Tour de France - Stage 1: Fromentine- Noirmoutier-en-l'Ile

I'd like an Aussie TDF winner after Lance gets #7. ;)

Maybe Mark Webber... errr, oops... wrong sport. :p

Ullrich got owned. He's totally done. He's got nothing. He can't put time on Lance in the mountains, he got served in the TT- and a short one!
Lance about has a free ride to #7 barring accidents.

Congrats to Zabriskie! He is a local (out of SLC), I raced him once up little cotton wood canyon, uh, he kicked my butt... :D

Ullrich got owned. He's totally done. He's got nothing. He can't put time on Lance in the mountains, he got served in the TT- and a short one!
Lance about has a free ride to #7 barring accidents.

Listen I am Lance Fan#1 - But don't forget 2003. Jan OWNED Lance in the mountains for several days and nearly won...Lance had some serious health issues and some bad luck as well (kinda the way Jan is right now right a stitched neck and likely sore muscles from his Friday crash)

I agree that Jan stunk the place out comapared to Lance today..but today is over. The race hasn't even begun yet.

I love this race and love the drama, but hate the day1 "HE'S DONE!, or "HE'S GOT IT IN THE BAG"
Anyone has watched a Tour de France knows that comments like that on day1 are as ridiculous as winning the tour 5 times in a row...er wait...

Hats off to Zabriskie. He averaged 33 mph over 19 miles. :eek: What a great ride!

No doubt the winner will come from either Discovery Channel, T-mobile, CSC, or Phonak.

It has been mentioned how Lance had super small gearing on his TT bike for stage 1. Do you think that some of the other Discovery team riders communicated to Lance information so as to determine a gear ratio just prior to Lance staring his time trial?

It has been mentioned how Lance had super small gearing on his TT bike for stage 1. Do you think that some of the other Discovery team riders communicated to Lance information so as to determine a gear ratio just prior to Lance staring his time trial?

Im sure they all had the course scoped out and had a plan made long before todays stage.

I thought Botero would do better but prologues aren't his thing anyways, the long TT is more his thing.

gotta love the Ullrich bashing, give me a break, the man bounced off a car yesterday and broke the rear window, its a wonder he is riding at all, he's probably stiff and sore all over.........."little accident"?????No im not an Ullrich fan, but come on, give credit where credit is due.

my respect goes to all the guys out there riding in more than just ONE GT this year, WTG guys, thats what racing is about

Agreed. While it was a GREAT start to what looks like is shaping up to be an historic tour, Zabriskie and Lance absolutely smoking the TT, you have to hand it to Jan just for even being there at all considering he went threw a rear windscreen yesterday. I look to see him coming back. I WANT him to. Give the guy a break (and smaller chainrings :D ) - He is a great rider. I just like the competition and the DRAMA! As said above - that's what racing is all about.

So fun! BTW - was flipping back and forth between the Tour and Live 8 - and the reunited Pink Floyd totally blistered Hyde Park! Epic all over this weekend!

In an interview last year, Lance commented how part of the stragegy was NOT to place first prematurely- one, to avoid having to defend the yellow, but primarily it's a strategic time management thing. The top finisher has to go to a photo op, then a mandatory drug control, then a mandatory press conference.
The second finisher goes directly into recovery mode, and get 2 hours more rest/sleep than the winner.

If Lance can place second for the first 10 stages, and if luck/ team dynamics can rotate the first place finishes among a variety of competitors, then after Stage10 Lance will be in first place without ever winning AND will have had 20 hours more rest than the first-placers.

That's the genius of Johan Bruyneel and the sophistication of LA's team.

And FWIW you've got to give Ullrich space for the crash just before the Tour.

What if Jan is just bluffing too? Remember LA has done this a couple of times to Jan... Maybe he wants one last chance for payback...

This boggles my mind. Not that Zabriskie has the fastest tt speed ever, but that Lemond's speed has stood for 16 years. What's been the point of all of that bike technology, training methods, aerodynamics, etc., if it hasn't led to a faster tt time?

Have tt times in general gotten faster? Was Lemond's speed a huge anomaly, aided by some environmental or geographical condition (like Beamon's 1968 long jump)?


Perhaps the race of a champion...Lemond... knowing what he needed to do to win the Tour. I believe that LA set out with the goal of catching Jan....I also believe that when he sets a goal you better look out. I really really hope someone challenges him big time.

I wish I had chosen Gonzalez de Galdeano for my top 10 picks, looks as if he may ride a good tour. With the 2 early TT's he may endup the team leader

This boggles my mind. Not that Zabriskie has the fastest tt speed ever, but that Lemond's speed has stood for 16 years. What's been the point of all of that bike technology, training methods, aerodynamics, etc., if it hasn't led to a faster tt time?

Have tt times in general gotten faster? Was Lemond's speed a huge anomaly, aided by some environmental or geographical condition (like Beamon's 1968 long jump)?

You mean all the dopers that Lemond was/is complaining about couldn't beat his record?

How great was Lance's ride today? Problems getting clipped in at the start. Eased off in the last mile or so after putting away Ullrich. Result: Lance's fastest TdF time trial of his career and the second fastest time trial speed in the TdF in 102 years at 33.97 MPH - Zabriske setting the "all time" record for the Tour at 33.98 MPH.

The "Lance Bashers" will say that the other contenders were just "laying low" to let Lance get "over confident". But, which guy who intends to WIN the Tour would "spot" Lance these sorts of margin:


- Basso 1:24

- Heras 2:18

- Mayo 3:13


Ullrich, riding well considering his "hard" crash earlier this week, and Vinokourov are the only contenders who ought to feel pretty good about how their day went. For a guy just along to "help" out Ullrich, Vinokourov is looking mighty strong.

No one expects Heras and Mayo to stay close to Lance in a TT. Basso? The Giro/TDF double is tough on the legs.

Lance has never truly had a bad day in the Tour. It's incredible how much time one can lose in the mountains if they come down with even the slightest illness. He could easily lose 20 minutes if that happened.

It ain't over yet.

If Lance can place second for the first 10 stages, and if luck/ team dynamics can rotate the first place finishes among a variety of competitors, then after Stage10 Lance will be in first place without ever winning AND will have had 20 hours more rest than the first-placers.

That's the genius of Johan Bruyneel and the sophistication of LA's team.

I don't doubt that the actual win today wasn't of the utmost importance to LA & Disco, but I would be shocked if Disco didn't do everything in their power to win the TTT. If they do, then your theory most likely can't last past stage 4.

Certainly Disco don't want all the front-of-the-peloton workload, but they are not going to throw away the TTT unless someone else is simply better on the day. CSC could be that team, thereby potentially keeping DZ in yellow, but it's definitely not a given.

Listen I am Lance Fan#1 - But don't forget 2003.


I love this race and love the drama, but hate the day1 "HE'S DONE!, or "HE'S GOT IT IN THE BAG"
Anyone has watched a Tour de France knows that comments like that on day1 are as ridiculous as winning the tour 5 times in a row...er wait...

oh yeah 2003... where Ullrich had much better form and Lance STILL won.

Ullrich doesn't have the attitude nor the form to win this year. You don't give up over a minute in 19K on purpose, that's just embarassing.

Ullrich had a crash before the TT... oh well, that's life. Suck it up and win or loose, excuses dont win the TDF. Ullrich himself said the crash was not serious.

Ullrich is done. He had NO form in the Td Suisse and he's only going to loose time to Lance in future TT's and mountains. I will be surprised if Ullrich can even stay in the front group on the climbs. He's done. No form is NO FORM. He doesn't have it- I wish he did but he doesn't. Lance has him mentally too- Ullrich will never break Lance man-to-man, because a) Lance has broken him many times b) Ullrich has NO FORM

T-Mobile's DS even said [we still have Vino to focus on] after today.

I'm looking for Basso to make things interesting. Vino and Kloden are good so the race will still be an interesting battle for 2nd and 3rd... and alot of finger crossing by Lance & Co that there are no accidents.

If it wasn't for the pedal screw up I think LA could've won the prologue.

:rolleyes

Lance wasn't winning the "first stage." No way they want to defend the jersey. And to those who say just lose it it doesn't quite work that way. Way bad form.

David Millar will win for sure....





DOH!


2006 baby! Assuming anyone wants to take him back ...

I think the real interesting part about this years TDF is how many guys arlready have a GT in their legs, given that should the old adage that you cant do well in more than one GT hold true, that wipes out basso,heras,zabriskie, and quite a few others.You wont likely see this little idea bantered around during LA's final TDF I dont think though.However, should any of these multiple GT guys do well and/or actually win it, it will look very very bad on LA whether LA fans want to acknowledge it or not.If the conventional wisdom of one GT and one GT only for serious GC contenders does hold true, well who are we looking at here?LA and ?Im honestly not sure how far you have to go down the list before you find someone actually with a legit shot at a GC win that wasnt in the Giro, im sure someone here knows?

Ullrich, riding well considering his "hard" crash earlier this week,

Considering he hit the back window hard enough to smash it, I don't think that the quotes are required. Jerk.

Ullrich had a crash before the TT... oh well, that's life. Suck it up and win or loose, excuses dont win the TDF. Ullrich himself said the crash was not serious.

Yeah, you're right. There are no excuses however I (and apparently Paul and Phil) think HE was downplaying it. He broke the back window of that Audi for christ's sake. Do you know how hard it is to do that?

Ullrich has Armstrong right where he wants him... .

before I comment on the actual stage, lets keep this civil.
I know there are some strong feelings here, but it's no excuse for
downright rudeness or personal attacks. . .
ok enough of that
I only recognize about three posters in this thread. Where did everyone come from?
like someone once said "It's the Tour, baby!"
DZ was awesome, props to him for the win and breaking Greg's TT record
(will we hear Greg whinge about this one? I hope not).
Lance, despite clipping out could have won the stage if he wanted
to. He just did not need to. His message was delivered loud and clear.
I'm betting Jan is hurting way more than he is letting on, going through
a window's gotta hurt. FWIW I think the reason Jan won't win is psychological
he can't seem to figure out LA and how to beat him.
I don't know if Vino can maintain for the entire tour, if this wasn't a grand
tour I think he would be a strong contender. It does speak legions for him
and will bode well when he leaves T-mobile next year.
The tour is NOT over, not by a long shot, there is too much unpredictable
in the first week or so, remember Lance in the crash 2 years ago (or was it 3?)
anyhow we have a long way to go before paris, I'm hoping for a close nail
biter of a tour.
RacerX nice to see you around, been a while.
Laggard, Devil who do you pick for the Maillot Pauve now?

Marty

I think the real interesting part about this years TDF is how many guys arlready have a GT in their legs, given that should the old adage that you cant do well in more than one GT hold true, that wipes out basso,heras,zabriskie, and quite a few others. <snip> Im honestly not sure how far you have to go down the list before you find someone actually with a legit shot at a GC win that wasnt in the Giro, im sure someone here knows?
Basso did a pretty good job at the Giro. He was ill for part of it, and came back to form in the last few days... But I don't think 28th place is what you're talking about. Heras didn't ride the Giro, but rides the Vuelta ususally.

Most of the riders who have a shot at the Tour didn't ride the Giro: Ullrich, Kloden, Vinokourov, Mayo, Heras. Even Bradley McGee decided to save himself this year.

What interests me is guys like Paolo Savoldelli. Giro winner, ready to run his butt into the ground for Lance in the mountains. That's one tired dude come July 24th.

It has been mentioned how Lance had super small gearing on his TT bike for stage 1. Do you think that some of the other Discovery team riders communicated to Lance information so as to determine a gear ratio just prior to Lance staring his time trial?

If it was highly variable to conditions, perhaps they could have just looked at the average speed of the earlier riders. As it was mostly flat.

What if Jan is just bluffing too? Remember LA has done this a couple of times to Jan... Maybe he wants one last chance for payback...

There is no bluff in a time trial.


What interests me is guys like Paolo Savoldelli. Giro winner, ready to run his butt into the ground for Lance in the mountains. That's one tired dude come July 24th.

Yeah, they keep talking about how strong that team is with him, but I'm not sure he has a lot of gas left.
But I guess it's a lot different to be a domestique... surely he could have a few extra resting days and still put in a great mountain stage or two. And I'd suspect him riding well in the TTT.

Of course it isn't over, but I said that, because Jan simply cannot take time out of Lance in the mountains. I actually was hoping to see Jan post a good TT number relative to the GC contenders, but he whiffed today.

Basso? I hope he wins the dang Tour, but the Giro-Tour double might be too much to ask of him this year or any.

The only thing that can defeat Lance now is a freak illness or crash. He's demonstrated an ability to avoid these things. Just can't see him yield anything now.

Laggard's right. The attacks have to come from all over when the road pitches up. I'm going to be sorely upset if we don't see that.

The only thing that can defeat Lance now is a freak illness or crash.

I don't know. Even if he doesn't have that trouble, there are still a few very strong climbers... and considering the route, it will be close. Remember he couldn't break Basso last year on an open stage, while still being on probably his career best form.

Ullrich is not the only rival here. In fact I wouldn't be suprised to see him finish outside the top 5.

Ullrich has Armstrong right where he wants him... .

are you saying he wants to lose?

Laggard, Devil who do you pick for the Maillot Pauve now?


I'm going to pick Pieter Weening. Should be a lock.

The Maillot Foix is a tossup though.

Just watched the stage on TiVo and wanted to get in my two cents... I fully concur with the Bobke - Lance eased up a bit, letting ZB take the stage and the yellow early on.

As for Jan - I think people are being a bit hard on his performance and not simply recognizing that Lance and ZB just had incredible times. When you look at Jan's time in comparison to the the rest of the field, it's right there...

I'm no tour expert by any means, but some of you think Jan, Brasso, etc, can't make up 1 minute over the course of 23 days? You're crazy.

yeah, but Armstrong has obviously shown he's in frightening form....AGAIN!!

Did anyone notice that there werent any golf ball dimples on the arms of Lance's suit? They made a real big deal about that technology on the "Chasing Lance" series. I wonder why they didnt use it.

???

A golf ball is spinning.
In a static suit, those dimples would be extra aerodrag.

Was there some effort to mislead the competition?

Zabriskie turned 26 in last December.
Wasn't the white jersey cuttoff 26 in December also?
Anyone know the precise date?

1/1/80 is the cuttoff/

???

A golf ball is spinning.
In a static suit, those dimples would be extra aerodrag.

Was there some effort to mislead the competition?

The dimples were placed in areas where it would help reduce aerodrag, not all over his suit. I don't recall ever getting a close enough view to determine if they were there or not.

???

A golf ball is spinning.
In a static suit, those dimples would be extra aerodrag.

Was there some effort to mislead the competition?


I guess we know someone who didnt tune in for the science of lance. Shame on you.

...some of you think Jan, Brasso, etc, can't make up 1 minute over the course of 23 days? You're crazy.

The point from "Day One" was NOT that the race was over. It was that THIS stage will be the best opportunity during the first week of the Tour to establish the relative physical condition of each rider. Their team mates could not help them through this stage. It was one rider, one road, and one clock.

BEFORE the Tour, the usual numbskulls were saying that "Lance is too old", "Lance has lost the fire in the belly", "Lance spends to much time on his rock 'n roll girlfriend", "Ullrich is in the form of his life", "Basso has learned to time trial"...etc., etc.

And, "Stage One" revealed the truth: Armstrong is in the best form of his life (this was the FASTEST time trial of this length Lance has ever run in the Tour). He has the fire in the belly. And, Ullrich and Basso and Mayo are the same guys they were last year...which means they are riding for second place.

To beat Lance, someone will have to push Lance over a cliff. And before the race is over, we may see someone try such a thing. But, if Lance remains healthy, and avoids crashes and injuries, he is the rabbit that the others must chase.

The Tour de France begins on July 12th, on the slopes of Courchevel. Lance has sent a message to the Peloton: "I'm ready".

I agree with Alan..Stage 1 was to tell us LAs strengths and weakness relative to his own successes and that of his prime competitors too.. Well its looks like LA is in prime condition and all those who took respite in his early season failures were barking up the wrong tree..It also looks like his competition has not improved in the tt relative to Lance..The tour isnt over but it sure looks like Lance is in prime form which means that unless bad luck befalls him it will take a near superhuman effort for someone else to win..

Jan cannot take time out of Lance in the mountains. Basso, maybe, but I doubt it. I was of the belief that Lance's TT skills would show a little age, and that others might be able to put time into him in the TTs. Nope. Not going to happen.

It's over and it just got started.

I was watching the time trails yesterday an was horrified to see Lance come out of his pedals on the start. But he still managed to take second in spite of it! He even passed the dude that stated before Lance. How embarrassing!!

wow, yeah thanks for the update on that "dude" but we are on to stage 3 already.

Wait wher eis the "tour de france forum" ? Am I missing something?
It is a sub forum under road cyclying.. look at the top of this forum...

yeah, but Armstrong has obviously shown he's in frightening form....AGAIN!!

Just finished watching stage 1. "Frightening form...." this just about sums it up! It is also great to see so many US cyclists in the top 15. That is a great story in itself.

Yeah, you're right. There are no excuses however I (and apparently Paul and Phil) think HE was downplaying it. He broke the back window of that Audi for christ's sake. Do you know how hard it is to do that?

It's tempered glass. It's not laminated like a windshield, so it doesn't necessarily take a lot to break it. Breaking the rear window leaves a wide berth on the potential magnitude of the impact. May have hard or may have been mild. All we know is that he did get cut, lost some blood, and is wearing a big bandage.

It's still pretty ambiguous whether Jan is hurting big time or not.

this one's for Penguin and Slvoid :D

http://img3.buzznet.com/assets/users8/ziggurat/default/msg-1120434152-2.jpg

The comentators made a...comment that seemed pretty interesting to me. The one guy...I forget who...said he thought it looked like LA eased up before the line and maybe gave the stage to DZ so that Dicso wouldn't have to worry about defending the yellow. Puts some pressure on CSC to defend and he had already crushed Ulrich and Basso...Vino is right up there though.

Hey Jan look out for that car! :D

I was thinking exactly the same as Bob way BEFORE that, when I heard the result is 2 seconds from Zabriskie.

I don't think Lance was afraid of having yellow early but I'm 90% sure that he gave that away to the guy being an American fellow, and the only third American who won YJ. It doesn't make sense that he's 3 seconds faster at the last check but lost 2 seconds at the end, which means 5 seconds total from the LAST CHECK point. That is about few kms away fron the finish line. If he could maintain all the speed through out the time trial, it's impossible to lose 5 seconds all of sudden on the last few, don't you think?

I think it's pretty smart move from Lance, also avoid spot light which he already gotten enough.

I was thinking exactly the same as Bob way BEFORE that, when I heard the result is 2 seconds from Zabriskie.

I don't think Lance was afraid of having yellow early but I'm 90% sure that he gave that away to the guy being an American fellow, and the only third American who won YJ. It doesn't make sense that he's 3 seconds faster at the last check but lost 2 seconds at the end, which means 5 seconds total from the LAST CHECK point. That is about few kms away fron the finish line. If he could maintain all the speed through out the time trial, it's impossible to lose 5 seconds all of sudden on the last few, don't you think?

I think it's pretty smart move from Lance, also avoid spot light which he already gotten enough.

Good point.

Of all the information Lance was getting from the team manager through the radio, he was aware of all the seconds gained and lost. I think it was the team manager's decision. It was meaningful to send a message to Jan by passing him but wasn't meaningful to take a first place at this point of the race.

After all, Lance wasn't gasping for air at the finish line. If he didn't hold it back, the result would have been even more frightening.

Good point.

Of all the information Lance was getting from the team manager through the radio, he was aware of all the seconds gained and lost. I think it was the team manager's decision. It was meaningful to send a message to Jan by passing him but wasn't meaningful to take a first place at this point of the race.

After all, Lance wasn't gasping for air at the finish line. If he didn't hold it back, the result would have been even more frightening.

Lance wasn't gasping for air because he knows precisely what HR and power to ride at... when you see people in that state you know they have done something wrong (common misconception.. go into the red zone too much and you will actually go slower and slower not faster) and we know that Lance did almost everything right in that TT. Carmichael hinted that Lance's slight slow down at the end was related to the one thing that he did wrong... it was a tactical move rather than one that would help him produce the best time... when he went past Ullrich he sped up... probably to demoralize him a bit and to dissuade him from following.. since LA was already riding at his LT, this acceleration would have put Armstrong well into the red zone and affected his time adversely..

Lance could have worn the jersey from start to finish had he won the first stage, that coupled with reports that he threw his helmet when he found out he lost by 2 seconds leads me to believe he tried to win it.

Lance could have worn the jersey from start to finish had he won the first stage, that coupled with reports that he threw his helmet when he found out he lost by 2 seconds leads me to believe he tried to win it.

That also means that if he knew the time difference between Zabriskie, he could have made up for it. If he gave everything he had, he wouldn't be mad at himself. Why he found it out only after he crossed the finish line? He didn't have a computer on his bike to tell that he slowed down enough to lose 5 seconds between the check point? Something doesn't add up.