General Cycling Discussion - Need advice on highway riding

If I'm lucky, and I think I am, I will be getting an assistant naturalist job at Kent St. Park. To get there I will have to bike or drive 7 miles thru town, and then another 7 on a two lane highway. I will definitely not be riding my bike to work on days it will be dark on my way home, but I am even worried about riding there during daylight hours. The road has relatively good visibility, but is fairly heavily traveled with about 1 in 20 vehicles being a semi. Unfortunately the shoulder is not paved. I worry about inattentive drivers plowing into me, or a person who cannot move over b/c of oncoming traffic not being able to avoid me. However, I cannot imagine this road is any worse than what racers train on regularly, or what tourers and some commuters ride. I also see racers out alone frequently, like I would be.

With a slow moving vehicle triangle on my bike, and maybe an orange vest, what are the odds of eventual death? It would seem that over the course of a year some idiot would not be looking where they are going and I'd be toast. All it would take is one. Any advice from racers, tourers, or commuters etc. would be much appreciated.

Thanks, Clay

Oxymoron, beleive me I worry about the same thing. What are your chances??? Who knows? Ya could live for a day could be dead tomorrow.

I ride a similar road, not for commuting but for recreational riding. Every now and then a semi would come by, I pullover and get off the road. It is a narrow road, I am rec riding, they are big and can't manouver or stop that well, they are working I am having fun, so the few seconds it cuts off my time I don't mind. I almost always get a wave of thanks from these guys. They don't want to hit me, nor do I!!

I can only tell you what I do:
- I don't ride during peak periods
- I don't ride on Friday evening or Saturday evening - kids are out in daddies car
- I use a rearview mirror, allows me to keep an eye on traffic
- I have my wits about me, NO DAYDREAMING
- I communicate. One thing I find that works is when you hear a car pullup behind you, turn your head to look. Motorists see this, and I think relaxes them a bit - they know, that you know, they are behind you. Motorists generally don't want to hit you and are afraid of cyclists. So that little bit of movement to show them that you are aware makes them less nervous and that you ar eincontrol and not gonna suddenly swerve in front of them.
- Consider yourself a car, follow ALL rules.
- The orange vest and triangle are excellent ideas. I find I get more respect when wearing them.


In all honesty, if the road is as busy, and as narrow as you describe I would find another route, ride off peak hours (which means earlier mornings and later evenings), or not ride it at all.

Just one more thing. When I use to commute to work (did for 10 years), I would work an extra hour to 1.5 hours everyday to allow for riding in off peak hours. Because of this my place of work gave me every second Friday off to compensate for the extra hours. Is that possible where you work?

Digger

I hate to generalize, because roads and drivers differ.

Factors to consider:
1) Pavement width.
2) Traffic speed.
3) Presence of other cyclists.
4) Blind curves.
5) Prevailing attitude and competence of local motorists.

My home-to-work commute includes a 1 mi / 1.5km stretch of narrow road with an unpaved shoulder. I definitely feel safer there with wider tyres (or even my mountain bike), in case I need to bail out. Fortunately, motorists are accustomed to seeing cyclists on this road, and the speed limit is 35mph, not 55.

When I ride to the LBS (work), i go along the 4 lane highway, main road. Highway 7 for those of you in Toronto. There is 1 semi within every 10 cars and the shoulder sucks. I am thankfully still alive today. To avoid it would mean a 10km increase in my trip and I am very lazy to get up earlier for the extra 10km.

Riding on a busy two lane highway is a challenge, but it can be enjoyable. I used to train everyday on a busy highway outside Moscow, ID - you want nasty drivers? They are the worst. I came to enjoy it. The number one thing to do is relax. 99.9% of truckers are your friends, when you hear/feel them coming get ready - the bow wave is a hoot and the draft gives you an automatic 5 mph. If the shoulder is narrow and the gravel bothers you, get different tires. Don't bother with a reflective triangle or vest, get a red flasher. If you don't think that is enough get two. I would agree that riding on a highway at night is a bad idea if there isn't a shoulder. Have fun.

Originally posted by Oxymoron
what are the odds of eventual death

That sounds so, I don't know, poetic? Who can say when you'll pedal off this mortal coil.

I take it there is absolutely no reasonable alternative routes? To me, the make-or-break is lane width. Can two trucks traveling in opposite directions pass and still leave enough room for you? If not, plan on riding in the gravel, or your death may not be so eventual. On the other hand, if others do it, than it's not uncommutable.

Some other "see me" precautions you might consider: LED blinkie on seatpost if you'll be riding in twilight or dark. If you'll be riding a dedicated commuter (or maybe even if not) a common practice is to put silver reflective tape on your rims, like this (http://www.faqs.org/faqs/bicycles-faq/part5/section-5.html). Also, I'd recommend riding with a mirror, if you don't. That way, you can see what's coming behind you, how they are driving, and decide in advance if abandoning the road would be good for your health.

Seven miles on a busy two lane with no shoulder. The only thing worse would be eight miles.

Let me guess, the road is all 'chip and seal' as well!

If it were me, I'd either find a safer route or drive it.

Originally posted by John E
....Factors to consider:
1) Pavement width.
2) Traffic speed.
3) Presence of other cyclists.
4) Blind curves.
5) Prevailing attitude and competence of local motorists.

...

I concur with John E.

One key aspect to consider is the condition of the shoulder. Can you move into it easily, without fear of loosing control? Is it good enough that it won't slow you too much? Is it easy to come back on pavement afterwards?

A rearview mirror is, I think, an essential safety item on such highways. I use mine to reassure me most of the time (i.e. the driver behind me is indeed avoiding me); but it also warns me about drivers who don't see me and who would run into me.

Trucks are generally good, unless they have some tight deadline to hit. The only problem is if you have a crosswind fron the left, because their presence create a more dangerous draught.

As for safety equipment, I would say:

- For daytime : bright colours, and either a white or bright yellow helmet, or a safety vest, or an orange slow-moving triangle.
My bikes have fenders. On the rear fender, I added a red and white reflective stripe, which looks like the one on trucks, except each section is 3" long, rather than 6" long. My panniers are also bright red with a large white reflective stripe.

- For nighttime : a decent headlight (to see potholes and the status of the shoulder), 2 very bright blinkies (in case one dies, the legal red reflector (an oversize CPSC or the SAE, which is brighter on axis) and one or 2 large (round 3" or oblong 2 x 5", SAE) amber reflectors.
The amber reflectors which are legal almost everywhere (providing you keep the red one), are two or three times brighter than the red reflector. If you place them low (mine are on the mudflap), they will be lit by cars.

I have received many positive comments on my rear illumination.

You were wondering about your nighttime safety. I don't feel it is that much a problem. You are more at risk at twilight, especially if you are travelling into the sun.

P.S. in 25 or 30 years, my only accident was last spring when someone picked me up on the sidewalk after running a red light and bumping into another car. I had just unlocked my bike, but was still on foot.

Regards,

Are you comfortable with riding on the road and be a part of the traffic itself? Do you live in urban city?

Well, it's earier in the city as the traffic is slower and drivers tend to look out for riders more often. I used to ride in the city at night alone on the roads itself and semis pass me like other cars. I dare not ride on US roads. It's basically all for cars. It's wider and drivers drive faster.

It is also right to pull to the side when you see something big approaching( bus, trucks etc.). The reason not being that it will hit you. It's more because of it passes you fast and close enough, you can get sucked towards the moving truck due to air pressure. A semi once did it on purpose on me and I really felt the strong force pushing me to the truck, it was really hard to control.

So we have no idea how to give you advice. It's really up to you to judge, but if you decide to go ahead, then be sure to get the front and blinking rear lights and maybe even a rear view mirror.

I worry about this, too. For my part, my commute takes me through a very busy intersection and part of a heavily travelled road (lots of suburbanites heading to work/shopping/etc) -- so I do the only things I can think of. I keep as far to the right as possible, make a lot of eye contact, wear really visible stuff and I go offroad when I see an especially big pack of cars (I ride a cyclocross bike).


To avoid it would mean a 10km increase in my trip and I am very lazy to get up earlier for the extra 10km.

Man, I wish my commute was longer . it's about 3.5 miles each way. I could take the scenic route, I suppose, but I procrastinate, so I leave the house with pretty much only the time I need to get there.


Who can say when you'll pedal off this mortal coil.

Now, that's pretty poetic too! I like that. has the air of a signature line, but (no offense) it is a little morbid.

--alex.

The last thing I'd worry about is the semis. Those drivers are great. If you have at least a couple of meters of pavement between you and the white line, then you should be ok.

Visibility is your ally at all times, of course, so a screaming-yellow jacket, reflective material and perhaps [broken record] a daytime-visible Niterider flashing taillight [/broken record] would be good ideas.

Originally posted by mechBgon
The last thing I'd worry about is the semis. Those drivers are great. If you have at least a couple of meters of pavement between you and the white line, then you should be ok.


I agree, 9 times out of 10 these guys do a great job.

Its the blokes in small truck you need to watch out for, theyre no better than your average cager.

cheers!

Well.... several thoughts.

I would advise you to get John Forester's book "Effective Cycling". It talks about riding in traffic. Most people think that overtaking collisions are likely for cyclists (being hit from the rear). Forester found that these were very rare. I think if you read the book, it will help you develop a more accurate world view of cycling. Since reading it, I have put on about 100,000 miles and I have yet to find anything in it that Forester was really wrong about. By the way, Forester found that bicycle commuters had very low accident rates. The rates were so low that Forester could not estimate the rate accurately.

Rear view mirror - makes me feel good but is virtually no help. I mean, think about it. You are going to glance in your rear view and discern that a certain car is being driven by an inattentive driver who is going to hit you and all this from a fleeting glance at say 100 yards plus distance? I don't think that it can be done.

I have done some reading on bicycle fatalities. There are about 800 per year in the USA. 80% of the fatalities involved a motor vehicle. About 50% of the fatalities occurred at night (I bet the rider was not using lights). About 30% of the fatalities were children. When I looked over the figures, I estimated that reasonably serious adult cyclists made up only about 30% of the fatalities. The fatalities were also broken down by time of day and day of week. I would think that the majority of bicycle miles in the USA are ridden by club riders on Sat and Sun mornings. Interestingly enough, there was no increase in cycling fatalities for those two days. So the fatalities suffered during club rides on weekends were so low as to be indistinguishable from background noise. Statistically speaking a cyclist is at half the risk for a fatal accident per hour as a motorist. Given the fact that the majority of cycling deaths seems to be from rookies (from my looking at statistics and Forester's figures), I believe that reasonably competent club riders have fatality rates of about one tenth that of motorists per hour or maybe even lower. This suggests that you would be SAFER on your commute on your bike than in a car.

Now when I ride, I DON'T FEEL SAFER. So how can this be? Well first off highway fatalities often involve drinking. Few people cycle drunk - they crash and burn before they kill themselves. Secondly, a large number of highway fatalities involve falling asleep at the wheel - cyclists don't do this much either. Another thing, is cyclists don't feel safe. If someone comes close to me when I am riding, it scares me and makes me more alert. I tend to be more alert and careful on my bike than when I am driving. I think I am probably safer on my bike then driving a car and I am a pretty safe driver (never had an accident).

But you are the one who has to live with this. If you don't feel comfortable, don't do it.

I agree with what Pat said, i also have Effective Cycling and find it helpful, just ignore the rants. :-)

I have to disagree with the mirror issue though. I am NOT saying that it should replace a head turn to see what is behind you. But I find it invaluable to watch traffic behind me. Sort of as a early warning system. However, Pat does bring up a point about mirrors that I have found with my experience. In heavy traffic, it is impossible to watch every car with your rearview mirror, as you would have to be constantly looking at it to judge the intentions of each car. So yes, it is somewhat ineffective in heavy traffic, but effective to the point of helping the cyclists keep an 'eye' on traffic behind. In light traffic, I find it usefull, as I said, for early warning. In Canada most cars now (except for the really old ones) have day running lights. You can see those waaaaay back. I can use my mirror to 'judge' the car. Is it weaving, moving out to pass, speeding, is the passanger side window open with a 2x4 sticking out, etc. All of this takes under 2 seconds for me to determine, plus I glance several times in the mirror to 'judge' the car, as it gets close I turn my head to give my 'communication' to the driver that I know he/she is there and as a good look to see what it is doing.

I also ride in the centre of the road (with light traffic), and use my mirror to see the cars then i move over to the right. Riding in the centre makes me more visible, and the movement indicates that I know a car is behind me. Of course, you cannot ride in the middle of the road in heavy traffic, and I rely on my communication to the driver.

I guess it is the same thing as a rearveiw mirror in your car. You don't (or shouldn't) use mirrors to turn or change lanes, you turn to look. But helps the driver ascertain what is happening behind, and monitoring traffic conditions.

I do admit that it may be somewhat of a psycological effect of having a mirror makes me feel safer. That's fine, if it's all in my mind, but I do not feel safe when I ride a bike without one. All my bikes, except my MTB bike, have mirrors, and I won't ride a bike on road without one.

Originally posted by Pat
By the way, Forester found that bicycle commuters had very low accident rates. The rates were so low that Forester could not estimate the rate accurately.

This brings up a good point. When someone refers to cycling as being dangerous, they are talking about statistics that include little Billy riding no handed on the gravel alley and Frankie doing wheelies down the stairs. One could say driving is dangerous if they were to include stock car racing accidents in a driving safety study. When a cyclist is riding properly and defensively, there is little reason an accident should occur.

When I was commuting regularly (I've since moved farther from work), I found that drivers gave me more respect at night than in the daytime, due to the high visibility of several blinkies in the rear, and one or two reflective triangles.

I agree that a mirror is essential just to give you a heads up on what's behind you. You still need to shoulder check. I use the glasses mounted Third-eye, so I can use it with all my bikes, and I think it's a great accessory.

On a two lane highway I also just get off the pavement if there's a semi behind. Tthere should be enough room for cars and light trucks, but the big ones just don't have enough space for it to be safe to get around you, with oncoming traffic.

Originally posted by mechBgon
The last thing I'd worry about is the semis. Those drivers are great. :confused: You must have better truck drivers in your state than I do.I'd say 75% of the bad experiences I've had while riding were because of trucks.I love roadcycling,but I only ride roads with at least 4 lanes if trucks are involved.Most will move over.Many don't know or care about the vacuum affect as they fly by if they can't move over into another lane.I sometimes ride 2 lane highways early Sunday mornings because there are not many trucks out then.But thats when I have had my worst experiences with truckdrivers playing 'games' cause there no witnesses!And they are gone before you can even think about a license plate number.

Originally posted by cyc
I agree, 9 times out of 10 these guys do a great job.


This reminds me of one of my threads from last year. No doubt this was one of the 1 out of 10.
http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?s=&threadid=6918&highlight=tractortrailer

Originally posted by hillyman
:confused: You must have better truck drivers in your state than I do.I'd say 75% of the bad experiences I've had while riding were because of trucks.I love roadcycling,but I only ride roads with at least 4 lanes if trucks are involved.Most will move over.Many don't know or care about the vacuum affect as they fly by if they can't move over into another lane.I sometimes ride 2 lane highways early Sunday mornings because there are not many trucks out then.But thats when I have had my worst experiences with truckdrivers playing 'games' cause there no witnesses!And they are gone before you can even think about a license plate number.

Well, in the first place, I used to do highway rides of up to 75 miles, often at night (from Spokane to Pullman or vice versa), starting with a tepid 2.4W Union halogen dynamo light and lots of reflectors on my Cannondale panniers. Whether day or night, the semi drivers treated me like fine china. If I rode within 6 feet of the white line, they would actually pull into the far lane of the two-lane highway when possible, to avoid suctioning me. They would dim their headlights when they identified my little headlight as belonging to a human, and sometimes they'd even dim their headlights when overtaking me from behind. So I'm very appreciative of the professional drivers around our region.

I actually wanted to get the suction effect off the semis, so when I spotted one overtaking (helmet mirror invaluable here), I would get as far to the right as possible, so they wouldn't swing out to the other lane to avoid blasting me. Then I would duck into their wake right after they passed... zooooom! :)

The shoulder on Highway 195 is a full lane wide, and that's the kind of highway riding that I like best. Narrow shoulders, or no shoulders, would give me concerns.

The shoulder on Highway 195 is a full lane wide, and that's the kind of highway riding that I like best.
I was thinking, that is a beautiful road. I used to ride the highway between Moscow and Palouse quite a bit. Have you ever ridden that? Hairy man. But I also love to "truck surf".

I don't remember ever making it to Palouse, but I do remember going down that gorge to the river... now what's the name of that... the WSU rowing team houses their racing boats down there. And I did ride from Pullman to the old Lewiston Grade and go down and up that, what fun! :)

Wawawai, classic training ride from Pullman. And yep, you get to watch the sweaty girls race up and down the river. Pullman/Moscow has turned out some good riders, including one pro - but I don't remember his name. The top riders frequently rode from Pullman, down the Lewiston grade and up Wawawai. I don't know what the grade on Wawawai is but, with the ever present wind, it is brutal - as you know. That stretch along the river sure is pretty though.

I try to ride in places and on roads which add as little tension to my ride as possible. Were I in your circumstance, I think I'd opt not to ride the stretch of road you describe.

The other replies to your post make a lot of sense too. I just think I'd lose too much of the benefit of the fun part of riding were I to ride regularly where I was worried, fearful or tense.

Originally posted by goodcatjack
Now, that's pretty poetic too! I like that. has the air of a signature line, but (no offense) it is a little morbid.

Stolen, if memory serves, from Hamlet who lacking a bike shuffled rather than pedaled.

Another comment in defense of truckers who, taken as a whole, get a bum rap. The problem lies in the trucks, which are larger and heavier and consequently have fewer options when encountering bicycles. ***** happens... it isn't necessarily intentional or overtly negligent.

Well, I wrote a long response to everyone's comments, but then I hit the "back" button to check something and it was gone when I came back. So here's the short version.

Thanks for the advice. I probably will not be riding to the state park. I don't like semi surfing and traffic's too heavy. The shoulder is wide but gravel, and the lanes are not wide enough for cars to pass without going into the opposite lane. There are no other routes for me to ride. My only option would be to ride the gravel along the edge of the grass where it is smooth and thinner. Does anyone know of glass proof mt. bike tires?

I'm thinking of buying a cheap bike to leave at the park, because it has a 2 mile long, very hilly, very swervy road running through it that has a 15mph speed limit. I could have fun doing laps, or ride to a picnic site for lunch. I'll take it where I can get it.

Clay

Originally posted by Oxymoron
My only option would be to ride the gravel along the edge of the grass where it is smooth and thinner. Does anyone know of glass proof mt. bike tires?

I cycled from D.C. to Pittsburgh, PA, and back along the C&O Towpath and Great Allegheny Passage. Altogether 1500 km. The surface was the stone dust and fine gravel.

I was prepared to deal with numerous flats on the tour, but we had only 3 flats for 3 bicycles. The tires were 26 x 2.1

All 3 flats happened when my spouse cycled into the new stone crumbles, which fell from a rock after the rain. These crumbles resembled needles. I could reduce it to one flat, but twice I did not notice a thin stone "needle" stuck in the tire knob.

Generally I was surprised how well the tires of our GIANT hybrids withstand the surface.

As for the road: try to obtain a new map of your area and analyze it carefully. There are 2 cities: one, which is known to drivers, and the second, which is known to cyclists.

There must be some obscure asphalt path, which is forsaken by motorists. But which will suit you handsomely.

Do not buy a cheap bike. Better buy good locks. The heavy lock you may keep at work. When you cycle on a nice bike you feel yourself better. A good bike lasts very long time.

You need 2.1 tires to negotiate the gravel, if you have to. I had some bad experiences with thinner (1.75) tires, especially when crossing rails and climbing curbs, while commuting.

Originally posted by Alexey

As for the road: try to obtain a new map of your area and analyze it carefully. There are 2 cities: one, which is known to drivers, and the second, which is known to cyclists.

There must be some obscure asphalt path, which is forsaken by motorists. But which will suit you handsomely.


The funny thing about Iowa is that only major highways heavily travelled back roads are paved. Everything else is gravel; deep thick gravel one can barely control a car on. Other equally rural states like Indiana seem to have every back road paved. I don't know what the difference is.

There is one good little-used asphalt road I could ride, but it would add 6-7 miles to my ride and would still require substantial highway riding to get to this road. And of course the few who do drive this road know it well and go 80 mph up and down the hills for the thrill of it.

It's ironic I have to go the direction I do, because if I went north or south out of town I could bike easily. And SW of town is an Amish settlement so the roads have good shoulders for their horse and buggies. But not on the path I would have to take. If I end up working there for a while I will probably move closer. Still won't be able to bike, but could maybe walk or cut down on my driving distance.

I'll probably still bike on occasional nice days from where I'm at now, but will use the shoulder and big tires.

Clay

your best bet is to get a life insurance, and the benficiary should be your love one's, if you don't have any then I won';t mind you making me, your benificiary and I will be forever gratefull to you:D :D :beer: :D :beer:

If there is an asphalt road, you will switch from gravel shoulder on asphalt anyway, sooner or later. So it is important to be visible.

Walking is also an option. Besides you may listen to MP3 player, while walking some sections.

You may read a very good material on commuting at
Ken Kifer's site (http://www.kenkifer.com)

A lot of people die from cardiovascular conditions, cancers, suicides, infections, etc. These are the main killers.

based on how you described it, i'd find a safer route or get a set of rollers. sorry, i know it's not what you want to hear. but dying sux.

Clay,

I am familiar with the area. I am assuming by your description that you will be biking to Kent Park.

There is a back road option that shouldn't add any distance to your route, just hills. If you take the IWV road to Ivy Ave that will get you directly to Tiffin. From there it is only a mile or two to Kent Park.

If you have the patience to wait for another year, they should have a multiuse trail that gets you pretty close to Tiffin. I will bet that next summer that will be completed from 12th Ave Coralville to Tiffin.

How do you feel about riding on the IWV? With the landfill, there is a lot of truck traffic, and whenever I drive it, there is always some hick on my tail who wants to do 70 mph. I would have to ride IWV for 3.5 miles to get to the road to Tiffin. I have in the past come over a hill on that road at 55 mph and found a biker there. Because there is no shoulder the biker couldn't go anywhere, and there happened to be a car coming at us. All I could do was slam on my brakes and pray. It was nerve wracking for us all, and nobody was doing anything wrong.

I also measured the road from Tiffin to Kent Park, and it's 3.5 miles. That would be about 15-20 minutes I suppose. Even with a bike trail to Tiffin I will have to get up my nerve for the highway part of the ride.

Thanks for the heads-up on the trail. I never hear about that stuff. I bought a map, but it wasn't very complete, and focused mostly on rail-to-trails. Do you know of any good map sources? Without actually riding all of them, I can't ever figure out what has been merely planned and what has been completed.

Clay

I sometimes try to follow a different route on my commute. More often than not these detours bring me nothing.

But sometimes I discover a nice shortcut or a quiet street. It is never perfect, as the steel boxes on wheels infested practically everything. But this technique does work.