Bicycle Mechanics - Is a heavy frame stronger?

Are steel frames like Dedacciai Zero Tre or Columbus Thron or Reynolds 520 stronger then Dedaciaia Zero Uno or Columbus Genius or Reynolds 853 ? And as such better suited for heavier riders??

I am not very educated on metallurgy but I do know that if a heavy riders has a lot of finess a lighter frame will hold up. If you are more of a power rider the lighter frame will tend to flex more putting more stress on the frame.

Slainte:beer:

My uncle in law snapped a lighter frame pedalling. Too much torque and time wear. I tend to go for beefier frames because they are generally stronger. But again you have to look at quality. A beefy looking frame that ways quite a bit can still suck.

IT depends, on alot of things.There is no simple answer.Some tubesets are better than others for hevier riders.Some of the light ones have weight limits. Others have been made especially for big riders.853 is ok as is thron,especially the oversize diameters.Genius is for lighter riders.Being heavy does not necessarily mean it's strong,Hi-ten is heavy but low strength steel.853 is realative light but strong steel.Diameter of the tubes matters too.Larger tube, diameter,greater the strength.Zero tre is low strength alloy, Zero is top of the line high strength heattreated steel.Both would build suitable frames, but the Z tre would need thicher walls or larger diameter and would end up bitng heavier. Same deal for 520.

I seem to recall someone asking this question in Bicycling magazine a few months ago. The response listed several specific road bikes especially suited for heavier riders but also seemed to suggest that most frames are fine except the very lightweight ones. You might check their website to see if you can find something. Some internet searching might turn up some suggestions.

Simple answer is yes. assuming you are comparing steel to steel, al to al and ti to ti. Weld failure aside. In actually quality of welds and assembly are more an issue in early failures of any product made from tubing. fatigue is the primaray failure mode in long term usage, damage is always a factor but generally not accounted for in design. It very simple really. It does not mean that heavier is better. But heavier is almost always stronger if the materials are similar.

All that said I have ridden both reynolds 853 and and reynolds 525 frames, the 853 frame is lighter and stronger than then the 520. I tipp the scales at around 190lbs.

Originally posted by DonTx
Simple answer is yes.

All that said I have ridden both reynolds 853 and and reynolds 525 frames, the 853 frame is LIGHTER and STRONGER than then the 520. I tipp the scales at around 190lbs. Did you contradict yourself?

i am no expert but i'm fairly sure there is a lot more to frame strength than weight.

consider a sears & roebuck department store special to be at one extreme. no doubt it weighs more than a buick, but i'll bet many of them are very breakable.

at the other extreme is a hand-crafted, lugged titanium bike from a leading maker. i'd wager the titanium bike is much stronger than the sears special, at probably 25 percent of the weight.

most bikes fall between these extremes. personally, i only buy bikes that have frames guaranteed for life. most steel frames, even those extremely light in weight, are protected. that way if you crunch a frame, you get a new one.

i've never crunched one yet.

Originally posted by Bandit
i am no expert ........

at the other extreme is a hand-crafted, lugged titanium bike from a leading maker. i'd wager the titanium bike is much stronger than the sears special, at probably 25 percent of the weight.

Current Ti is Tig welded, if the tubes used are all Ti. I did once see one that was built for a special project that was of lugged construction in which the Ti tubes were bonded to stainless lugs. There are current serotta and merlin models among others where the Ti HT,BB and stays or other parts are bonded to CF tubes. I know of no example of 'Lugged Ti ' construction in the same sense as lugged steel construction.

Originally posted by Bandit
i am no expert ................. personally, i only buy bikes that have frames guaranteed for life. most steel frames, even those extremely light in weight, are protected. that way if you crunch a frame, you get a new one.

i've never crunched one yet. Lifetime frame warranties cover defects in materials and workmanship and often not even failure due to 'fatigue'.Certainly not crunches caused by crashes or acts of stupidity like leaving one on the roof rack and driving into the garage.

Pokey...some companies in the past have been known to cover breakages of any reason...at least with a fix...there aren't many left now though with the new extremes, especially in mtb. They can't afford to warranty some of the dumb crap we are trying to pull off. I really can't blame them either. :)

a thousand pardons. i should have said "lugged steel" or tig-welded titanium.

and i thought it would be obvious i meant crunched through normal use, not through boneheaded maneuverings.

Originally posted by Maelstrom
Pokey...some companies in the past have been known to cover breakages of any reason...at least with a fix...there aren't many left now though with the new extremes, especially in mtb. They can't afford to warranty some of the dumb crap we are trying to pull off. I really can't blame them either. :) Maybe true, and there are crash replacement policies too.But not free or necessarily cheep. Iwas once offered 'a deal' on a trashed Trek OClV frame that could be fixed by Trek for $700.Could have bought a good used one cheaper.Did not even bother carrying it home.

I guess the confusion is that steel was supposed to be strong. However nowadays I see more and more steel frames which are not supposed to be ridden by heavier riders. Columbus Genius is one of them and Columbus Nemo is even not appropiate for riders above 145 lbs. I am 185 lbs which means that eighter of those frames is out of the question for me. However there are riders out there weighing 50 lbs lighter than me but 10 times stronger. Those people would have to be careful how hard they push their pedals or they could rip those frames apart. I mean there are now limits on weight, limits on warranty, maybe very soon there will bikes which not supposed to be ridden for more tham 27 miles and bikes not for hills.

It would seem that not only big riders need a strong frame, but strong riders would, too.

Can you say that a 150 lb. pro would need the same strong/stiff frame as a 200 lb. Cat 4 amateur? Is there any correlation?

Originally posted by WoodyUpstate
It would seem that not only big riders need a strong frame, but strong riders would, too.

Can you say that a 150 lb. pro would need the same strong/stiff frame as a 200 lb. Cat 4 amateur? Is there any correlation?

I guess a pro does'nt have that dilemma. He doesn't have to worry about the money aspect. It only matters for people who can't afford high end. Then price matters and choices have to be made.

My advice is to research the steel tubing manufacturer's. Reynolds, True Temper, Columbus etc. However since many here trust Sheldon, read his info: http://www.sheldonbrown.com/frame-materials.html

I would agree. My future uncle snapped a race frame at the toptube / seat tube just by pedaling. He is purely a xc guy and litterally road the frame into pieces. Luckily Kona replaced it with no questions.

Maelstrom, what kind of bike was that? a moutainbike?

Originally posted by Maelstrom
I would agree. My future uncle snapped a race frame at the toptube / seat tube just by pedaling. He is purely a xc guy and litterally road the frame into pieces. Luckily Kona replaced it with no questions. Some frames are just junk, and there are also manufacturing and material defects unrelated to weight.

This is a perfect example. Gorgeous frame for gorgeous price. But there is nothing you can do with it, unless you're anorexic and go downhill.

http://www.gvhbikes.com/Colnago%201/10-05-02/54%20Zeus%20Genius.jpg

Kona King Kikapu. 1999 I believe (I could be wrong on the year but it was a few years old). It was simply a matter of aluminum fatigue with constant abuse. He rides a tremendous amount of single track and puts in about 300-500km of hard single track a week (including winter riding) with half of that done in racing conditions. Not a matter of a weak bike just one that was ridden into the ground.

No biggy for him. It was replaced within a few days (sponsored rider)

Originally posted by pokey
Some frames are just junk, and there are also manufacturing and material defects unrelated to weight.

Material fatique is also something people sometimes forget about :)

Originally posted by Maelstrom


Material fatique is also something people sometimes forget about :) ............. that also speaks to design and manufacturing. Not necessarily weight, although insufficient material in the right places could be a factor...

Originally posted by green lion
This is a perfect example. Gorgeous frame for gorgeous price. But there is nothing you can do with it, unless you're anorexic and go downhill.

http://www.gvhbikes.com/Colnago%201/10-05-02/54%20Zeus%20Genius.jpg all the link got me was a picture. no description.Could not find it at GVH bikes either. So, just what is it?Need the details before spreading applesauce.

Originally posted by pokey
all the link got me was a picture. no description.Could not find it at GVH bikes either. So, just what is it?Need the details before spreading applesauce.

Pokey, it is at GVH bikes. it's a size 54 Zeus Mega Genius at $495.00. I've cut'n paste the discription:
Columbus Genius w/Reynolds Ouzo Comp threadless carbon fiber fork, celeste, mango and pearl white color scheme, 54cm t.t., made by Orbea, this is a NEW frame that has never been built up, it has a couple of miniscule paint chips from being on display, originally sold for over $900.; great value!

Tis is one of the most beautiful bikes I've seen in my life.(exept of Colnago) It's even my size!

Originally posted by green lion


Pokey, it is at GVH bikes. it's a size 54 Zeus Mega Genius at $495.00. I've cut'n paste the discription:
Columbus Genius w/Reynolds Ouzo Comp threadless carbon fiber fork, celeste, mango and pearl white color scheme, 54cm t.t., made by Orbea, this is a NEW frame that has never been built up, it has a couple of miniscule paint chips from being on display, originally sold for over $900.; great value!

Tis is one of the most beautiful bikes I've seen in my life.(exept of Colnago) It's even my size! Genius if fine for my size and weight. Even less of an issue in a size 54 unless one is a real heavy weight. Even the $900 original price is not that high considering what other light,quality steel framesets can go for,from other makers.. One might suspect some cornercutting somewhere at that price??, but that may be unfounded speculation. Nice looking frame though.