is fun!

Congratulations on having a goal. It's not just the riding. What are you eating?
If Dominoes delivers 4 nights out of 7, the cycling isn't going to make a dent

My diet is fairly "normal". I generally don't eat fast food (maybe twice a month at most). My problem food is the salty stuff, like chips. I've decided to cut those out and find healthier snacks.

I don't think my calorie intake will be a big problem. I'm more worried about getting a good calorie burn each and every time I go out on the bike, so I'm not fooling myself into thinking I'm accomplishing something other than a scenic tour of the neighbourhood.

The problem with chips isn't salt. Water retention is temporary. The problem is the horrible fats, and the carbs without fiber.

You eat chips, but you eat healthy? Parse error.

You'll know you're riding enough if you can go further and further each week. If last week's route is easy as hell, and you can keep going and going and going.

Thanks for the replies so far.

Some questions...

1) Do I really have to be sore after a ride to know that I've done good work? It seems to me that if I'm running for an hour at a medium heart-rate (to burn fat), then that shouldn't make me sore, as opposed to pedaling up a hill for an hour, where I can see how my thighs would be dead the next day.

2) If the rate is around 35-50 calories a mile, how can I translate this into cadence? I'm not really sure of my mileage (actually, kilometerage). I attempt to maintain a steady pedaling pace, regardless of whether I'm going up, down or flat. I assume, that more important is maintaining my HR in that 120+ zone? (that ability to talk is a good simple measure)

3) It seems to me, that your body will start burning carbs first (easiest to burn). So, given all the above info, how long of a store of carbs would I have before my body would turn to burning more fat than usual? This is really my original question in a different form.

1) No. Play the numbers game first. If you burn 4000 calories and eat 3000 calories, you'll lose weight. It doesn't matter if the 4000 burnt calories came from playing chess or boxing Mike Tyson.

2) buy a HR monitor. They're cheap. really. www.nashbar.com

3) Your body utilizes all three macronutrients (protein, carbohydrates, fat) for energy for all activities at all times in varying ratios. In fact, you burn the most fat, as a percentage of your calorie utilization, when you SLEEP. However, your total calorie utilization when you sleep is so low that it's not particularly signifacant. This goes back to the numbers game. Just burn the calories first. Worry about where the calories come from when you get under 12% bf.

The problem with chips isn't salt. Water retention is temporary. The problem is the horrible fats, and the carbs without fiber.

You eat chips, but you eat healthy? Parse error.

You'll know you're riding enough if you can go further and further each week. If last week's route is easy as hell, and you can keep going and going and going.

I never said I eat "healthy", I said I eat a fairly "normal" diet. I'm more than aware of the nutritional value of foods. I generally eat good foods, but like most people, I have a couple of "problem" foods. My point was that, unlike many who enjoy "sweets", I enjoy salty snacks, and chips fit the bill. The salt isn't why I'm cutting them out, but rather the ridiculous fat content.

Like I said, my calorie intake isn't my concern. I know how to eat well. My problem has been the fact that I went from an uber-active person to a generally sedentary person. As a result of that, the fact that I quit smoking 8 months ago and my hitting my 30's, I've put on a bunch of weight - all of it on my stomach.

What I'm trying to figure out is how to maximize the benefit of cycling without becoming obsessed with going that extra mile. I don't mind working hard to lose the weight, but I'm also willing to be patient. I don't want to kill myself on my bike each day. I just want to go out, ride, and come home knowing that I've realized a physical benefit for the time spent.

1) No. Play the numbers game first. If you burn 4000 calories and eat 3000 calories, you'll lose weight. It doesn't matter if the 4000 burnt calories came from playing chess or boxing Mike Tyson.

2) buy a HR monitor. They're cheap. really. www.nashbar.com

3) Your body utilizes all three macronutrients (protein, carbohydrates, fat) for energy for all activities at all times in varying ratios. In fact, you burn the most fat, as a percentage of your calorie utilization, when you SLEEP. However, your total calorie utilization when you sleep is so low that it's not particularly signifacant. This goes back to the numbers game. Just burn the calories first. Worry about where the calories come from when you get under 12% bf.

OK then. Let me ask you this - assuming I am riding and my HR is in the aerobic target zone. How long would you recommend I stay in this zone? Maybe more realistically, how long would you say is the MINIMUM amount of time I should stay there before I am wasting my time?

Then I reiterate: scrap all the high tech. Ride as far as you can, then turn back. You'll know when its too far. You'll get real tired.

Repeat this. You'll notice that you're making progress... you can go farther and farther.

Keep that up till you can ride 50+ miles several times a week.

Wow, you lost the weight.

Its that simple. Save the money on gadgets, don't overanalyze, and have FUN with it.

Then I reiterate: scrap all the high tech. Ride as far as you can, then turn back. You'll know when its too far. You'll get real tired.

Repeat this. You'll notice that you're making progress... you can go farther and farther.

Keep that up till you can ride 50+ miles several times a week.

Wow, you lost the weight.

Its that simple. Save the money on gadgets, don't overanalyze, and have FUN with it.

If I was a lotto winner, and had 24 hours a day to do as I please, this would be a great plan. However, my free time is limited, which is why I asked the original question.

Perhaps on my days off, I can ride and ride and ride. However, during work days, this isn't an option. This is why I'm trying to get a ballpark answer as to how long I should expect to put into a ride (or keep my HR in the target zone) in order to get a decent benefit from it.

If the answer is, say, an hour, then I can aim for that. If my HR is too low, I can always ride faster. Unfortunately, riding longer isn't necessarily an option for me.

Buddy... noone says you have unlimited time. Ride as much as you CAN, is the point.

Don't overcomplicate this. You'll get to know your body soon enough, and you'll note your progress, and so you'll know how much is enough.

If you've got 20 minutes to ride, then SPRINT baby SPRINT. The point is: ride till you're tired as hell.

Perhaps on my days off, I can ride and ride and ride. However, during work days, this isn't an option. This is why I'm trying to get a ballpark answer as to how long I should expect to put into a ride (or keep my HR in the target zone) in order to get a decent benefit from it.



At the bottom of THIS (http://www.bicycling.com/training/0,3317,s1,00.html) page (on Bicycling Magazine's website), there is a calculator where you can input your time, intensity of ride, and body weight in order to get an approximate number of calories burned... very helpful. Try putting in data for an hour ride at the intensity you fell comfortable with, and see if that's acceptable for you, remembering that a pound of fat = 3600 calories.

After you know the numbers, it's just up to your goals, and the lifestyle that this cycling is a part of.

Let me offer my expeirence as it was only a year ago, I was 52 when I started riding again after a 15 year lay off so I did not have to go through the learning phase. I weighed 200 lbs and rode about 1 hour 3 times a week until I got into a little better shape and then rode 4 times a week with a 2-2 and 1/2 hour ride on the weekend. I lost 40 lbs in about 4.5 months, I rode a good pace so as not to waste my time(HRM would be nice). Read any info you can as knowledge is most helpful and I wish you all the luck in the world. I have kept the weight off and ride about 100 miles a week now(6ft and 157 lbs), I feel a whole lot better than I did before.

Thanks for the replies so far.

Some questions...

1) Do I really have to be sore after a ride to know that I've done good work? It seems to me that if I'm running for an hour at a medium heart-rate (to burn fat), then that shouldn't make me sore, as opposed to pedaling up a hill for an hour, where I can see how my thighs would be dead the next day.

2) If the rate is around 35-50 calories a mile, how can I translate this into cadence? I'm not really sure of my mileage (actually, kilometerage). I attempt to maintain a steady pedaling pace, regardless of whether I'm going up, down or flat. I assume, that more important is maintaining my HR in that 120+ zone? (that ability to talk is a good simple measure)

3) It seems to me, that your body will start burning carbs first (easiest to burn). So, given all the above info, how long of a store of carbs would I have before my body would turn to burning more fat than usual? This is really my original question in a different form.1)No. In fact you don't really want to be sore as you will want to ride again in 24 hours and be recovered in order to do so. Cycling isn't bodybuilding so forget about the pump and the burn.

2) Calories per mile doesn't translate into cadence. And although others will disagree, I think it is better to exercise by time than miles. Time and intensity. Get the gadgets. A heart rate monitor and an inexpensive cycleometer. The secret is to keep your HR under a certain percentage!! Sounds strange I know but most new cyclists will find they are usually pushing harder than they should.

3) You don't want to deplete your body's store of carbs while exercising (or anytime else for that matter). That's called "the bonk" and it will not help you lose weight or get fit. In fact it is important that you avoid "the bonk" by taking in some carbs before, during and after exercise. The post workout meal is probably the most important meal of the day as the influx of carbs will help prevent your immune system from taking a dive.

Don't go hungry and drink considerably more water than you think you need ... considerably more! Also, you may find that you aren't losing weight as rapidly as you had hoped. Don't fear as you are probably building up some muscle and losing bodyfat so don't rely on the scales completely. I would think an hour a day would be plenty for a fitness/weight loss program.

At the bottom of THIS (http://www.bicycling.com/training/0,3317,s1,00.html) page (on Bicycling Magazine's website), there is a calculator where you can input your time, intensity of ride, and body weight in order to get an approximate number of calories burned... very helpful. Try putting in data for an hour ride at the intensity you fell comfortable with, and see if that's acceptable for you, remembering that a pound of fat = 3600 calories.

After you know the numbers, it's just up to your goals, and the lifestyle that this cycling is a part of.

OH MY GOD...

I burn between 2 and 3000 calories on my long rides twice a week. Thats a pound of fat. Nevermind all the other stuff I do like walk and swim, and nevermind that I eat only "health" food in a caloric deficit anyway. Holy crap. No wonder the weight seems to be melting off. Loose skin, HERE I COME. Actually, my weight varies so much, this happens now no matter what. But just damn.

Actually, if you are carbing up for rides, and drinking alot of water...

then I recommond abandoning the scale. You KNOW you're losing fat if you're exercising regularly and aren't eating a caloric excess (more than you were). I haven't weighed in months. But I've lost about 4 inches on my waist in two months... my belt keeps tightening. The old pants fit. These measurements don't lie. The scale is pathological. It wil just confuse you, encourage your to dehydrate/underfeed for rides, etc.

The scale is your enemy. You are after lost inches and increased performance, not pounds. I.e. body composition change, not weight loss.

And as to soreness... everyone I know who started cycling got sore occasionally for the first month or so. Its just not possible to avoid a hill once in a while that pushes you a bit much, in most areas.

Although for me, after about two months of training... soreness has become something else. Like I can feel my quads adapting to the load after a long ride... but they don't quite hurt, if that makes sense.

If I was a lotto winner, and had 24 hours a day to do as I please, this would be a great plan. However, my free time is limited, which is why I asked the original question.

Perhaps on my days off, I can ride and ride and ride. However, during work days, this isn't an option. This is why I'm trying to get a ballpark answer as to how long I should expect to put into a ride (or keep my HR in the target zone) in order to get a decent benefit from it.

If the answer is, say, an hour, then I can aim for that. If my HR is too low, I can always ride faster. Unfortunately, riding longer isn't necessarily an option for me.
The more you ride the more you burn(one mile=35cal 2miles=70cal).
The more you eat the more you absorb(one slice of bread=100cal 2 slices=200cal).
The difference will come out as a change in weight over the long term.


Fat and carbs are both burned at all times. Fat is the main fuel for staying warm (shivering excepted, thats carbs) and is generally the main fuel up through moderately intense excersize. Carbs tend to dominate at higher exersize intensities. The longer a workout lasts the more the fat burn goes up and the carb burn goes down, even with carb intake(sugar water), there is no cutoff.
The specific numbers, percentages, and intensities, for fat verses carb burn, vary from person to person so much it is not possible to give you a narrow target range without a lot of lab testing.

Total calorie burn rate is always equal to exorsize intensity.

It takes a certain amount of energy to move the bike from point A to point B with a given wind speed/drag. Energy is measured in calories, thus it takes a certain number of calories to move the bike from point A to point B at a given speed(wind drag). It does not matter if it is your first mile of the day or your 100th mile of the day, that mile takes the same amount of energy.

I'm wildly guessing that you ride 12-15 MPH so would burn 420-650 calories per hour with a MTB on a smooth packed gravel or paved surface.

OH MY GOD...

I burn between 2 and 3000 calories on my long rides twice a week. Thats a pound of fat.

Ain't it sweet. :D

When I do my current long ride, I burn about 3500-3800 calories... I'm so glad I found that calculator!

Thanks to everybody who offered advice here. I appreciate the different viewpoints and sources of info.

I think, after reading everything, I will aim to ride a minimum of 4 times per week, at 1 hour per trip. If possible, I will try to get in 6 to 8 hours if the weekend weather permits.

I'm not sure if I'll buy a scale. My belt will be a good measure, but the precision of a scale does appeal to my desire to see numerical results.

I've only had the bike 12 days, but I've ridden 9 of those days, and I already am beginning to feel more energetic, and my endurance has already increased a significant amount.

I'm just happy that I've finally found a way to exercise that I actually enjoy.

Just get on a bike and ride! I am getting back into this and I probably would have asked the same question since im doing it for weight loss as well (fun too). The reason I didnt is it will be like a crutch...or an excuse to give up. So and so said I only need to go for 30 minutes so I can quit now when in reality you arent even warmed up and can go for another hour but you lack motivation to do so.

So just get out and ride...use your body as your gage. If you are out of shape, maybe 15 miutes is all you can do at first...so what? Bump that up 5 minutes a week and before you know it you will be cranking away. Anybody who gives you crap for riding for 15 minutes or even 10 if thats all you can do is an idiot...do what you can but push yourself while doing it.

Like I tell myself about everything I do...if it wasnt hard I wouldnt bother doing it.

Just get on a bike and ride! I am getting back into this and I probably would have asked the same question since im doing it for weight loss as well (fun too). The reason I didnt is it will be like a crutch...or an excuse to give up. So and so said I only need to go for 30 minutes so I can quit now when in reality you arent even warmed up and can go for another hour but you lack motivation to do so.

So just get out and ride...use your body as your gage. If you are out of shape, maybe 15 miutes is all you can do at first...so what? Bump that up 5 minutes a week and before you know it you will be cranking away. Anybody who gives you crap for riding for 15 minutes or even 10 if thats all you can do is an idiot...do what you can but push yourself while doing it.

Like I tell myself about everything I do...if it wasnt hard I wouldnt bother doing it. Good advice-let your body do the talking.

EXACTLY! Thats what I've been trying to say: AVOID EQUIPMENT. The key to your continued success is you, and the bike. Thats it. No scale (THEY LIE! You could carb up, have a GREAT ride, rehydrate afterwards, gain 3 pounds, be frustrated, but have made the most progress you ever have, that day), just inches.

The entire idea is to connect your mind to your body, through exercise. Not just for the purposes of knowing when to quit, how much is enough, etc. But because this feeling of connectedness is SATISFYING, and will lead you to continue the cycling. Whats more, once you've got the mind-body connection, it will control what you eat as well... you'll eat for FUEL for your cycling, or to recover. And not just to eat cause you're hungry.

Its about a transformation. And simplicity is the quickest way to get there. Just ride, blank your mind, and enjoy what comes. It will be all good.

Gadgets will get in the way. No scale. No HR monitor. No nothing. Not for a couple months at least.