Brompton? Dahon?

[Eggplant Jeff]

Eggplant Jeff, has been conditioned to pay more because he has not been educated in bike usage like his more astute European and Asian counterparts. The people who use bikes the most tend to have simple machines that are dependable, not too flashy, and does it's job well. Americans are conditioned to have the best-even though it may not be on closer examination.

Yeah that's CLEARLY the problem. I'm not educated in bike usage :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:.

That's why I went and checked them out in person, test rode 'em, tried folding, etc.

And if you think the "European and Asian" counterparts are so much better, go check out the "depression" thread in General Cycling (it may be down a few pages by now). Some guy in India complaining about his flashy x-mart-quality bike. Everyone (mostly Americans) told him go buy a solid dependable not too flashy bike and he was like no I want a bike that looks good.

[Eggplant Jeff]

It's incredible how much Brompton wants for their bikes. Spending $2,089.00 for a utility bike is waaaay too much. The US dollar has dropped so much that you're really paying a lot for the poor exchange rate and not quality. Have you checked out what you can get on BikeFirday.com for that kind of money? Night and day.

Yeah I can get a bike that doesn't fold down very small. I'm not arguing that Bike Fridays aren't great bikes. I'm just saying they aren't ideal for a daily commute where you want it to quickly fold to a small package.

[Eggplant Jeff]

Hey Jeff What types of hills did you try the Brompton on? Will you be riding hills on your regular commute. I too like the folder size but worry about my hills, which kick my ***** on a touring bike. Charlie

I tried one hill that was fairly steep (although not very long). In 1st gear of the 3-speed I had no trouble spinning up it. The 3-speed gears are pretty widely spaced. On my current bike I probably would have been on a gear somewhere in between the first and second gears of that 3-speed.

If gear-inch measurements mean anything to you, you can look up the gear-inches for each gear on a brompton (try google). I've never calculated the gear inches for my current bike so I just compare by how it felt when riding.

[Eggplant Jeff]

Don't judge me to your standards.

Amen Koffee!

Every bike is ideal for something. Not all bikes are ideal for any particular task. Bike Fridays seem designed with the world traveller in mind. Xootr Swifts seem designed with the serious or semi-serious sport biker in mind. Brompton's are designed with the commuter in mind. Dahon has a wide range of models that serve most markets.

Can you travel the alps on a Brompton? Sure. Would you want to? I wouldn't.

But that's not what I plan on doing with my folder, so that's not a consideration for me. I plan on riding to and from work, possibly carrying the bike onto public trans, definitely carrying it inside and storing in my office, and probably taking it into the occasional store on my way to/from work.

Honestly I gotta tell you, maybe I'm just used to the Commuter forum where people ride anything and everything, but the level of brand loyalty / brand bashing in this forum really surprised me.

[folder fanatic]

"You don't sound like you travel at all.

It sounds like you need a folder just to get around town or something along those ends. Don't judge me to your standards. I do tours- world tours. A simple bike that you seem to cherish will most likely not suit my needs. I rode through Italy and Switzerland. Do you really think your low level bike would suit my needs? If you do, you need to travel more often.

I got a Bike Friday. I decided to go with the custom bike. Why? Because I want a bike that's comfortable for me. If you've ever taken a trip where you've had to haul 50+ pounds of gear up and down mountains all day, you'd want to be as comfortable as you can too. I also upgraded the components on my BF. Why? Because if you're hauling 50+ pounds of gear up and down mountains all day, you better pray your gears shift as smoothly as possible. I've done mountain rides (and tours) on lower end bikes with average components. I also paid extra for the luggage that comes with the BF. Why? Because it's one of the most secure luggages that convert to a trailer. It makes things totally easy for me, and it ensures that my touring goes as smoothly as possible. To say that I did this for ego means you know very little about folders except what your mind conceives of them to be used for.

Thankfully, folders have such a variety of uses that if you just need to tool around town, you can get a folder for that and not make that big investment. But the more you're going to need that folder for, the more high end it's going to go, and the more it's going to cost. And sure, there will always be people that think they can do a full Swiss tour across the Alps on a Itsy Breezer. God bless 'em. But for those who want a bit more comfort and want a higher performance bike, then don't fault them for putting the money down. It just looks narrow minded, and not to insult you, but it looks cheap.

I find it laughable that you're claiming my bike friday is non-transitable. I always can get on any bus or train by folding it down and sticking a sheet over it or throwing a big garbage bag over it. If it can fold, it will be transit-able.

Tell you what. Next time I plan my next trip overseas, I'll tell you in advance. You can bring your basic folding bike and we'll take the Alps one mountain at a time. I'll try not to let my ego get in the way." -koffee brown

My goal was not to attack you personally, Koffee. My goal was to simply illustrate what I was taught by my world travelling father who had enough of travelling when he stopped being a hobo (hobos are not bums) back in 1940. He told me that people made do with the simple things (including bikes) and to consider about the destination itself rather than getting there. It is true I did not travel for the past 10 years taking care of my father who has since passed on. When I do travel, I will probably not take any of my bikes along with me. Because of 9/11/01 and the two transit strikes in LA, I did adopt folding bikes as personal protection (and getting perscriptions for dad) during these times of crisis simply because my full size bike would probably be stolen while I was in the hospital. If I rode any high performance bikes-even folding ones-it will attract the gang members that live all around me. So hence the low end, ugly, boring, funny looking bikes. I am safe, my dad got his perscriptions and all is well. If I travel now, I would buy or rent a bike at my destination if I felt comfortable about it or need one. I like to travel light as I can anywhere I go, be it local or distant.

As for the original post's question, I merely informing Eggplant Jeff and others that folders are great all around bikes, are far more flexible than regular bikes, and don't have to be extremely expensive to be effective. I am not your average American since even with an advanced education beyond high school, I chose to take a sabbatical than join the workforce seeing to my father's needs. Would I do it again? Sure! And I would make the same choice with the folders. I did consider Bike Friday very seriously after my father's death since I would be more free to work and travel. But the roadblocks are still in place. I would put myself in danger if I even had one in the house-the BF's are way too cool. So I chose a simple Brompton instead. And the money that I would have spent for the BF went to bury my dad.

Thank you for your invitation, but I must decline since when I ride anywhere be it here in the US or abroad, I prefer to ride alone.

[Dahon.Steve]

Well he must have wanted to do it that way, since all you have to do is leave the handlebars unfolded and you can use them as a handle to wheel the bike around WITHOUT bending over. And you can leave the luggage attached to them too and you have a neat little luggage cart that is stable and allows access to your stuff.

Good one..

I didn't know you could keep the handlebar up and maybe he didn't either. You proved me wrong.

[Eggplant Jeff]

Good one..

I didn't know you could keep the handlebar up and maybe he didn't either. You proved me wrong.

Yeah it was one of those features that made me go "MAN these guys thought of a lot when they designed it!"

I can believe he didn't know though, I wouldn't have realized from their web site and stuff but the DBS (distant bike shop ;)) I went to showed me. If you just ordered online or whatever you might not figure it out.

[bfold]

If you have skate wheels on your Brompton with a rack, you can also push the folded Brompton along with the seat post up. Just becareful not to pick up the bike without setting the seat post back down.

If you have anyone of the Bromton Bags and attachments. You can also attached the bag and use the handle on the bag to push the folded Brompton around without bending over.

Just a few minor corrections. Bromtpon makes incremental changes to their bikes and more frequently in recent years so, make sure you test ride a newer version if possible also, the ride of a "C" type is not the same as the others so, make sure you test ride both. Some of the complains about poor brakes comes from older model Bromptons and the Brakes still use on the "c" model. They are the old saccoon brakes not the newer Brompton brakes.

Since last year the rear hub on a three speed model is no longer the same as the 6 speed model. They now use SA hubs on the 3 speed model and SRAM hubs for the 6 speed model. The difference in price when the bike is new between 3spd model and 6spd model is only about $100 so, I would recommend taking the option if the price is not too much of an issue becasue to change it later will cost alot more.

Other item to consider is the rack with the New EZ-wheel great for rolling the bike around. Definately look into the Dual Pivet back brake option usually $10 more if you custom order it. The standard High Leverage back brake is hard to adjust when you have a rack. Finally Definately check into the Schwalbe Marathon Kevlar Tires. They do add one more pound to the bike but the puncture ressistance is well worth it.

Enjoy.

[Wavshrdr]

If you have skate wheels on your Brompton with a rack, you can also push the folded Brompton along with the seat post up. Just becareful not to pick up the bike without setting the seat post back down.

If you have anyone of the Bromton Bags and attachments. You can also attached the bag and use the handle on the bag to push the folded Brompton around without bending over.

Just a few minor corrections. Bromtpon makes incremental changes to their bikes and more frequently in recent years so, make sure you test ride a newer version if possible also, the ride of a "C" type is not the same as the others so, make sure you test ride both. Some of the complains about poor brakes comes from older model Bromptons and the Brakes still use on the "c" model. They are the old saccoon brakes not the newer Brompton brakes.

Since last year the rear hub on a three speed model is no longer the same as the 6 speed model. They now use SA hubs on the 3 speed model and SRAM hubs for the 6 speed model. The difference in price when the bike is new between 3spd model and 6spd model is only about $100 so, I would recommend taking the option if the price is not too much of an issue becasue to change it later will cost alot more.

Other item to consider is the rack with the New EZ-wheel great for rolling the bike around. Definately look into the Dual Pivet back brake option usually $10 more if you custom order it. The standard High Leverage back brake is hard to adjust when you have a rack. Finally Definately check into the Schwalbe Marathon Kevlar Tires. They do add one more pound to the bike but the puncture ressistance is well worth it.

Enjoy.

I don't know that I'd go for the 6spd as it doesn't give you much more range than the 3 spd. It is about 178% vs. 216% or so (don't quote but I am close). It is more like a high/low range than something you can easily go up through the gears. It is more like a 4 spd than anything else. 1st gear on the 6spd isn't much lower than the 3 spd and 6th isn't much higher than 3rd either. I personally was quite disappointed in it from that persective. If it had a wider range it would be more useful.

As for Brompton brakes none them are really very good even on the more expensive models. Definitely go with the better dual pivot brakes but still don't expect great performance. I upgraded the brakes on my C model and now they are better than what comes up on the better ones. Plan on a brake upgrade no matter what if you like to ride fast, carry a heavy load or are in hills.