Commuting - Flats- patch or replace?

Are patch kits quick fixes only, or can I expect a patched tube to last a while? I'm picking up a lot of glass shards, and I don't want to have to spend 10-20 bucks a week on new tubes!

Any thoughts?

Kelvar belted tires and a patch kit. I love kevlar.

Faux:

Get kevlar belted tires, or a kevlar type tire (specialized armadillo, nimbus etc.) as lauren suggested.

Patching tubes is personal preference. For many people patching tubes is a religion. I remember I was on a ride and a person got a flat tire and the tube had 16 patches on it..... I do a lot of solo rides 125 miles + and never patch tubes, unless I run out of spare tubes on a ride. I use fairly punture resistance tires. My commuting bike I have specialized nimbus and have not had a flat since I put the tires on my bike last December. The only time that I have not ridden the nimbus tires is when I have my nokian studded tires on the bike.

If you are going to patch tubes on a ride practice before you need to patch a tire.

I can't afford to throw tubes away each time they get a puncture.

I don't get a lot of punctures but I still patch. I've had a dozen or so patches on a tube in the past.

I always carry a spare tube and a patch kit when I ride. If I do get a puncture I just put the spare in. If I get two punctures, which is extremely rare, I can repair either tube and be on my way again.

patch

I carry two spare tubes and a patch kit. I replace the tube on a ride, and patch later at home.

I believe in patches! Tubes are inexpensive, but can add up fast. I'll also follow suit in recommending kevlar belted tires. It isn't perfect (something put a big cut in the unprotected sidewall of my rear tire on my recent tour), but I've found shards of glass embedded in the tread of my tire that stopped at the kevlar belt. Another thing to keep in mind is that kevlar doesn't do a thing to prevent pinch flats, so keep your pressure up and mind the road! On the same tour that put a slash in one of my tires, I managed to blow both tubes at once when I hit a nasty hole at speed.

Anyway, conventional wisdom is to carry at least one spare tube for a quick change on the road, but to patch the punctured tube later. Unfortunately, really big holes, like from a tire blow-out may not patch, forcing you to replace the tube.

Glue-less patches are temporary usually, although I've seen them last a while.

Glue-on patches are permanent solutions. In fact, done right, they make the tire stronger where it was patched, as the glue melts the rubber of the tire and the patch together.

I carry a spare tube, but, if I ever get a puncture, I patch it at home...

Patching tubes is personal preference. For many people patching tubes is a religion. I remember I was on a ride and a person got a flat tire and the tube had 16 patches on it.....

Wow, I thought I was cheap...errr...frugal.

I think the cement patches are great and have gotten many miles out of tubes with patches. I usually just change tubes when there are 3 or 4 patches. I almost always have a spare tube but try ot save it in case of major damage to one of the tubes that a patch won't fit, or I run out of patches (which has never happened).

ive had a tube with 18 patches on it, thats my record

I got 23 flats in 2004 over about 16,500 miles, changing tubes is silly when you can patch a pinhole in a few minutes, most of the time the tire/wheel doesnt even have to come off the bike, just enough tire to get a handful of tube where the leak is.So far in 2005 Ive only had one flat.......probably just jinxed myself with that !!

Patch. They seem to be just as strong as the original tube, maybe more.

i always replace. tubes cost me $4 at the LBS. Patch kits cost around the same, maybe slightly cheaper. Patching takes time, honestly not much, but when I'm in a hurry to get home the difference in cost between patch/tube is so small that I honestly don't care.

Since March I've used 3 tubes (and two were right at the beginning when I was using an incorrect tire pressure) for a total of $12 over 1000 miles on my bike. Honestly thats the cheapest thing I've encountered on the bike!

Patch kits may cost around $3, and I used to buy one after every flat anyway becuase the open glue tube might not last the month or two until I get another flat.

So I just replace. That way it saves me some time on the road.

I do carry a patch kit and spare tube in my pack just in case I get multiple flats. And I always offer help to those stuck on the side of the road.

Wow, I thought I was cheap...errr...frugal.

I think the cement patches are great and have gotten many miles out of tubes with patches. I usually just change tubes when there are 3 or 4 patches. I almost always have a spare tube but try ot save it in case of major damage to one of the tubes that a patch won't fit, or I run out of patches (which has never happened).

16 patches is just getting started. The tube is hardly broken in by 16 patches. 25 or 30 is a good number of patches to aim for. After 30 patching just seems silly. :D

I have tubes with 15 patches on them, and they don't leak. I haven't had good luck with the glueless patches from park and others, put the conventional ones work just fine.

On the other hand, forget what I just said....send your punctured tubes to me for...uhhhh....safe disposal.

Patch kits may cost around $3, and I used to buy one after every flat anyway becuase the open glue tube might not last the month or two until I get another flat.

I'm pretty sure a glue tube will last 2 months. You are closing them, right?

dude obviously I'm closing them but honestly I don't want to chance it. I like to have a fresh glue bottle in the pack. For example I flatted out last week. The prior flat was in April. I'm pretty confident that the glue would have been shot. Anyway picking up a spare tube at the LBS is a great reason to hop over to the shop as well.

I live in an apartment in the city, and don't really have a place to patch up a tube when I get home. Wife doesn't like tubes and sweaty cyclists stinking up her kitchen with glue and rubber. And I don't like to patch on the road if I don't have to.

dude obviously I'm closing them but honestly I don't want to chance it. I like to have a fresh glue bottle in the pack. For example I flatted out last week. The prior flat was in April. I'm pretty confident that the glue would have been shot. Anyway picking up a spare tube at the LBS is a great reason to hop over to the shop as well.
I know, I know, I was only kidding. :p


I live in an apartment in the city, and don't really have a place to patch up a tube when I get home. Wife doesn't like tubes and sweaty cyclists stinking up her kitchen with glue and rubber. And I don't like to patch on the road if I don't have to.
You could always do your patch your tubes in the shower like I do, while you prepare dinner. /KRAMER

I know, I know, I was only kidding. :p


You could always do your patch your tubes in the shower like I do, while you prepare dinner. /KRAMER

LOL maybe I can create room after all for the kegerator in the new kitchen by moving the disposal into the shower!

Are patch kits quick fixes only, or can I expect a patched tube to last a while? I'm picking up a lot of glass shards, and I don't want to have to spend 10-20 bucks a week on new tubes!

Any thoughts?

I buy tubes in ten packs at Performance, making them about $2.00 a tube. I do not regularly get flats, and I do not trust a patched tire.

I've got a box full of tubes in my garage that I really, really, really intend to patch one of these days when I get around to it. Really!

Patch it until you can't patch no more!

Koffee

Customer: Do you patch tubes?
Me: No we just replace them.
Customer: But the tube is in good shape it just has a hole in it.
Me: I understand sir but if that patch leaks you'll be back and you won't be happy so we just replace them, its better that way.
Customer: Well how much is that?
Me: 10 bucks.
Customer: 10 bucks, can't you just patch it?
Me: Yeah sure 15 bucks.

I only patch if I have to, I prefer to go the new tube route. Granted they do not cost me that much but whatever. I also have kevlar beaded tires on my bikes so if I do get a flat it tends to be a pretty good size hole like a large nail or industrial type staple which I would not trust a patch with.

I stop patching when the tube is double the original weight... :D

dude obviously I'm closing them but honestly I don't want to chance it. I like to have a fresh glue bottle in the pack. For example I flatted out last week. The prior flat was in April. I'm pretty confident that the glue would have been shot. Anyway picking up a spare tube at the LBS is a great reason to hop over to the shop as well.



I use the rubber cement you can get at stationery stores, the sort used for mounting photos.

You 'replace only' people are crazy! I thought bicycling was supposed to be better for the environment somehow... At your rates, you'll dispose of a car tire worth of rubber in less time than it takes to wear out a car tire.

And if you don't trust patches... Its because you aren't doing it right! I've got 4 patches on one of my tubes that I've been using for SEVEN YEARS. And it still holds air!

Some people carry a spare tube on the road, and if they flat, they just swap in the spare tube, and then take the time back at home to patch the tube right, which after a good testing run, turns it into another 'spare tube' for the road. That way you don't have to sit by the road for long, but you still don't waste a perfectly good tube.

peace,
sam

I buy tubes in ten packs at Performance, making them about $2.00 a tube. I do not regularly get flats, and I do not trust a patched tire.

I'm puzzled as to why you wouldn't trust a patched tube. I have tubes that are older then some of my underwear ;) and they are still going strong. In fact, they're in better shape than some of my underwear :eek: :D

I save my punctured tubes until I get 5 or 6, then patch them all at once.

When you open a new tube of glue, it's best to use it all immediately.

16 patches is just getting started. The tube is hardly broken in by 16 patches. 25 or 30 is a good number of patches to aim for. After 30 patching just seems silly. :D

I can't tell if you are serious or not - but I hope you are serious :)

I throw out my tubes when they get 3 or 4 patches. I have had a patch leak only once since 1987!

not patching your tubes is wasteful on a number of levels.

1) waste of money
2) waste of resources (where that tube going when you throw it out?)
3) waste of skills

on the commute, i replace the tube with a good one and patch the old one at home later. unless i also puncture that tube, that is.

it's good to keep the patching skills tuned-up -- you can carry a lot more patches than tubes.

i generally keep patching tubes until the valve fails or it gets a tear bigger than a patch.

I can't tell if you are serious or not - but I hope you are serious :)

I throw out my tubes when they get 3 or 4 patches. I have had a patch leak only once since 1987!

My wife makes fun of me when I go past 25. Honestly. The only time I replace a tube is when the valve stem fails.

I find i'm rather incompetent at patching tires, but I can't figure out what to do with used tubes so they're piling up in my room.

You 'replace only' people are crazy! I thought bicycling was supposed to be better for the environment somehow... At your rates, you'll dispose of a car tire worth of rubber in less time than it takes to wear out a car tire.

And if you don't trust patches... Its because you aren't doing it right! I've got 4 patches on one of my tubes that I've been using for SEVEN YEARS. And it still holds air!

Some people carry a spare tube on the road, and if they flat, they just swap in the spare tube, and then take the time back at home to patch the tube right, which after a good testing run, turns it into another 'spare tube' for the road. That way you don't have to sit by the road for long, but you still don't waste a perfectly good tube.

peace,
sam

let's see.. your riding produced four flats that became four patches in seven years...
so if your repairs were altered you would have four tubes in seven years.. how does this equal the disposal of a car tire?

i rarely get flats when using quality kevlar tires, maybe every couple months... when i use cheap tires i get them weekly, so if we are to compare the environmental impacts of one that patches with cheap tires then i would speculate the impact could be much more compared to one that replaces a tube with each puncture given the rubber cement manufaturing and foil tube waste etc. that is entailed in the patching.

but really isn't this a hypercritical point?
i certainly don't think anyone is "crazy" for patching or replacing.. but then i replace so maybe i am indeed "crazy" ;)

Are patch kits quick fixes only, or can I expect a patched tube to last a while? I'm picking up a lot of glass shards, and I don't want to have to spend 10-20 bucks a week on new tubes!

They'll last forever if done right. Get the kind with glue, not the glueless kind, and follow the instructions. If you're getting that many flats, you probably need to get kevlar belt tires or tire liners.

let's see.. your riding produced four flats that became four patches in seven years...
so if your repairs were altered you would have four tubes in seven years.. how does this equal the disposal of a car tire?

i rarely get flats when using quality kevlar tires, maybe every couple months... when i use cheap tires i get them weekly, so if we are to compare the environmental impacts of one that patches with cheap tires then i would speculate the impact could be much more compared to one that replaces a tube with each puncture given the rubber cement manufaturing and foil tube waste etc. that is entailed in the patching.

but really isn't this a hypercritical point?
i certainly don't think anyone is "crazy" for patching or replacing.. but then i replace so maybe i am indeed "crazy" ;)

When you live in the land of poky things like I do, replacement can become expensive indeed. Four flats is common for a per week average especially when the goatheads cure out in the fall. To each his own.

From an environmental stand point however, the amount of volatile organic compounds released by patching a tube rather than replacing it and the waste involved is far outweighed by volative organic compounds and waste involved in producing the tube even with multiple patches. A new tube requires lots more chemicals and energy to produce also as well as the solid waste from the packaging and the old tube. From that standpoint, it "better" to patch than replace...even with good tires.

Down south, in the desert, where the plants are pointy and evil, rode a lone biker in the second half of a double century, doom smote upon his tire repeatedly....... Well to make a long story short (too late), I had 14 flats one day. I can't carry 14 tubes with me but 14 patches is much more manageable. I had a kevlar tire bite it due to a road hazard and the spare tire was not kevlar. The rain had caused the road to become a bed of thorns. Anyway, I carry 2 tubes and a bunch of patches. I have never had a tightly lidded tube of glue dry up and that is after being stored in 110+ degree heat on a regular basis over 3 years now. I always close the tube as soon as I have applied the contents to the tube.

incidentally it irks me to no end having to pick up faster peoples tubes on the side of the road at organized rides. If you started with the weight you are certainly strong enought carry it back to the start.

incidentally it irks me to no end having to pick up faster peoples tubes on the side of the road at organized rides. If you started with the weight you are certainly strong enought carry it back to the start.

it irks me a little...until i realize....

a) if it's the right size, i just got a free tube (that i'll patch)
b) if it's not the right size, someone else will get a free tube (that i'll patch first).
c) if it's thrashed it's still usable for something.

I'm puzzle as to why you wouldn't trust a patched tube. I have tubes that are older then some of my underwear ;) and they are still going strong. In fact, they're in better shape than some of my underwear :eek: :D

I do not trust them because every last patched tire I've had has not lasted as long as a new tire. As for the argument against me for not caring for the environment, I am already doing my part by not driving my car 5 days a week :D I also use slime to prevent flats. I guess one could look at it like "an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure." Either that or the cost of patching a tire is about the same as sliming a tire. :shrug:

Let me understand, you have patch kits that the glue goes bad in??? I've been using the same tube of glue for 2 years....? It hasn't dried out and the tubes I've patched are holding just fine. Or at least the one I rode yesterday was. Patching is easy and works just fine.

I use the rubber cement you can get at stationery stores, the sort used for mounting photos.

Ditto. I'ts the same stuff.

I'd say how I patch tires but I've forgotten, it's been so long since I had a flat. If I got one I would patch it, though.


And back when I did get them, I patched them.

Let me understand, you have patch kits that the glue goes bad in??? I've been using the same tube of glue for 2 years....? It hasn't dried out and the tubes I've patched are holding just fine. Or at least the one I rode yesterday was. Patching is easy and works just fine.

A glue tube that has had the seal punctured will eventually dry out here in Colorado. Our lower air pressure makes the solvent evaporate faster then lower altitudes so I try to get new glue tubes at the start of every season. I have had to walk to the nearest bus stop several times until I learned that lesson.

I do not trust them because every last patched tire I've had has not lasted as long as a new tire. As for the argument against me for not caring for the environment, I am already doing my part by not driving my car 5 days a week :D I also use slime to prevent flats. I guess one could look at it like "an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure." Either that or the cost of patching a tire is about the same as sliming a tire. :shrug:

I was just curious. Didn't mean to imply that you don't care for the environment. Making new tubes is less environmentally friendly than repairing them but all that pales in comparison to the wheeled toxic waste dumps we (collectively "we", as in "society") drive around all day. We could have oil dripping from the chains of our bikes and replace tires and tubes everyday and still come out ahead in that department.

I'm puzzle as to why you wouldn't trust a patched tube. I have tubes that are older then some of my underwear ;) and they are still going strong. In fact, they're in better shape than some of my underwear :eek: :D

HAHAHA! If only you couild patch underwear as easily as a bike tire tube! I once put a Rema Tip Top patch over a hole in the toe of my Converse Chuck Taylor All Stars. It held up well and got some chuckles/thumbs ups from my messenger brethren.

I won't put more than 7 patches on a tube. That's just where I draw the line. Patches are great but they add weight (each one insignificant amount but it adds up).

ive had a tube with 18 patches on it, thats my record

I got 23 flats in 2004 over about 16,500 miles, changing tubes is silly when you can patch a pinhole in a few minutes, most of the time the tire/wheel doesnt even have to come off the bike, just enough tire to get a handful of tube where the leak is.So far in 2005 Ive only had one flat.......probably just jinxed myself with that !!

Pardon my newbie ignorance but how can you tell where the leak is?

P.S. I'm taking a bicyle course in two weeks and one of the things I'll learn is maintenance but I'm commuting 14 miles per day so in the mean time . . . Thanks!

Pardon my newbie ignorance but how can you tell where the leak is?

P.S. I'm taking a bicyle course in two weeks and one of the things I'll learn is maintenance but I'm commuting 14 miles per day so in the mean time . . . Thanks!

There are a number of ways. The easiest if you have access to water is to inflate the tube and put in a tub of water and look for the leaks. There will usually be some small bubbles trapped on the tube, make sure you wipe them off under water to insure that they aren't small leaks. If they reform without being taken out of the water, they are leaks.

Another way is to "kiss the tube". Inflate the tube so that it is much larger then it would be in the tire. It should be half again as big. Then slowly run the tube across your lips like you are gently kissing it. It looks silly but we humans have lots of nerves in our lips which is why kissing is so pleasurable :D If there is a flow of air you will feel it on your lips. Mark the place and patch it.

Another easy way to find a leak is to find the object that caused it. If you have a big old goathead sticking into the tire. That's your leak! Don't pull it out! Take the tire apart find the object and fix the flat. This is the best way since you don't have to take anymore of the tire off the bead then needed to get that section of tube out.

There are a number of ways. The easiest if you have access to water is to inflate the tube and put in a tub of water and look for the leaks. There will usually be some small bubbles trapped on the tube, make sure you wipe them off under water to insure that they aren't small leaks. If they reform without being taken out of the water, they are leaks.

Another way is to "kiss the tube". Inflate the tube so that it is much larger then it would be in the tire. It should be half again as big. Then slowly run the tube across your lips like you are gently kissing it. It looks silly but we humans have lots of nerves in our lips which is why kissing is so pleasurable :D If there is a flow of air you will feel it on your lips. Mark the place and patch it.

Another easy way to find a leak is to find the object that caused it. If you have a big old goathead sticking into the tire. That's your leak! Don't pull it out! Take the tire apart find the object and fix the flat. This is the best way since you don't have to take anymore of the tire off the bead then needed to get that section of tube out.

He's talking about locating the leak without taking the tube out of the tire, as was mentioned in the post he replied to. Only the last method you mentioned has a chance of working in that scenario.

I was just curious. Didn't mean to imply that you don't care for the environment. Making new tubes is less environmentally friendly than repairing them but all that pales in comparison to the wheeled toxic waste dumps we (collectively "we", as in "society") drive around all day. We could have oil dripping from the chains of our bikes and replace tires and tubes everyday and still come out ahead in that department.

No problemo - I've just had bad experiences with patching. Perhaps I should ask my LBS about it, as you do have a valid point. Remedial Patching School :D

I'd say how I patch tires but I've forgotten, it's been so long since I had a flat. If I got one I would patch it, though.

You've doomed yourself to a flat tomorrow.

Count me in the patch crowd :)

Anyone who does not patch is welcome to send me their punctured tubes. I'll make sure they are carefully disposed of so they can pose no further danger to the original user ;)

Cheers,

Ed

I'm one of those replace-and-patch-at-home types. I carry one spare and if I get another flat then I will do a roadside patch. However, I rarely get flats. OTOH, I am picky about my tubes and I'm a bit picky about paying too much for them too. I like a specific tube brand with a specific valvestem style and they're not always on sale. I pick up a couple when they are but as a result I'm encouraged to patch my old tubes and not just throw them away. I also give them away to friends. The only tubes I don't reuse are the ones which have had the valve pull out. I find other uses for that such as turning pieces of them into a plug for my seatpost in order to hold spare spokes...

http://www.neebu.net/~khuon/albums/carrying_spokes/PICT0002.thumb.jpghttp://www.neebu.net/~khuon/albums/carrying_spokes/PICT0003.thumb.jpghttp://www.neebu.net/~khuon/albums/carrying_spokes/PICT0005.thumb.jpg

... or using them to line the jaws of my homemade repair stand...

http://www.neebu.net/~khuon/albums/bike_repair_stand/pict0009.thumb.jpghttp://www.neebu.net/~khuon/albums/bike_repair_stand/pict0010.thumb.jpghttp://www.neebu.net/~khuon/albums/bike_repair_stand/pict0004_001.thumb.jpg

patching tires is hardly a "skill"

i mean honestly it's pretty easy right? is there something i'm missing? FYI I replace but I could not imaging losing the "skills" to patch!

It is interesting however to notice that this question was aksed a few weeks ago on the road bike forum. The vast majority favored replacing vs. patching. Guess it goes to show that commuters are doing it for more monetary and environmental vs. physical and fun reasons. Not sure if my hypothesis works out but still it's interesting becuase there is a vast difference in the majority opinion between the two boards.