Singlespeed & Fixed Gear - Suzue + DuraAce = stripped lockring

I removed the cheepy stamped lbs 15t cog from my road bike suzue hub and installed a 16t duraace cog..

I re-installed the lockring and found that it did not go in as deep as with the other cog... it turns out the duraace is a few mm thicker than the other cog..

so i tigten it all up and ride it ... about 10.5 miles down the road, i lock up the back and i don't stop !! then i'm freewheeling and going nowhere... thanks shimano ! =(

I stripped the lockring threads ...

so now I have a dead hub that I have to replace ... just got it a month + ago ... =(

I managed to get the lockring back on, and I used a liberal dose of thread locker (RED) on it ... I rode it to work and it was ok (didn't try to skid) ... and it was fine...

either way, I think I need a new hub .

http://www.nitrousworld.com/images/bicycle_pics/Schwinn/suzue_1/MVC-001F.JPG

http://www.nitrousworld.com/images/bicycle_pics/Schwinn/suzue_1/MVC-002F.JPG

http://www.nitrousworld.com/images/bicycle_pics/Schwinn/suzue_1/MVC-003F.JPG

road hub with loctite or on a proper track hub? suicide wheel = you lost.

I was running a DA lockring when I stripped the lockring threads on my Eno hub. Is there some compatibility issue here that nobody's talking about?

Dude, Ford, you've been around here long enough to know that you've got to retighten that lockring after you've ridden a few miles (w/o backpedaling).

Suzue Jr, I assume? That was my first rear wheel, with DA cog and lockring, and I didn't have any problems at all.

Of course, requisite sympathy offered. It sucks.

edit: I've got DA lockrings on that Suzue wheel and a Forumula wheel. No problems.

Suzue Jr, I assume? That was my first rear wheel, with DA cog and lockring, and I didn't have any problems at all.

Same wheel here: Suzue Jr., DA cog and lockring. It's been going on three years of solid use with no problems at all. I can't say enough for proper installation by proper mechanics.

Some things are worth having a shop do.

Add me to the list.
First bike: Suzue Jr. with DA.
Still working fine.

You're freaking me out a little. I have the Suzue rear wheel (not the Jr...the next one up...I forget the name...) and have a DA coming in the mail. Did you all have them installed by a mech, or will I be okay if I remember to follow all the steps?

from my road bike suzue hub.

road hub? or a suzue track hub on a road frame?

You're freaking me out a little. I have the Suzue rear wheel (not the Jr...the next one up...I forget the name...) and have a DA coming in the mail. Did you all have them installed by a mech, or will I be okay if I remember to follow all the steps?


The original lockring that I had on there with the lbs cheepy stamped 15t cog was removed from a NIB bianchi pista.

I have since installed that lockring on my ebay track bike and only use it on the track.

I then installed the crappy no-name lockring from the ebay bike onto my suzue hub, and I think this may have been part of the problem..

but as I mentioned in the orignal post, I don't think the issue is the lockring, its the cog.. the DA cog is like 2 or 3 mm thicker than the other cog I had, and therefore the lockring cannot thread in as deep as before.

What I may try doing is shaving the DA cog down by 2 mm using a grinder .... that should give me enough space to get the lockring all the way in ...

We'll see... there is still " some bit " of threads left on the hub for the lockring... maybe it can be salvaged.

Add me to the list.
First bike: Suzue Jr. with DA.
Still working fine.

+1

Professionally installed as well, even though I have all the tools to do it myself.

FordFaster I'm sorry 'bout your hub.

That said I wish there was a real standard on cog shoulder widths and threading. Seems everyones making gear which sort of works but is not the dialed-in gear we need. Its not rocket science but yet every manfacturer seems to have their variances. EAI seem to have the fewest issues so they get my vote.

I also 2nd the notion that you have to re-tighten the lockring after riding on an installed cog. Its just the way it is. Even if you rotafixed it. Even if you chain whipped it. It takes about 2mins to pull the wheel off, get your lockring wrench in there and then put it all back together. 2mins and you've got piece of mind for a long time.

FordFaster I'm sorry 'bout your hub.

That said I wish there was a real standard on cog shoulder widths and threading. Seems everyones making gear which sort of works but is not the dialed-in gear we need. Its not rocket science but yet every manfacturer seems to have their variances. EAI seem to have the fewest issues so they get my vote.

I also 2nd the notion that you have to re-tighten the lockring after riding on an installed cog. Its just the way it is. Even if you rotafixed it. Even if you chain whipped it. It takes about 2mins to pull the wheel off, get your lockring wrench in there and then put it all back together. 2mins and you've got piece of mind for a long time.


I had it tightened... I use the screwdriver and hammer method to tighen it on.

I had it tightened... I use the screwdriver and hammer method to tighen it on.

Guy walks into a bike shop, and asks to talk to the mechanic. he says "My hub strips when I do this" The mechanic says "Don't do that!"

Seriously man, get a proper lockring tool, or take it down to the bike shop to get them to do the final tightening. the screwdriver and hammer method is asking for trouble. Ride it up a couple of hills with no back pressure, then tighten that lockring on there good with the proper tool.

Which reminds me. I need to get a lockring wrench before I ride my new bike very far.

by that shot it doesn't look like you had your cog on tight in the first place. woops.

The new Surly lockrings have an extra lip that allows you to get more thread engagement if you have a thick cog that sticks out over the lockring threads. I think the new IRO ones have the same feature. Might be worth the time to look into it.

Ah, yes. I'm getting a better idea of the whole situation now. Since I don't have the proper tools, I SHALL take it to the lbs to get the cog/lockring on when it gets here (gaah! I'm sick of waiting for it! I want it now!) There is seriously nothing like the proper tools in this world of incompatible bike parts.

that lockring is on as tight as it will go without further damaging the threads on the hub...

and I know that it was on as tight as i could get it its just that it did not grab on to as many threads on the hub since the cog is so much thicker ...

i think i'm gonna grind the F out of the cog on my bench grinder when I get home today... that'll let me get that lockring in a few more turns and hopefully i'll be back in business ! =)

All I'm saying is that an unstripped Suzue Jr has sufficient threading for a DA cog and lockring. A thinner cog might allow the lockring to be screwed on further, but there was enough.

BFFGSS takes no responsibility for wheels with stripped threads and cogs with the F ground out of them, secured via hammer and screwdriver...FF, really, put a freewheel on this hub and start shopping for a new one...

All I'm saying is that an unstripped Suzue Jr has sufficient threading for a DA cog and lockring. A thinner cog might allow the lockring to be screwed on further, but there was enough.

BFFGSS takes no responsibility for wheels with stripped threads and cogs with the F ground out of them, secured via hammer and screwdriver...FF, really, put a freewheel on this hub and start shopping for a new one...


I think you might have a point.

I am in the process of having a local frame builder make me a set of track wheels ... I will then swap my ebay wheels onto my FG conversion ....

those ebay hubs (no name) have plenty of thread on them to fully secure the lockring and DA cog...

I think you might have a point.

I am in the process of having a local frame builder make me a set of track wheels ... I will then swap my ebay wheels onto my FG conversion ....

those ebay hubs (no name) have plenty of thread on them to fully secure the lockring and DA cog...

You'd be much better off. Or you could rotafix the hell out of the cog and use the wheel as a beater track wheel, since you wouldn't really be backpedalling.

But people'll always buy singlespeed wheels for the right price.

You'd be much better off. Or you could rotafix the hell out of the cog and use the wheel as a beater track wheel, since you wouldn't really be backpedalling.

But people'll always buy singlespeed wheels for the right price.

SO you are saying that rotafix is NOT safe for street / rugged use ? LOL

Some Suzue hubs don't have deep cog threads. the nicer cogs are too thick like you say. The lockring WON'T thread on far enough and WILL pop off no matter how tight you get it.

IN ORDER TO ACHIEVE FULL STRENGTH IN ANY THREADED ASSEMBLY YOU MUST ENGAGE THREE THREADS. For a lockring with 24 threads per inch, divide 24 by 3. The answer is 8 so you need 1/8 inch engagement in order to achieve a FULL STRENGTH assembly.

Hope that makes sense. Don't reuse that hub, it's trash. I've got one just like it. They cna be had for about $20 if you look around. Not worth it even at that price.

later
dave


I think you might have a point.

I am in the process of having a local frame builder make me a set of track wheels ... I will then swap my ebay wheels onto my FG conversion ....

those ebay hubs (no name) have plenty of thread on them to fully secure the lockring and DA cog...

tighten a cog without a chain whip (I busted my chainwhip trying to get my last cog on) - the rotafixa method ain't no bunk, except you possibly run the risk of cranking down your cog too tight:

http://204.73.203.34/fisso/eng/schpignone.htm

*edit*, whoops, I started writing this a while ago and missed the above replies.

I used a Hozan lockring tool for the first time last night (previously was using the crappy one that came in my lifu tool kit) and you can really get a lot of even leverage on a lockring. It was easy to feel like I was applying too much force on the lockring, and I had to go slow and easy, rather than pushing as hard as possible before it slipped off, which was the case with my last (adjustable, I think for bb cups) tool.

rather than pushing as hard as possible before it slipped off, which was the case with my last (adjustable, I think for bb cups) tool.

Park HCW, eh? Right there with you.

+1

Professionally installed as well, even though I have all the tools to do it myself.

How does one "professionally" install a lockring?

Is there some character trait that prevents people from threading and tightening a simple lockring?

It frickin easier then waffles and syrup...........

It frickin easier then waffles and syrup...........


uhhh, seen that screwed up plenty of times.

How does one "professionally" install a lockring?

Is there some character trait that prevents people from threading and tightening a simple lockring?

It frickin easier then waffles and syrup...........

exactly. get the right tools or risk damaging your hub and lockring. and be sure you put the lockring on in the correct direction. pretty easy.

the rotafixa method ain't no bunk, except you possibly run the risk of cranking down your cog too tight.

you aren't joking. it definitely works but man it's scares me sometimes because i'm always afraid it might be working too well.

f-ing rotafix.

I took the DA cog and grinded it to the same thickness as the surly cog that I had on it earlier, and then I put it back on using a brand new formula lockring... then I used the rotafix method but I think I over-did it and chewed up the threads on the hub !! LOL

sheesh.

Anyway, I was able to get the lockring on tight and I rode it around with just a little slippage after a few skids, and then I re-tighened the lockring a few times to be sure + used some thread sealant on it..

Anyway, I'm gonna take it apart during lunch in the workshop and try to JB weld the threads.. .we'll see how that goes !

and grinded it

So you screwed up a perfectly good cog to fix a screwed up hub?

So you screwed up a perfectly good cog to fix a screwed up hub?

Close. I think it's more like he screwed up a perfectly cog to further screw up an already screwed up hub.

Ford, just order a Formula hub for $45 (IRO's got a 10% off sale right now) Borrow a truing stand, and rebuild that wheel.

Close. I think it's more like he screwed up a perfectly cog to further screw up an already screwed up hub.

Ford, just order a Formula hub for $45 (IRO's got a 10% off sale right now) Borrow a truing stand, and rebuild that wheel.


I've been endlessly looking through ebay and amazon / froogle for something that is I like & can afford...

I've never built a wheel before & I Don't even know how many holes my suzue hub has... I've got to get all of those ducks in a row before I start doing anything else, + I want to go with 700c wheels instead of the 27 inchers that I've got on there now...

I'm just trying to find a good set of track wheels & hubs below $ 200.. then I'll just put my ebay bike wheels on my street rig and i'm set.

I'm just trying to find a good set of track wheels & hubs below $ 200.. then I'll just put my ebay bike wheels on my street rig and i'm set.

If that's all you want Chuck's has a set with Formula hubs, for $165, or the IRO wheelset is $185 - $18.50

If that's all you want Chuck's has a set with Formula hubs, for $165, or the IRO wheelset is $185 - $18.50

I'm getting Andate Cycles on the phone.. they are local (Miami area).. I'll see what a custom wheelset will cost me... then I'll decide... if its just $ 50 or so difference for the custom stuff with higher end parts then I may go that route, otherwise I'll see what IRO has to offer ... =)

Ok, I splurged a little ...

I ordered a wheelset, 28 hole DuraAce Low Flange Flip Flop hubs (2 track cogs and 2 lockring type) + Velocity Silver Deep V wheels. Laced 3x. + a set of tufo c s22 tubular Clrs. Price was $ 360.

So, at least I'll have a better set of track wheels and now I can put those ebay wheels to the true test of durability !!!!

so now i've spent more than what it would have cost to buy a pista or similar entry level bike... and I don't really know if the new components are really any better than the stock pista parts ? =/

Either way, I think my current ebay Mercier bike will handle better with these new wheels... we'll see.

Ok, I splurged a little ...

I ordered a wheelset, 28 hole DuraAce Low Flange Flip Flop hubs (2 track cogs and 2 lockring type) + Velocity Silver Deep V wheels. Laced 3x. + a set of tufo c s22 tubular Clrs. Price was $ 360.


It's all in how you justify it to yourself.

Ok, I splurged a little ...

I ordered a wheelset, 28 hole DuraAce Low Flange Flip Flop hubs (2 track cogs and 2 lockring type) + Velocity Silver Deep V wheels. Laced 3x. + a set of tufo c s22 tubular Clrs. Price was $ 360.

So, at least I'll have a better set of track wheels and now I can put those ebay wheels to the true test of durability !!!!

You're really doing your avatar justice...

You're really doing your avatar justice...


Thanks !

so now i've spent more than what it would have cost to buy a pista or similar entry level bike... and I don't really know if the new components are really any better than the stock pista parts ? =/

What, are you kidding? That's a ******* nice wheelset, and handbuilt by someone who presumably knows what they're doing. Way nicer/durable than Pista wheels. The frame's the best part of that Mercier...you'll notice a difference right away.

Also, call the guy and have him put your cog on; let's not go through this again, eh?

just buy buy all the same manifacture parts, then no problems. shimano w/ shimano etc.

hey ford, i went to my 1st elantra meet 3 weeks ago.some asian dude had a s/c, it was a blue hatchback.

hey ford, i went to my 1st elantra meet 3 weeks ago.some asian dude had a s/c, it was a blue hatchback.


thanks for violating my thread ! but yes, that is the s/c that I had on my XD a long time ago =)

It's been resold more times than florida ... lol

hehe.

f-ing rotafix.

I took the DA cog and grinded it to the same thickness as the surly cog that I had on it earlier, and then I put it back on using a brand new formula lockring... then I used the rotafix method but I think I over-did it and chewed up the threads on the hub !! LOL

sheesh.

Anyway, I was able to get the lockring on tight and I rode it around with just a little slippage after a few skids, and then I re-tighened the lockring a few times to be sure + used some thread sealant on it..

Anyway, I'm gonna take it apart during lunch in the workshop and try to JB weld the threads.. .we'll see how that goes !


don't reuse this cog on your new wheels! don't don't don't!

it wasn't the rotafix that buggered up your hub threads, it was the fact that you buggered up your cog threads with the grinder. if you cut something up like that without something to chase the threads afterwards, there's about a 99% chance that those threads are gonna be screwed up. and since steel is harder than aluminum, it cut into your hub rather than chasing the ****ed threads on the cog.