When to use Studs?

[Satyr]

I am car free, and this is my first year living in an area where it snows. I am currently using a small road bike with fenders, and decently wide rims. It's just a commutng beater really, but currently my only bike.

Uppsala is a fairly flat place, but I am not sure how much it snows or how salted the roads are. Would studded tires be necessarily only with lots of ice and snow? I was hoping to just go with some knobbies slighty wider than the slicks I use now, and taking my rides slower.

S

[clevernamehere]

It really depends on the conditions of the local roads in the winter. Studs won't do anything for you in snow, but they help a lot on ice. Studded tires can be quite costly, so you may want to try using the wider tires with more aggressive tread to start with till you know what the conditions will be like. Or maybe someone at a local bike shop could give you an idea of the winter riding conditions.

[Joe Dog]

I agree with clevername - the studs help a lot on ice or packed snow but don't do anything in loose snow and are bad on dry pavement. In Anchorage they don't really plow - they just mash the snow down and it gets packed by the vehicles. In those conditions, the studs are a necessity in my opinion. My Ice-Spikers were twice as expensive as the cheapy tires, but the spikes supposedly last much longer and the stud placement is supposedly better as well. These are my first studs, so I don't have anything to compare them to, but I am happy with them.

If you want to try a slightly more beefy tire but not spring for studs, you might try a CrossMax or other Cyclocross tire. Good luck!!

[Ziemas]

I am car free, and this is my first year living in an area where it snows. I am currently using a small road bike with fenders, and decently wide rims. It's just a commutng beater really, but currently my only bike.

Uppsala is a fairly flat place, but I am not sure how much it snows or how salted the roads are. Would studded tires be necessarily only with lots of ice and snow? I was hoping to just go with some knobbies slighty wider than the slicks I use now, and taking my rides slower.

S
If you are going to be going in areas with cobble stones avoid studs at all costs. They will make you slip and slide like no tommorow. Check out the Coni Town and Country or the old Top Touring with recessed tread for good non-studded winter traction.

[Michel Gagnon]

It depends on the conditions and on how conservatively you ride. On the Icebike list (see http://icebike.org for details), there are a few riders from Sweden, Norway and Finland, so you may ask them. However, at least two of them ride with studs in Winter.

A safe compromise is to get one for the front wheel, so that you avoid front-wheel slips. And if you get one, get the Nokian because it uses carbide studs that don't wear out on asphalt.

[CBBaron]

The studded tires I used last year were very heavy and slow compared to my normal Marathons, so I only rode them when neccessary. Because almost all the roads on my commute are salted heavily I only needed them on days it snowed and for the short section of my commute on residential roads that Cleveland eventually gets around to plowing and salting. The need for studs very much depends on your local conditions. If you ride on roads that are not salted you will probably need them. If everything is cleared quickly and salted studded tires are an expensive, slow tire with poor traction.
This year I plan to have two sets of wheels so I can swap at a moments notice which tires I will use every day. Cleveland gets alot of snow fall, but plows and salts pretty well so I only need the studs one or two days at a time with a week or so between significant snows.
Craig

[Juha]

I have a winter beater hybrid bike, with a pair of Nokian W106 studded commuter tyres permanently on. They way I see it, the problem in winter is you can never tell for sure what is beneath a (fresh) layer of snow. If it's soft snow all the way to the pavement, then you will be fine with regular tyres. But if there's ice / hard packed snow beneath you will be very happy to have studs.

I use quality studs, so I don't mind too much riding on dry pavement occasionally. The wear is really minimal. Only concern is the added rolling resistance, and you will have that anyways in winter. Safety is a priority for me.

--J

[halfbiked]

Satyr, are you Swedish, or a non-Swede living in Sweden?

When we rented a car in Malmo last December, it came equipped with studded tires - I think thats indicative of Swedish winter road conditions. We only saw rain, but didn't spend a lot of time in Sweden & even then were only in the South.

[jharte]

I ride through every winter. It only snows a few times here. I gave up my studded snows last year. I'll be looking for some really wide knobs to put on this year. I also have to adjust my fenders each year to make room for the fat tires!

I agree with Juha, you can never tell what is beneath. However, in the Midwest, we have less black ice than you guys up north. And yes, they are heavy and slow.

Riding in the snow is awesome!

[PaulH]

I got through five winters of daily riding without studs. You have to be willing to put your foot down and slide it as a stabilizer, and you will have to walk up some hills. Expect a few falls. It takes skill and may be slow, but you can do it.

Nowdays, I put the studs on in December and take them off in March. I use the lightly-studded Hakkapilita W106 which works well on dty pavement. They make winter riding much easier and very pleasant, but one can get by without them.

Paul

[Satyr]

Satyr, are you Swedish, or a non-Swede living in Sweden?

When we rented a car in Malmo last December, it came equipped with studded tires - I think thats indicative of Swedish winter road conditions. We only saw rain, but didn't spend a lot of time in Sweden & even then were only in the South.

I am merely studying in Uppsala for the year, perhaps to return later for a PhD. program. Truly a beautiful land.

Some of my Swedish friends say the roads are heavily salted, so I shall try to get by without studs and tone down my aggressiveness.

Thanks all for the replies. Perhaps I will update on the conditions once it begins to snow.

S

[jharte]

PaulH, did you say 'walk up some hills'? Sorry, I have to draw the line somewhere! :D

I may look for some Hakkapilita W106 this year and give them a try. I made the last two sets of studded snows. Way too slow and way too heavy.

Theoretically, if I ever did have to walk my bike, I would make sure I wasn't seen doing it! :D :D

[ChroMo2]

the time when you wanna use studded tires is when winter ends and the temperature rises above 32 degrees and then freezes again at night. That's when your going to see ice on your normal route. Nokian is an excellent studded tire. Or you can make your own. I made homemade studded tires with sheetmetal screws that were so agressive, I went to a city park and rode wheelies on the ice. But basically some fat tires with low air pressure work well. If you ride a lot in winter, you'll probably go down, it's just a part of winter riding. Riding in deep snow can be three or four times as energy consuming as riding in the summer.

[GlowBoy]

I've been to Scandinavia (SE Norway) in winter, and from what I recall there was a mix of hardpack and soft snow with occasional ice. Studded tires might not be essential, but my guess is they'd make your commute a whole lot more pleasant - and safe.

Nokian Hakkapeliittas aren't the most aggressive tread for snow, but they've got enough studs to hang on when things start to get slick. And they work great on pavement. I've used them for commuting for several years (in both the 700x35 and 700x45 size) ... my area gets very little snow but lots of frost, so I ride them on bare wet or dry pavement 95% of the time: they work extremely well on pavement with no real loss of grip versus comparable unstudded tires. Only real disadvantages are the expense, a bit of extra noise, and the weight. They do weigh 900-1000g each, so be prepared for your bike to be accelerate quite a bit slower. Also be careful if you take your bike indoors, so you don't scratch up the floor.

[telenick]

A Stud is helpful for breeding and general horse play when you're ...oh, never mind. You mean studded tires.

From another thread:

I ride a mtn bike around a ski resort all winter (ski resort employee here) . I am often riding on ice and snow pack, dodging shuttle busses and cars, fending for my life all for the sake of a getting a fresh brew from the local java hut. Then it's back to the office with cup in hand. I've certainly biffed it a few times and the studs weren't there to help much. One time I threw a chain ...that was a come to Jesus moment for sure.

I wore out the studded tires in a few ski seasons.

The following winter season I just ran with regular knobbies. I was surprised to find that studded tires are not really any improvement over the regular knobbies for cornering, braking and starting. I had not increased the level of carnage. I have increased my snow/ice riding skills. That seems to make a much bigger difference than knobbies vs. studs.

my .02 YMMV

[nathank]

the way i see it - if you're a dedicated winter commuter in a region that gets snow/ice more than a few times a year (Sweeden qualifies) then it is worth th $40-70 for a studded tire UP FRONT. the tire should last at least 3 winters, maybe longer (my Schwalbe semi-spiked tires are ready for their 3rd season and they are fine and have lost about 2 studs per tire out of 150 or so)

the front is where it can be dangerous on ice without studs. not having studs on the back just means you may have to walk sometimes if it's really slick but not really a safety issue.

i personally disagree with what a few have said about studs being slippery/dangerous on regular wet roads. especially if you get the variant with no studs in the center of the tire.

on my commuter i do it pretty much like auto users just waiting a little longer to put them on: i put my front on around the time of the first snow/ice (end of October here in Munich) and then then rear on some time in November. they stay on full-time even if we have a 4-week spell above freezing where the roads are clear until April/May or so.

i ride the Schwalbe tires with the studs ONLY on the outside so they still roll well on pavement but have the studs for cornering. then on a day when there IS potential for ice i let out some pressure so the tire contact patch increases and the studs can do more. (letting pressure out is easy, changing a tire or even a wheel is NOT something i want to do at 7am before my commute to work)

for my off-road winter adventures i have the aggressive Schwalbe IceSpiker with like 304 studs. it is great for off road and works pretty well on major ice but is VERY loud slow and annoying on pavement, so i find it overkill for the commuter.

my recommendation: check into a semi-studded tire for the FRONT with studs only on the outer part of the tread -- either from Nokian or Schwalbe --- Schwalbe "Snow Stud" Schwalbe Snow Stud
Perfect winter tire.
The spikes are not on the tread center, but arranged along side it in the area of greatest contact pressure. When properly inflated it can be used under normal road conditions. By lowering the air pressure the tire gains optimum grip on icy roads.
http://www.schwalbe.com/index.pl?bereich=produkte&einsatzbereich=4&produktgruppe=17&produkt=214

[PaulH]

I put my Nokian W106 studs on in December and take them off in March. I find that the lightly studded W106 is just right, given that the roads are usually treated. If you ride untreated surfaces you may have to use a more extreme winter tire, but these are much slower on dry pavement.

I notice a small "nibble" while riding across grates, but that is the only negative. Putting on just a front tire gives good control with minimal increase in rolling resistance. However, without rear studs, you may have to walk the bike up hills.

Paul

[ghettocruiser]

The ice-spiker is a beast of a tire on pavement. There is just so much resistance, more than a 3-inch DH tire. Last winter it had me re-routing my commute to use an ice-covered trail rather than a bare road because the tires just felt so much faster on the ice. Maybe it was just psychological. It was definitely a lot more fun.

If the roads looked clear but I had doubts about the conditions, I would put the studs on the front only. I got caught by a sudden blast of freezing rain last winter with only the front studs on. It was slow going and a lot of fish-tailing, but I was doing better than most of the cars.

On actual ice, front-studs only can get you into problems, as whenever I brake the bike wants to 180 around and go backwards. This could be a clever off-road stunt or a terrifying traffic ordeal, depending on where you were at the time.



Edit: about the studs in fresh snow. Generally they are too small to do much good. But two years ago I put 106 stainless lag-bolts (complete with outside nuts) on a DH tire for winter downhill riding. The bolts were at least 8mm out of the lugs. The next day there was a heavy snowfall forecast, so what the hell I rode the tire to work. The pedaling was beyond difficult, but I was motivated by the fact that I was actually riding a bicycle in a foot of rutted snow when the cars were stuck.

[ChroMo2]

*****READ ABOVE******

[meb]

the way i see it - if you're a dedicated winter commuter in a region that gets snow/ice more than a few times a year (Sweeden qualifies) then it is worth th $40-70 for a studded tire UP FRONT. the tire should last at least 3 winters, maybe longer (my Schwalbe semi-spiked tires are ready for their 3rd season and they are fine and have lost about 2 studs per tire out of 150 or so)

the front is where it can be dangerous on ice without studs. not having studs on the back just means you may have to walk sometimes if it's really slick but not really a safety issue.

i personally disagree with what a few have said about studs being slippery/dangerous on regular wet roads. especially if you get the variant with no studs in the center of the tire.

on my commuter i do it pretty much like auto users just waiting a little longer to put them on: i put my front on around the time of the first snow/ice (end of October here in Munich) and then then rear on some time in November. they stay on full-time even if we have a 4-week spell above freezing where the roads are clear until April/May or so.

i ride the Schwalbe tires with the studs ONLY on the outside so they still roll well on pavement but have the studs for cornering. then on a day when there IS potential for ice i let out some pressure so the tire contact patch increases and the studs can do more. (letting pressure out is easy, changing a tire or even a wheel is NOT something i want to do at 7am before my commute to work)

for my off-road winter adventures i have the aggressive Schwalbe IceSpiker with like 304 studs. it is great for off road and works pretty well on major ice but is VERY loud slow and annoying on pavement, so i find it overkill for the commuter.

my recommendation: check into a semi-studded tire for the FRONT with studs only on the outer part of the tread -- either from Nokian or Schwalbe --- Schwalbe "Snow Stud"
http://www.schwalbe.com/index.pl?bereich=produkte&einsatzbereich=4&produktgruppe=17&produkt=214

This is the approach that I suspected might work best for my location. The tendancy here is more often ice patches rather than snow/ice the entire route, but there are a few days of continuous snow.

Are the studs completely off the pavement when travelling straight with high tire pressure?

Are there stopping issues when you hit an ice patch without the spikes in the center?

Might one consider a peppering of spikes on the edge with a small number of spikes in the center?