I just got this bike in size small. I'm 5'7" and my wife is 5'3", so the small is just right for us. I got the version with the S&S couplers as we dream of the fabulous European tour and other world travels.
After a week and about 40 miles of riding we love the bike. We have not had enough time to ride it as we have a 5 year old boy who can only manage about 10 miles per outing. Also, we have not been able to find more than a few hours to ride without him. Nonetheless, we have enjoyed every minute with the bike. It is at least 10 pounds lighter than our 13+ year old Santana Cilantro and much faster. In addition to the lower weight, the 700c x 28 tires and aero wheels really seem to help. Hills that seemed strenous on the old bike are barely noticed on the new. The only complaints or problems so far are (1) the couplers got loose after just a few miles and the frame started to squeek until I tightened them (I now check them before every ride); and (2) the suspension seat post needed some lube and squeeked for a while until the shop found the problem. Overall, the bike is great, with smooth quick shifting, good but stable handling, and a comfortable ride without too much sense of flex.
We are about to go on a trip to Florida (which was planned before we even got the bike) and we will be using this trip as a test to evaluate the ease of transporting the bike. Initial packing was a bear. The bike fits easily into the two soft S&S cases the bike shop strongly suggested. The cases are quite nice although I am still paranoid about checking the bike in soft sided cases. We will see how it survives air travle and baggage handlers.
The challenges with packing were: (1) I had no idea how much disassembly would be required, so I had to keep trying things to see what would fit and then disassembling until the pieces fit; (2) planning, measuring and cutting the protective material took forever and required quite a bit more creativity than I had been expecting; (3) figuring out which parts to put in each bag and how to arrange them took lots more trial and error than I expected.
After what felt like 12 hours, but was probably closer to 6, everything is packed. My initial determination is that removing the water bottle cages, all cranks, front fork, brakes (DuraAce, not v-brakes) and rear derailer provides the easiest packing and best protection, but this disassembly and separately bagging up each part is very slow. I expect to get faster with experience, but the first time out, I really wondered if the effort would be worth it. I'm sure I'll feel differently once I've had a few nice 40 mile rides along the ocean. Also, I hope that packing to come home will be much faster.
Ira
The BikeForums Team
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I've got a Co MOtion with S&S couplers, and they have never made any noise at all. I disassembled and re-asembled it at teh shop when I bought it, so maybe I put more torque on them than your shop had. I think S&S has an asembly outline on their website; it may be helpful for you in determikning what you dissassemble and what you don't. It took me a few hours to do the whole thing, and I've had years and years of expereince in doing this with racing bikes. You will get better... COngrats on the new ride, and have fun on yor trip. Off to Spain in 6 weeks ourselves!
ElRey
NOt sure it will be helpful, but here's a link to some packing suggestions: http://www.precisiontandems.com/s&soptions.htm
cornucopia72
We are about to go on a trip to Florida (which was planned before we even got the bike) and we will be using this trip as a test to evaluate the ease of transporting the bike. Initial packing was a bear. The bike fits easily into the two soft S&S cases the bike shop strongly suggested. The cases are quite nice although I am still paranoid about checking the bike in soft sided cases. We will see how it survives air travle and baggage handlers.
Ira
After seeing how luggage is handled by airport handlers, particularly in Mexico, but even here in the States, we decided not to consider soft cases. You need to remove the front fork? That is a lot more work and time than we would be willing to invest. Then again, you may find that enjoyable.
PaMTBRider
We check our couplers a few times per season just for piece of mind but never had any issues with them coming loose. I have never heard anyone say that you can overtighten them by using the provided wrench so don't be afraid of really snugging them up. I would also reccomend putting some grease on the threads before assembly. This helps in preventing any moisture entering the frame through the threads. We use a Dupont Teflon bearing grease but I am sure there are other alternatives.
We have travelled a few times with our Co-Motion and it takes us about an hour to assemble or disassemble. It partly depends on how much time we spend cleaning each piece. We are using two hard cases.
TandemGeek
I remember the first time I disassembled our tandem for travel... pretty much stripped the frame as you described. Second time out I found I could leave the brakes, fork, and water bottle cages on the frame, cutting way down on disassembly/reassembly time. I could probably leave some of the crank arms installed but the self-extractors & reuseable chain links make their removal a snap and leaving them on invites all kinds of potential packing issues.
Given that they now limit checked bags to 50lbs, I'm now thinking about using sheets of foam placed between the frame pieces vs. the PIA velcro-fastened tube protectors as of way of further reducing the time and bother of packing. I swear, 1/2 of your time is consumed sorting out and wrapping or removing the padding.
TandemGeek
We use a Dupont Teflon bearing grease but I am sure there are other alternatives.
You'd think so, but given how much time Steve Smilanick (Mr. S&S) spent testing and documenting the results of his lubricant studies it does make one wonder: http://www.sandsmachine.com/grease_t.htm
acrafton
Re the cases. . .I have a Co-Motion S&S bike and I called them and asked which case and they STRONGLY recommend the soft or hybrid case (you can see them at their site). They told me that the vast number of damaged bikes they see are from the HARD case. Even though they sell more soft and hybrid cases, they do not see many if any damage. They don't know why this is the case but they guess it is:
1. Hard cases are harder to pack so people make mistakes packing them.
2. Since (1), the bikes move around more and cause damage.
3. Baggage handlers may (they stressed may) handle them differently than hard.
4. TSA will most likely NOT be able to repack a hard case that they inspect but can certainly repack a soft one.
So. . ., I personally will trust the folks who made my bike and get the hybrid.
irablumberg
You need to remove the front fork? That is a lot more work and time than we would be willing to invest.
Actually, using a ratchet wrench with 5mm allen socket I can loosen up the stem cap and captain's stem in about 30 seconds. Once the stem is off, it only takes another 30 seconds to push the fork down out of the bottom of the head tube. Since all the bearings are in cartridges, they stay in the head tube, no muss, no fuss. I was amazed at how quick it was to pop off the fork. Also, the front brake comes off the fork with no more than 60 seconds of wrenching. If I tried hard, I probably could find a way to pack the fork and front part of the frame without disassembly, but packing is much easier and more flexible with the parts separate.
Ira
zonatandem
Pre-S&S fittings, we used to take pedals off tandem, turn the handlebars and put pipe foam on the tubes; put pannier bags on rear rack packed with stuff. A heck of a lot easier/simpler than the S&S route. However most airlines will no longer accept a wheeled in tandem, but demand a box/case.
Montague had a folding tandem int he 80s that I could fold and put in hardcase in 15 minutes. Record time claimed: 3 minutes with 2 people.
Sold a few of the S&S bikes and after initial disassembly/re-assembly, the 1 hour time is achievable.
If you plan to fly with tandem at least a couple times a year, S&S is well worth the investment.
We've done the majority of our major travels already and now pretty well stick to USA/Canada. Flying was easy/fast when vacation time was limited. However, being retired has its advantages . . . don't have to hurry there/back. Toss our stuff, tandem and Rudy's racing bike inside our old Accord station wagon, and off we go!
Pedal on TWOgether!
Rudy and Kay/zonatandem
TeamTi700
"(2) the suspension seat post needed some lube and squeeked for a while until the shop found the problem."
We had the same problem with our telescoping Tamer seat post. Lube only seemed to help the first few months. After 5 years of listening to the squeeks and other noises, we ordered a new carbon fiber one with the parallelogram design this summer. It also was quite noisy, even after being lubed.
Our final solution was to purchase a used captains post (unsuspended) on eBay. This solved our problem for $10. The funny thing is, my stoker found that she is more comfortable on this unsuspended seat post. The suspension was causing chafing, even with the posts set at their stiffest setting.
ElRey
I've travelled a bunch with racing bikes in hard cases and never had a problem. I knew a lot of others who had soft cases, and damage from their use was far more common than with a hard case. Not sure what the rationale from CO MO is for their (don't they sell the hard cases on their website?), but I sure can't agree.
TandemGeek
I've travelled a bunch with racing bikes in hard cases and never had a problem. I knew a lot of others who had soft cases, and damage from their use was far more common than with a hard case. Not sure what the rationale from CO MO is for their (don't they sell the hard cases on their website?), but I sure can't agree.
If I had to guess based on what I've seen, folks who use the soft cases tend to do a better job of protecting & packing their tandems than some who use the hard cases. Unless you immobilize what you put in the hard case by binding everything together or stuffing dunnage in all the gaps, everything in the hardcase will begin to shift as soon as you close the lid and stand the case on it's end. The more its handled, the more things shift and before you know it, padded tubes end up crossing each other collected at the "bottom" of the case when put on end, and when they're layed flat and things get stacked on top sometimes one of the tubes will become deformed. Same thing with stays and derailleur hangers, never mind "loose" items chaffing and banging around.
I bind all of the frame pieces, handlebars, and compression towers together using two large cotton/terry cloth bath towels and two nylon straps such that everything is immobilized as a unit and then pack dunnage in the corners of our hard case (water bottles, shoes, and other soft items) to keep everything in place (~48lbs). Our soft case carries the wheels with the axles removed (Thank you Phil Wood) in wheel bags along with saddles, a plastic tackle box containing the cranks, and another containing tools and other misc. parts (rear hub guts & chain). Thus far, no problems on six trips. Everything is exactly where I put it when we left and, thankfully, TSA has not opened and inspected the case.
cornucopia72
I've travelled a bunch with racing bikes in hard cases and never had a problem. I knew a lot of others who had soft cases, and damage from their use was far more common than with a hard case. Not sure what the rationale from CO MO is for their (don't they sell the hard cases on their website?), but I sure can't agree.
Comotion recomends "hybrid cases" not soft cases
irablumberg
Well, there is good news and bad with my travel experience.
The bad news is that bike lanes are rare and narrow in Boca Raton, Florida. I grew up riding in Manhattan, so I am completely comfortable dodging buses and cars on busy streets. My wife/stoker is not. We had one 20 mile ride that felt good to me and was a total panic trip for her and then we put the bike away.
The good news is that the bike survived travel both ways with nothing worse than a slight tear in a small section of handlebar tape. Packing the second time (for the return trip) was fairly easy. It took about 3 hours total. Much of that time is spent wrapping frame tubes in the protective wrap. The actual disassembly only took about 45 minutes as I knew just what to remove and how to remove it this time. It was also easier to pack each case as I had a pretty good feel for which pieces to put in which case.
Overall, I am glad to have a bike with couplers. However, it is clear that any time I can put the bike on my roof rack, I will opt for that mode of travel rather than packing and unpacking the bike. For air travel, I do feel better about having a bike with couplers. It makes checking simpler and also ensure that we can get the bike from the airport to a hotel without hiring a separate cab.
Ira
ElRey
I'd say that if you spent more time asembling and disassembling than riding, maybe you should rethink.