Singlespeed & Fixed Gear - Another Cyclist Vs. Motorist Thread

So I just had the most hostile encounter I've experienced yet.

I was riding down [editing out the specifics] (and here I thought my only threat was the infamous pedestrians that never learned to look both ways before crossing the street) going at a steady 25 mph or so when some jerk rips by me at something like twice my speed about three inches from my handlebars, only to slam on the brakes five seconds later to avoid smashing into the car in front of him that's stopped at a red light. I tactfully reminded him that there was a wide open lane to the left by slapping his windshield and flipping him off.

The light turns green, I take off and get up to speed, and feel something hit my leg. Hard. I'm sure it comes as no surprise that the ******* mother****er threw a water bottle at me; looking back on the incident, I guess it shouldn't have surprised me either, as someone who's willing to risk a stranger's life so they can hit a red light faster probably isn't going to be the most emotionally balanced person.

Now, I'm generally in control of my emotions and not very quick to anger, but when it comes to cyclist/motorist altercations, I'm always reminded of a friend of mine who was hit on his bike so badly by a reckless driver (who was completely sober but going 50 mph in the wrong lane in a 25 mph no passing zone) a couple months ago that we weren't allowed to see him one last time because he was unrecognizable. That said, I was seeing red and completely blind to logic at this point, so I speed by the car at the next light and kick the side view mirror off (just barely keeping my balance), and dart off down the empty sidewalk of a nearby one-way street.

Not exactly the emotionally centered outlook I normally try to have; I realize that the situation shouldn't have escalated as it did. Not to mention, at no point did I even THINK to look at his license plate until after the whole thing was through.

I guess my purpose in writing this is mostly just venting to a crowd that might be sympathetic. But also, while I was cooling off before I rode back home (it took almost a half hour of walking and deep breathing before I stopped shaking) I was trying to think of more non-violent ways I could've handled the situation. Has anyone ever been in a similar situation and just stood in front of the offending car at the next light, not letting them pass? Unknown Rebel-style? I figure if you stand close enough, they'd never be able to accelerate fast enough to do any serious damage to you.

Of course, the second they get out of their car, I'd take off in a terrified sprint, as I weigh in at a measly [I suppose a description of myself isn't too smart, either].

Whoo. Thanks for letting me vent.


[Edited out some of the more incriminating specifics.]

Now, I'm generally in control of my emotions and not very quick to anger,




I tactfully reminded him that there was a wide open lane to the left by slapping his windshield and flipping him off.

:rolleyes:

In most of my altercations with drivers I most often look back and think I could have handled it better. I rode for a couple years in a very bicycle-hostile city, my goal of every day was to NOT get honked at on my commute. I guess I'm spoiled now because if I get honked at now, it's only because I may have cut off a car, Anyway one time I was honked at; I rode up to the truck on the passenger side and explained to them I am a legally allowed to ride in the streets as a vehicle. They yelled at me, as was usual, so at the next red light I rode to the driver side. The man was about to yell at me when I gather up a huge loogie and spit bullseye in his face on the arch of his nose. As I was riding off I cut him off and he started revving his engine. When he got the green light, he caught up with me and tried running me over. I ducked out onto the sidewalk, and they caught up with me on the road twice after, each time trying to run me over. I had to duck out in a residential street because at this point they were chasing me. It felt GREAT to spit on his face and see him in full surprise! I know member son this board will say that cyclists shouldn't add to the Driver Vs. Cyclist mentality but when you are hassled and yelled at every single day for months straight, you really begin to profile every driver as an *******.
I still see this every day, I still do think that driving is unhealthy and promotes stress and causes neighbors to hate each other when I see drivers yelling at other drivers. the car is just an unhealthy machine, physically and mentally.

Oh and once I got on this guy's ass because he pulled up too far in an intersection when I was on a crosswalk. I have to say I wasn't very civil. the confrontation ended when a 300lb man got out of the car and was ready to throw down. But man drivers in this city ****ing sucked. I got ran over on an average of once every two months as a pedestrain, on foot, crossing legally.

whew, I feel good talking about it. But I can say that ever since I moved to Austin, I haven't had any negative incidents with drivers because they respect my right to the road. So I respect them.

Yes, I know, I know. But like I said, when it comes to reckless drivers, I'm not all too rational.

you better hope that guy never sees you again!

I wouldnt be posting this **** on the net. Delete it before someone forwards it to the cops or the it gets around. Someone who's sideview mirror got kicked off will be pissed, and no you don't have a right to destroy someone's car because they goosed you.

Edit: or atleast be smart enough to remove the specifics

I would absolutely LOVE the fact that you kicked the ****er's mirror off, if I thought it would have done any good. He is worse off, you are not better off. Not a pareto improvement. **** cars, and **** drivers.

Oops, that was a reply to afterthisnap.

And wow, do I ever want to move to Austin. I'm seriously thinking about it after I'm done with school. Bike-friendly? One of the best live music scenes in the US? You've got it made!

it's like San Fran (from what I hear). Biking is the "hip" thing to do; also austin is the 7th healthiest cities in the country so biking is big for exercise. (Ironically the place I come from is the most obese city in the country). As far as the live music, it is ridiculous. On one of the public television stations MET, they run show listings in a banner under the music videos and those banners run for about ten minutes just covering one week of show listings before it loops.
also, Lance Armstrong lives here. I mean, what city wouldn't be bike friendly if a cyclist "hero" lived there?

I'm not sure why biking is big actually. It just IS. and fixies are a-plenty. Even recumbents have their place, there is a recumbent-only bike store, and driviers politely yield to hunky recumbents that take up half a lane.

don't mean to hijack the thread but part of driver-cyclist relations varies city by city

Has anyone ever been in a similar situation and just stood in front of the offending car at the next light, not letting them pass? Unknown Rebel-style?

i've done this, 57th st in manhattan. it pissed him off, but it wasn't very satisfying. pissed off all the drivers behind him too, who tipped off a cop, who questioned me as i was locking up. didn't ticket me or anything though.

you hit his car...he hit your body...**** him!!

edit: as far as cities go, i find it ironic about vancouver that it is advertised as an 'outdoorsy activity mecca' and the drivers here can really be quite hostile. just a light perusal of craigslist R&R will show you how many drivers dream of running over cyclists and pedestrians here...

http://vancouver.craigslist.org/rnr/120332785.html

Has anyone ever been in a similar situation and just stood in front of the offending car at the next light, not letting them pass? Unknown Rebel-style?

Yes, for like 15 minutes. They ended up just accelerating into me, but it only knocked me off.

So I just had the most hostile encounter I've experienced yet.

I was riding down [editing out the specifics] (and here I thought my only threat was the infamous pedestrians that never learned to look both ways before crossing the street) going at a steady 25 mph or so when some jerk rips by me at something like twice my speed about three inches from my handlebars, only to slam on the brakes five seconds later to avoid smashing into the car in front of him that's stopped at a red light. I tactfully reminded him that there was a wide open lane to the left by slapping his windshield and flipping him off.

The light turns green, I take off and get up to speed, and feel something hit my leg. Hard. I'm sure it comes as no surprise that the ******* mother****er threw a water bottle at me; looking back on the incident, I guess it shouldn't have surprised me either, as someone who's willing to risk a stranger's life so they can hit a red light faster probably isn't going to be the most emotionally balanced person.

Now, I'm generally in control of my emotions and not very quick to anger, but when it comes to cyclist/motorist altercations, I'm always reminded of a friend of mine who was hit on his bike so badly by a reckless driver (who was completely sober but going 50 mph in the wrong lane in a 25 mph no passing zone) a couple months ago that we weren't allowed to see him one last time because he was unrecognizable. That said, I was seeing red and completely blind to logic at this point, so I speed by the car at the next light and kick the side view mirror off (just barely keeping my balance), and dart off down the empty sidewalk of a nearby one-way street.

Not exactly the emotionally centered outlook I normally try to have; I realize that the situation shouldn't have escalated as it did. Not to mention, at no point did I even THINK to look at his license plate until after the whole thing was through.

I guess my purpose in writing this is mostly just venting to a crowd that might be sympathetic. But also, while I was cooling off before I rode back home (it took almost a half hour of walking and deep breathing before I stopped shaking) I was trying to think of more non-violent ways I could've handled the situation. Has anyone ever been in a similar situation and just stood in front of the offending car at the next light, not letting them pass? Unknown Rebel-style? I figure if you stand close enough, they'd never be able to accelerate fast enough to do any serious damage to you.

Of course, the second they get out of their car, I'd take off in a terrified sprint, as I weigh in at a measly [I suppose a description of myself isn't too smart, either].

Whoo. Thanks for letting me vent.


[Edited out some of the more incriminating specifics.]

way to be out of line. hopefully next time you won't start something and have the driver finish it with his CAR!

Get his plate and report a reckless driver. No point in escalating a situation that could get you killed.

way to be out of line. hopefully next time you won't start something and have the driver finish it with his CAR!

Not to be a jerk, but I already pointed out that I was out of line in the original post.

Not to be a jerk, but I already pointed out that I was out of line in the original post.

sorry, didn't see that at the very end. i do think it's kinda frightening that people feel that you did the right thing though.

Get his plate and report a reckless driver. No point in escalating a situation that could get you killed.
does anything actually come of this?
I mean when it comes to cyclists, cops generally aren't eager to help them out. For example, here people have called cops about cars parked illegally in bicycle lanes but I haven't heard of cops doing anything.

I'm not saying that cyclists should be vigilantes but does calling in a reckless driver actually result in anything?

Next time, instead of slapping his car, scream "SERENITY NOW" as many times as it takes to cool down. Than follow him and take all the bolts out of his wheels??

Next time, instead of slapping his car, scream "SERENITY NOW" as many times as it takes to cool down. Than follow him and take all the bolts out of his wheels??

hahahahahahahaha...would the bolts come out meditative, telekinesis style?

it's like San Fran (from what I hear). Biking is the "hip" thing to do; also austin is the 7th healthiest cities in the country so biking is big for exercise. (Ironically the place I come from is the most obese city in the country). As far as the live music, it is ridiculous. On one of the public television stations MET, they run show listings in a banner under the music videos and those banners run for about ten minutes just covering one week of show listings before it loops.
also, Lance Armstrong lives here. I mean, what city wouldn't be bike friendly if a cyclist "hero" lived there?

I'm not sure why biking is big actually. It just IS. and fixies are a-plenty. Even recumbents have their place, there is a recumbent-only bike store, and driviers politely yield to hunky recumbents that take up half a lane.

don't mean to hijack the thread but part of driver-cyclist relations varies city by city

what's that city? i forget just what it is....

and stendhalian...same thing goes with boise, where i used to live..."outdoor mecca", they say....skiing, snowboaring, hiking, kayaking (road cycling is actually pretty big there, too). but if you go past a few square miles of what barely passes for "downtown", it's not really very bike friendly. it's where all the off-roaders and four-wheeler "outdoors" types live, and there are a lot of them. gun racks and screaming at bikes and trying to run down cyclists. riding there every day really built up a hatred of cars and drivers in me.

I always just think of it like a cycle (no pun intended). Maybe the reason he was so hostile in the first place was because of a previous bad incident with a cyclist. And now after another bad incident he'll be even more inclined to **** with a cyclist next time he sees one, each time getting more dangerous.

That's just the rational side of my brain, of course. In matters concerning *******s putting my life at risk I tend to anger quickly, and it takes a lot of restraint to keep from getting myself into a bad situation.

does anything actually come of this?
I mean when it comes to cyclists, cops generally aren't eager to help them out. For example, here people have called cops about cars parked illegally in bicycle lanes but I haven't heard of cops doing anything.

I'm not saying that cyclists should be vigilantes but does calling in a reckless driver actually result in anything?
Not always directly. It's more a record keeping thing. You make a complaint, it gets filed, if any other complaints get filed against the same driver or the same driver is involved in something that requires investigation, your complaint will come up. It's like it goes on you permanent record.

hell it's ****ing allston what do you expect...

I've been guilty of kicking off a side ver mirror in JP, AFTER they were out of the car and into a house

ok edited so no one can track you down, but uhhh well they can thru your proffile
**** I saw you at international the other day, your bike is adorable...

Back in the day it was a water bottle full of coke...... carving my anarchy symbol onto the hood.

ummmm...alexi? i'd edit that last post, the FGG one. waaaay too many specifics in that one.

Has anyone ever been in a similar situation and just stood in front of the offending car at the next light, not letting them pass? Unknown Rebel-style?
I got knocked over by a cab driver on Drexel's campus while coming to a stop (right on 33rd and Market where there is a marked bike lane) in the beginning of January. I got up, kicked my bike to the side, and slammed my hands on his hood yelling "YOU F***ING HIT ME!" trying to create the biggest scene I could. He made an illegal right hand turn on red and sped off. I was so pissed off at the time, that I didn't get the number or even the cab company......neither did any of the people watching. Go figure.

buy a small airhorn, ride by and blow it in his face, no harm done and it's quite relieving

I still see this every day, I still do think that driving is unhealthy and promotes stress and causes neighbors to hate each other when I see drivers yelling at other drivers. the car is just an unhealthy machine, physically and mentally.




not to pick you apart... but...

Seeing the things you just stated in that which I quoted.. does NOT show proof that the car is the factor causing people to behave this way. I'm not sure where you or others look to find truths.. but people have acted this way in grocery stores.. in libraries, and countless other enviornments. The car has little to do with it.

The human mentality towards others has been this way for longer than ANY of us have been alive. You already know this, but these days we are trying too hard to find the blame that things such as the car, guns, money and other material items are victims to OUR already natural habits. It's called.. drum roll please... The EGO! :O yes folks.. the ego. YES, cars do provoke us into unleashing this beast called the ego, because they are sort of.. in a strange way, tanks. We usually feel bigger and more in control of others, so no they don't help. But they are in no way the cause of humans acting hateful. I've been in the store getting a jug of milk and bread before.. when a lady basically shoved her way in front of me before I could get to the cashier. I said in a joking way "haha, I've just got two items.. mind if I go first?" All I got was a sneer and the good ol fashion "are you ****ing stupid" look. She ofcourse had an entire cart full of things.

Anyways. I wasn't trying to bust your chops.. just saw an opportunity to rant about something I find important.

not to pick you apart... but...

Seeing the things you just stated in that which I quoted.. does NOT show proof that the car is the factor causing people to behave this way. I'm not sure where you or others look to find truths.. but people have acted this way in grocery stores.. in libraries, and countless other enviornments. The car has little to do with it.

The human mentality towards others has been this way for longer than ANY of us have been alive. You already know this, but these days we are trying too hard to find the blame that things such as the car, guns, money and other material items are victims to OUR already natural habits. It's called.. drum roll please... The EGO! :O yes folks.. the ego. YES, cars do provoke us into unleashing this beast called the ego, because they are sort of.. in a strange way, tanks. We usually feel bigger and more in control of others, so no they don't help. But they are in no way the cause of humans acting hateful. I've been in the store getting a jug of milk and bread before.. when a lady basically shoved her way in front of me before I could get to the cashier. I said in a joking way "haha, I've just got two items.. mind if I go first?" All I got was a sneer and the good ol fashion "are you ****ing stupid" look. She ofcourse had an entire cart full of things.

Anyways. I wasn't trying to bust your chops.. just saw an opportunity to rant about something I find important.


sure, but how many of those people at the store or the library drove there and got pissed off on their way over? i can't deny it's an ego matter and some people will be *******s, no matter what. but i think being caged up like that exacerbates things.

hell it's ****ing allston what do you expect...

I've been guilty of kicking off a side ver mirror in JP, AFTER they were out of the car and into a house

i think it's commendable that he kicked off the mirror. people flip one another off all the time, so what? it shouldn't ever go farther than verbal. the driver chose to escalate the situation by chucking a bottle of water at the cyclist. i'm sure he's going to regret being such an unreasonable prick when he's signing that check for hundreds of dollars.

now before you hippies get on my case , the cyclist chose to escalate the situation by kicking the mirror off - if that driver got out of his car and the cyclist got his ass handed to him, then i wouldn't have any sympathy for him at all.

the underlying point is: don't start s__t you aren't prepared to finish.

perhaps if more drivers felt the consequences of pissing a cyclist off would be more severe than the cyclist doing breathing exercises then they would think twice before acting the fool.

And wow, do I ever want to move to Austin. ...Bike-friendly?

Someone said that Austin is bike-friendly?

That hasn't been my experience at all. Along the north side of the river / downtown and around the UT campus is excellent, but if you dare to venture out of the paths and onto the streets anywhere else, you're fodder for abuse in my experience. I've had more people shout and throw things at me in one day of cycling around Austin than I typically get in two or three years of daily cycling in Colorado.

Gutter-bunnies and sidewalk cyclists are legion in Austin. A couple of months ago, I was walking along the sidewalk and a whole herd of OCP mountain bikers came thundering by on the narrow sidewalk on their way to a nearby trail. It was a Sunday and there wasn't even much traffic on the adjoining street!

Pluses about Austin: The trail system is excellent. If you stick to downtown and the campus area then street riding is just fine. There are a zillion buses constantly running so it's easy to draft behind one or hitch a ride. There's a large community of fixed riders. There are good bike shops all around Austin. There is no winter so you can easily ride year round.

sure, but how many of those people at the store or the library drove there and got pissed off on their way over? i can't deny it's an ego matter and some people will be *******s, no matter what. but i think being caged up like that exacerbates things.

Who knows man, really? Me? nah, being in my car lightens my mood, but then I love driving my car. Not only that, but I tend to be a light hearted person to begin with in most circumstances.. which, leads me to believe even more, that cars have little to do with how people CHOOSE to react and act on events.

I can see however, if an individual has an anger problem, that being in a metal coffin would increase said problem, due to the fact that there arises that "control problem". So, yes, I don't think cars are on the helping matters side. But I really don't think they cause it.

I'm a FIRM believer in not blaming my actions on ANY outside factor. I believe that we, everyone of us willing make our choices to be negative or positive. That's putting it rather simply, but I don't discard that other factors can come into play, but ultimately, if a driver chooses to run you over... it's not because they've had to drive a vehicle all day.. it's because they ALREADY have issues. So, if you're in the grocery store.. that same person could flip out on you because you went for ben and jerry's instead of sealtest.

I think Im wording all that right.. but eh..

:)

yeah, sure, a nice person won't become a monster because of a car. but those who can't handle it or are already not so nice will have those problems exacerbated by... you know...being cooped up in a metal box, stuck in traffic...all that sort of thing.

"can't handle it" pretty much lets me see exactly where you're coming from.. and I agree.

The other day I was swerved at by some dude in a pickup. I don't think he was actually trying to hit me, just spook me a little (he'd been stuck in traffic and construction behind me while I commanded the whole of my lane, the bike lane being closed off), so I gave him the double-middle-finger salute and figured that was that. Until I saw his brake lights come on. He pulled into the bike lane ahead of me and stopped. I stopped as well and pulled onto the sidewalk. We waited there for a while, until I decided he just needed another opportunity to swerve at me, so I started up again. He gunned his motor, turned right inches in front of me and sped away, but not before shooting me one of those tough-guy Clint Eastwood looks we all know so well.

Maybe the biggest problem in car-vs-bike altercations is the disproportionate response to actions on wither side. I considered (and still do) the middle finger to be a perfectly appropriate response to a swerve, but the implicit threat in stopping and waiting (will he get out? does he have a weapon? should I reach for my lock yet?) coupled with yet another swerve seem out of all proportion. When he cut in front of me, he came so close that, were I less skilled (okay, even less skilled) than I am, I could easily have fallen, maybe even under his back tire. I don't think I'm out of line in interpreting this as a threat on my life. Finger =/= threat of violence.

In this case and millions of others, I would say that the car itself plays a big part. I'm guessing that this guy (I actually recognized him once he drove by; I haven't seen him for years, but we used to drink together very occasionally) doesn't go around making random threats at people he passes in the street when he's on foot. But while safely inside a giant suit of armor, herded into a line of other such creatures and subjected to traffic, construction, etc, frustration coupled with an enhanced sense of power conspire to lower the limits of what he feels he's justified doing.

Ah, hell, I'm preaching to the choir, and probably not saying anything new. To summarize: cars aren't the whole problem, but they're well above 75% of it, in my opinion, by virtue of exacerbating the frustration of otherwise average law-abiding Joe (and Jane) Sixpacks, as well as enabling them to lash out with minimal threat to themselves and maximum potential for harm.