Singlespeed & Fixed Gear - italian vs. japanese

i'm not usually one to start polls, but hey...i'm curious. which flavor of track bike do you like best?

I like them both, really. That said, one thing in favor of Japanese bikes is that they cannot have remotely as brittle paint as the Italian bikes do.

http://www.slabco.com/ciocc3.jpg

yum.. all italian(cept the seatpost.. boo...) i actually like them both though.. i like when you dont mix your gear.. like wearing nikes with a puma shirt.. bad style.. the all NJS bike is always a winner

edit: i cant speak for all italian paint jobs.. but if you look at the paint wrong on this bike it chips..

I like pizza.

It's kinda like asking which of your two children you prefer. Not fair.

I like New York in June.

i'm guilty of mixing...but i have good reason. i prefer japanese, but no way will i ever find a 62cm japanese track bike, so i have italian steel built by a canadian man and outfitted with japanese parts. shrug.

I like a Gershwin tune...

that ciocc is hot!

i'm guilty of mixing...but i have good reason. i prefer japanese, but no way will i ever find a 62cm japanese track bike, so i have italian steel built by a canadian man and outfitted with japanese parts. shrug.

Be careful with that sort of thing. I hear the italians like to drink, and I know you wouldn't want to support that.

**** you, what makes you think you have the right to personally attack me outside that thread?

**** you, what makes you think you have the right to personally attack me outside that thread?

Take it easy, pal. I'm just trying to help you vote with your dollars.

WTF, over?

whatever. i guess he must be a little liquored up.

on with the matter at hand.

Honestly, I don't worry too much about my bikes' countries of origin. My main ride, the fixed mtb, was tigged up by a hard-drinkin' man in Chico, California. My old main ride was tigged by an anonymous welder guy/gal in Japan.

Out of the rest of the fleet, one was built in somerville, the rest were made by robots.

one was built in somerville
w00t!

anything else but tasty fat chance in somerville? and did they ever make a one off track frame? i like fat chance.. especially old lime green style

anything else but tasty fat chance in somerville? and did they ever make a one off track frame? i like fat chance.. especially old lime green style

Curses, it looks like I've been living a lie. I'd been told that my ti mtb frame was built by merlin, but it turns out it was built by sandvik. Well, looks like we'll have to substitute Kennewick, Washington for Somerville, Mass.

Sorry to disappoint.

(I did own a fat chance for several years, though. Sorry, it was black.)

Obligatory fixed gear content : Someone took the same frame I'm talking about and built it up into http://www.fixedgeargallery.com/2005/apr/KwangPaik.htm

Curses, it looks like I've been living a lie. I'd been told that my ti mtb frame was built by merlin, but it turns out it was built by sandvik. Well, looks like we'll have to substitute Kennewick, Washington for Somerville, Mass.

Sorry to disappoint.

(I did own a fat chance for several years, though. Sorry, it was black.)

Obligatory fixed gear content : Someone took the same frame I'm talking about and built it up into http://www.fixedgeargallery.com/2005/apr/KwangPaik.htm


I didn't know that Sandvik made bikes but the tubing that merlin uses is made by them.

S/F<
CEYA!

I didn't know that Sandvik made bikes but the tubing that merlin uses is made by them.

S/F<
CEYA!

Ceya - I'm under the impression that Sandvik started up a sports division, which eventually spun off into Ti Sports. As far as I can tell, this DBR frame was welded by Sandvik's sports division before the spinoff.

Ceya - I'm under the impression that Sandvik started up a sports division, which eventually spun off into Ti Sports. As far as I can tell, this DBR frame was welded by Sandvik's sports division before the spinoff.


They was one of the first to make Ti (good Ti ) for bikes.Sandvik made 3-2.5 Titanium

http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m3MKT/is_n143_v104/ai_18515553.

If that is true that is news to me and will check on that also tommorrow.

S/F<
CEYA!

They was one of the first to make Ti (good Ti ) for bikes.Sandvik made 3-2.5 Titanium

http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m3MKT/is_n143_v104/ai_18515553.

If that is true that is news to me and will check on that also tommorrow.

S/F<
CEYA!

I'd love any information you can track down. Google's not being as helpful as I'd like, but from what I'm seeing it looks like sandvik built the kona hei hei, kona score, cove hummer, and dbr team ti frames.

http://www.tri-cityherald.com/news/2001/0502/Story2.html has a bit of information on the sandvik/ti sports connection, and http://www.konaworld.com/TechArea/newtech4.html confirms that they were building ti frames in '99, at least.

Anything to confirm or deny this poor bike's lineage would be great.

I have a crosscut saw by sandvik. It has an orange handle and is incredibly whippy.

ceya.. not that i dont like having you here.. but didnt you say goodbye to us? were those tears for naught?

ceya.. not that i dont like having you here.. but didnt you say goodbye to us? were those tears for naught?

Man, if you drive ceya away, I will personally think unkind things about you. I might even tell my cat. It's nice to have a resource like Ceya around this place.



I have a crosscut saw by sandvik. It has an orange handle and is incredibly whippy.


Hmm. No orange handle, and the bike doesn't feel especially whippy. Perhaps they used different techniques.

I'd love any information you can track down. Google's not being as helpful as I'd like, but from what I'm seeing it looks like sandvik built the kona hei hei, kona score, cove hummer, and dbr team ti frames.

http://www.tri-cityherald.com/news/2001/0502/Story2.html has a bit of information on the sandvik/ti sports connection, and http://www.konaworld.com/TechArea/newtech4.html confirms that they were building ti frames in '99, at least.

Anything to confirm or deny this poor bike's lineage would be great.


Yeah alittle down time before my trips overseas. I did state I will post now and then.. Well it is now.

As you see I also stated NO PRIVATE MESSAGES and will ask for my account to be closed. Sept 5 will be my last day. Kissena's last track event of 2005

S/F<
CEYA!

im not drivinng anyone away.. he wrote us a farewell letter.. i was just wondering what changed his mind... think whatever youd like of me though.. im just letters on a page to you

ah.. he answered the question.. ok.. thanks.. carry on..

I like to wash down my ramen noodles with a bottle of Pinot Grigio.

I like to wash down my ramen noodles with a bottle of Pinot Grigio.

You must be one of them renaissance men.

im not drivinng anyone away.. he wrote us a farewell letter.. i was just wondering what changed his mind... think whatever youd like of me though.. im just letters on a page to you

ah.. he answered the question.. ok.. thanks.. carry on..


SR,

Is correct ! I am leaving and my other bike forums account will go as well. MAYBE!
Back to the world of School,Knives and Grappling!

No more talk about me and Back to the topic at hand..Japanese or Italian???

S/F,
CEYA!

hard to find good deep drop stems that aren't nitto. I seen a few from cinelli but not as sexy as the nitto ones.

I like the craftsmanship on the Italian stuff, but the Japanese components and design seem to make more sense.

Look at Shimano, they gave up on high flange hubs with the Dura ace 7710 group. Why? High flange doesn't really do anything except add weight.

High Flange on the street just seems silly to me at this point and I tend to avoid it if at all possible.

I like the look of low flange much better anyway.

i like the japanese stuff, 'tho' it took me a while to realize it, and i'm still not quite sure why. i think it might have something to do with utility, and a little bit of irritation with whole 'cult of campy' thing. (said the guy with the njs campy hub).

(said the guy with the njs campy hub).

Woah - you got that hub off ebay? Good job!

hard to find good deep drop stems that aren't nitto. I seen a few from cinelli but not as sexy as the nitto ones.

3T

I like pizza.Okonomiyaki for me....

I love my Ciocc road bike and I have a Colnago sitting in the garage waiting for parts to come in to convert it to fixed. Seeking out a Celeste Bianchi for another road bike. Italian steel is my friend.

i have a 84ish celeste bianchi track bike - might be intrested in selling.

Okonomiyaki for me....

were you sad when the tasty okonomiyaki joint on 2nd closed?oh wait.. it was first? i get those two confused... i wanted it last night annd settled for udon.. or do you have another spot? please share..

there is okonomiyaki in echo park? It is huge in Osaka.

A little out of the way but we've been going here the last 3 years or so.....
http://www.gajaokonomiyaki.com/estore.htm

there is okonomiyaki in echo park? It is huge in Osaka.
echo park= tacos :D

wow thanks.. i will def. go there.. we wish there was some in e.p... but the fixer is right.. theres tacos.. and if you want something different.. then theres burritos..

back to the thread...as another big guy I have to mix as well, Italian steel steed with Japanese fixins...

Whatever fits your needs and pocket book. I find the Campy only sect to be a little weird and cultish (cough cough http://www.campyonly.com/tattooed.html#Jason) ;)

But I say whatever floats your boat. It has always been the Japanese that brought the most advances in recent decades. Things like index shifting etc. Campy and others missed those boats entirely for some years.

I like both italian and japanese. That said the distributors in my country for campagnolo and shimano rarely bring in the track group. Campagnolo has such a small market here hence they do not bring in the pista group. And shimano is priced much lower than campy, plus they bring in the track group from time to time.

If I were to build one however I would go all japanese or all italian depending on the frame. Would not mix as far as possible. Yeah I am sometimes an obsessive purist... :p

I have a crosscut saw by sandvik. It has an orange handle and is incredibly whippy.

Dude you have your own crosscut? That's sweet as hell. My team has a taylor that's unbelieveable but I've never heard of sandvik. Nice?

Older Guerciotti frames were painted with Dupont Imron™ in the US.
Best paint on any Italian bike, IMHO. Not all paintjobs on Italian frames are bad.

I like the craftsmanship on the Italian stuff, but the Japanese components and design seem to make more sense.

Look at Shimano, they gave up on high flange hubs with the Dura ace 7710 group. Why? High flange doesn't really do anything except add weight.

High Flange on the street just seems silly to me at this point and I tend to avoid it if at all possible.

I like the look of low flange much better anyway.


Sorry, Campy discontinued their High flange early last year and it been in the works since late 2002.. Shimano just did it this year.

S/F<
CEYA!

I enjoy using Shimanagnolo components on my drive train, and of course only a genuine Cinitto stem. I don't care where my stuff comes from, as long as it does what it is supposed to do. :)

peace,
sam