How simply do you live? [Archive]

iBarna

01-03-06, 02:00 AM

This topic came up in the 'lurkers' thread, and so I'm making it into its own topic.

I have always (well, ever since I wasn't a teenager anymore) liked simple living. I always strive to reduce the number of things I own. Currently I think that apart from a few pieces of furniture (mattress, three comfy chairs in the living room, a rug and the cat tree) I could fit my life into three moving boxes. I just moved and apart from the furniture above, and my animals, which I transported in a friend's car that I borrowed for two hours, I moved by bike. Nothing reduces your life to a bare minimum like moving on a bike :)

Now I'm not Mr. Scrooge, mind you. To me this is not about saving money (though living simply does save you a chunk) as much as it is about just not having to worry about / store / repair / haul around stuff. I just cannot stand clutter. I think people who know me would be surprised that I own so little, because as I said, I don't deprive myself by any means. I do like nice stuff, and whatever I need, I will get. But, I will think hard if I really need something, and also that once I know that I need something, in what form do I need it? What makes the most sense? Is there something out there that could solve multiple problems at once? I get a huge kick out of this sort of tinkering and simplifying, maybe it's the same joy people get from buying all sorts of crap they use only once?

Just a few examples:

* My laptop is a very important component in my life. Apart from the obvious, I use it to: work from home, watch DVD's, wirelessly stream music to my speakers which are connected to an Airport Express -- basically my stereo. (Accordingly, the laptop must be a nice one. Next iBook or Powerbook is coming up.)

* Most of my documents and pictures, as well as all music I own is in digital form (yes, I do backups). Digital music and photography rule.

* I don't own books. I go to the library. I do buy books as well, but usually I donate them to the library once I read them. The way I see it, the library stores it for me so that I can still access it later, if I need to. I don't own DVD's either. Online rental is a great thing.

* I don't own fancy shmancy kitchenware. My cookware consists of a tried and true cast iron pan, a medium sized pot, one excellent chef's knife and a cutting board. That's it. I have prepared many a scrumptious dinner just with this equipment, to the disbelief of the observer(s).

* I change the contents of my closet. I like to buy clothing, but I am careful to not hoard it. I donate or sell / trade clothing and shoes I don't wear anymore.

* Obviously, I have no car, only a bike. My collection of bike tools is sparse, but allows me to do most repairs at home. If the job is too big, I bring the bike in. Last time this happened was a stuck bottom bracket cup, which the nice girl in the LBS removed for $5, using a special BB tool and a 5ft iron pipe. I would never have been able to do it, so it was a great deal.

Anyone else here who shares this philosophy and lives along these same lines? How much stuff do you own that you can't move on your bike? (And how do you justify it? :p)

mrkott3r

01-03-06, 02:17 AM

going for the intel mac eh? The yonah core looks promising though and its dual core. So it should be one of the better lappies out there. when it comes out in the next month or so.

Back on topic. I enjoy having decent stuff, so I may not own as much stuff, but I know its better quality and lasts longer.
The three things I will always hang onto though:
trombone, bike, computer with dsl connection.
i cant carry any of that stuff on my bike

Im in the middle ground don't like clutter (gotta clean room again) but I do like owning some stuff

iBarna

01-03-06, 02:25 AM

Right on... I'm waiting for those Intel Macs :) Why can't you carry these things? You should see the stuff I have been hauling around (all without a trailer). There's a good chance that I could transport both your trombone and computer w/ DSL stuff on a bike AT ONCE. Hehe ;) Unless you have a 21" CRT monitor.

mrkott3r

01-03-06, 02:28 AM

well the trombone is in a large and heavy case (roughly 10kgs) and is akward and I certainly do not want to drop it.
Computer again would be heavy w/ 17inch screen and all the cables, speakers etc.

What doesnt fit in a backpack doesnt come with me on the bike

Juha

01-03-06, 03:12 AM

I've thought about this. But it seems something's gotta give: I'm a music junkie, so I have a decent stereo set, a whole bunch of CDs and a grand piano in the living room. Also my friends think I could easily donate half of my bike related stuff and still be able to ride nicely. Personally, of course, I don't consider any of these excessive.

--J

Alekhine

01-03-06, 05:49 AM

I make a good living, so it's tempting to spend the money on stuff, but I don't. I save it. The exception to this is the wonderful bicycle I am currently building up and my Steinway grand piano.

I definitely live more simply than most though.

-I don't eat out, EVER. I cook every meal myself, and I daresay I do a better job of it than most restaurant chefs I've run into.
-I am car-free.
-I live in a small cottage.
-During winter, I resist the urge to warm my home with the furnace, prefering to put on extra layers.
-I hand-wash all my clothes with a 1940's clothes plunger, and hang them to dry outside.
-I grow my own. :groucho eyebrows:
-I hate forms, credit cards, insurance companies, attorneys, etcetera. I try to avoid these things as much as possible.
-My favorite activity is camping by bicycle in summertime.

nathank

01-03-06, 06:10 AM

well, i think i have a lot more stuff than you but i am moving more in that direction and i like not having TOO much stuff as it is a real pain.

i got out of college and moved to another city with all of my possessions in the back of my pickup truck and i thought that was cool. then in the first few years of working i bought all kinds of stuff: leather couch, big TV, etc... and when i moved from Texas to Portland i had to rent a huge truck!!

then for my next move from Portland to Boston i got rid of about half of my stuff and had the rest shipped... (gave my kayak and my motorcycle to friends - the kayak i sometimes miss but not for the hassel it would have been to keep it)

then i moved to Germany and i got rid of another half of my stuff and put another 2/3 of that in storage and only took a small amount. i had a small apartment and actually did quite fine with "less stuff". then after 2 years of paying storage i finally cleared out my storage stuff in the US giving half of the stuff away to friends and shipping some to Germany.

i do have a lot of stuff: 5 bikes, 2 snowboards, skiis, snowshoes, bike repair tools and parts, massive amounts of outdoor camping, climbing and snow gear, books, etc. but the main difference now is that 1) i have not bought any significant furniture in a while and 2) i REALLY think before i buy something -- and i really like this much better!

on the other hand i don't think i will ever again be able to fit all my stuff in the back of a pickup truck - much less transport it all with my BOB Trailer or XtraCycle (yeah, 2 other things i own)

davidmcowan

01-03-06, 07:34 AM

I shed most of my belongings when I was moved to Costa Rica. Now that I am back in the states my idea of minimalism is much more minimal. :) You should really take a look at this site (www.simpleliving.net) go in the forums section that have advice and encouragement (much like here) around all of the different angles of simple living. This site and there are the two that keep me truckin' in a low paying job and living a "rich" lifestyle.

pakole

01-03-06, 07:36 AM

If I toss all of my school stuff, which I can do after june (yea.) I can fit my life in 7 boxes, not including my bikes, and 2 pieces of furnitune. I agree having a small amount of stuff is great since its just less things to manage. I have been forced into a simple lifestyle since I am a college and time and money is money, which I am short of :{, and I do not want to have things that will waste my time or money with me or on me. Since I hate buying new stuff, I try to make sure my stuff last, so I maintain all stuff tha I have thus the more stuff I have the more stuff I have to maintain. I did not really realize the time needed for this maintenence, until i got my first bike last June. It is just amazing to consider the amount of time that you can put into it, but it is also a great feeling to ride a finely tuned bike versus one that have seen a wrench in a while, but anyway I have left my point. I really like living simply, and I am a big propenent of living within your means, whch including more then money, but also time. If you do not do it weekly or monthly, then its probably something that is not worth your time and money. (Oh course, there are exception like skiing since its seasonly, but if you do not ski each season, then the rules are still the same.) Just saying. Anyway, I am not sure if the bike force me to live simpole. I mean if I had a car. The onyl extra thing I would have is an insurance additon (I already have renters insurance) and gas payments, so I say its the person, not the bike that makes life simple.

Roody

01-03-06, 03:31 PM

iBarna is a man after my own heart. I live in a small apartment and also cook delicious meals with a couple pans. I have even simplified my cooking and use fewer ingredients, but fresher and tastier. I have a lot of clothes (most from thrift stores) but I weed through them pretty often. I buy and adopt a lot of bikes, but give them all away. The bike I ride is freakishly minimal--nothing added but a lock, and a waterbottle in the summer. I know that's stupid, but I like it anyway. I give a LOT of money away, some to charities and causes, most to people I know who need it. That's stupid too but it makes me happy. My biggest luxury is coffee. I haven't used alcohol or drugs for many years.

Who are your philosophers of simplicity? I like Buddha because he teaches not to get attached to things. I also like Thoreau because he simplified to the core and because he knew how to live outdoors.

Roody

01-03-06, 03:33 PM

Oh. I couldn't move "everything I own on my back on the bike." I would need a small pickup truck, one load, then ride the bike over to the new crib.

That quote ("move everything I own on my back on the bike") is great. It is really in the spirit of Thoreau!

timmhaan

01-03-06, 03:43 PM

i try to run all errands (which isn't much), pay bills, check the internet, etc. while i'm at work. i have very little to do once i get home, except ride my bike. in addition to the bikes i have a small TV so i'm not tempted to watch it that much, a book case of books, and two guitars. that's basically it.

linux_author

01-03-06, 03:54 PM

- i'm retired after telecommuting (writing books and magazine articles via Internet) for nine years... i now ride my bike to do food shopping, banking, etc., and ride a bike 15-20 miles a day at least five days a week... (although i only did six miles today as my 73-year-old mother-in-law rode my wife's beach cruiser with me in the park this afternoon)

- the wife unit now works out of house via telcommuting (job is more than 1,500 miles away)... no more driving to work and back... the bonus is that she got a pay raise on the job move! whoo hoo!

- life is good!

:-)

Brad M

01-03-06, 04:14 PM

I wish I could cut the clutter, but being a packrat isn't by choice! I definitely know how to live frugal, and is a big reason why I commute by bike. I recently moved in to a small house so now I have no choice but to live simply.

AlanK

01-03-06, 04:29 PM

I live pretty simply - most of my friends are amazzed at how minimalist I am. In additon to my bike, I have a few clothes, books TV, bed, and futon, and a few other odds and ends (pictures, etc.) I get most of my media materials (books, DVDs, etc.) from the library.

My last great indulgence is cable TV. I'm trying to work up the discipline to cancel the cable, and realocate that money on a gym membership.

timmhaan

01-03-06, 04:31 PM

My last great indulgence is cable TV. I'm trying to work up the discipline to cancel the cable, and realocate that money on a gym membership.

cancel the cable, put that money into a 401(k) or IRA, and ride your bike instead of going to the gym. :)

Brad M

01-03-06, 04:33 PM

Being TV-free is one of the best things you can do for yourself. It's not quite so bad if you're also addicted to the Internet. You still have a source for news and _interactive_ entertainment.

matt_savvy

01-03-06, 05:12 PM

I live in a one-room apartment. I don't drink, smoke, and I'm vegan. I'm a hoarder by nature, but I've tried to fight agianst that as much as I can.

I own very few clothes or books (when I moved at the beginning of last summer, I gave away most of both of these). I use the library a lot, and I rarely (if ever) change my clothes. I've actually been wearing these pants since nov 04, and the same t-shirt since september 05. I DO own an assload of cd's and a fair sized stereo. I don't have the internet at home (I use it at work) and I don't own a tv, either. I do also own a bunch of trashpicked bike parts (mostly wheels) that I hang on to in the hopes that someone can use them down the line.

what blows away most people who see how I live is the fact that I own neither a couch or a bed. I sleep on my floor in my old sleepingbag. most people think I live pretty simplistic, but ever day I look for ways to live even more simple.

cosmo starr

01-03-06, 05:21 PM

simplicity for the sake of purity will lead to enrichment....i think, thats my goal for this year....but a quote i like is
'live simply so that others may simply live'....it was a sticker so i dont know who to credit.

AlanK

01-03-06, 05:41 PM

cancel the cable, put that money into a 401(k) or IRA, and ride your bike instead of going to the gym. :)

Biking alone isn't enough - it's good cardio and lower body workout, but doesn't do much for your upper body strength. I have some freeweights at home (forgot to mention on my earlier post), but it'd be nice to join a gym to have a nice array of equipment to work out with.

Alekhine

01-03-06, 05:56 PM

what blows away most people who see how I live is the fact that I own neither a couch or a bed.

I'm the same. No couch. No bed. No TV. I do have two very nice sitting chairs though, one of which is a definite reading lounger and the other which is a wooden antique.

As for a bed, I prefer to sleep on the floor with my Thermarest and a couple of comfy blankets because my back likes a very firm underlying surface. My time spent in tents put this oddball thing into me. I'm going to be getting a kakebuton and a Japanese futon (shikibuton) soon though, because I've grown fond of them. (It's not what we think of as a futon in the US - which is a sort of hybrid couch/bed. A Japanese futon is a thin wool-filled cotton mattress that trifolds and stows in a closet or large cupboard, with a big, heavy, warm quilted comforter that does the same.)

Unlike most here though, my book collection is silly big and needs to be reduced, but I can't bring myself to. I've even used the shelves in my bathroom to house some of it.

davidmcowan

01-03-06, 08:08 PM

Gandhi said "live simply so that others may simply live".

worker4youth

01-03-06, 08:38 PM

The only thing I have a lot of is bikes: 3 of them -- 1 fixed, 1 road, and 1 mountain. I suppose I don't NEED all 3, but they're nice to have. iBarna, do you have just one bike?

kevink159

01-03-06, 09:03 PM

I been pairing down for a while, and by Feb 1 I will some clothes and books I will be storing at my parents, the living off my bike for 7 or 8 months. I have already donated a ton of books to charity and kept the really good ones, but to be honest I should have donated the really good ones to charity first to let someone else get a chance to read them.

turtle77

01-03-06, 10:46 PM

I have a laptop, a futon, some clothes, some cd's and books (both of which I'm slowly selling off- itunes and libraries - yes!!!) a small tv and vcr which I'm free-cycling (www.freecycle.org) and tools, which I'm keeping because I always need 'em for something. I also have a goal of being able to move with my bike (in june).

Thor29

01-03-06, 10:46 PM

[QUOTE=matt_savvy]I use the library a lot, and I rarely (if ever) change my clothes. I've actually been wearing these pants since nov 04, and the same t-shirt since september 05.

Yikes!

joesmohello

01-03-06, 10:52 PM

I moved to Santa Fe about a month ago with only a large suit case and a backpacking pack. Since arriving I've bought a futon mattress (no frame) and splurged on two 4'x8' plywood sheets to make a shelving system and a 14" wok. I shipped my one bike and some blankets. That's it.

iBarna

01-03-06, 11:40 PM

Good stuff in here!

Interesting that some here extend this simplicity to not drinking etc. Well, I do drink, smoke (will quit soon, you'll see), take the occasional drug (nothing hard, just pot and such), and I actually think that eating out brings a lot of simplicity into my life. It's more expensive, but then again I live right downtown in a city with so many great restaurants... All right, it's a vice. But you guys should try the grilled eggplant sandwich at Herbivore on Valencia Street.

Which leads me to...

Who are your philosophers of simplicity? I like Buddha because he teaches not to get attached to things. I also like Thoreau because he simplified to the core and because he knew how to live outdoors.

Oh, Thoreau is a good one. To me it's Epicurus. What the current world understands as Epicureanism is not what the man had in mind. He did say that we should indulge in pleasures, but he also said that these pleasures should be simple, and that one should never indulge in anything excessively. Epicurus' school had the motto 'lathe biosas', which means, 'live hidden' or 'live simply' depending on the translator. It basically means to live a simple life, surrounded by friends, eschew the limelight and politics. Live a simple life, eat well, drink well, laugh well, love well, never stop learning and philosophizing... :)

You should really take a look at this site (www.simpleliving.net) go in the forums section that have advice and encouragement (much like here) around all of the different angles of simple living. This site and there are the two that keep me truckin' in a low paying job and living a "rich" lifestyle.

Great tip! I never thought about looking for an online forum about this :)

The only thing I have a lot of is bikes: 3 of them -- 1 fixed, 1 road, and 1 mountain. I suppose I don't NEED all 3, but they're nice to have. iBarna, do you have just one bike?

Yeah, only one, this one (http://static.flickr.com/34/73115749_82be5b1680_o.jpg), a nice vintage Bottecchia. Though I soon will start working on a second, more comfortable cyclocross. Two bikes is a luxury I will afford, because I bike everywhere, and it will be nice to have a back-up. -- I actually thought about building TWO identical bikes to keep repairs simple (both bikes would correspond to the same standards, etc.) How cool would it look to have two absolutely identical, sleek black bikes hanging on your wall, in an otherwise uncluttered room? ;)

Being TV-free is one of the best things you can do for yourself. It's not quite so bad if you're also addicted to the Internet. You still have a source for news and _interactive_ entertainment.

Very true. The best thing that happened me in a long time was to give up TV. Now, when I watch it (at a friend's house, say), I can't believe how stupid it is and how many hours I wasted in front of it. I guess the TiVo-type stuff makes it more bearable, but still...

jamesdenver

01-05-06, 05:24 PM

can i say how much i love this thread. i hate clutter, limit my clothes in closet (i
make sure i donate some as i buy new ones). i eat out (save for GOOD meals, not junk), but often cook several meals at home, and i take them to work in my rack trunk in little square t'wares. since i moved back to denver from LA five years ago i've pared down my busyness, stress, and stuff. since biking commuting i've realized how much pleasure there is in saving money, and now the the debts are paid off (except house) after a few years i'm looking forward to traveling overseas even more this year.

i think "living simply" is more a state of mind than based on how much stuff one owns (even though i preach living simply through means of reducing excess in your life)

for example a guy in the country who owns 20 junk cars and enjoys tinkering with them and fixing them might be living just as simply as one of us. i've found it has more to do with stress and society's demands placed on us. there's an "anti-overscheduling" movement starting in books and blogs, based on the ridiculous of the concept that your life is only productive and valuable if you're running from place to place and have a million things to do. some of this is geared towards parents, and i've read stories of multiple lessons, soccer games and fast food dinners in cars rushing from one place to the next.

hopefully people realize the annoying phrase "well you have to much time on your hands" is not a negative thing, but a good thing. there's a difference between taking a lazy approach to life versus sitting in the park in a summer evening reading, or just spending a few hours doing nothing, or doing more enriching things like taking spanish lessons (which i'm starting in two weeks)

i think a hobby that involves junk and clutter is certainly different than an aggravating household of crap that stresses you out, but i think we all realize living simple for financial reasons also provides us more opportunites for dictating how our day is spent (making oragami or spanish lessons). less spending on unneeded things equals less debt equals less need for part time or additional jobs. i for example own bought a hot tub last spring, but because i found a guy selling it for under $800. the reason? he was getting one with a TV/DVD player built in. some might consider me not simple for owning something needing maintenence and using more electricity. i enjoy it, and i laugh at his need to spend $10,000 on a hot tub which does the exact same thing as the one he sold me (now on my back patio)

in another post i referenced the phrase "manufactured wants" and someone argued with that term. we're so oversaturated with marketing;/advertising/commercial messages, i don't think enough people quickly disect whether they truly can use something or they actually need it. for example yes i wanted a hot tub, but i was patient, and had no intention if spending retail on it. this fell into my lap, so i rewarded myself and am happy, and still consider myself simple. note these two articles:

http://www.theonion.com/content/node/30284
http://www.theonion.com/content/node/29448

anyway i love this post. i consider myself quite simple, although i own a home, hot tub, and several computers for my audio production work. i have a plan in life of living below my means, educating myself, traveling, so in the long run i'll be able to not stress about money, travel and learn, and be able to be a good example of living simply to family friends and others

also check this article about the 116 year old lady.

http://www.happynews.com/news/12162005/ecuadorean-woman-is-worlds-oldest.htm

This line sums it all up:

Her calm disposition may be the secret to her longevity, her daughter said. "She always had a very tranquil character," Irma said. "She does not get upset by anything. She takes things very calmly and she has been that way her whole life."

jamesdenver

01-05-06, 05:28 PM

oh and right on about cooking your own food. the big joke about "guys not being able to cook" is BS

with sites like foodtv.com you can do anything simple or complicated. it's simple steps, just like building a TV cabinet. i find it MUCH easier to whip out a few pans, saute up whatever, it's relaxing to chop veggies, and i can have dinner cooking by the time i'd be seated at a restaurant.

in addition to being car free, a great way to save money is to be concientious about where and how often you eat out.

i love having breakfast at the diner by my house, or going our for sushi, but i always know what i'm going to have, how much i'll spend, and limit myself to places that serve GOOD food.

even traveling my backpack is filled with cliff bars, bananas, apples, tuna cans and crackers

vrkelley

01-05-06, 06:31 PM

I like Ken Kifer's philosphy on simple living. He has a lot of bike stuff too

http://www.kenkifer.com/Thoreau/index.htm <---Just read his comments on the right side of the page for starters....it'll take more than one pass to take it all in.

Sadly Ken is gone now... :(

we are so busy with unnecessary worries and works that we can't appreciate life.

bokes

01-05-06, 11:07 PM

I own clothes, a few bikes, camping equipment, skis, bed, chair, kitchen stuff, laptop, projector (for dvds), a guitar, tools, and that's about it. I just rent furnished flats, or borrow excess furniture from my family.

I have a passion for adventure, travel, languages, and have a ton of hobbies, so 10 years ago when i graduated from Uni i decided to work a year, take a year off, work a year, take year off... at the expense of buying a nice house, kids, car, and lots of stuff.

I've had an incredible time but i always feel like i'm fighting the expectations of society that view me as an underachiever. But I always tell myself that if i were to die tomorrow, i'd be much happier than if i had climbed the corporate ladder.

jamesdenver

01-06-06, 08:24 AM

I have a passion for adventure, travel, languages, and have a ton of hobbies, so 10 years ago when i graduated from Uni i decided to work a year, take a year off, work a year, take year off... at the expense of buying a nice house, kids, car, and lots of stuff.

I've had an incredible time but i always feel like i'm fighting the expectations of society that view me as an underachiever. But I always tell myself that if i were to die tomorrow, i'd be much happier than if i had climbed the corporate ladder.

well done and well said. after working full time since 19 and two year college (i'm 30 now) i'm finally traveling and have a good job that gives me enough vaca time to do it.

i may want to go back to school down the road, or i may travel more, spend a year abroad, etc. but the good thing is the road ISN'T mapped out - given our simple lives we can choose as we like.

shokhead

01-06-06, 08:35 AM

Lets see,i have a 2000gateway with ME and its crap. Maybe a $4000 HT with 125cd's and 50 DVD's. A 02 Altima and a 99 Caravan,both paid for. No CC debt. A $900 house payment for another 6 years.{paid 80,000 in 80,worth 600,000} Levis and T-shirts,dont own a suit. Mow my own lawn and no maid. Wife works as i do full time and 1 daughter moved out and the other in her 2nd year at LBCC. We live pretty simple. I have to watch tv,i was born with it.

smilin buddha

01-06-06, 08:49 AM

This has to be one of the best sections on this site. I have realized a little late that I have to much stuff. I was always looking for books and buying all the latest ones. Sad, but I work at the library. I started to donate my items slowly at first and have been cleaning the house ever since. I donated a large amount of things to local charities during christmas, but have so much more to do. I have started to pair down the clothes. And purchased some Dickies work pants and shorts. Less items will give me less time to worry about them. So my friends think I am nuts. They run around with the latest ipods and electronic doodads. And I read books about letting go and simplifying. The hardest part for me was the realization that I was wrapping my self worth in the items I owed. Funny I thought I owed them, but they actually owned me.

stokell

01-06-06, 09:52 AM

The watershed for me was when I started touring. I go light.

When I was younger success meant possessions. Now I see them as baggage that holds me down, keeps me back and prevents my freedom. The side-effect is now that I no longer have financial problems. When you don't own a car and don't buy 'things' you save lots and lots of money.

pedex

01-06-06, 10:13 AM

Everything I own would easily fit into the back of a small p/u truck, I could be gone in under 45mins. My monthly expenses hover around $450/month including rent,food,etc etc etc. Other than my rather serious computer equipment and habit my life is pretty simple. No TV, no cars or trucks, no bed, very little furniture, cook all my own meals etc etc.

Just a few years ago I had 3 vehicles, 3 truckloads of stuff, and was your typical american uber consumer..........that life is history, and im alot happier for it. About the only complicated part of my life is the business I run, and a messenger business isnt all that tough to deal with, even being an army of one. Heck its about noon here and Im home nice and warm doing computer work while waiting for more calls for runs to come in, life is good.

TxBiker

01-06-06, 11:17 AM

I gotta say, as a father of two and husband to one, this is a great topic. I have started my quest to simplify my life and love it. I sold "my" car last year and we are down to one family car. I have been biking to work for almost 6 months now. Love it!!

I too have been the "true" American consumer and hate it! I have joined a local freecycle group and have already begun "the purging". Of all the articles in the Living Car Free subforum, I keep hoping this topic gets updated so I can get more ideas!!!!

What excites me the most is that while I am doing this, my kids see this and will grow up with a more acceptable idea of "possessions" and not fall prey to consumerism. Of course....Santa and the grandparents have un-done a lot of what I was doing before Christmas to keep things simple and small. Oh well.....

Chris

jamesdenver

01-06-06, 01:25 PM

i gotta check out freecycle. i used craigslist for tons of stuff.

i took down a frame on my patio consisting of heavy long steel pipes. took a picture and put them up figuring an artist or building/designer could find some use for them - and was helping load them into a truck within a few hours.

junk to me is of great value to others, and vice versa

Dahon.Steve

01-06-06, 03:10 PM

in another post i referenced the phrase "manufactured wants" and someone argued with that term. we're so oversaturated with marketing;/advertising/commercial messages, i don't think enough people quickly disect whether they truly can use something or they actually need it.

Most of people's manufactured wants comes from the television set. It surprised me how little I wanted to buy things once I stopped watching television. I really believe this is the reason people want to buy the latest cars because you're programmed to need an SUV after watching hundreds of hours of commercials.

After nearly going bankrupt several years ago trying to live a lifestyle I couldn't afford, I'm through with commercialism. My TV cannot get reception without cable so I have a subscription with NetFlix and get to watch the movies without the commericals. My cable TV is gone and I log onto this forum at work and using my cell phone at 14.4K!! My large collection of books were sold during my recent move and I'm getting rid of the rest! I'm sick of clutter.

I've been bad with cycling in general. I'm discovering the reason I'm purchaing is to get rid of depression. I've found that nothing makes you want to go out and shop like being depressed so I have to catch myself. This summer, I'm selling off four of my bikes and live with two. You'll see people on this forum buying a bicycle each year on credit! Even though this is a procycling forum, don't fall into this trap.

I find it hard to believe that after living my life with credit card debt, I'm finally free for good. Don't get into this trap even for a bicycle.

smithers

01-06-06, 04:10 PM

naisme

01-06-06, 10:27 PM

I don't know how simply I live, I think it is rather relative. In comparing myself to my family and friends I'm pretty simple. I do own a big TV but I watch DVDs, only Saturday night do the cat and I sit in front of the boob tube, Cops. I watch movies and DVD bike races (love Paris-Roubaix). I own a big American made van, that is back on the road. I have a one bedroom apartment, a mile from work, I let the guy below me heat the place, I've come home and it's been 70 in my apartment. I cook my own meals, with exception of what I eat at work and Friday afternoons I eat lunch with my brother, and one Saturday a month I eat with all three brothers and their kids. I used to be a regular at coffee joints, but I solved that when my step dad gave me his old Krups espresso machine, so the only reason I go to a coffee house is to get beans.
At Christmas I shocked everyone that I drove to the family get together, because I ride most everywhere I go.
I hang on to the van with the idea of using it as a camper/sag wagon, but I have been working on a touring bike for two years now, and think I'm close to being dialed in.
On the complicated side of things, I own a small bike shop, or so I am told, 16 makes me a bike shop, a couple (4) are frames that I'm slowly acquiring parts for. I have two track frames, and a bunch of road/fixed conversions, as well as a road bike, the touring bike and an MTB.
I just cleaned out the closet of my old cloths, donating them to the halfway house I work in. I bought a bunch of wool sweaters at Goodwill for Christmas, they are great for riding in.
Like others have said before me, I still have a long way to go. I dream of having two maybe three bikes, but I like all of them and have a little blood sweat and tears in them too. I have cross-country skies, a revived obsession from my youth, and camping equipment, both for car and bike camping.
I contemplate moving every other week, to a climate that is more bike friendly, and could get rid of the behemouth, it's an expenditure, like everyone has said that I can do without.
Currently my simplicity has run to Zen, and getting up at 5 am to go to the Zendo and sit, it is amazing what has been showing up on the junk pile on trash day, my old PCs and monitors. I still cling to things like books, mostly Zen. I could rid myself of a lot of pocessions and still live pretty comfortably. Maybe it will come with my awakening, or I'll awaken to the impermanence of pocessions... Hmm, must speak to the master...

karmical

01-07-06, 02:51 AM

simplier than most, not as simple as some, since there is nothing wrong with pampering yourself and loved ones with the fruits of your labors-

we tend to cook most of our meals, but since we both work, there are plenty of days where i have no problem letting someone else take care of that burden, and have plenty of friends that are chefs, so i'm always taken care of in that department-

watch tv, no cable though, lots of dvds & vhs, tend to like the classics personally and all of norman lears stuff but not tied to it and don't have to watch everyday or weekly just when i/we feel the need.

too many books here as well, last move i had more crates of books than anything else-
have a bed, a few chairs, but not much else, going to be after the move then we'll expand a bit, but still remain as clutter-free as possible
barter/trade for much of everything

af895

01-07-06, 08:59 AM

Hi iBarna!

Two quotes I'm fond of:

"Success isn't defined by the things you have.
It's defined by the things you don't need."

"It is desirable that a man be clad so simply...and that he live in all respects so compactly and preparedly
that, if an enemy take the town, he can, like the old philosopher, walk out the gate empty-handed without anxiety."

As recently as 2004, I was living a rampant-consumer-based life. A number of events - 18-hour workdays, a failed relationship, failing health and the closing of my company - contributed to my reevaluating that lifestyle.

I live very simply these days. I might go out for food once every few months but prefer to cook for myself. I watch TV but try to limit it Simpsons, Family Guy, King of the Hill and PBS/Nature/Discovery/Travel type stuff. (roommate has cable and the TV so I can't get rid of it completely)

My laptop is both a working tool and entertainment center (hp 17" widescreen - great for DVDs and it replaces a desktop computer). My futon is both a couch & bed.

I can't say all of my worldly possesions would fit in one box but certainly they'd fit in a small room or do a good job furnishing a bachelor pad.

All of the things said in this thread hit home with me.
My possesions used to own me. Now, I find comfort in stopping along my bike rides and watching the real world unfold. The things I keep in my home are out of convenience - tools, books etc - not from a desire to "collect" things.

Ultimately, my goal is find a steady "job" - I live on contract work - pay off one remaining student loan and "drop out" - touring by bike much like this fellow did: http://www.wildworks.co.nz/csr/photographs.php

Thanks for posting. It was a reminder to me that people are more important than things. "Love people and use things, don't use people and love things" perhaps? :)

CJ

jamesdenver

01-07-06, 10:07 AM

i've had great luck getting rid of stuff on ebay and craigslist; i agree with dahon steve-stay out of the credit card trap! i had myself in quite a $$$ mess when i had credit card debt and it SUCKS!
a great thread! i'm always excited to read about others living lightly / cheaply /clutter-free!!

i made the last big "chunk" payment on my CC last fall, and i have an obessesion with remaining free of credit card debt. intangible as it is, it's a trendemendous

i've had up and down CC for 11 years. i've gotton it down, racked it up, paid with some help my 'rents, racked some more up. there's so many "get out of CC guides out there" but i think they're missing one point: they tell you to cut back on things, cut out little expenses like $20-30 a month things, watch how much you eat out, etc. that's smart, but it won't happen without a fundamental life philosophy change regarding your goals, need, and wants. if you still like going to the mall to BUY stuff to make yourself happy, it won't happen. i believe spending is like an addiction, and eventually you'll relapse. if you hang out with friends who don't see a good time as anything else than spending $100 on dinner and martini, it's a tough call and you may see less of them. on the other hand you may find friends that enjoy things like drinking coffee at a diner, or practicing spanish together.

i noticed even last year, that when i had $4,000 in debt, it's a lot easier to justify spending 40-60 bucks on something. it's barely a dent in what you owe. now with a clean slate, i watch my purchases even MORE carefully than when i had a few grand on the cards.

also you can then using cards to MAKE you money. some cards offer 1-5% cash back on purchases, and i have a UAL miles card - so even though i prefer cash, i use mine for groceries, gas, etc.. and as soon as i walk in the door make an online payment from my checking account for $40-50 or whatever i spent.

oh i think ebay and craigslist are excellent tools for our culture. i find clothes, tools, books, gifts, and lots of new stuff too. i hope craigslist stays exactly the way it is and never sells out to registrations, ads, etc

all the best and happy saturday!!!

531phile

01-07-06, 10:14 AM

531phile

01-07-06, 10:22 AM

I like Ken Kifer's philosphy on simple living. He has a lot of bike stuff too

http://www.kenkifer.com/Thoreau/index.htm <---Just read his comments on the right side of the page for starters....it'll take more than one pass to take it all in.

Sadly Ken is gone now... :(

First Syndey and now I find out Ken Kifer is dead. Damn. Who else?

af895

01-07-06, 10:47 AM

i made the last big "chunk" payment on my CC last fall, and i have an obessesion with remaining free of credit card debt. intangible as it is, it's a trendemendous

i've had up and down CC for 11 years. i've gotton it down, racked it up, paid with some help my 'rents, racked some more up.

Krikey James! Reading that was giving me cold sweats. I too went through the credit card thing. When I simplified my life in 2004, I paid them off and cut them up. On the occasion I want to order something online, I'll hand cash to a friend of family member and ask if they'd place the order.

... there's so many "get out of CC guides out there" but i think they're missing one point: they tell you to cut back on things, cut out little expenses like $20-30 a month things, watch how much you eat out, etc. that's smart, but it won't happen without a fundamental life philosophy change regarding your goals, need, and wants. if you still like going to the mall to BUY stuff to make yourself happy, it won't happen. i believe spending is like an addiction, and eventually you'll relapse. if you hang out with friends who don't see a good time as anything else than spending $100 on dinner and martini, it's a tough call and you may see less of them. on the other hand you may find friends that enjoy things like drinking coffee at a diner, or practicing spanish together.

WORD. You hit the nail on the head there.
A lot of the so-called friends I used to have are people I don't see anymore because they couldn't wrap their heads around just hanging out and talking - they had to be at a restaurant or mall spending.

I have a whole new set of friends now - people I have a deeper connection to - who play instruments, work on bikes together or let me cook for them. One of them was about to make an order from Nashbar for some bike stuff. I went into my box of bike goodies, pulled out a pair of road bars and brakes and saved him $100. Craiglist, Freecycles and the local bike co-op are great ways to save.

I think we're just a bit ahead of our time there: once our species gets over peak-oil and realizes the embodied energy tied up in the materials we throw out, we'll need to be frugal because, say, a set of handlebars will cost you $400 new on account of the mining, refining, manufacturer and transportation costs. (though that might not happen in our lifetime)

"It's not the big expenses you plan for that'll bankrupt you - it's all the tiny little ones you didn't keep track of that'll add up."

Durn good discussion here!