Interesting VC perspective

[Bekologist]

I go for a bike ride today, my first bike ride (YES!) in two and a half months (FINALLY!) after coming off a bad bike accident/broken hip. Naturally, my speed was not there at all, I was biking at about 25% of my normal or less. What I found VERY interesting, was


my lane positioning was more important at slower speeds. I had to be further out in the roadway to feel comfortable at the slower speeds, not vice versa. I also had to signal sooner, and lane changes had to be instituted looking further back in traffic at my slower speeds as well.


I guess this is interesting to me because it was counterintuitive to my thinking about slower speed bicylists and VC tactics. At my much slower than normal speeds I felt I had to be further out, in oilpan alley, to keep my comfort level up. This was on 25-35 mph, 2 and 4 lane, big city streets with regular signal controls.

[genec]

I go for a bike ride today, my first bike ride (YES!) in two and a half months (FINALLY!) after coming off a bad bike accident/broken hip. Naturally, my speed was not there at all, I was biking at about 25% of my normal or less. What I found VERY interesting, was


my lane positioning was more important at slower speeds. I had to be further out in the roadway to feel comfortable at the slower speeds, not vice versa. I also had to signal sooner, and lane changes had to be instituted looking further back in traffic at my slower speeds as well.


I guess this is interesting to me because it was counterintuitive to my thinking about slower speed bicylists and VC tactics. At my much slower than normal speeds I felt I had to be further out, in oilpan alley, to keep my comfort level up. This was on 25-35 mph, 2 and 4 lane, big city streets with regular signal controls.


Makes sense when you consider that at faster speeds you "blend/merge" better with moving traffic.

Interesting observation.

Get better soon. Didn't realize you had gone through such grief.

[CommuterRun]

That never occurred to me. Thanks for pointing it out, Bekologist. :)

[chipcom]

Glad to see that you are back in the saddle!

[John E]

1) Welcome back into the saddle again!
2) Thanks for your observations regarding speed versus lane positioning. I suppose it's really all about speed differential between you and nearby motorists, so the same principle might apply when comparing a 30mph road to a 50mph road.

[genec]

1) Welcome back into the saddle again!
2) Thanks for your observations regarding speed versus lane positioning. I suppose it's really all about speed differential between you and nearby motorists, so the same principle might apply when comparing a 30mph road to a 50mph road.

Perhaps true, but how wide out there do you want to be on a 50MPH road with traffic approaching?

[Bekologist]

I suppose it's really all about speed differential between you and nearby motorists, so the same principle might apply when comparing a 30mph road to a 50mph road.

I don't know about that comparasion, but on a city street I ordinarily claim the right of way in the right tire track riding at 20, I had to ride right smack dab in the center of the roadway at 5-7 mph to keep cars at a safe passing distance. Maybe this is just an element of VC I wasn't aware of but it is counterintuitive to how I previously thought about slower speed biking and lane positioning.

[sggoodri]

At slower bicycle speeds, passing by motorists happens more frequently, and drivers may be less patient when doing it. So while I recommend staying right if the lane is wide enough while cycling slowly, it's still better to ride farther left if the lane is too narrow for safe same-lane passing at a high speed differential. Taking the lane makes it clear to other drivers that they need to change lanes, and the added room they give usually makes up for the possible increase in harassment by the occasional driver who might not think a slow moving cyclist should be doing that.

[John Wilke]

At my much slower than normal speeds I felt I had to be further out, in oilpan alley, to keep my comfort level up.

The slower I'm going, the greater the impact when I'm hit, so I'm still worrying about the inattentive driver who's yakking on the phone, digging in the notebook for that address, while the kids are yelling in the back seat. Even if it's 'just' a 25mph limit road, there isn't anyone driving that slow. For me, my comfort zone is "staying out of the way", I'm not challenging a car ... I'm staying RIGHT. (of course I haven't been back on the bike yet after my crash and I may just go ballistic out there and start throwing rocks. :o ).

John Wilke
Milwaukee

[LittleBigMan]

I don't know about that comparasion, but on a city street I ordinarily claim the right of way in the right tire track riding at 20, I had to ride right smack dab in the center of the roadway at 5-7 mph to keep cars at a safe passing distance. Maybe this is just an element of VC I wasn't aware of but it is counterintuitive to how I previously thought about slower speed biking and lane positioning.
I've noticed that, once I got over the feeling that I didn't belong in the center of the lane, I actually felt much safer. Motorists simply changed lanes to pass. I ended up feeling quite natural "owning" the lane.

I don't always do this, but I do know what you mean.

[Brian]

We're still debating at work if it's possible to safely commute by bike. I'm not too keen on riding in a marked bike lane next to 90Km/h traffic for starters, but there may be a way around that.

The problem is a small bridge over the train tracks. That should help you with the visual here. It's fairly short and steep, and the roadway narrows so that there is no bike lane. This leaves the cyclist in the position of having to assert himself (or her) by claiming the narrow lane from motorists on their way home. These fine Aussie motorists travel at an average speed of 60Km/h, and are not known for their patience.

I'm not really inclined to test my uphill sprinting abilities on a mountain bike in 90 degree heat after a 9 or 10 hour workday, but the idea of riding still appeals to me. There are other issues to be worked out as well, but this could be the deal-breaker.

Opinions? Suggestions?

[Mars]

We're still debating at work if it's possible to safely commute by bike. I'm not too keen on riding in a marked bike lane next to 90Km/h traffic for starters, but there may be a way around that.

The problem is a small bridge over the train tracks. That should help you with the visual here. It's fairly short and steep, and the roadway narrows so that there is no bike lane. This leaves the cyclist in the position of having to assert himself (or her) by claiming the narrow lane from motorists on their way home. These fine Aussie motorists travel at an average speed of 60Km/h, and are not known for their patience.

I'm not really inclined to test my uphill sprinting abilities on a mountain bike in 90 degree heat after a 9 or 10 hour workday, but the idea of riding still appeals to me. There are other issues to be worked out as well, but this could be the deal-breaker.

Opinions? Suggestions?

First, I would try and change the debate to whether it is safe to commute by CAR. :)

I ride a very similar stretch of road on my commute. The speed limit is the same but there is no bike lane or shoulder. There are some short steep hills. My experience is that taking the right track (errr... left in your case, correct?) and riding predictably and quickly will calm most drivers. Some will beep and holler, but since I am assuming that you will be riding at approx the same time each day, they will eventually accept your presence on the road. They may not like you being there, but then, they don't like each other being there either.

I have found that the more "official" looking my bike clothes are (ie: helmet, shades, lycra) the less hassle I get. Results may vary on that one, though.

[Bikepacker67]

For me, my comfort zone is "staying out of the way", I'm not challenging a car ... I'm staying RIGHT.

The problem with that logic is that often "staying out of the way" equates to "not being seen".
I'd rather ride out 6 feet from the curb, and when I see an approaching car start to move left, I'll move 2feet to the right - but ONLY after I know they've seen me!

EDIT:
Plus there's a psychological aspect to it.
From WAYYY back, the driver sees me out "in the middle of the road" and immediately thinks "look at this azzzhole riding his wittle bikie right in MY WAY - what a PITA!"

And then as they start to shift left (100yds back or so) and I then move right they think "good, the ******* is getting out of MY way" - and they pass safely, thinking that they've gotten the better of the encounter.

Leaves them fat and happy.

[Bekologist]

We're still debating at work if it's possible to safely commute by bike.

The problem is a small bridge over the train tracks. That should help you with the visual here. It's fairly short and steep, and the roadway narrows so that there is no bike lane. This leaves the cyclist in the position of having to assert himself (or her) by claiming the narrow lane from motorists on their way home. These fine Aussie motorists travel at an average speed of 60Km/h, and are not known for their patience.

I'm not really inclined to test my... abilities on a mountain bike in 90 degree heat after a 9 or 10 hour workday, but the idea of riding still appeals to me.

Opinions? Suggestions?


In this case, wouldn't an intrepid mountain biker take the side trail off the roadway and over the tracks?

I've ridden lots of 100km/hr roads with bridges that neck down like you describe, and you've just got to take the lane.

[I-Like-To-Bike]

From WAYYY back, the driver sees me out "in the middle of the road" and immediately thinks "look at this azzzhole riding his wittle bikie right in MY WAY - what a PITA!"

And then as they start to shift left (100yds back or so) and I then move right they think "good, the ******* is getting out of MY way" - and they pass safely, thinking that they've gotten the better of the encounter.

Leaves them fat and happy.
Next time this driver comes across a cyclist "in the middle of the road" for no apparant reason he may assume (from previous encounters with you and other cyclists adapting this unique technique of cycling/swerving all over the road in front of traffic) that the bicyclist will always move over in time, and find no need/reason to alter course or speed at all. May leave you or some other cyclist flattened and very unhappy.

[Bikepacker67]

Next time this driver comes across a cyclist "in the middle of the road" for no apparant reason he may assume (from previous encounters with you and other cyclists adapting this unique technique of cycling/swerving all over the road in front of traffic) that the bicyclist will always move over in time, and find no need/reason to alter course or speed at all. May leave you or some other cyclist flattened and very unhappy.


I Disagree.

Cyclists get mowed down from behind because drivers don't SEE THEM until it's too late.
As much as SOME cagers act like tyrants, they are 99.999% of the time cowards, and have no desire to deal with police/courts/jail/fines.

Make yourself noticed and you won't get hit.

[Brian]

To Bek and Mars,

I never said it was safe by car. A main highway feeds onto the link road, and 2 lanes merge into one about 100 metres or less before the bridge. Every day is exciting. The idea of dismounting, climbing a fence, running across 8 sets of tracks (it's a shunting area) and climbing another fence isn't appealing either. Oh, I think that's a $400 fine too. Lycra won't get respect either. A milk crate on the rear rack with a carton of beer is more likely to cause drivers to give me some respect. I guess I send my offsider first, and see how he goes. If he comes in to work the next day, I'll give it a go. Once in the yard at work, we only have to deal with big trucks, a train, and about 6 forklifts.