palmertires
10-07-05, 08:10 AM
In traffic, which side should a cyclist pass another cyclist on? Left or right?
Commuting - How to pass another cyclist?
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10-07-05, 08:16 AM
Left. Always left. If you can't go around because of traffic, wait until you can. And say something... like, "on you left" or a friendly "how's it goin'".
Sure you can always say something like, "Looks like I'm about to drop you," or "Hm... is there something wrong with your bike? No? Well, it must be your legs then. See ya!"
But that's less friendly.
Always on the left.
Sure you can always say something like, "Looks like I'm about to drop you," or "Hm... is there something wrong with your bike? No? Well, it must be your legs then. See ya!"
But that's less friendly.
Always on the left.
yespatterns
10-07-05, 08:21 AM
Or, you can let them know that you are passing them because you "turned it up to 400 watts".
oboeguy
10-07-05, 08:21 AM
Yes, on the left BUT you must have your mouth closed so it looks like you're only breathing through your nose, thus using only minimal effort to drop the chump. Don't say anything friendly either. ;)
palmertires
10-07-05, 08:25 AM
I intuitively pass on the left since that is what I was taught in driver's ed...passing on the right is not a good idea for a lot of reasons, but I have noticed plenty of cyclists who do pass me on the right. Just this morning...and I almost didn't realize they were passing there. Could have been a bad situation.
Cromulent
10-07-05, 08:30 AM
I intuitively pass on the left since that is what I was taught in driver's ed...passing on the right is not a good idea for a lot of reasons, but I have noticed plenty of cyclists who do pass me on the right. Just this morning...and I almost didn't realize they were passing there. Could have been a bad situation.
That's crazy. Are you on a trail, or in a bike lane? Or are you biking in the middle of the road? The only way I could see it being okay is if you're taking the lane (riding in the middle of the road) and someone else is riding near the curb. Otherwise passing someone on the right is just nuts.
That's crazy. Are you on a trail, or in a bike lane? Or are you biking in the middle of the road? The only way I could see it being okay is if you're taking the lane (riding in the middle of the road) and someone else is riding near the curb. Otherwise passing someone on the right is just nuts.
Sigurdd50
10-07-05, 09:09 AM
Unfortunately, the majority of bikers who pass me on the left (on bike path, road, wherever) NEVER announce their arrival and passage. If there is a good wind (in the ears, blocking the swish=swish of bike tires in the rear) this can be a startling experience. If there is a large group of riders, I will usually, in as nice a voice as I can muster, with PROJECTION, say... "BIKER... PASSING ON THE LEFT" as if to remind them about this courtesy.
ON a couple ocassions I have even gotten passed on the right by groups of riders -- usually on a bike path; I am moving at between 12-14 MPH; they are moving at 20-25 MPH. It's as if they see the path is not wide enough for them to pass in their 'formation' so they have to pass on left and right... single file doesn't appear to be an option. hmmm
I hate to harp on this, but I think ALL riders should harp on this:
If you are overtaken by a faster rider and they pass with out alert, and you happen to shift a foot left because you don't sense a rider there, serious crap can happen. This would seriously screw up my morning commute/
ON a couple ocassions I have even gotten passed on the right by groups of riders -- usually on a bike path; I am moving at between 12-14 MPH; they are moving at 20-25 MPH. It's as if they see the path is not wide enough for them to pass in their 'formation' so they have to pass on left and right... single file doesn't appear to be an option. hmmm
I hate to harp on this, but I think ALL riders should harp on this:
If you are overtaken by a faster rider and they pass with out alert, and you happen to shift a foot left because you don't sense a rider there, serious crap can happen. This would seriously screw up my morning commute/
ghettocruiser
10-07-05, 10:09 AM
On the left. With enough speed that they don't even think about tucking in behind you.
rule
10-07-05, 10:17 AM
Anytime somebody does this I ride them down, and call out "I am passing on your left." If they pass me again with no call, I catch their wheel and say "Hey if you'll please let me know when you are coming around, it will be a whole lot safer for us both."
Only a complete dickhead won't get that message. Given time and enough of that kind of riding, they will find the hard way anyway.
Only a complete dickhead won't get that message. Given time and enough of that kind of riding, they will find the hard way anyway.
va_cyclist
10-07-05, 10:19 AM
Unfortunately, the majority of bikers who pass me on the left (on bike path, road, wherever) NEVER announce their arrival and passage. If there is a good wind (in the ears, blocking the swish=swish of bike tires in the rear) this can be a startling experience. If there is a large group of riders, I will usually, in as nice a voice as I can muster, with PROJECTION, say... "BIKER... PASSING ON THE LEFT" as if to remind them about this courtesy.
...
I hate to harp on this, but I think ALL riders should harp on this:
If you are overtaken by a faster rider and they pass with out alert, and you happen to shift a foot left because you don't sense a rider there, serious crap can happen. This would seriously screw up my morning commute/
If there is a good wind and your hearing is impaired, then can you really be sure they didn't say anything?
I only call out OTL if I'm forced to pass within close proximity to someone, like in a bike lane or on a trail. On the open road, I pass (on those rare occasions that I actually find a rider slower than myself) with enough room that it doesn't matter what the other person does, so I rarely call out in those situations.
...
I hate to harp on this, but I think ALL riders should harp on this:
If you are overtaken by a faster rider and they pass with out alert, and you happen to shift a foot left because you don't sense a rider there, serious crap can happen. This would seriously screw up my morning commute/
If there is a good wind and your hearing is impaired, then can you really be sure they didn't say anything?
I only call out OTL if I'm forced to pass within close proximity to someone, like in a bike lane or on a trail. On the open road, I pass (on those rare occasions that I actually find a rider slower than myself) with enough room that it doesn't matter what the other person does, so I rarely call out in those situations.
Iain Morris
10-07-05, 10:25 AM
Anytime somebody does this I ride them down, and call out "I am passing on your left." If they pass me again with no call, I catch their wheel and say "Hey if you'll please let me know when you are coming around, it will be a whole lot safer for us both."
Wow and I thought I had to worry about cars. Some of you guys are pretty tense.
Wow and I thought I had to worry about cars. Some of you guys are pretty tense.
chipcom
10-07-05, 10:25 AM
I use "geezer on your left!" but I had to quit projecting my old Marine DI voice when doing so, it tends to startle folks. ;)
ghettocruiser
10-07-05, 10:25 AM
Yep, in terms of verbal warnings I only give them for confined areas.
On the road, I will just pull out into the normal stream of traffic and pass them as a car would. If they really are prone to spontaneously swinging to the left while riding in traffic, I'll let them work that out for themselves.
On the road, I will just pull out into the normal stream of traffic and pass them as a car would. If they really are prone to spontaneously swinging to the left while riding in traffic, I'll let them work that out for themselves.
palmertires
10-07-05, 10:36 AM
That's crazy. Are you on a trail, or in a bike lane? Or are you biking in the middle of the road? The only way I could see it being okay is if you're taking the lane (riding in the middle of the road) and someone else is riding near the curb. Otherwise passing someone on the right is just nuts.
In this morning's instance, I was riding on a residential street with cars parked on both sides. I do not hug the line of cars, so maybe this person thought there was room there...or, they were reluctant to pass me on the left. Whatever the reason, I did experience a moment of what in the world is going on? Why are they passing me on the right? They had to ride dangerously close to the line of cars to pass there... Also, they were hardly going any faster than I was, so passing seemed pointless.
In this morning's instance, I was riding on a residential street with cars parked on both sides. I do not hug the line of cars, so maybe this person thought there was room there...or, they were reluctant to pass me on the left. Whatever the reason, I did experience a moment of what in the world is going on? Why are they passing me on the right? They had to ride dangerously close to the line of cars to pass there... Also, they were hardly going any faster than I was, so passing seemed pointless.
chinitonorte
10-07-05, 10:37 AM
I just yell "Bike". An experienced rider will know your coming around on the left. Or just "Left" if you know they're experienced. Shouting at kids and less experienced can be a hit or miss. Usually if your authoritative, they will just stop pedaling and freeze. Others, will automatically look and swerve, these types require a wide berth in passing safely.
If you really want to bug people, get a horn.
If you really want to bug people, get a horn.
max-a-mill
10-07-05, 10:37 AM
Anytime somebody does this I ride them down, and call out "I am passing on your left." If they pass me again with no call, I catch their wheel and say "Hey if you'll please let me know when you are coming around, it will be a whole lot safer for us both."
Only a complete dickhead won't get that message. Given time and enough of that kind of riding, they will find the hard way anyway.
see i take a little offense to this. i pass people without a warning for the piece of mind of me and everyone else.... i ride on a fairly crowded MUT; if i announced "no your left" to everyone i pass (bikers, joggers, dog walkers, roller-idiots), some mornings, i'd never stop shouting.
i give an "on your left" to anyone who dosen't look capable of staying right for long enough for me to pass safely... i find silence whenever possible makes my commute much less like driving.
if someone is staying on their proper side, and you can pass them safely; why bother them with an "on your left"? i argue this will startle many people and cause just as many erratic swerves as saying nothing at all.
how many people have you had come left at you when you make your announcement? i have had plenty...
Only a complete dickhead won't get that message. Given time and enough of that kind of riding, they will find the hard way anyway.
see i take a little offense to this. i pass people without a warning for the piece of mind of me and everyone else.... i ride on a fairly crowded MUT; if i announced "no your left" to everyone i pass (bikers, joggers, dog walkers, roller-idiots), some mornings, i'd never stop shouting.
i give an "on your left" to anyone who dosen't look capable of staying right for long enough for me to pass safely... i find silence whenever possible makes my commute much less like driving.
if someone is staying on their proper side, and you can pass them safely; why bother them with an "on your left"? i argue this will startle many people and cause just as many erratic swerves as saying nothing at all.
how many people have you had come left at you when you make your announcement? i have had plenty...
FLBandit
10-07-05, 10:37 AM
I almost never have to pass anyone on the road. On the bike paths it's a different story. I always try to pass on the left and give a warning there.
cooker
10-07-05, 10:56 AM
If I'm going to pass close, for example within a wider bike path where there's room to pass within the path, I ring my bell and I may call out "on your left". If there is an opportunity to pull out into the main traffic lane to pass, I don't warn them, since in that case I'm no different than a car passing them. If they're approaching a red light and I want to pass on the left and then make a legal right turn, I always hang back 'til they're fully stopped, because frequently I see bicyclists swerve left into the pedestrian crosswalk without shoulder checking.
If someone passes me on the right, I scorn them as a fool.
If someone passes me on the right, I scorn them as a fool.
Sigurdd50
10-07-05, 10:57 AM
If there is a good wind and your hearing is impaired, then can you really be sure they didn't say anything?
I only call out OTL if I'm forced to pass within close proximity to someone, like in a bike lane or on a trail. On the open road, I pass (on those rare occasions that I actually find a rider slower than myself) with enough room that it doesn't matter what the other person does, so I rarely call out in those situations.
I can see your point, but why take any chances?
I ride as if I am a vehicle. As a vehicle, I try to abide by basic road rules and logic. Vehicles are (hopefully) required to signal before passing, changing lanes, or turning left or right. A verbal signal or bell is the best a cyclist can do. Making assumptions like there is a strong wind so this rider WON'T hear me anyway or this rider won't suddenly make an evasive maneurver so I can pass with out alerting them is fool-hardy. All along my commute route there are streets that are in various states of disrepair. There are patches that are nearly unrideable, requiring that I move slightly away from the edge of the street. A passing rider may not be aware of the rough road surface in front of me and that I am going to move 18 inches to the left to avoid a spill ... and if the approaching rider is traveling at a fast clip, and they don't alert, there is trouble ahead!
It seems that arguments for NOT alerting riders of passing are just arguments for being lazy. How much effort is involved vs. the potential trouble/injury avoided? When I drive in a car and pass/turn, I use my signal. I don't piss and moan about what a hassle it is to use my car turn-signal.
I only call out OTL if I'm forced to pass within close proximity to someone, like in a bike lane or on a trail. On the open road, I pass (on those rare occasions that I actually find a rider slower than myself) with enough room that it doesn't matter what the other person does, so I rarely call out in those situations.
I can see your point, but why take any chances?
I ride as if I am a vehicle. As a vehicle, I try to abide by basic road rules and logic. Vehicles are (hopefully) required to signal before passing, changing lanes, or turning left or right. A verbal signal or bell is the best a cyclist can do. Making assumptions like there is a strong wind so this rider WON'T hear me anyway or this rider won't suddenly make an evasive maneurver so I can pass with out alerting them is fool-hardy. All along my commute route there are streets that are in various states of disrepair. There are patches that are nearly unrideable, requiring that I move slightly away from the edge of the street. A passing rider may not be aware of the rough road surface in front of me and that I am going to move 18 inches to the left to avoid a spill ... and if the approaching rider is traveling at a fast clip, and they don't alert, there is trouble ahead!
It seems that arguments for NOT alerting riders of passing are just arguments for being lazy. How much effort is involved vs. the potential trouble/injury avoided? When I drive in a car and pass/turn, I use my signal. I don't piss and moan about what a hassle it is to use my car turn-signal.
Cromulent
10-07-05, 10:58 AM
see i take a little offense to this. i pass people without a warning for the piece of mind of me and everyone else.... i ride on a fairly crowded MUT; if i announced "no your left" to everyone i pass (bikers, joggers, dog walkers, roller-idiots), some mornings, i'd never stop shouting.how many people have you had come left at you when you make your announcement? i have had plenty...
I don't disagree with you. On a crowded MUT, saying 'on your left' to everyone is a PITA. And with practice and experience, you get a feeling for who seems to need a heads up and who doesn't. Obviously you can't really look at someone and judge, though that's essentially what you do, so to me it's better to err on the side of caution. Not that it always matters either. I think on one ride home on the bike trail each person I passed was listening to music and probably didnt hear me anyway.
I prefer it when someone says, 'on your left' to me. I find it safer.
I don't disagree with you. On a crowded MUT, saying 'on your left' to everyone is a PITA. And with practice and experience, you get a feeling for who seems to need a heads up and who doesn't. Obviously you can't really look at someone and judge, though that's essentially what you do, so to me it's better to err on the side of caution. Not that it always matters either. I think on one ride home on the bike trail each person I passed was listening to music and probably didnt hear me anyway.
I prefer it when someone says, 'on your left' to me. I find it safer.
matt_savvy
10-07-05, 10:59 AM
I always worry about calling out nothing but "left!"
once I did that and the dude thought I meant "hey, I'm coming on your right, you'd better move to the LEFT!"
so now I just move out into the flow of the cars and just tear past
once I did that and the dude thought I meant "hey, I'm coming on your right, you'd better move to the LEFT!"
so now I just move out into the flow of the cars and just tear past
Walkafire
10-07-05, 10:59 AM
...Ring your Bell
:roflmao:
Always on the Left
:roflmao:
Always on the Left
Az B
10-07-05, 11:04 AM
I have one of those little air horns on my handlebars. I usually get as close as possible, riding as quietly as possible, and then let out a long blast on the horn right behind the other rider. They usually get out of my way, sometimes pulling over, sometimes stopping as they smack into a sign or something. But they always yell something friendly as I pass them. At least I think it's friendly... I can't hear very well anymore from all the air horn blasts.
Az
Az
Cromulent
10-07-05, 11:07 AM
I have one of those little air horns on my handlebars. I usually get as close as possible, riding as quietly as possible, and then let out a long blast on the horn right behind the other rider. They usually get out of my way, sometimes pulling over, sometimes stopping as they smack into a sign or something. But they always yell something friendly as I pass them. At least I think it's friendly... I can't hear very well anymore from all the air horn blasts.
Az
See. This is perfect. If it ain't friendly, at least it's hilarious.
Az
See. This is perfect. If it ain't friendly, at least it's hilarious.
wheezl
10-07-05, 11:11 AM
In Central Park during traffic hours I almost always pass on the right. Only an idiot would do otherwise.
In traffic I only call out if I am close. Usually I get into the other lane and don't bother saying anything. If someone is gutter hugging on the left I sure as hell am not going to pass them on the left. They get an "on yer right!" from me. Not my fault if they don't know how to ride. Obviously I keep my distance and make sure not to startle them.
You folks who say "always pass on the left" perplex me. There are a wide variety of legal traffic situations that call for passing on the right.
In traffic I only call out if I am close. Usually I get into the other lane and don't bother saying anything. If someone is gutter hugging on the left I sure as hell am not going to pass them on the left. They get an "on yer right!" from me. Not my fault if they don't know how to ride. Obviously I keep my distance and make sure not to startle them.
You folks who say "always pass on the left" perplex me. There are a wide variety of legal traffic situations that call for passing on the right.
pinkrobe
10-07-05, 11:11 AM
how many people have you had come left at you when you make your announcement? i have had plenty...I hate riding the pathway system in Calgary for exactly this reason. I yell "on your left" well before I catch up to people, and over half of them drift left WITHOUT LOOKING. Due to my superhuman reflexes, I haven't taken anyone out, but there have been occasions where I want to give 'em a bit of a kicking. I ride on the road almost exclusively since I can ride as fast as I want and I don't have to worry about passing people all the time.
Cromulent
10-07-05, 11:26 AM
You folks who say "always pass on the left" perplex me. There are a wide variety of legal traffic situations that call for passing on the right.
Most of us who say that don't ride in Manhattan. But other than passing someone who is in the far left lane of a one way street, where would you pass someone on the right?
Let's say I'm in the right lane of a two lane one-way street that also has a bike lane. If I'm in the right lane, someone can pass me on the right in the bike lane. If I'm in the left lane, someone could pass me in the right lane or the bike lane.
If I'm at stopped at an intersection, waiting for the light to change, and I'm heading straight, someone could take a right turn on my right...
But (and maybe I'm way off here) don't most people who ride in the street stay 3 or so feet from the curb in the right lane? And if there are parked cars with dooring potential, then don't you stay just out of door reach? And shouldn't this sensibly leave only room to pass on the left? Not starting any VC arguments here, just curious.
Most of us who say that don't ride in Manhattan. But other than passing someone who is in the far left lane of a one way street, where would you pass someone on the right?
Let's say I'm in the right lane of a two lane one-way street that also has a bike lane. If I'm in the right lane, someone can pass me on the right in the bike lane. If I'm in the left lane, someone could pass me in the right lane or the bike lane.
If I'm at stopped at an intersection, waiting for the light to change, and I'm heading straight, someone could take a right turn on my right...
But (and maybe I'm way off here) don't most people who ride in the street stay 3 or so feet from the curb in the right lane? And if there are parked cars with dooring potential, then don't you stay just out of door reach? And shouldn't this sensibly leave only room to pass on the left? Not starting any VC arguments here, just curious.
Erick L
10-07-05, 11:39 AM
I pass on the left, with plenty of space. I never say anything. I don't pass in curves on a bike trail. I don't even call out when two persons are crowding the trail, I just go in the grass.
max-a-mill
10-07-05, 12:23 PM
. I don't even call out when two persons are crowding the trail, I just go in the grass.
see THOSE people i yell for... i hate people who can't respect a multi-use trail.
the WORST are the ones who see you coming and don't get out of the way... those people get forced into a nice game of chicken with me. i am a big guy and play to win!
lately it's the highschool cross country teams that really freakin annoy me. apparently they don't get any pep-talks on how to use the trail safely/correctly round here before they let them loose.
see THOSE people i yell for... i hate people who can't respect a multi-use trail.
the WORST are the ones who see you coming and don't get out of the way... those people get forced into a nice game of chicken with me. i am a big guy and play to win!
lately it's the highschool cross country teams that really freakin annoy me. apparently they don't get any pep-talks on how to use the trail safely/correctly round here before they let them loose.
cooker
10-07-05, 12:41 PM
Vehicles are (hopefully) required to signal before passing, changing lanes, or turning left or right. A verbal signal or bell is the best a cyclist can do...It seems that arguments for NOT alerting riders of passing are just arguments for being lazy. How much effort is involved vs. the potential trouble/injury avoided? When I drive in a car and pass/turn, I use my signal.
I disagree with your argument. When you are changing lanes to overtake another bike, a verbal signal or bell is not "the best you can do". In a car, you use the turn signal NOT to warn the vehicle you are overtaking, but to instead to warn the people behind or beside you that you are about to make a lane change. On a bike you should do the same, and a bell or verbal warning is not the appropriate signal in this case because cars behind you may not hear your words, and they won't know why your are ringing your bell. Instead you should shoulder check, then signal the lane change with your arm. Once you're in the traffic lane you don't really need to speak or ring your bell to let the other cyclist know you are passing (no other vehicle would do it), but it probably doesn't hurt to do so, just in case (s)he is dumb enough to veer left without shoulder checking.
Robert
I disagree with your argument. When you are changing lanes to overtake another bike, a verbal signal or bell is not "the best you can do". In a car, you use the turn signal NOT to warn the vehicle you are overtaking, but to instead to warn the people behind or beside you that you are about to make a lane change. On a bike you should do the same, and a bell or verbal warning is not the appropriate signal in this case because cars behind you may not hear your words, and they won't know why your are ringing your bell. Instead you should shoulder check, then signal the lane change with your arm. Once you're in the traffic lane you don't really need to speak or ring your bell to let the other cyclist know you are passing (no other vehicle would do it), but it probably doesn't hurt to do so, just in case (s)he is dumb enough to veer left without shoulder checking.
Robert
wheezl
10-07-05, 12:50 PM
Most of us who say that don't ride in Manhattan. But other than passing someone who is in the far left lane of a one way street, where would you pass someone on the right?
Let's say I'm in the right lane of a two lane one-way street that also has a bike lane. If I'm in the right lane, someone can pass me on the right in the bike lane. If I'm in the left lane, someone could pass me in the right lane or the bike lane.
If I'm at stopped at an intersection, waiting for the light to change, and I'm heading straight, someone could take a right turn on my right...
But (and maybe I'm way off here) don't most people who ride in the street stay 3 or so feet from the curb in the right lane? And if there are parked cars with dooring potential, then don't you stay just out of door reach? And shouldn't this sensibly leave only room to pass on the left? Not starting any VC arguments here, just curious.
On a two lane one way street the bike lane should be on the left. If it's on the right, your city is trying to kill you. You should always pass on the right since parked cars should be on the left. If the bike lane is on the right.. then yes passing on the left is appropriate.
I don't like bike lanes. However like you, I don't want to argue about it :)
Let's say I'm in the right lane of a two lane one-way street that also has a bike lane. If I'm in the right lane, someone can pass me on the right in the bike lane. If I'm in the left lane, someone could pass me in the right lane or the bike lane.
If I'm at stopped at an intersection, waiting for the light to change, and I'm heading straight, someone could take a right turn on my right...
But (and maybe I'm way off here) don't most people who ride in the street stay 3 or so feet from the curb in the right lane? And if there are parked cars with dooring potential, then don't you stay just out of door reach? And shouldn't this sensibly leave only room to pass on the left? Not starting any VC arguments here, just curious.
On a two lane one way street the bike lane should be on the left. If it's on the right, your city is trying to kill you. You should always pass on the right since parked cars should be on the left. If the bike lane is on the right.. then yes passing on the left is appropriate.
I don't like bike lanes. However like you, I don't want to argue about it :)
cooker
10-07-05, 01:37 PM
On a two lane one way street the bike lane should be on the left. If it's on the right, your city is trying to kill you.
I don't get it...why on the left on a one-way?
R
I don't get it...why on the left on a one-way?
R
wheezl
10-07-05, 01:40 PM
I don't get it...why on the left on a one-way?
R
Most people don't carpool. The chances of being doored are substantially reduced on the left.
R
Most people don't carpool. The chances of being doored are substantially reduced on the left.
Lieren
10-07-05, 01:47 PM
That's crazy. Are you on a trail, or in a bike lane? Or are you biking in the middle of the road? The only way I could see it being okay is if you're taking the lane (riding in the middle of the road) and someone else is riding near the curb. Otherwise passing someone on the right is just nuts.
Ha. Welcome to Philadelphia, where it seems most folks pass on the right, often at intersections. I suppose that's what I get for actually slowing down and stopping at lights, but it's not like I don't leave room on the left for people who are faster than me...
Then again, standards for all sorts of public behavior are fairly low here.
Ha. Welcome to Philadelphia, where it seems most folks pass on the right, often at intersections. I suppose that's what I get for actually slowing down and stopping at lights, but it's not like I don't leave room on the left for people who are faster than me...
Then again, standards for all sorts of public behavior are fairly low here.
Cromulent
10-07-05, 01:53 PM
Ha. Welcome to Philadelphia, where it seems most folks pass on the right, often at intersections. I suppose that's what I get for actually slowing down and stopping at lights, but it's not like I don't leave room on the left for people who are faster than me...
Then again, standards for all sorts of public behavior are fairly low here.
Yeah... I was under the impression that a reasonable cyclist will bike safely in the interest of his or her own self preservation. But I'm kinda stupid like that. :D
Then again, standards for all sorts of public behavior are fairly low here.
Yeah... I was under the impression that a reasonable cyclist will bike safely in the interest of his or her own self preservation. But I'm kinda stupid like that. :D
wheezl
10-07-05, 01:56 PM
Then again, standards for all sorts of public behavior are fairly low here.
Didn't you guys once boo Santa Claus ?? :P
Didn't you guys once boo Santa Claus ?? :P
james_swift
10-07-05, 03:32 PM
Here's the proper way to do it...draft the guy for 100 meters or so...get really tucked-into his slipstream almost to the point of touching wheels...don't do any work, just sit back...then in the last 30 meters, reach down deep into your suitcase-of-courage and swing out wide (to the left) and blow past him like the devil and all his daemons from hell are hot on your tail. Follow-up by punching the air with both fists, and/or a deep, throaty, "hell yeah!!!".
Wil Davis
10-07-05, 04:09 PM
They get a distant warning using #1, and if there's no reaction, a closer blast on #2, and if that fails, a yell or two… actually kids usually get a kick out of the horn…
- Wil
- Wil
azesty
10-07-05, 04:33 PM
I nearly always pass on the right.
But then we drive on the left side of the road here, so it kind of makes sense.
a
But then we drive on the left side of the road here, so it kind of makes sense.
a
kwhord
10-07-05, 04:42 PM
dont pass them, impale them with the bayonet mounted to the front of your bicycle!!!
Az B
10-07-05, 07:51 PM
They get a distant warning using #1, and if there's no reaction, a closer blast on #2, and if that fails, a yell or two… actually kids usually get a kick out of the horn…
- Wil
Jeez, do you have enough crap on your bars?
Lemee guess, you've got a pair of bull horns on your helmet?
Az
- Wil
Jeez, do you have enough crap on your bars?
Lemee guess, you've got a pair of bull horns on your helmet?
Az
tokolosh
10-07-05, 09:46 PM
I hate to harp on this, but I think ALL riders should harp on this:
If you are overtaken by a faster rider and they pass with out alert, and you happen to shift a foot left because you don't sense a rider there, serious crap can happen.
word. get a bell if you're shy and/or don't want the biker of the second bike to hear that you're out of breath.
If you are overtaken by a faster rider and they pass with out alert, and you happen to shift a foot left because you don't sense a rider there, serious crap can happen.
word. get a bell if you're shy and/or don't want the biker of the second bike to hear that you're out of breath.
tokolosh
10-07-05, 10:17 PM
you use the turn signal NOT to warn the vehicle you are overtaking, but to instead to warn the people behind or beside you that you are about to make a lane change.
i don't know. probably most of the people who do it to me don't think that they're informing me of anything, but i make a note anyway and i do adjust myself to accommodate that they're trying to do. once they change up they'll be in my blind spot for at least a moment, and i like to know who's in that. i can also see the road ahead of where they're going better than they can, since i'm in front of them. and if something's in that lane and they have to react to it too suddenly, strange stuff can happen. maybe they don't think they're obliged to tell me what they have in mind, but the way i always understood the whole driving deal, i'm obliged to stay aware of whatever it is.
but it probably doesn't hurt to do so, just in case (s)he is dumb enough to veer left without shoulder checking.
eh well, dumb. not everyone riding a bike out there is experienced. not everyone is 100% stable on their bike in a range of changing conditions, and not everyone has rock-solid reflexes, especially when they're labouring enough to be pass-able by somebody else. in other words, not all veers to the left are of the intentional kind that involve shoulder checking. i do know that one of the surest ways to discombobulate someone like that (because i kind of am someone like that) is to appear out of nowhere at their shoulder. and i'm not all that impressively dumb. [/QUOTE]
i don't know. probably most of the people who do it to me don't think that they're informing me of anything, but i make a note anyway and i do adjust myself to accommodate that they're trying to do. once they change up they'll be in my blind spot for at least a moment, and i like to know who's in that. i can also see the road ahead of where they're going better than they can, since i'm in front of them. and if something's in that lane and they have to react to it too suddenly, strange stuff can happen. maybe they don't think they're obliged to tell me what they have in mind, but the way i always understood the whole driving deal, i'm obliged to stay aware of whatever it is.
but it probably doesn't hurt to do so, just in case (s)he is dumb enough to veer left without shoulder checking.
eh well, dumb. not everyone riding a bike out there is experienced. not everyone is 100% stable on their bike in a range of changing conditions, and not everyone has rock-solid reflexes, especially when they're labouring enough to be pass-able by somebody else. in other words, not all veers to the left are of the intentional kind that involve shoulder checking. i do know that one of the surest ways to discombobulate someone like that (because i kind of am someone like that) is to appear out of nowhere at their shoulder. and i'm not all that impressively dumb. [/QUOTE]
Camel
10-08-05, 02:59 AM
Allways left, but only while I'm smoking a cigarette, whistling & listening to my i-tunes on a brakeless fixie.
dedlee tredlee
10-08-05, 07:07 AM
Depends wot country you're in. If you drive,ride,walk on the left hand side of the road then pass on the right and vice versa. So in the US you would pass on the left but here in Oz you'd pass on the right. Simple really. Bike traffic rules should be the same as other vehicular traffic rule within any given country.
va_cyclist
10-10-05, 10:06 AM
It seems that arguments for NOT alerting riders of passing are just arguments for being lazy. How much effort is involved vs. the potential trouble/injury avoided? When I drive in a car and pass/turn, I use my signal. I don't piss and moan about what a hassle it is to use my car turn-signal.
I know you weren't talking about me when you said "piss and moan", so no offense taken. :) I think signaling for turns is a different case. With turns, you're either crossing the path of other vehicles, or stopping to wait for them, so a signal is a necessary warning to those ahead or behind. I use turn signals without exception in the car and on the bike. (Okay, maybe I skip them on the bike if nobody's around.) Returning to your analogy, do you honk the horn or flash the lights every time you pass someone in a car, even when there are two lanes? I'll occasionally flash the lights if I'm overtaking a much slower car, or if I'm pulling into an oncoming lane to make a pass, but otherwise I don't.
I know you weren't talking about me when you said "piss and moan", so no offense taken. :) I think signaling for turns is a different case. With turns, you're either crossing the path of other vehicles, or stopping to wait for them, so a signal is a necessary warning to those ahead or behind. I use turn signals without exception in the car and on the bike. (Okay, maybe I skip them on the bike if nobody's around.) Returning to your analogy, do you honk the horn or flash the lights every time you pass someone in a car, even when there are two lanes? I'll occasionally flash the lights if I'm overtaking a much slower car, or if I'm pulling into an oncoming lane to make a pass, but otherwise I don't.
Sigurdd50
10-10-05, 10:28 AM
nah.. when I say piss and moan I am spreading the love around to all who may be doing thus :^)
Returning to your analogy, do you honk the horn or flash the lights every time you pass someone in a car, even when there are two lanes? I'll occasionally flash the lights if I'm overtaking a much slower car, or if I'm pulling into an oncoming lane to make a pass, but otherwise I don't.
the deal is here... bikes don't have rear-view mirrors and side view mirrors; we are trained to look in our blind spot (well, hopefully, most of us) while driving... the point is, visual awareness in a car is enhanced by mirrors and training and lights. PLUS, cars are LOUD. ON a bike, I can hear the car coming from behind me for several blocks (on level ground); I start rearranging my biking position for some time before a car passes because i get plenty of notice. An approaching cycle is another thing: if it's a fixie, YOU DON'T EVEN HEAR THEM; if it is well repaired roadie, about the same, plus they are travelling much faster; if it is 10-speed in disrepair, I might hear it clicking as it approached. I guess I am trying to adopt the same, redundant habits that I use in a car (signaling despite the lack of traffic) and use it on a bike.
oh, and I got a nice brass bell over the weekend. Can't wait to use it and use it and use it
Returning to your analogy, do you honk the horn or flash the lights every time you pass someone in a car, even when there are two lanes? I'll occasionally flash the lights if I'm overtaking a much slower car, or if I'm pulling into an oncoming lane to make a pass, but otherwise I don't.
the deal is here... bikes don't have rear-view mirrors and side view mirrors; we are trained to look in our blind spot (well, hopefully, most of us) while driving... the point is, visual awareness in a car is enhanced by mirrors and training and lights. PLUS, cars are LOUD. ON a bike, I can hear the car coming from behind me for several blocks (on level ground); I start rearranging my biking position for some time before a car passes because i get plenty of notice. An approaching cycle is another thing: if it's a fixie, YOU DON'T EVEN HEAR THEM; if it is well repaired roadie, about the same, plus they are travelling much faster; if it is 10-speed in disrepair, I might hear it clicking as it approached. I guess I am trying to adopt the same, redundant habits that I use in a car (signaling despite the lack of traffic) and use it on a bike.
oh, and I got a nice brass bell over the weekend. Can't wait to use it and use it and use it
noisebeam
10-10-05, 03:18 PM
I pretty much only ride on the road and my experience is based on that. I very rarely give warning. I usually am well into the lane and as law requires for cars I pass with >3ft of room, but I most often at least 5ft of room. Why should I yell out when all the cars passing don't (and we ask they don't honk)?
Al
Al
recursive
10-10-05, 07:41 PM
I usually pass silently if the person appears to be going in a straight line. I know that doesn't prove that they will continue going straight, but neither does notifying them. In my experience yelling something is more likely to cause them to do something differently than staying silent. I usually pass on the left, but today I passed someone on the right. He was on the left edge of a >10foot bike lane. I passed him with probably at least 3 feet of clearance. To our left were 2 lanes of fast traffic.
Sigurdd50
10-10-05, 08:05 PM
I pretty much only ride on the road and my experience is based on that. I very rarely give warning. I usually am well into the lane and as law requires for cars I pass with >3ft of room, but I most often at least 5ft of room. Why should I yell out when all the cars passing don't (and we ask they don't honk)?
sorry to keep jumping into this thread, but I'm feeling a little bit of a crusade coming on here. Re-read and re-think the prior posting:
You can hear cars coming and THEY know you can hear them coming to. There is no reason for them to alert you (altho on many ocassions I get a nice quick 'beep' to let me know they are coming). Heck, if the wind is right, I CAN SMELL THEM COMING. I think it is not reasonable to say 'cars don't do it, why should we do it?' I've used cars as an analogy because they use the roads and there are traffic laws. It's a safety issue -- perhaps moreso for bikes-to-bikes. Perhaps for some, it isn't a safety issue until you end up in a wreck with another cyclist, pedestrian, or vehicle. At that point you might have the luxury of thinking: "wow, I think i will use some alert system from now on." Safety is something you practice.
As another poster said: if you don't like to verbally alert riders/peds, get a bell. I see my practice as something that benefits me, but more for OTHER riders... I don't see it as any inconvenience, and I can't find any excuses not to do it...just like I can't find any excuses why i SHOULDN'T use seat belts in a car.
sorry to keep jumping into this thread, but I'm feeling a little bit of a crusade coming on here. Re-read and re-think the prior posting:
You can hear cars coming and THEY know you can hear them coming to. There is no reason for them to alert you (altho on many ocassions I get a nice quick 'beep' to let me know they are coming). Heck, if the wind is right, I CAN SMELL THEM COMING. I think it is not reasonable to say 'cars don't do it, why should we do it?' I've used cars as an analogy because they use the roads and there are traffic laws. It's a safety issue -- perhaps moreso for bikes-to-bikes. Perhaps for some, it isn't a safety issue until you end up in a wreck with another cyclist, pedestrian, or vehicle. At that point you might have the luxury of thinking: "wow, I think i will use some alert system from now on." Safety is something you practice.
As another poster said: if you don't like to verbally alert riders/peds, get a bell. I see my practice as something that benefits me, but more for OTHER riders... I don't see it as any inconvenience, and I can't find any excuses not to do it...just like I can't find any excuses why i SHOULDN'T use seat belts in a car.