Mountain Biking - shiamno XTR hydralic calipers VS. hayes EL Camino calipers

hey guys.. i read alot of forums about how shimano brakes suck.. so i wounder? is the hayes better? and if i do get the hayes because it is better.. can i mate it to the XTR dual control brake lever?

Alot of people here have various experience with the Hayes vs. Shimano debate; I'll stay out of that one.

I'm not 100% sure, but I don't think you can mate the dual control with much of anything other than Shimano. Something about cable size maybe?

ok.. thanks anyway.. guess i will post this in a differewnt forum.. cause i know sometimes this forum can become a warzone.. wish guys here were more friendly..

ok.. thanks anyway.. guess i will post this in a differewnt forum.. cause i know sometimes this forum can become a warzone.. wish guys here were more friendly..

I've ridden the XTR and own XTs myself. They stop me with more than enough power with plenty of modulation. I can't see why you would want anything better....Donno about the hayes though.

Also, I'm sure Shimano has ironed out the sticky piston problem...

No, you cannot use a hayes caliper on a Shimano Dual Control lever. You cannot mix shimano parts with hayes. Shimano's brakes use mineral oil for hydraulic fluid, and Hayes uses DOT 4 fluid. Mixing either will produce not-so-good results. The Shimano lever will also have a different sized piston in the lever, which would push more or less fluid for X inches of lever pull than the hayes.

My opinion:
I would take the El Caminos over the Shimano brakes. I do not like the dual control lever, I find that they are too easy to accidentally shift while riding, and it is flexy. The Shimanos do however modulate quite nicely.

I think the hayes are much better looking, you have more shifter options, and the lever is stiff and more adjustable. It still depends on the riding you will be doing.

Best to stick with a shimano calliper, I'm sure the instructions will list all the compatible models.

If you want to use a non shimano calliper you will have a few issues to deal with.

The shimano lever not push the same amount of fluid when you pull the lever depending on piston diameter and stroke.
The hydro line may be a different size making it difficult to attach to the caliper.
They may use different fluid types that could cause a problem with seals. Shimano use mineral oil so you need a caliper that will work fine with it.


Hope where rumoured to be producing mineral oil seal kit so you could use hope callipers with duel control leavers. I'm not sure if it ever came about though.

thanks guys.. so i will just have to stay with shimano.. then whats all these stuff people say that shiamno brakes sucks if you all praise it? and by the way.. does any one know any good derailluer cable housing that does not cause cable rub?

then whats all these stuff people say that shiamno brakes sucks if you all praise it?

They USED to have sticky piston and people couldn't get their brakes aligned properly because of it. However, it is no longer a problem.

ok.. thanks