General Cycling Discussion - Kicked out of Carl's Jr!?

Ugh, well, today sucked! I took my bike for a spin today, and decided to eat at the local Carl's Jr, about 8 miles away. Anyhow, my bike was very clean, and dry, so i decided to take the bike into the store while i ate, there was only about 5 other people in the place, as it was close to 9:00pm.

So, i pushed my bike into a back corner, where nobody was, and then went to wait inline to order, when i was inline, the manager came out and told me i couldnt have my bike in the store. I told him that it was clean, and dry, and that i dont dare leave it outside not locked up, they didnt have bike locks anyhow.

He decided to take it upon himself to put my bike outside, as soon as i saw him pushing my bike to the door and went and took it away from him, i told the guy i would be only a few minutes then on my way. But he wouldnt hear it, he insisted the bike stay outside.

Well, i decided to go accross the street and eat at Taco Bell (UGH!)...

So my question is, do you take your bike into fast food places? When i go on small (under 20 miles) rides in the city, i dont take my lock, as it weighs ~6lbs. Personaly, i dont want to risk loosing my $1K+ bike when eating $4 of food.

When ever I'm planning on stopping on a ride, I take a lock with me. You could pick up a Krypto. cable lock for under $20 and carry that on the trips where the bike will be in sight.

In the rare case I am on a ride and someone wants to stop and I don't have a lock, I do the following:
-Keep the bike in sight at all times
-Loop my helmet strap through the front or rear wheel and the frame, or connect two or more bikes w/ the helmets. The longer it takes someone to deal with this, I can be outside stopping them from getting away.
-If I'm riding a bike with gears, have the chain in the small cog and small chainring. After I'm parked, shift both levers to the large cog and chainring positions. No one can get away when the bike is trying to shift through that range.

Basically, make a quick get away impossible. However, I still say always lock your bike.

By the way, I vote for Taco Hell over Carl Jr's!!! :)

Unfortunately, Joe, what is obvious common sense to us cyclists seems to totally escape the average **** sapiens. For this, we cannot blame them, as they have not entered the privileged realm of cycling. BUT...

I would complain to the district manager. Come off as intelligent, patient and patriotic (that ought to do it). Throw around some well-known names, like "Lance Armstrong" and "Abraham Lincoln" (Abe usually helps any given situation). Be understanding, but genuinely hurt!

I bet soon we'll see bike racks at Carl Jr's!

(in a pig's eye!) :eek:

Seriously, some good news: I went to pay a water bill today on my bike. Being the bold f**t that I am, I brought baby in the building with me, right up to the counter. The beautiful Nubian princess behind the glass said, "I see you guys up and down College Ave. all the time!" I almost fainted from her dazzling charm!
Well, lemme say, we (baby and I) walked outta there with our heads held high!

(Applause, applause!) :cool:

MMMMMMM! You handled that very well. I do agree if you are taking it anywhere take a lock or set it up that makes it hard to get away. I applaud you for holding back. I would have been all over that manager. Pull up to the drive thru, that drives them nuts.

Plain and simple. Just boycott the place, and ask everyone you know to do the same. Let's see how clever this guy really is.

Chris

You can also try and write letters to "Town Talk" newspapers. the free local ones. We will change their mind. If that fails get your friends to go over and take up parking spaces while you take turns going in. One space per bike during a heavy time ought to attract some attention.

I agree with Hunter, go through the drive-thru. You get the strangest looks sometimes!

Agree with all of the above, but I sometimes get caught short too, if I didn't intend to make a stop. I've never had a problem at the bank, or credit union taking the bike inside, but havn't tried too many other places. I've seen a few signs on fast food places, Wendy's is one, that say no bikes at the drive through window. I remember riding many extra kilometres one day looking for a place where I could get an ice cream cone without losing sight of my bike. I finally had to settle for the infamous McD's, because I could see the bike from the counter. It still didn't feel right to leave my bike out there.

One other thing you can do is pop the front wheel off and take it inside with you. With a quick release it's about a 30 second operation.

Tribob - love the filling up the parking lot idea. That should teach them!

Sorry to hear that, Joe. The store manager wasn't very diplomatic. Then again, if he had better people skills, he/she probably wouldn't be making just over minimum wage and still be called a "manager".

Well, Guys, as natural as it may seem to us, bringing a bike into a resturaunt, store, or other business isn't normal and isn't socially acceptable unless you are visiting some really earthy wholeistic '70's wanna-be establishment. heck, it probably isn't even legal.

There would be a valid argument that in many businesses, a bicycle creates a fire escape hazard.

Another valid argument would be that the bike takes up space dedicated for customers.

More basically and perhaps more importantly, it makes the owner look like a nut and nobody wants to be around a potential nut in these modern times. Having a nut in a hamburger shop 'aint good for business if you know what I mean.

I have heard that cowboys often felt the same about their horses as we sometimes feel about our bikes. They would fall in love with their horses and felt that "any place good 'nuff fer me is good 'nuff fer ma horse!". Some even prefered to sleep outside with their horse rather than inside a hotel.

I lock my bike right outside the resturaunt window where I will be eating. This is the joy of the fast-food resturaunt - BIG windows. If you see somebody stealing your machine, THEN go nuts.

I have a better idea. You should contact you local advocacy group and pick a time to get as many cyclists as possible to park their bikes inside the place, and immediately order the most expensive thing on the menu.

If anyone complains about the bikes, you should all then turn around and walk straight out without paying a cent (if you haven't eaten the meal they can't do a thing to stop you).

The management seems to take delight in being undiplomatic, so fight fire with fire!

Chris

I just follow One Rule, if your establishment is not bike friendly , I am not your customer or "guest", I don"t like what happen to you Joe", imagine the resto manager picking up you bike and putting it outside, if I were in your shoes, I would immediately leave the place, and give him the "F..You "word but good for you and you left the place and didn't say any word on the nasty manager, your still civilized..

Originally posted by mike
Sorry to hear that, Joe. The store manager wasn't very diplomatic. Then again, if he had better people skills, he/she probably wouldn't be making just over minimum wage and still be called a "manager".
This is probably the most important reason you had trouble. I never cease to be amazed at the lack of business acumen posessed by some managers and entrepeneurs who could be attracting cyclists to their businesses by providing secure bike parking at their establishments. At the very least, it would give them the appearance of being progressive, even if no customers ever used the facilities. Compared to the cost of auto parking, the expense would be negligible.

Well, Guys, as natural as it may seem to us, bringing a bike into a resturaunt, store, or other business isn't normal and isn't socially acceptable unless you are visiting some really earthy wholeistic '70's wanna-be establishment.
Normal? No. Socially acceptable? I thought we cyclists survived by going against "social acceptability." I've seen bikes in grocery stores, government buildings, and even my own workplace.

heck, it probably isn't even legal.
I would like to see that law. If it exists, there are a lot of criminals loose in our country.

There would be a valid argument that in many businesses, a bicycle creates a fire escape hazard.
A "valid" argument? The same argument could be made for shopping carts, or the way businesses lay out their merchandise in a cluttered way that forces people to pass every possible piece of junk before they can find what they are really looking for. But that would hinder normal business operations.

Another valid argument would be that the bike takes up space dedicated for customers.
Excuse me! What am I? Chopped liver? Cars in the parking lot take up thousand of square yards. Ten percent of all land area in the USA is paved. I guess if we added space for bikes, we'd all be pushed into the ocean.

More basically and perhaps more importantly, it makes the owner look like a nut and nobody wants to be around a potential nut in these modern times. Having a nut in a hamburger shop 'aint good for business if you know what I mean.
No comment.

I have heard that cowboys often felt the same about their horses as we sometimes feel about our bikes. They would fall in love with their horses and felt that "any place good 'nuff fer me is good 'nuff fer ma horse!". Some even prefered to sleep outside with their horse rather than inside a hotel.
Yeah, but they HUNG horse thieves.

I lock my bike right outside the resturaunt window where I will be eating. This is the joy of the fast-food resturaunt - BIG windows. If you see somebody stealing your machine, THEN go nuts.
Now that's the most reasonable thing I've heard yet. ;)

Joe, I think you should be able to park the damn bike in the restaurant! I mean, shoot, it's not like it's drippin with mud or dung or something awful!

Anyway, I agree with Mike and y'all, the restaurant manager probably had an overzealous bug of manageritus, and probably new to the whole managing thing. He probably didn't know any better but to throw his weight around, and didn't think he was doing a diservice to you. I know coz a while back ago, I used to work in retail hell, and thought that our main concern was to make profit for the business, and not to provide customer service. Of course, I learned after awhile it's just better to give whatever the customer wants because of the following:

1. The corporate office almost ALWAYS backs up the customer.
2. It'll make life a LOT easier to make the customer's life easier...less stress for the establishment.
3. It's the customer, not stupid enforcement of rules, that pays for the Carl's Jr's manager's paycheck.

That said, I think your best recourse is to contact the District Manager, and then continue to work your way if the District Manager does not give you an acceptable resolution. Not to mention, it'll be good for someone to teach that kid good customer service.

Hey, there's always hope, a friend of mine used to work as a Carl's Jr. Manager, and he told me that they used to call him "NeoNazi Manager" coz he was so darn uptight about everything. I think he learned his lesson, because his management style is nothing like his previous life at Carl's! :)

Btw, here's their comment form: http://www.carlsjr.com//express_yourself/express_yourself.html

Good luck!

--Sussette

Oh, Sussette, that's cool. Let's all send a message to Carl Jr. Better yet, let's find out where the heck Carl Sr. is and tell on junior!

This situation reminds me of the old American Express "do you know me?" commercials where famous people have unrecognized faces.

That manager probably had no idea that he was talking to THE Joe Gardner of BikeForums.com. THE man himself.

If he had known, he would have polished your bike and given you extra fries - maybe even given you the Big soda cup even if you only paid for a medium.

Maybe it's time for you to start using your clout, my friend. Time to start throwing around the "BF.com" word. MMhmm.

In Winnipeg, we're going to get a Mountain Equipment Co-op store, which is a large outdoor outfitting company with stores in several other cities. They also have an extensive mail order operation.

They are very progressive, using recycled materials, locating in areas of the city that need renewal etc. They said in their press release that they wouldn't have any parking for cars, encouraging the use of alternate forms of transportation.

I emailed them to ask if they would have bike parking. Within three days (it was over the Easter weekend), I received two emails back from them describing their bike parking policy. They will have bike racks, off the sidewalk, monitored by video with loaner locks available if you don't have one. For the employees, they have indoor bike parking and showers.

Now that's a bike friendly company, which I support now and probably will even more so when they open up here.

aerobat, Give them our best regards and "Thumbs-up"

Their place, their rules. There are some dog lovers out there that do not understand why their pooch can't come into the restaurant.

I been refused service at a McD's drive through, also for no good reason, but whattayagointado?

As a fellow biker, I'm with Joe and all who don't think brining a bike inside should be unusual.

Still, we all have to choose our fights wisely.

For you cats on the west coast like LA, the fight may be easier and may be worth fighting.

Notice that Joe lives in Utah. Was Buford Pusser from Utah? You get the point

Seriously Joe, if some bastard manager at a fast food place touched anything on me or of mine, I would break the connecting bone.

I never have problems though. Heck, where i live, you dont dare leave your bike unattended. I take mine in line with me. They never say anything.

Monkey Spud,

He he...if you look like you're going to break somebody's connecting bone...I can see why they wouldn't mess with you!!!

haha! (Y)

Originally posted by Oscar
Their place, their rules. There are some dog lovers out there that do not understand why their pooch can't come into the restaurant.

I been refused service at a McD's drive through, also for no good reason, but whattayagointado?


Continue to raise the issue. Tell everyone you know and get it out as much as you can. Not conform and just let it go. Not turning a blind eye because that's just the way it is. As questions and demand answers. Last but not least as it goes with this topic protect your property. That is what you do!

Yeah, but...

If everone aggressively protected pet "rights" (pets, bikes, loud motocycles at night, cigars, luggage space in airplanes), this would be a society of buttheads. We're close to that enough as it is.

Part of live is losing a few times, unfortunately.

Losing a race, fight, bet, that kind of stuff is acceptable, but a penis envy manager with a 6 foot stick in his butt isnt acceptable. If they arent going to have a bike rack outside of their establishment, then they either need to let the biker inside WITH his/her bike or allow the biker through the drivethrough (which they NEVER do).

Originally posted by Oscar
If everone aggressively protected pet "rights" (pets, bikes, loud motocycles at night, cigars, luggage space in airplanes), this would be a society of buttheads. We're close to that enough as it is.

But Oscar, we ARE a society of buttheads! It's a question of whose butt gets ahead. :beer:

I suppose that's why I stick to my cave and eat dandelions. Cheers.

That manager was a butt nugget, no, he is THE butt nugget. I've gone through drive throughs before and they usually ignore me, so I have to go inside. Now, if they don't like my bike inside, then why I ask, won't they give me service in the drive through?? huh? That usually stumps them(managers).
More people have pets than have bikes, and bikes don't attack people(only ticked off cyclists). But dogs, everybody has one, and they attack people every chance they get and people torture them, that is wrong, so dog owners wouldn't have much ground to argue on. Cyclists on the other hand... huh huh. We can't take our bikes inside, we can't use the drive through, and most places don't even have bike racks.And, bikes aren't(sad but true) living things so(to dunder heads) they can't be tortured, and they don't(as I mentioned before) attack people. So we have a lot of ground to argue with. And we have to get our butts ahead, because ours are more shapely :beer:

You tell em! The next one that pisses you off you should give them an example of the meaning of your name!!

hehe..

Joe and all, check out the comment I submitted to Carl Jr.'s via the feedback form provided by Technogirl.

Just for fun, let's blitz 'em with these kinds of messages.

The Carl's Jr. comment line is http://www.carlsjr.com//express_you...s_yourself.html

Here is what I wrote (Joe, I took the liberty of using your name as you had so boldly posted it on bikeforums.com):


"I travel often and usually like to go to Carl Jr. restaurants whenever possible. Mmm, I love your burgers and your fries are absolutely tops!

HOWEVER, I was disturbed when a friend of mine named Joe Gardner told me that he received shabby treatment by the manager at your Highland, Utah location.

Apparently, there were no bicycle parking facilities at that Carl Jr. location and my friend, riding on a very expensive bicycle, brought his clean, unobtrusive bicycle into the thinly populated restaurant while he ordered his meal (with great anticipation of some quality food, I should add).

The management gave my friend the absolute bum's rush, escorted from the restaurant, and was treated so callously as to make me lose my enthusiasm for the Carl JR’s corporation.

Coincidentally, Mr. Gardner is a very well known leader of the bicycling community throughout the USA. As bicyclists, his experience of such shabby treatment has become a subject of conversation, e-mail, and electronic postings throughout the USA and as far reaching as Australia, Hong Kong, and England.

While it may seem of little consequence to your organization, this kind of discrimination is alarming to many bicyclists.

I would appreciate a response from you advising whether bicyclists at other Carl Jr. locations can expect to be so unwelcome or was this an isolated incident?"


Anyway, maybe I can get Joe some free coupons for Carl Jr.'s or at least better treatment if he ever goes back.

Mike, thanks man, i actualy sent off my comment to Carls a few days ago, thanks technogirl!

I didnt include much in my comments, however i did include a link to this thread, and asked them to email me back with there bicycle policy.

Good idea mike.. I mouthed off a bit to them as well =]

Mike -

That was great feedback. It covered everything in a thoughtful, intelligent way while pointing out important things that will get the business owner's attention - i.e. lots of bicycling customers know about this bad treatment and won't be spending their $$$ at your place.

Mike,

This Internet is powerful, eh?

I gave'em a piece of my mind just a few minutes ago!! I hope they go outta business. I think I'm going to make a "anti Carl Jr's" website and club.

If many of us post about this on their site, that should help.

I think CKE would be very interested in developing better relationships with cycling customers. I'm pretty sure the manager you encountered does not display the corporate face well. I'm sure that Carl's Jr - and Hardee's and Taco Bueno - could be educated to see the benefit of making their facilities more accesible to the cycling and eating community.

Jonathan

Carl's Jr sucks.

Chris

Yes, when I did send them my email, I TRIED to be positive by starting out my email with, "I really like some of your food." Sorry, Joe, couldn't blatently lie, there...some of their food just plain "blows"! However, I did tell them that I was disappointed with the way that they had treated a fellow Joe...hopefully, someone will listen to our complaints! :)

I've never taken a bike into a restaurant before, but always take a lock. While I uphold my fellow cyclists' right to bring their bikes into establishment, it makes me feel a little odd.

At first, when I read this post, I thought, of course they got upset.

Then, I thought about their most likely reasons for being averse to allowing bikes inside:

1. Dirty tires
2. Space taken by the bike

But, would they kick out a stroller or a wheelchair, or do they make everyone take off their shoes when they enter? No, and these all touch the same outdoor surfaces that bike tires do.

The space is no more than a laden stroller or a wheelchair.

Jonathan

Hey joe!!! the Carl Jr's feedback site emailed me, I need the street and address of the Carl Jr's you went to. :beer:

fubar, could you forward that email to me? or even post the contents here, i'll get the street address tomarro.

Never take "NO" for an answer from somebody that doesn't have the authority to say "YES".

I always have a cable lock with me and always try to tie up my bike where it will be visible while I'm inside a place. But if what happened to you, Joe, happened to me, I know one thing, I'd never go back to that place, and I would make a point of spreading the word.

I was lucky to always be able to park my bike by my desk at work; and it pleases me whenever I see a bike inside a business place--Barnes and Noble here in town is one.

I cannot see that a bike would pose a "fire exit hazard" any more than a wheelchair or another shopping cart.

I wonder how much anti-bike behavior stems from jealousy.

Here is what the email siad:


Dear Mr. Brown,
First of all, I would like to apologize for the situation you experienced at
Carl's Jr. You are correct that we fell very short on our customer service.
We apologize for the inconvenience we have caused you.

I would like to follow up on this right away. Could you please tell me the
location of the Carl's Jr. in question? I need the city and street address.

Thank you. I look forward to hearing back from you.
Sincerely,

Erin Alden
CKE Guest Services.


Do you want me to post what I put in the comment box??

Man, I didn't get the address, but it's the only Carl's Jr in American Fork, Utah.

I actually went back to the Carl's Jr today for dinner, without my bike, I decided to go in and sit down to eat, rather then the drive thru, the guy who escorted me out last time wasn't there, im wondering if this guy wasn't the manager? I should have been a bit more controversial (contentious?) when it all happened, I guess I was a wimp, or just too nice...

I would hate to get somebody fired over this, I would however like to see more fast food places bike friendly. Letting bikes (clean / dry) inside, or even nice available bike racks.

And yes, I would be very interested to read what you put in the comment box. :)

Hi Joe,

if you were to put in your complaint, you needn't mention the person's name if you're worried they'd get the sack...the company should take on the complaint regardless...

We don't get branches of Carl's Jr over here in the UK, are they like a burger joint???

Rich

Here's what I put in the comment box. :eek:
Comments:

My buddy, Joe Gardner,went in to one of your restuarants recently, and
because didn't have a bike lock and the Carl Jrs didn't have a
bike rack, he brought his bike with him. Now, the bike wasn't dirty, and
Joe put in a corner where is wouldn't be conspicuous. But the manager of
that particular branch took it upon himself to remove Joe's bike. This is an outrage, what do you want Joe to do with his bike?? You make no provisions for him to lock it up, and by the by, his bike cost 1000+
dollars.I think this is discrimination. By the managers actions he was saying"cyclists are not welcome". If this is so, you should have all your branches post"no cyclist" signs on the front of their doors.

Check this out...



Dear Mr. Brown,
Thank you for getting back to me with the store location.

Please be advised that I have forwarded a copy of your comments to the
District Manager responsible for this area. Follow-up action will be made
with the General Manager and crew regarding your observations. They are
being taken seriously and will be addressed.

If I can be of further assistance, please contact me.

Sincerely,

Erin Alden
CKE Guest Services.

That is awesome, thanks mr brown, er, fubar :)

Leave it to BF.com members to get things taken care of!!! :beer: