Why do so many mountain bikers put so much emphasis on the weight of their bicycle? Going to the extent of having a gram scale seems like the person is unsure of their capabilities. Sure, it's nice to have a bike around 21 pounds. But if you think weighing each component, and chosing the one that's lightest, don't you think you could be sacrificing structural integrity, and risking building a safer mountain bike?

It depends on the purpose of the bike. It also depends on how much that person has done to prepare for the upcoming race season. If that person has trained on a daily basis and has lost 50 pounds then it seems as if that person deserves to have a light bike. It also seems that as long as the person is able to spend money on the bike in order to make it lighter without taking food off the table it seems like you should just live and let live.

I assume that you are writing about me since I haven't seen too many other people on the mountain bike portion of this site showing new parts with the weights. I enjoy trying to make by bike as light as possible while still keeping it reliable. If that makes me (or anyone else) happy what is the problem with it?

Please research the parts that I have used. Once you find that they are unsafe for xc use please let me know. Until then don't assume that just because parts are light that they are not reliable.

Cheap, Light, Reliable - Pick any two.

Oh yeah, could you please explain to me how wanting a light bike translates to being unsure of my capabilities?

Just so you know the majority of the best cross country riders in the world are weight weenies. I guess they are unsure of their capabilities as well. :rolleyes:

It always amazes me how much nonsense you are able to post ChroMo2. Just doing a quick scan of your previous posts lets everyone know exactly how much you actually know about this sport. I know that you say that you are "experienced". Unfortunately your posts don't seem to agree with that statement.

I'm just trying to figure out which one of your posts have been the most informative.

Could it be.....
.
what kinda bikers ride cannondales? (http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=133646)
.
or could it be one of your powerful posts from this thread...... (http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=151382)
.
These are two of my favorites from that thread.
.
in order of performance gains it's the frame first! handlebar grips, gloves, pedals, crank, wheels, rear derailler, cassette, chain, front derailler, brake pads, handlebars, waterbottle.
also the stem is very important it decides how agressive you ride.
.
I think one of the best responses to your posts in the past was by never. I don't think I could get it right so I am going to have to quote him on this one.
.
Are you really being serious when you make your posts?

It always amazes me how much nonsense you are able to post ChroMo2. Just doing a quick scan of your previous posts lets everyone know exactly how much you actually know about this sport. I know that you say that you are "experienced". Unfortunately your posts don't seem to agree with that statement.

I'm just trying to figure out which one of your posts have been the most informative.

Could it be.....
.
what kinda bikers ride cannondales? (http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=133646)
.
or could it be one of your powerful posts from this thread...... (http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=151382)
.
These are two of my favorites from that thread.
.


.
I think one of the best responses to your posts in the past was by never. I don't think I could get it right so I am going to have to quote him on this one.
.I appreciate your first response, it made more sense than your other two. I'm a former street racer, and have built street racing motors by my own specifications from the studying that i have done on aftermarket applications. I've seen my designs on motors that were duplicated in HOT ROD magazine, after I applied specicific components. I'm also a trained technician and worked on military vehices in Ft. Carson Colorado. I've raced motorcycles and snowmobiles and have performed the work to make them outperform standard factory designs. If your "biffed" by my posts it's because i've actually put mysellf in the position to test vehicles that were built with aftermarket parts and i've actually machined parts that have never been seen before to use them in racing applications, and I test them, pushing the limits of exhibitionism sport riding. So basically buiding a racing bicycle is very common for me, and understanding 99% of the componentry to it's applications is second nature. I've seen a 19 pound mountain bike with fiberglass spokes. Unfortunatey the price you have to pay for that is the spokes break easily no matter how much you weigh. Would you wanna use fiberglass spokes in competition? They weigh a lot less! I wouldn't. I use Control tech seatposts. I own two of them. They don't make them anymore, it's too bad, they were of superior design. I use Selle Italia Flite saddles with titanium rails. I tried the tubular titanium instead of the solid rails. I broke a rail on a tubular seat. The seat was lighter because of it's design. Selle Italia offered to replace the rail. I thanked them and just decided to buy a new one. So maybe people can learn that if you sit around and weigh your components, your not always going to help yourself, and you might end up with a bike that's going to break. My bike weighs about 24 pounds and it does a far superior job than most hardtails. I rely on physical performance. I think it would be fun to see people post their bikes and tell us how much their bikes weigh.

I appreciate your first response, it made more sense than your other two. I'm a former street racer, and have built street racing motors by my own specifications from the studying that i have done on aftermarket applications. I've seen my designs on motors that were duplicated in HOT ROD magazine, after I applied specicific components. I'm also a trained technician and worked on military vehices in Ft. Carson Colorado. I've raced motorcycles and snowmobiles and have performed the work to make them outperform standard factory designs. If your "biffed" by my posts it's because i've actually put mysellf in the position to test vehicles that were built with aftermarket parts and i've actually machined parts that have never been seen before to use them in racing applications, and I test them, pushing the limits of exhibitionism sport riding. So basically buiding a racing bicycle is very common for me, and understanding 99% of the componentry to it's applications is second nature. I've seen a 19 pound mountain bike with fiberglass spokes. Unfortunatey the price you have to pay for that is the spokes break easily no matter how much you weigh. Would you wanna use fiberglass spokes in competition? They weigh a lot less! I wouldn't. I use Control tech seatposts. I own two of them. They don't make them anymore, it's too bad, they were of superior design. I use Selle Italia Flite saddles with titanium rails. I tried the tubular titanium instead of the solid rails. I broke a rail on a tubular seat. The seat was lighter because of it's design. Selle Italia offered to replace the rail. I thanked them and just decided to buy a new one. So maybe people can learn that if you sit around and weigh your components, your not always going to help yourself, and you might end up with a bike that's going to break. My bike weighs about 24 pounds and it does a far superior job than most hardtails. I rely on physical performance. I think it would be fun to see people post their bikes and tell us how much their bikes weigh.


Someone tell Lance Armstrong to get off his 16 lb Trek, it's unsafe! :O:O:O

So is the point of this thread to scoff at those who care what their bike weighs? Seems a little ridiculous to me.

If an XC racer has a 23 lb. bike and another who has a 21 lb. bike race, and both have equal abilities, who will win? The one with the lighter bike. I suppose if you don't want to win, then there's no point in being a weight weenie.

Someone tell Lance Armstrong to get off his 16 lb Trek, it's unsafe! :O:O:O

So is the point of this thread to scoff at those who care what their bike weighs? Seems a little ridiculous to me.

If an XC racer has a 23 lb. bike and another who has a 21 lb. bike race, and both have equal abilities, who will win? The one with the lighter bike. I suppose if you don't want to win, then there's no point in being a weight weenie.
Lance Armstrong doesnt ride a mountain bike. get real

Lance Armstrong doesnt ride a mountain bike. get real

Once again you have proven that you speak of things you know nothing about. Do a search, you will find that he has actually won some mountain bike races.

http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b148/LowCel/other%20people%20pics/armstrong99shtrk1.jpg

I appreciate your first response, it made more sense than your other two. I'm a former street racer, and have built street racing motors by my own specifications from the studying that i have done on aftermarket applications. I've seen my designs on motors that were duplicated in HOT ROD magazine, after I applied specicific components. I'm also a trained technician and worked on military vehices in Ft. Carson Colorado. I've raced motorcycles and snowmobiles and have performed the work to make them outperform standard factory designs. If your "biffed" by my posts it's because i've actually put mysellf in the position to test vehicles that were built with aftermarket parts and i've actually machined parts that have never been seen before to use them in racing applications, and I test them, pushing the limits of exhibitionism sport riding. So basically buiding a racing bicycle is very common for me, and understanding 99% of the componentry to it's applications is second nature. I've seen a 19 pound mountain bike with fiberglass spokes. Unfortunatey the price you have to pay for that is the spokes break easily no matter how much you weigh. Would you wanna use fiberglass spokes in competition? They weigh a lot less! I wouldn't. I use Control tech seatposts. I own two of them. They don't make them anymore, it's too bad, they were of superior design. I use Selle Italia Flite saddles with titanium rails. I tried the tubular titanium instead of the solid rails. I broke a rail on a tubular seat. The seat was lighter because of it's design. Selle Italia offered to replace the rail. I thanked them and just decided to buy a new one. So maybe people can learn that if you sit around and weigh your components, your not always going to help yourself, and you might end up with a bike that's going to break. My bike weighs about 24 pounds and it does a far superior job than most hardtails. I rely on physical performance. I think it would be fun to see people post their bikes and tell us how much their bikes weigh.

WOW, I guess all that makes you an expert when it comes to bikes. :rolleyes:

WOW, I guess all that makes you an expert when it comes to bikes. :rolleyes:
Thank you! it's O.K. to realize that some people making posts do have the experience and education :beer:

Like I told you when I responded to yet another one of your enlightening pm's. You are a legend in your own mind.

Lance Armstrong doesnt ride a mountain bike. get real


Pwned.

I don't know any world-class XC racers so I just used the world's most famous roadie. The exact same thing applies to them too.

Get real.

Why do so many mountain bikers put so much emphasis on the weight of their bicycle?
Mostly because we have to pedal them everywhere. When choosing between two components of roughly equal performance, weight matters. As someone with your background should understand (I'm kinda surprised you had to ask, actually) a cyclist puts out so little horsepower that small changes in both sprung and unsprung weight matter very much. Especially in racing situations.



Going to the extent of having a gram scale seems like the person is unsure of their capabilities.

No, only unsure of manufacturer's claimed weights, and their ability to guess at the weight of something by just holding it. Once again, this seems so simple as to be obvious, but for you it apparently wasn't. I'm surprised at your questioning the need for accuracy and precision, and for questioning the need for an advantage in a competition situation.


Sure, it's nice to have a bike around 21 pounds. But if you think weighing each component, and chosing the one that's lightest, don't you think you could be sacrificing structural integrity, and risking building a safer mountain bike?

Yes. With careful reading you will discover that most cyclists don't choose based on weight alone. We pick an application (like xc racing bar for a 175lb rider) and from among the qualified parts weight is one consideration in which bar we eventually buy. My all-mountain ride, at 30lbs, is not the lightest thing out there, but the parts are all about as light as they could be without me being worried that 4' drops would start to break things. (except for the hubs -coulda saved a pound by spending another $200, but I couldn't swing it).

So, if we're not sacrificing structural integrity based on our intended use, you will find that a lighter mountain bike is safer. Easier to maneuver, easier to stop, easier to accelerate and bunny hop out of situations. You'll be less fatigued riding it, which will help to avoid crashes.

Wow the weather must be crappy!

it's easy to namedrop and post pictures of things that you think are cool. That's obvious, by the name that bikers so lovingly like to drop. Even a picture of our American Hero! But there was always the man who created the bike, and there's always gonna be the next guy to build the better one. But certainly you can't beleive that the weight of the components or even the bike, is going to dictate its performance?

How is it possible for someone to type so much yet say so little? :rolleyes:

I've been watching MTB races for 6 years now, and for some reason, I've never seen a Clydesdale (200 pounds+) sport rider win the overall in the Sport class. Ya think it might be the weight?

My kid started XC racing with a 24" Specialized kid's MTB, which, at the time, weighed about as much as he did... Once he was upgraded to Hardrock Comp, he shaved at least 20 minutes off his average race time. These days he's riding a way cooler - and lighter - bike... and he's looking forward to passing LowCel :D

I've been watching MTB races for 6 years now, and for some reason, I've never seen a Clydesdale (200 pounds+) sport rider win the overall in the Sport class. Ya think it might be the weight?

My kid started XC racing with a 24" Specialized kid's MTB, which, at the time, weighed about as much as he did... Once he was upgraded to Hardrock Comp, he shaved at least 20 minutes off his average race time. These days he's riding a way cooler - and lighter - bike... and he's looking forward to passing LowCel :D

Once he gets what you told me about (no details since I don't know if he reads this forum or not) I'm sure he will have no trouble passing me. I'm sure his goals are set much higher than just beating someone like me anyway. :D

I'm looking forward to seeing how fast he is next year and for years to come. I'm sure he will be one of the fastest in the series before all is said and done. One of the benefits of being an old man is that I will at least have an excuse when the young 'un beats me.

Ended up getting him an IronHorse Triumph - it weighs WAY more than his Scalpel, but I figure it's better training to haul the extra weight around... besides, I didn't want it to fall apart on the 1st mile on the dirt road before he even gets to the hardtop! I'm also hoping he'll prefer it to his mountain board (what ever possessed me??)

it's easy to namedrop and post pictures of things that you think are cool. That's obvious, by the name that bikers so lovingly like to drop. Even a picture of our American Hero! But there was always the man who created the bike, and there's always gonna be the next guy to build the better one. But certainly you can't beleive that the weight of the components or even the bike, is going to dictate its performance?


I didn't know it was possible for anyone over the age of 13 to have a post this incoherent.

Do you think "weight weinies" go good with Hormel Chili? :crash:

it's easy to namedrop and post pictures of things that you think are cool. That's obvious, by the name that bikers so lovingly like to drop. Even a picture of our American Hero! But there was always the man who created the bike, and there's always gonna be the next guy to build the better one. But certainly you can't beleive that the weight of the components or even the bike, is going to dictate its performance?

I can and do. Acceleration=force/mass. Less mass means more acceleration. Moreacceleration is a performance characteristic. That's it. I have answered your questions, and you have not indicated that you think my specific answers were wrong. Unless you want to discuss things coherently I promise not to get drawn into another post.

I can and do. Acceleration=force/mass. Less mass means more acceleration. Moreacceleration is a performance characteristic. That's it. I have answered your questions, and you have not indicated that you think my specific answers were wrong. Unless you want to discuss things coherently I promise not to get drawn into another post.
what's wrong with you "weight weenies"? You dont factor in the most critical part! Dont be surprised that the main component in any type of racing is the man making the machine work at its peak efficiency.

i think most everyone will agree with me on this. when you start out racing a light bike is going to help you, but not make you the best. when you have been racing for a while and you are good, real good. a light bike is going to make you better.

that is why people buy/build light xc bikes.

Why do so many mountain bikers put so much emphasis on the weight of their bicycle? Going to the extent of having a gram scale seems like the person is unsure of their capabilities. Sure, it's nice to have a bike around 21 pounds. But if you think weighing each component, and chosing the one that's lightest, don't you think you could be sacrificing structural integrity, and risking building a safer mountain bike?
I have a gram scale and have used it considerably. Having a light bike only complements my capabilities and maximizes my performance. I can't afford the lightest parts and at times settle for a cheaper aftermarket part over the name brand piece. I have never had a failure due to shaving weight.Also a large part of mountain bike racing is the belief in your self, many times I have pushed the other guy just hard enough to have him doubt himself and when that happens I have defeated him.If you beleive you have a fast bike this will help a great deal.eliminating the weight on the bike takes that variable away from the equation. Total confidence in you and your ride brings the best performance. That's why
I'm a wieght weenie. and oddly enough it works.

I have a gram scale and have used it considerably.

Aren't those for drugs?

I'm a former street racer, and have built street racing motors by my own specifications from the studying that i have done on aftermarket applications. I've seen my designs on motors that were duplicated in HOT ROD magazine, after I applied specicific components. I'm also a trained technician and worked on military vehices in Ft. Carson Colorado. I've raced motorcycles and snowmobiles and have performed the work to make them outperform standard factory designs. If your "biffed" by my posts it's because i've actually put mysellf in the position to test vehicles that were built with aftermarket parts and i've actually machined parts that have never been seen before to use them in racing applications, and I test them, pushing the limits of exhibitionism sport riding.

So you admitting you're a street racer just proves you're an idiot again. I worked at a race track for a long time and saw lots of "street racers" that thought they knew what they were doing. One trip to the track revealed that they didn't. And if you had ever raced at the track, you would have a very good understanding of how weight affects ET and MPH. The same principles are true with a bike, less weight for the same given power means quicker acceleration and a higher top speed.

I've built street motors and race motors, and I've even built complete race cars. I've also made cars go faster with stock parts than other have with modified parts. What's my point...well I don't have a point, just like you when you ramble on in your posts. Who cares what else you have done when you are asking about weight issues with bikes.


So basically buiding a racing bicycle is very common for me, and understanding 99% of the componentry to it's applications is second nature.

Then you would understand that components are chosen for a reason. Are freeride or downhill guys weight weenies...no, because it would sacrifice their performance. XC and road racers generally are because weight reduction further enhances their performance. And if you haven't noticed, most lightweight XC race components are designed to take such abuse. If they weren't, competitive racers and the masses wouldn't be using them.


I've seen a 19 pound mountain bike with fiberglass spokes. Unfortunatey the price you have to pay for that is the spokes break easily no matter how much you weigh. Would you wanna use fiberglass spokes in competition? They weigh a lot less! I wouldn't.

I've seen 19lb mountain bikes with regular spokes, what's your point? If someone wants to put fibreglass spokes on their bike, what do I care? And why do you care? Obviously they felt that the spokes would work for their given application and riding style.


I use Control tech seatposts. I own two of them. They don't make them anymore, it's too bad, they were of superior design.

That's a nice story...who cares! Do you have an attention deficit disorder or something?


I use Selle Italia Flite saddles with titanium rails. I tried the tubular titanium instead of the solid rails. I broke a rail on a tubular seat. The seat was lighter because of it's design. Selle Italia offered to replace the rail. I thanked them and just decided to buy a new one.

Maybe you're too heavy or were using the saddle for something other than it was originally intended. And you know, stuff does break, parts do fail, light parts and even heavy ones.


So maybe people can learn that if you sit around and weigh your components, your not always going to help yourself, and you might end up with a bike that's going to break.

That is why you choose components based on your given application and your riding style. Like I said above, a FR/DH rider will make different component choices than an XC rider. Even various XC riders will make different choices because different things are important to each of them.

You have to be smart and choose the components designed for your riding. But any serious rider will understand that stuff is going to break. I'm not expecting anything on my bikes to last indefinitely.


My bike weighs about 24 pounds and it does a far superior job than most hardtails. I rely on physical performance.

24lbs is still pretty light, it's definitely not anywhere near heavy. So are people that ride 30lb hardtails more physically fit than you are? Do they rely on physical performance more than you do?


I think it would be fun to see people post their bikes and tell us how much their bikes weigh.

Rockhopper weighs 23-23.5lbs
Major Jake weighs 25lbs
Allez Elite weighs 22lbs
Peugeot used to weigh 30lbs
My wife's Kona Lanai weighs 31lbs, she must be a better rider than you.

I think it would be fun to see people post their bikes and tell us how much their bikes weigh.

Ellsworth Enlightenment - 20.5 lbs w/ disc brakes

Ellsworth Truth - 24.75 pounds

Independent Fabrication Ti Crown Jewel - 16.5 lbs

KHS Flite 500 - guestimating around 21 - 22 lbs This is just a winter training bike so I'm not concerned about weight, did go with lightweight wheels I had laying around though.

Of course I'm not worthy of any of them, just don't tell that to my sponsors. ;)

So you admitting you're a street racer just proves you're an idiot again. I worked at a race track for a long time and saw lots of "street racers" that thought they knew what they were doing. One trip to the track revealed that they didn't. And if you had ever raced at the track, you would have a very good understanding of how weight affects ET and MPH. The same principles are true with a bike, less weight for the same given power means quicker acceleration and a higher top speed.

I've built street motors and race motors, and I've even built complete race cars. I've also made cars go faster with stock parts than other have with modified parts. What's my point...well I don't have a point, just like you when you ramble on in your posts. Who cares what else you have done when you are asking about weight issues with bikes.




Then you would understand that components are chosen for a reason. Are freeride or downhill guys weight weenies...no, because it would sacrifice their performance. XC and road racers generally are because weight reduction further enhances their performance. And if you haven't noticed, most lightweight XC race components are designed to take such abuse. If they weren't, competitive racers and the masses wouldn't be using them.




I've seen 19lb mountain bikes with regular spokes, what's your point? If someone wants to put fibreglass spokes on their bike, what do I care? And why do you care? Obviously they felt that the spokes would work for their given application and riding style.




That's a nice story...who cares! Do you have an attention deficit disorder or something?




Maybe you're too heavy or were using the saddle for something other than it was originally intended. And you know, stuff does break, parts do fail, light parts and even heavy ones.




That is why you choose components based on your given application and your riding style. Like I said above, a FR/DH rider will make different component choices than an XC rider. Even various XC riders will make different choices because different things are important to each of them.

You have to be smart and choose the components designed for your riding. But any serious rider will understand that stuff is going to break. I'm not expecting anything on my bikes to last indefinitely.




24lbs is still pretty light, it's definitely not anywhere near heavy. So are people that ride 30lb hardtails more physically fit than you are? Do they rely on physical performance more than you do?




Rockhopper weighs 23-23.5lbs
Major Jake weighs 25lbs
Allez Elite weighs 22lbs
Peugeot used to weigh 30lbs
My wife's Kona Lanai weighs 31lbs, she must be a better rider than you.
obviously you aren't too on top of the racing thing here. You can't compare the difference between racing cars and bikes. a car has a "fixed" power output, by the design of it's motor. A bicycle is powered by the man/woman operating it and doesn't put out a constant power source as an internal combustion engine. Also you couldn't dig deep enough into your applications to touch on the subject of suspension (which is a major part of automobile racing) Also you don't realize that almost any part of a bicycle is aftermarket. And in auto racing I've went beyond aftermarket to fabricate pieces on an induction system to keep it normally aspirated for daily driving and to not cause stress on other components. I've built street racing machines before I built racing bikes. There's a whole lot more applications of theorys that apply in a motorized vehicle. The motor on a bicycle is also the operator. If you were trained well enough in your physiological being. You would be a little wiser and able to contribute to the ideas of racing, instead of lashing out with hurt feelings, because someone else has the ability to offer the objectives, that only come to you when that subject is brought up. What may seem novel to you is indelible in my past excecutions of racing, because not only have I built the machines, I've operated them. You don't see me getting upset about someones offer of their knowledge. Maybe it's a stabillity thing or even an ego thing. But that's one thing about being a hardcore racer. If your a winner you've got bragging rights, and the ego goes along with it. If this were an automotive forum, the text would get a lot more complicated, dictating numbers that pertain to things like, volumetric efficiency, and gear ratios. I like the simplicity of mountain bikes, but i'm still waiting for some more educated responses and technical jargon. I figured the racing section would be more intillectually stimulating, but it doesn't surprise me that guys with growing egos take offense when they aren't the ones to elaborate on a subject that could be more indepth. You know I don't care if you wanna pass judgement with sarcasm, obviously i'm not that unresponsive. I really would like to see racers that offer more to this forum. It's better than someone asking whats better "this or that". I'm more for advancing. Just remember, a lighter component doesn't make it better! PERFORMANCE IS BASED ON DESIGN

obviously you aren't too on top of the racing thing here. You can't compare the difference between racing cars and bikes.

You originally brought up cars and how your mastery of cars makes you a bike guru. I only brought it up again to emphasize the fact that most of your posts are pointless and incoherent.


but i'm still waiting for some more educated responses and technical jargon

Re-read all of your posts then you will understand why no one bothers to do anything but ridicule you.

You originally brought up cars and how your mastery of cars makes you a bike guru. I only brought it up again to emphasize the fact that most of your posts are pointless and incoherent.




Re-read all of your posts then you will understand why no one bothers to do anything but ridicule you.
excuse me NEVER, do you get headaches a lot?

Only when I read your posts...but the laughter makes me feel okay.

obviously you aren't too on top of the racing thing here. You can't compare the difference between racing cars and bikes. a car has a "fixed" power output, by the design of it's motor. A bicycle is powered by the man/woman operating it and doesn't put out a constant power source as an internal combustion engine. Also you couldn't dig deep enough into your applications to touch on the subject of suspension (which is a major part of automobile racing) Also you don't realize that almost any part of a bicycle is aftermarket. And in auto racing I've went beyond aftermarket to fabricate pieces on an induction system to keep it normally aspirated for daily driving and to not cause stress on other components. I've built street racing machines before I built racing bikes. There's a whole lot more applications of theorys that apply in a motorized vehicle. The motor on a bicycle is also the operator. If you were trained well enough in your physiological being. You would be a little wiser and able to contribute to the ideas of racing, instead of lashing out with hurt feelings, because someone else has the ability to offer the objectives, that only come to you when that subject is brought up. What may seem novel to you is indelible in my past excecutions of racing, because not only have I built the machines, I've operated them. You don't see me getting upset about someones offer of their knowledge. Maybe it's a stabillity thing or even an ego thing. But that's one thing about being a hardcore racer. If your a winner you've got bragging rights, and the ego goes along with it. If this were an automotive forum, the text would get a lot more complicated, dictating numbers that pertain to things like, volumetric efficiency, and gear ratios. I like the simplicity of mountain bikes, but i'm still waiting for some more educated responses and technical jargon. I figured the racing section would be more intillectually stimulating, but it doesn't surprise me that guys with growing egos take offense when they aren't the ones to elaborate on a subject that could be more indepth. You know I don't care if you wanna pass judgement with sarcasm, obviously i'm not that unresponsive. I really would like to see racers that offer more to this forum. It's better than someone asking whats better "this or that". I'm more for advancing. Just remember, a lighter component doesn't make it better! PERFORMANCE IS BASED ON DESIGN

So I guess they don't teach grammar in hot rod weekly then eh?

:(

Most car racers I have met are fat and smoke, they make for poor bike racers. I was big into the whole car racing crap for a while. I had a turbo charged Subaru Legacy. I turboed it myself. It was a 2.5 and it was fast. But by the time I had replaced pretty much every part on the car to make up for the increase in power I relized, this sucks. I was 50lbs overweight and getting older. I knew a lot about cars but I hadn't been on a bike in 5 years. I figured out fast I didn't know shat about them. The stuff you are saying doesn't apply to bikes. When stress is not a factor lighter is better, period. Now if stress becomes a factor lighter isn't better. The bike industry has found the best designs for both and there is very little you or I can add to the mix.

Once again you have proven that you speak of things you know nothing about. Do a search, you will find that he has actually won some mountain bike races.

http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b148/LowCel/other%20people%20pics/armstrong99shtrk1.jpg
ey out of theme, where did yo get that pick, is great jeje (im a mountain biker but a fan of lance :D

I just did a search on google for Lance mountain biking pictures. :D

cannondale ht 21lbs. hot rod guys are into cheap muscle... cars that are big and heavy and have tons of power. Same goes for bikes with those people.

maybe i should listen to chromos advice and do xc races on a 45# down hill bike
so that my components are more reliable

Pwned.

I don't know any world-class XC racers so I just used the world's most famous roadie. The exact same thing applies to them too.

Get real.

Trent Lowe was a world class XC racer from Australia. Of course, he left MTB racing for road racing, and spent a lot of time racing with Lance. Enough trivia though, must get back on topic.

Light weight and reliability do not have to be mutually exclusive. Case in point: The tandem pictured below weighs less than 40lbs, yet is in every way more reliable than just about any bike any of you own. That's not a boast or a challenge, just a statement of fact. Everything on there is tandem-rated for 400+lbs. And even with the DH fork, 203mm brakes, Shimano 636 pedals in back, a cro-mo stoker stem (to be replaced soon) and that ugly rack (it's gone now) it still comes in around 38lbs.

There is nothing wrong with the careful application of lightweight components. If I was racing, I would want my bike as light as possible. If you've ever had to hoist your bike to your shoulder to climb an unrideable section of trail, you'd appreciate light weight too. I won't even get into the car/bike debate, as that's just silly. And yes, I have a scale that measures in grams too. Sometimes I even use it for bike parts.

http://www.ozbikesports.com/images/tbackview.jpg

I have a weight scale as well, and I bought it primarily for weighing bike parts. I weigh everything part by part, and here is a chart that I keep for my bike.
http://img243.imageshack.us/img243/6969/image59ta1.jpg
This is the basic one actually, I have a more complicated one which would be too large to post here ;)

I guess this shows that I'm the one who is the most unsure of his capabilities... :rolleyes: (whatever that means anyway)

I guess this shows that I'm the one who is the most unsure of his capabilities... :rolleyes: (whatever that means anyway)

You aren't going to take away all of my glory now are ya? Could we possibly share the title being the most unsure? ;)

You aren't going to take away all of my glory now are ya? Could we possibly share the title being the most unsure? ;)

Hahaha... :roflmao: yeah, you are definitely more unsure than I am, but I like the idea of sharing the title :p. Thanks for the gesture.

:beer:

My wife bought a nice digital gram scale for the kitchen..baking. I sneak parts in every now and then to weigh them, in fact I just weighed my grafton cranks (175/110).. 422 grams...sweet!

Maybe it's a stabillity thing or even an ego thing. You know I don't care if you wanna pass judgement with sarcasm, obviously i'm not that unresponsive.I really would like to see racers that offer more to this forum. PERFORMANCE IS BASED ON DESIGNIt's better than someone asking whats better "this or that".o a car has a "fixed" power output, by the design of it's motor. (which is a major part of automobile racing) Also you don't realize that almost any part of a bicycle is aftermarket.bviously you aren't too on top of the racing thing here. You can't compare the difference between racing cars and bikes. And in auto racing I've went beyond aftermarket to fabricate pieces on an induction system to keep it normally aspirated for daily driving and to not cause stress on other components. I've built street racing machines before I built racing bikes. There's a whole lot more applications of theorys that apply in a motorized vehicle. The motor on a bicycle is also the operator. If you were trained well enough in your physiological being. You would be a little wiser and able to contribute to the ideas of racing, instead of lashing out with hurt feelings, because someone else has the ability to offer the objectives, that only come to you when that subject is brought up. But that's one thing about being a hardcore racer. Just remember, a lighter component doesn't make it better! I If this were an automotive forum, the text would get a lot more complicated, dictating numbers that pertain to things like, volumetric efficiency, and gear ratios. What may seem novel to you is indelible in my past excecutions of racing, because not only have I built the machines, 'm more for advancing.If your a winner you've got bragging rights, and the ego goes along with it.I've operated them. You don't see me getting upset about someones offer of their knowledge. I like the simplicity of mountain bikes, but i'm still waiting for some more educated responses and technical jargon.A bicycle is powered by the man/woman operating it and doesn't put out a constant power source as an internal combustion engine. Also you couldn't dig deep enough into your applications to touch on the subject of suspension I figured the racing section would be more intillectually stimulating, but it doesn't surprise me that guys with growing egos take offense when they aren't the ones to elaborate on a subject that could be more indepth.

I LOVE CHROMO2!!! Chromo2 rocks!!!

I'm going to go look for more of his posts! If laughter is the best medicine, this sh*t should cure cancer!

i think people concerned about weight are ******ed...
give 'em a few months with that heavier bike, and they will be just as fast as the others
it can only make you stronger. unless you are racing xc with a downhill bike...

i think people concerned about weight are ******ed...


Sounds like you have never experienced riding a lighter XC bike...ride a heavy XC bike, then ride a lighter XC bike...you'll understand the difference.

i think people concerned about weight are ******ed...


Thats the pot calling the kettle black......

i think people concerned about weight are ******ed...
give 'em a few months with that heavier bike, and they will be just as fast as the others
it can only make you stronger. unless you are racing xc with a downhill bike...

To each their own I guess. I'll stick with my lightweight bike for racing though. I know I can tell a difference when going from a heavy bike to one of mine. Why carry extra weight if you don't have to.

Handgrips for serious weight weinies:

http://www.aimcomm.com/users/dminor/images/weiniebar.jpg

Handgrips for serious weight weinies:

http://www.aimcomm.com/users/dminor/images/weiniebar.jpg

And then you wouldn't have to carry any additional food along with you!