Classic & Vintage - schwinn paramount help--50th anniversary model

Found this today. Schwinn Paramount 50th Anniversary. I'm unsure of the heritage; the frame is not marked as to frame tubing; I have yet to find a serial number. I know just enough about Paramounts to be dangerous. I'm aware some later models were built by National/Panasonic in Japan; some are from Waterford, and some from Chicago (feel free to correct me on any of this). The rear dropouts on this frame are Shimano; and the component mix as found was eclectic enough to make me think the bike was either upgraded or sold as a frame and then equipped by the buyer. It's a nice frame, though it has some paint/rust issues. It doesn't look like the Japanese ones to my untutored eye; all of those I've seen had a kind of candy sprinkle paint job and were marked "PDG" all over.

I tend to figure out stuff after I run into it, so any help would be appreciated, and I admit to having enough Schwinn knowledge to seperate a Paramount from a Caliente, but not much more. Some of the posters here are quite expert on this stuff. Thanks in advance. There are a few more pics on the "catch of the day" thread, mostly of the aforementioned rust issues, so if you need more/better ones, let me know.

50th ann were 1987, approximately. made by waterford, of real Columbus (I thought that they were all made of SLX, and the steering tube on mine is rifled, but waterford put on an SL sticker when they painted it, so, well, go figure). Standard build was dura ace(7400, seven speed, downtube shifters), although you could order as a frameset, and so you see 'em with other things as well. The most desirable are the black ones with the gold forks (I have also seen a white one with the gold fittings as well), but they are all worth quite a chunk of change if they are well cared for. Yours looks to be in pretty good shape...keeper or seller?

you need to rake your lawn. probably need to call your mom as well.

1988 was the 50th anniversary for Paramounts, and in that year, all Paramounts had a 50th anniversary head badge decal. There was a special 50th anniversary edition that had gold decals and a gold plated fork. As far as I know, the components were to the customers specs.

1988 was the anniversary year (though some of the anniversary bikes were built in '87). All of the Waterford Paramounts were decaled with the anniversary logo, but the limited edition (numbered) bikes had gold forks and gold decals. They came in black, red, blue and white (at least). The regular Paramounts had silver, black and red decals depending on the color of the bike.

Bob Hufford
Springfield, MO

1988 was the anniversary year (though some of the anniversary bikes were built in '87). All of the Waterford Paramounts were decaled with the anniversary logo, but the limited edition (numbered) bikes had gold forks and gold decals. They came in black, red, blue and white (at least). The regular Paramounts had silver, black and red decals depending on the color of the bike.

Bob Hufford
Springfield, MO

My seller said '87...but the date code is, in fact, '88. I haven't ever seen a red or blue one with gold forks; I thought the white may have been a repaint, or someone just lucked into a gold plated fork. They were for real then? Do you know how many of the gold ones were made (~1400 50th anniversarys in total).

There was a 1988 50th anniversary Paramount on eBay, and the auction ended yesterday (no bids). The minimum bid price was $1499, and I came REALLY close to bidding, but aready have a Paramount and decided I don't need another one. The item number is 7195718975, and there are some good photos of it still on eBay.

The 50th anniversary Paramounts, as Luker and Bob Hufford have already said, were made at the Waterford facility and used Columbus tubes.

Attached is the 50th anniversary seat tube decal I copied from the eBay item description as well as a side view of the bike. Nice!

I heard 500 bandied about, but I really don't know. Ask Richard Schwinn at Waterford -- I'm sure he'd tell you.

Here's a red one ...

http://home.mchsi.com/~lhufford/88para50th.jpg

Bob Hufford
Springfield, MO

Oh ... and here's a nice black one with a Campy 50th group on it ...

http://home.mchsi.com/~lhufford/87para50th.jpg

More pics here (http://www.raydobbins.com/paramount/index)

Bob Hufford
Springfield, MO

yeah. I think black is my favorite, but the red look really good too. There was a black one in my size for years at the lbs. I finally screwed up my courage to buy it, went in and found that the dealer had traded it back to the schwinn rep for some crap or other, just the week before I went in to deal. I still feel covetous...

Doesn't Ray Dobbins have the sweetest bicycles?

"Yours looks to be in pretty good shape...keeper or seller?"

At 57cm, it's too small to keep. The frame looks okay, no dents, dings, or cracks, no sign of crash damage, but the paint has issues and there are some generous rust spots. Looks pretty surfacey, should clean up okay. Proceeds likely to be used to purchase some French thingee or other, given my predilictions. If it were about 62cm, no way I'd part with it. Rides purty good.

"Standard build was dura ace(7400, seven speed, downtube shifters), although you could order as a frameset"

Not this bike... 105 drivetrain, eight speed. Cinelli bars. Dia Compe Gran Compe II brakeset. 105 hubs laced w/ wheelsmith butted spokes to Mavic Open pros. Prolly sell the frame and part the bike out.

"The minimum bid price was $1499"

Good to know I didn't spend to much PHEW Dear God I love thrift stores.

"you need to rake your lawn. probably need to call your mom as well."

Leaves have barely started to fall here. I know Idaho trees are probably barren by now, but I usually don't bother to rake 'till December.

It interesting the parts everyones mentioning - I bought a Campy Century C-Record Gray Finish groupo off a 50th anniversary Paramount . I still have some of the part which were beautiful - the seapist was very impractical though beacause it was 27.4 which I think was standard on Waterfords for a while

"...it was 27.4 which I think was standard on Waterfords for a while..."

Mine has a 27.2 in it, and it seems to work okay...

"Not this bike... 105 drivetrain, eight speed. Cinelli bars. Dia Compe Gran Compe II brakeset. 105 hubs laced w/ wheelsmith butted spokes to Mavic Open pros. Prolly sell the frame and part the bike out."

Dibs on the brake calipers if that's what you decide.

yeah. That's much better than the quote function.

...If it were about 62cm, no way I'd part with it...

I found a 62cm Continental behind the thrift store the other night (didn't grab it though). Baby blue. If you want to trade, I'll see if I can grab it still. ;)

If you part it out, let us know, I'm sure most of those parts would be snatched up in short order. (What condition are those wheels in?) ;)

Oh ... and here's a nice black one with a Campy 50th group on it ...

http://home.mchsi.com/~lhufford/87para50th.jpg

More pics here (http://www.raydobbins.com/paramount/index)

Bob Hufford
Springfield, MO

thanks, man. now i have to go change my shorts. :D

There was a 1988 50th anniversary Paramount on eBay, and the auction ended yesterday (no bids). The minimum bid price was $1499, and I came REALLY close to bidding, but aready have a Paramount and decided I don't need another one. The item number is 7195718975, and there are some good photos of it still on eBay.

The 50th anniversary Paramounts, as Luker and Bob Hufford have already said, were made at the Waterford facility and used Columbus tubes.

Attached is the 50th anniversary seat tube decal I copied from the eBay item description as well as a side view of the bike. Nice!
Thank God you didn't buy it. The last 3 Anniversary Paramounts I saw on ebay went for $500-$750 range. $1500 is way too much. even for a complete bike. Keep shopping.

Tim

"Yours looks to be in pretty good shape...keeper or seller?"

At 57cm, it's too small to keep.


57? Remember your good friend Seely. I have such a hard time finding 57cm frames...

Luker.

Are you sure you didn't squeeze the 27.2 to fit I am almost sure seat tube diameter was 27.4 - anyone else care to comment. My Chicago 69 Paramount is 27.2 but my understanding is Waterford was using that 27.4 tube set the Richard Sach raves about. Eveyone know if they use two different tube set.

Luker.

Are you sure you didn't squeeze the 27.2 to fit I am almost sure seat tube diameter was 27.4 - anyone else care to comment. My Chicago 69 Paramount is 27.2 but my understanding is Waterford was using that 27.4 tube set the Richard Sach raves about. Eveyone know if they use two different tube set.

Waterfords with the Reynolds 753 all use a 27.4 seat tube. I just finished a rebuild on a 1995 1200 and it had a 27.2 in it. We had to spread the rear stay back to 27.4 and now it's OK. The 753 tubset is very light for steel.

Tim

I did not. The group was original with the bike and the DA parts were all beautiful; the only thing that I did to the setup was switch to bar-end shifters. The bike had been used as a commuter (with yellow reflective tape all over) and then on the windload trainer. The toptube finish was ruined, and so I dispatched the bike back to Waterford for a refinish. This doesn't preclude the original owner mashing the seat clamp down, but it worked pretty well, and this is usually one of those little thing I fret over...

Hey luker,

Sorry I didn't meaning anything personal just trying to learn more. It is amazing what some folks will do to get seatposts to fit. Last 2 bikes I rebuilt - one French and another Swiss were victims of this we are all fortunate that steel is real and this can be remedy with the right tools most of the time.