Road Cycling - Anyone know about these Leader frames

I noticed these road bike frames on Ebay - "Leader" with a alloy carbon blend (seat stays). Here is a picture, the selling price "buy it now" is $299, if you purchase the frame they will include a carbon fork for $99. Any insight?

very suspicious *raises metaphysical eyebrow

I'm sure its fine. One thing for sure, the graphics are ugly.
Nikos, I'm not sure if you are on some path of chasing your tail. I know you are selling your Talledega because you think its too small for a yellow, used bianchi or maybe this Leader?

I thiink you should just adjust the stem/seatpost of the talledega. It won't, contrary to your belief, mess up your legs or stretch you out too far. The way you have it set up is similar to the way racers set up their bikes.
Plus, none of the frames look nearly as good as your talledega. I think it's alot of effort for very little if any gain.
Now if you "think" you need it, one can justify anything. You have been comfortably riding that bike (shop fitted, I add) and you can't let people on the internet- who have never seen you, your bike or you on your bike judge what is right for you. My suggestions are to try to help with a cm here, cm there adjustment.
I feel as if you are throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Maybe I'm wrong but maybe you should think about what you already have before you throw alot of time, effort and expense when maybe a seat/ stem adjustment is all you need.

Originally posted by RacerX
Maybe I'm wrong but maybe you should think about what you already have before you throw alot of time, effort and expense when maybe a seat/ stem adjustment is all you need.
I was amazed at how high the seat posts were on some of the bikes in the Tour de France. My seat post won't even go that high.

Obviously one school of thought, even among these professionals, is that you should have a smaller frame and longer seat post.

They are supposedly based out of San Diego. I am in San Diego until mid-August; I'll investigate, maybe I can visit their hub and gather some clues...

in the meantime, Google has revealed:
a 2-man relay team sponsored by Leader (http://www.geocities.com/admiralsandmel/raamsponsors.html)

Leader bike homepage (http://www.leaderbikeusa.com/) (down at the moment).

Some of the deeper links to their site do work, but some of them are mislabeled (the link to the LD780 page, the frame you are curious about, mistakenly jumps to the LD775 description).

The poor English in them also raises eyebrows. Note the mis-spelling of "excellent" found both on their site, and also in a review by "someone that bought a leader frame off ebay":
Leader site, description of their carbon seatposts (http://www.leaderbikeusa.com/newLBweb/ldweb/other/seatpost.htm)
versus
a "review" (http://www.mybikesite.com/messages/road/messages/1773.htm) Note the similarity of English, and mis-spelled words.

another "review" (http://www.roadbikereview.com/DRMBike_204crx.aspx) Note again the poor English, mis-spelling, and recurring ALL-CAPS.

another (http://www.mybikesite.com/messages/road/messages/1767.htm), again with poor English:

If you meant to run a legitimate business, would you resort to writing artificial reviews of your products? If you meant to start a legitimate, long-term business, would you be so careless with typing and webpage creation? They could be a genuine enterprise, but these things DO raise suspicion in my mind...
Note, these were the only reviews of the product that I could find, both of them posted in 2002; and, San Diego is about 15 minutes from the Mexican border (which might explain the low $).

I hope I am not smashing an honest business with this cruelty. I mean to find out more by calling/visiting them, I'll let you know.

For what it's worth...

Leader is mainly a contract manufacturer for other bike brands. I kknow, for example, that Argon 18, a generally well-thought-of marque in Canada, has its CF bikes made by Leader. There are a whole lot of bikes out there that are Leaders under the paint.

For what it's worth...

Leader is mainly a contract manufacturer for other bike brands. I know, for example, that Argon 18, a generally well-thought-of marque in Canada, has its CF bikes made by Leader. There are a whole lot of bikes out there that are Leaders under the paint.


Although I'm a bit late (a year?) I want to weigh in here.

I was in negotiation with the fine peeps at Leader Bike for around two weeks trying to get all the details worked out on the carbon fiber/aluminum road bike they offer (785R with full Dura Ace components). During this time I was also in communication with Getawaybikes.com regarding their Tommaso Ti road frame.

The Leader bike was selling for $2049.00 and they wouldn't budge on the price. I emailed Getaway Bikes and asked if they could match or beat the Leader Bike price on a fully assembled Tommaso Ti bike with Dura Ace Flight Deck components. Getaway gave me a great (and better) price so I decided to go with them. I informed the guys at Leader Bike that I appreciated all their help but I was going to pass on their bike (I did not tell them why). I got an email back from them IN ALL CAPITAL LETTERS which I assumed meant that they were yelling at me... Very poor netiquette.

When I called Getaway Bikes to place my order I found their customer service rep. to be very friendly and helpful (and there were no type-o's in any of the emails we exchanged). Leader Bike, on the other hand, had TONS of type-o's in their communications (not to mention getting "yelled" at) which left me wondering exactly what caliber of people I was dealing with.

As I type this my bike is in the process of being built and I'm pretty stoked. I'll be even more stoked when I get it!

Merry Christmas to me!!! :D

Hello,

I could not help responding to the post by Thhaze. This is the second post he writes about Leader with the same message. We do not recall him ever wanting to place an order. Maybe Gateway put him up to this? To see someone take so much time in trying to make us look so good.

If anyone should have any questions about us please visit one of our dealers or go to our website www.leaderbikeusa.com you can find our address and telephone number there. We will be happy to answer any of your questions.

You are welcome to view product reviews @ roadbikereview.com our distributor leaderbikestore on eBay has a high positive feedback rating. This should answer any of your customer service questions.

Thank you for reading my post.

Happy Holidays,

Brian

Remember Guys, its simply aluminum tubing, It's not an expensive material, nor is it hard to work with.

fetishcycles.com sells a frame made of Columbus Airplane tubing w/carbon rear stays for $400 Colnago sells a frame made of the same Materials for over $1200.00 Sure the Colnago has nicer welds and paint but $800.00 worth?

If you can handmake a frame from Columbus Airplane and sell it for $395, Surely Leader can manufacture reliable 7005 series generic aluminum frame for $100.00 less

Yah, I'd say check out Fetishcycles.com and email them they offered me a bargain, they might do the same. Their prices just jumped on their high-end stuff, but the low-end Al/CF frame is still real cheap.

Dear Fetish Spokesman,

Get your facts straight. Easton, Altec, Deda, Etc. all use 7005 Alloy.

From Leader website:

http://www.leaderbikeusa.com/info/about.htm

7005 Aluminum

7005 aluminum is slightly stronger than 6061 so it can mean slightly lighter frames. We use 7005 aluminum for several of our frames because it is so light and stiff.

FROM COLUMBUS AUTHORIZED DEALER:

http://www.sanobike.com/columbus.htm

Airplane

Airplane is derived from a 7005 alloy and offers extreme Iightness together with high resistance and stiffness. Airplane allows the manufacture of frames intended for competitions where extreme performance Is required.

If anyone has any questions please contact me.

Brian C. Tel. 619 425 6452

Nikos,

I can vouch for Leader. I own a 785r ultegra machine and it is absolutly beautiful. pics here: http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=30599&page=38&pp=15

I spoke via e-mail and phone to a guy nammed Sal who I think runs the company. They sized me up perfectly to the bike and even threw in some extra upgrades for free. The customer service was outstanding and I woodent wory aboute a few misspelled e-mails :)

I was in the market for a modern racer and spent 6 months getting one. I really wanted a DeRosa but the price range was way out. I test rode DeRosa, Lemond, Treck and many more. I was a bit squeemish about buying on line with out a test ride. But at my LBS's basically if they did not have it in stock then you got no test ride anyway and maby you don't like the lbs stock. So I saw Leader months earlier and thought about it later, called them did research, even posted here at one point. Made the decesion to buy and I am 100% satisfied. Especially for the price. Plus they have life time warrenty on frame and a crash replacement warrenty where you can get the frame at cost. Cannot beat it IMO...

EDIT: OK Now I see this is a revived old post maby you have a new bike by now??? If it is a leader let me know what you think...

I bought a Leader bike frame a couple years ago, and I was very pleased. the only problem with it was the paint chipped very easily. But I repainted it and it was an amazing bike. It was actually stolen, so I will miss it. But it cant be beat for the price.

I have a 785R with the upgrade for about two months and I believe it is a great frame with graet components. I was trying to understand your email that I am replying to and it seems that Leader is buying the tubing or frames from the company you refer to. To me it does not matter. The welds are perfect and it handles great at any speed. I am curious though as to who makes the frame. I also bought my wife a 735R and she has the same views about the frames quality and handling.

My friend has the all aluminum frame. Great price for the DA components, but he does complain that the frame is very stiff and not too comfortable. His steel bike got wrecked and so he bought this one.

I guess with the carbon stays you're looking at, it should only get better. But most important is the fit. If you're in San Diego, call their offices and ask to visit them to take a look at some sizes...

Two monthes ago I called Leader about their bikes and asked for their "best price" on the 735. They were very short with me and not very customer friendly. Maybe I just caught the person on a bad day, but it didn't matter to me. I never called them back.

Next time you want to search for rider impressions on a frame just use the search feature on roadbikereview. (http://www.roadbikereview.com)

That would have given you these pages:

735TT (http://www.roadbikereview.com/Frames/Leader%20Bike/PRD_321195_2493crx.aspx)
735R (http://www.roadbikereview.com/Frames/Leader%20Bike/PRD_321492_2493crx.aspx)

780R (http://www.roadbikereview.com/Frames/Leader%20Bike/PRD_133406_2493crx.aspx)
715R (http://www.roadbikereview.com/Frames/Leader%20Bike/PRD_133407_2493crx.aspx)

I guess their best price is the low regular price. I know a messenger who has been riding one for a few months, he really likes it. He got it fully built for very little $.

Doctors and Engineers can't spell, so why should bike dealer's be able to? :)

I own 2 leader bikes, the 716R and the new 2005 780R model. I love them both and have had no problems with either of them. The customer service at Leader has been nothing but oustanding.I wouldn't hesitate to refer them or buy again in the future.

I own 2 leader bikes, the 716R and the new 2005 780R model. I love them both and have had no problems with either of them. The customer service at Leader has been nothing but oustanding.I wouldn't hesitate to refer them or buy again in the future.
Interesting first post....

55/Rad

What is so interesting 55/Rad?

What is so interesting 55/Rad?

methinks he suspect an alterier motive.

-mark

methinks he suspect an alterier motive.

-mark
no ulterior motive here, I'm new to this and have nothing to gain from giving my opion. I just went to the first topic re: the bikes I own.

When a 2+ year old product related thread gets resurrected for no apparent reason by a first-post newbie singing the praises of said product, then it looks suspicious that maybe said newbie has an ulterior motive.

Now, re-read the entire thread - especially the part about Leader's customer service. If you were the owner of Leader bikes, would you want this reputation? If you ran a somewhat shady operation, would anyone put it past you to convince a friend or employee (you?) to come here and try to change the public opinion?

I have nothing against Leader or you and I hope I am wrong. I'm just stating what it LOOKS like.

55/Rad

I bought a 785R durace this spring from Leader. The bike as far as I am concerned is a great machine. I liked it so much this summer I bought my wife a 735R ultegra triple. The 785R is very light and does not flex. It is a pleasure to ride. Leader has done every thing that they said they would. The owners of Leader have also been very good on selling me replacement tires. Great price on 3000GP contis.

...I have nothing against Leader or you and I hope I am wrong. I'm just stating what it LOOKS like.

55/Rad

If she's not hot, she's not worth the time to look at.

When a 2+ year old product related thread gets resurrected for no apparent reason by a first-post newbie singing the praises of said product, then it looks suspicious that maybe said newbie has an ulterior motive.

Now, re-read the entire thread - especially the part about Leader's customer service. If you were the owner of Leader bikes, would you want this reputation? If you ran a somewhat shady operation, would anyone put it past you to convince a friend or employee (you?) to come here and try to change the public opinion?

I have nothing against Leader or you and I hope I am wrong. I'm just stating what it LOOKS like.



55/Rad

If you look at my post above you will see that I came into this thread late too and that apparently someone from Leader Bikes called 'LeaderBikes' came into this thread to counter some of the bad press. I think this dude probably just searched for Leader bikes in the forum and rekindled the thread.


I still have 0 problems with mine and absolutlly love to ride it.



I bought a 785R durace this spring from Leader. The bike as far as I am concerned is a great machine. I liked it so much this summer I bought my wife a 735R ultegra triple. The 785R is very light and does not flex. It is a pleasure to ride. Leader has done every thing that they said they would. The owners of Leader have also been very good on selling me replacement tires. Great price on 3000GP contis.

Really how much? Do you get a good deal b/c you are a customer?

Point taken, I am new to this and didn't look at the posting dates. I have no affiliation with any form of cycling business. I have had great service and haven't had any problems with my bike. I can see why it would have looked out of place, that being my post.

Point taken, I am new to this and didn't look at the posting dates. I have no affiliation with any form of cycling business. I have had great service and haven't had any problems with my bike. I can see why it would have looked out of place, that being my post.
My apology for erroneously calling this out. As I stated, I hoped I was wrong and I'm glad it turned out that way.

Welcome and see you on the boards....

55/Rad

I recently bought a Leader bike in ebay. I have not tested it in the hills. The main reasons why I bought it were price and Dura Ace components. The graphics look cheap. The welding does not look profesional. The bike was shipped promptly but without the promissed water cages. The guy responding to the email was rude and treatening. I will report later on how the bike feels while climbing. Overall it has been a bad experience because of the very poor customer service.

I have decided to take a more proactive stance toward misleading posters on the forums.

Yes I am a dealer for Leader Bike. I have been selling on ebay for quite some time. My feedback score is 99.3% out of over 1200 customers. Sometimes there will be someone who has some form of aggression they need to let loose on others. Unfortunately this is one case.

Please take some time to read my feedback on ebay or read reviews on road bike review if you are interested on ordering. By the way Leader only uses the finest materials. All frames are hand smooth welded, with decals clear coated over. I can post a close-up of the welds or e-mail them upon request. You are welcome to e-mail me as well leaderbikestore@leaderbikeusa.com I can answer any question you may have.

My feedback on ebay:

http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback&userid=leaderbikestore

Thank You,

Brian C.
Leader Bike Store

735R with smooth welds.

I've never gotten welds via email. Please send.

On 10/29/04 I paid for the leader bike. It arrived about a week later. Everything was OK but the two water cages were missing. I wrote to Brian twice about the missing cages. At first, he assured me that they would be sent right away. Two weeks passed by and then I got this email asking for my feedback:>
> > > >From: "eBay Member : leaderbikestore" <aw-confirm@ebay.com>
> > > >Reply-To: leaderbikestore@leaderbikeusa.com
> > > >To:
> > > >Subject: Your item has been shipped.
> > > >Date: Tue, 23 Nov 2004 01:49:38 -0800
> > > >I have shipped the following item to you. You should be receiving it
> > >shortly.
> > > >Once your item arrives in satisfactory condition, please leave feedback
> > > >for me. I will do the same for you.
> > > >Thank you again!

This was my response:

> > >From:
> > >Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 9:41 PM
> > >To: leaderbikestore@leaderbikeusa.com
> > > >Subject: RE: Your item has been shipped.

> > >I got the bike but the two water cages were missing. I can not do any
>long rides until I get the cages. This is the tird e-mail I write.....If I do
> > >not get them soon my rec will not be possitive.
>

This was Brian's response:

>
> > >From: "Leader Bike Store" <leaderbikestore@leaderbikeusa.com>
> > >Reply-To: <leaderbikestore@leaderbikeusa.com>
> > >To:
> >
>
> > >Subject: RE: Your item has been shipped.
>
> > >Date: Tue, 23 Nov 2004 21:53:37 -0800
>
> > >I have e-mailed you twice about the cages. They are on back order. If you
> > >want I can refund you $20 credit or you can wait until I get them.
> > >Frankly I do not appreciate being threatened. I can give you neg feedback as
> > >well. Our inventory indicates we did ship you the cages but I am taking your
> > >word for it and reordering the cages for you. You get an awesome bike and a
> > great deal and then you decide to bite my hand
> > >off. If we made the mistake I apologize and would like to credit you or ask
> > >you wait until I get them.
> > >Brian c.
> > > _____ >

This was my response:

>
> >From:
> >Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 5:43 AM
> >To: leaderbikestore@leaderbikeusa.com
> >Subject: RE: Your item has been shipped.
>
> >Brian,
>
> >Your e-mails have gone from (paraphrasing):...we apologize...we'll send the
> >cages right away.....to: the cages were ordered and will ship ASAP.....to:
> >we did ship you the cages...I can give you neg feedback as well....you
> >decide to bite my hand off.....
>
> >I thought I was the buyer and you were the seller.
>
> >I do like my bike but your service is dismal and your manners do not belong
> >in a sales person.
>
> > _____

This was Brian's response:
>>>
>>>
>>>From: "Leader Bike Store" <leaderbikestore@leaderbikeusa.com>
>>>Reply-To: <leaderbikestore@leaderbikeusa.com>
>>>To:
>>>Subject: RE: Your item has been shipped.
>>>Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 10:20:50 -0800
>>>
>>>
>>>Ok. Will it be a refund of $20 for the cages or do you mind waiting until
>>>elite delivers the cages?
>>>
>>>Happy Thanksgiving,
>>>
>>>Brian
>>> _____

This was my response:

>>
>>From:
>>Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 8:01 PM
>>To: leaderbikestore@leaderbikeusa.com
>>Subject: RE: Your item has been shipped.
>>
>>Ok. Will it be a pair of good quality water cages in my front door by
>>12/1/04 or this will go as my rec:
>>
>>Avoid! Rude! Incomplete order. 4wks later offers $20 and treatens neg
>>feedback.
>>
>>
>> _____

On 11/26/04 leaderbike put $25.00 into my PayPal account. I ordered the cages with nashbar. I did not leave feedback for leaderbike. Then I posted my opinion of leaderbike in the forum. The graphics are cheap. The welding looks unprofessional (If you run your finger in the inside of the dropoffs it feels very rough and coarse). But the worse is their service. Brian sent me this email:

>From: "Leader Bike Store" <leaderbikestore@leaderbikeusa.com>
>Reply-To: <leaderbikestore@leaderbikeusa.com>
>To:
>Subject: RE: Your item has been shipped.
>Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 22:57:43 -0800
>
>HEY THANKS FOR THE FEEDBACK. I SUBSCRIBE TO THE FORUM.
>
>YOU DEFIANTLY LIE ABOUT THE PRODUCTS I SELL. EVEN THOUGH I AM NOT THE
>MANUFACTURER LEADER BIKE I DO NOT APPRECIATE THEY WAY YOU TALK ABOUT THE
>PRODUCTS.
>
>EVEN THOUGH YOU WERE VERY IMPATIENT, RUDE, AND THREATENING I REFUNDED YOU
>SOME MONEY.
>
>YOU MUST HAVE SOME DEEP PASSIVE AGGRESSIONS AND YOU ONLY FELT LIKE DUMPING
>IT ON SUCH A NICE PRODUCT.
>
>REMEMBER WHAT YOU RIDE. I WILL BE LOOKING AT YOUR POSTS AND REPLY IN KIND.
>
>BRIAN
> > _____

This was my reply:

Brian,
I told the true and I saved all the emails to prove it. I will post the letter that you just sent me in the bike forums and all future letters that you write to me....even when you write an apology.

This was Brian's answer:

You have some really deep aggression you need to let out. And it appears even though I have done nothing to deserve.
This will be the last and final e-mail I will ever send you. You are truly a sick man.
Cheers,
Brian

Wow, sounds like a great guy. :lol: Hopefully the way the bike rides will end up making it all worth it in the end. I've read a few bad things about service and attitude but I don't believe I have ever heard anything negative about the way the bike rides. Appearance and welds, thats a different story. A member of our local club bought one of them a few months ago. He is very happy with the way his bike performs.

in defense of the guys at leaderbike, it seems like they are trying their best to get their foot in the door of the industry with a decent product. i went through the same thing when i started my custom painting business. when you're doing the best you can to provide the service advertised and something small goes wrong, it never helps to have some impatient a-hole breathing down your neck, e-mailing incessantly and trying to make your life miserable over something that could be easily rectified with the use of some very basic reasoning skills.
now, in defense of the crybabies, i understand that customer service is important. but when you're dealiing with a small company that is just doing their best to keep up, you should be prepared for some small mishaps in regards to service. we aren't customer service professionals, we're just trying to do what we do. maybe later on when we're actually IN the door, we'll be able to afford to pay some poor schmoe to kiss your @$$ and take the abuse for us. sorry.

All this over two water bottle cages...

Okay, reviving an old thread but other may be onsidering a Leader frame and appreciate the feedback.

I ordered a 735TT frame last July. It arrived in about a week but with the head tube damaged. I called Sal and Brian and they authorized a return and as soon as tracking showed my damaged frame as being pickup by UPS they sent a replacement. Great service there for sure. Frame 2 arrived in another week. Nice welds, overcoated graphics ( I for one like the bold white "Leader" on the tube) decent paint. First thing I notice though is the right downtube cable stop is threaded larger than the adjuster so it simply drops in without engaging the threads. I also see the the seat tube water bottle boss is offset from the centerline of the bike about 3/8" to the left so the bottle sits over towards you leg instead of centered on the bike. I call them again and they argue that I am wrong and cannot tell correctly if it is off. I work in a welding fab shop and using precision tools verify it is off. I am told I can send it back at my expense and if they dissagree I will pay return shipping on the same frame. If correct I get a replacement but at this point having gotten 2 bad frames I have no assurance I will not get a third. So, I make an adjuster in my shop that matches the oversized hole and live with one less water bottle. Not my idea of great customer service but after building up my frame with Ultegra components I am very pleased with my bike.
I would love to have another style frame for a second bike but the first quality hassles will prevent that.

Okay to excellent product, okay to poor customer service.

Tony Miller

It's rather unfortunate to hear your experience with Leader was so rough. I know this is an old post from 2003 but I recently learned a lot by reading these forums and reviews before buying my Leader 725tr last month (in 09).

It seems as if thing have certainly changed at Leader. I was met with superb customer service. ...I mean the kind you only get in the small towns of red states any more. I spoke with two gentlemen by the names of Sal and Chris. Both were very nice and willing to spend as much time as needed to answer my dumb rookie questions and switch my order from white to black wheel and then back again about 5 times. They were even kind enough to throw in a Lasgo crank to get me started.

The bike rides like a dream and the service alone made me want to build another Leader. I'm sorry Thhaze, I'm sure your experience back in 2003 would not happen again with Leader.

Very happy, Anonymous customer

This thread wins the "most resurrections in a 7 year period" award

hahah. good stuff.

I want to see a VH1-style 'Where Are They Now' episode about this thread.

"Brian continues his anger management classes. Leader bike is drinking champagne on his 45-foot yacht, while atmlv hasn't been heard from since 2005... next time on BF1."

i had an EMO haircut in 2002 when this thread started. and that was when emo sorta underground. I am ashamed of 2002.

5 years later and I still hold my opinion.

Small towns in red states? Yeah, they are famous for their hospitality. Haha... oh man.

5 years later and I still don't hold my Tet.

fixed :D

Funny thread.

FWIW, my Leader came as I expected it to for the price I paid.

Small towns in red states? Yeah, they are famous for their hospitality. Haha... oh man.

If you're white and don't look 'coastal', sure, they're friendly as hell.

I want to see a VH1-style 'Where Are They Now' episode about this thread.

"Brian continues his anger management classes. Leader bike is drinking champagne on his 45-foot yacht, while atmlv hasn't been heard from since 2005... next time on BF1."

Yeah no kidding... lol. :lol: