Mountain Biking - Back pain, what am I doing wrong?

I have a lot of back pain after biking, and during biking. When I bike, I usually get pain in my lower back, and later I get it between my shoulder blades. The lower back pain goes away after 30 minutes of not riding, but the pain between my shoulders stays for hours and hours.

What am I doing wrong? How could I adjust my bike so that it doesn't bother me as much?

are you on a full suspension? the same thing use to happen to me when I rode my hardtail with a 3L camelbak. After a while I think the muscles got stronger and I only had a little discomfort in my lower back.

are you on a full suspension? the same thing use to happen to me when I rode my hardtail with a 3L camelbak

yeah get a sissy bike with fs, then you don't have to build any muscles to prevent back pain.

:p

I ride a Hardtail, a Trek Bruiser 2. There's a pic in my Signature("My baby"). I don't have a camel back either. I'm 17, 5'9" and I weight roughly 160 lbs

yeah, how long have you been riding? I would get off the seat when you hit any bumps... that should help

You should do some workouts for your lower back as well as strenghtening your core with a stability ball. Pain in your upper back? I think you just need to build some muscle there ;-)

I wouldn't know what kind of workouts to do, but I do squats atleast 2 times a week, usually 3 and I stretch for about 10-15 mins a day. I've never had lower back pains though. Are you hunched over less than 90*? And by less than 90* I mean relative to your thighs when your cranks are horizontal to the ground.Your riding position might be too aggressive.

*edit* The selector has a very good point.

I looked at your bike, you don't actually ride with the seat that low do you?

yeah get a sissy bike with fs, then you don't have to build any muscles to prevent back pain.

:p

what are you like 15 or something? I could crush you in one hand :)

what are you like 15 or something? I could crush you in one hand :)

No, I'm 32.

If you really want to build muscle in your back get a roman chair

how long have you been riding?
Not much since it's the winter. I don't ride with the seat all the way down, but I do if I'm doing street, but in that case, I'm not sitting anyway. I had the same back pain all year (I got my bike April 1st, 2005) and it never went away. I look kind of awkward when I'm riding sometimes, because I'll be trying to crack my back somehow on the bike, or do some streches to try to relieve the pain. It works, but not for long. :p

go see a chiropractor

I would go to the shop where you bought the bike, ask them to fit the bike to you, get up off the seat when you hit bumps, and get a book on stretching and strength training. plus ride your bike more, after they fit it to you. I know it took me some time to get use to riding after I hadn't been for so long. I would have sore shoulders and a little back pain and be completely exhausted after a 8-10 hour ride, but after a few thousand miles (1.5 months) my muscles got stronger and I wasn't exhausted after riding. all this on a hardtail.

Upper back and neck pain can result from having too much weight on your hands. Sometimes lowering your seat slightly will put more weight toward the rear of your bike, relieving some pressure on your arms, neck and upper back. Whatever you do, change things slowly (millimeters, not inches).

those brake levers look like they need to be adjusted to point more upward.

go see a chiropractor :eek: A VERY BAD IDEA!!! Go to see a DOCTOR!!! Trust me on this.

:eek: A VERY BAD IDEA!!! Go to see a DOCTOR!!! Trust me on this.

Well, probably was good you came to this forum first, as you may not even need to waste your time on a doctor. A lot of MDs won't know enough about the biomechanics of your biking to know exactly what is going wrong. The guys on here have a lot of experience and have been giving decent advice.

Except the chiropractic comment. No point in getting your back adjusted/cracked/destroyed without any scientific basis whatsoever. I know some people swear by chiro, but let's think: Is it really fixing it if you have to go back once a week to 'readjust', and you never get better, and are never properly told how to get better? NO! Are they bringing you back a lot to make money maybe...in some weird caplitalist ploy that they somehow fit into their care for only you? YES!

If the problem doesn't clear with some strengthening and making sure your frame measurements fit your body, then you'd be WAY WAY better set to see a physiotherapist. They know their muscles.

Oh, and have a pint after you ride. That always helps the sore.

-RotD

Oh, and have a pint after you ride. That always helps the sore.
-RotD
You speak wise words my friend.

Except the chiropractic comment. No point in getting your back adjusted/cracked/destroyed without any scientific basis whatsoever. I know some people swear by chiro, but let's think: Is it really fixing it if you have to go back once a week to 'readjust', and you never get better, and are never properly told how to get better? NO! Are they bringing you back a lot to make money maybe...in some weird caplitalist ploy that they somehow fit into their care for only you? YES!

If the problem doesn't clear with some strengthening and making sure your frame measurements fit your body, then you'd be WAY WAY better set to see a physiotherapist. They know their muscles.


Just to bring in the other side, my personal experience, a physio misdiagnosed my back problem and gave me some exercises that made it worse. A chiropractor sorted me out, and though I was going to see him every couple of weeks at first, a year later I'm now on every four months and the next visit will probably be my last.

Having said that, I wouldn't go to any alternative medical person I didn't have personally recommended to me.

Best advice so far this thread: build core strength with a gym-ball. Even sitting on it watching TV (with your feet off the ground if you can) did a lot of good for my back.

Just to bring in the other side, my personal experience, a physio misdiagnosed my back problem and gave me some exercises that made it worse. A chiropractor sorted me out, and though I was going to see him every couple of weeks at first, a year later I'm now on every four months and the next visit will probably be my last.

Having said that, I wouldn't go to any alternative medical person I didn't have personally recommended to me.

Best advice so far this thread: build core strength with a gym-ball. Even sitting on it watching TV (with your feet off the ground if you can) did a lot of good for my back.
Having a few herniated discs in my lower back , I speak from expirence . I've been misdiagnosed by both doctor and chiro before the doctor ordered a MRI. This showed the problem , and would never have been fixed by a Chiropractor/Witchdoctor. I didn't need surjury , Just some shots into the spine (very painful) but they did the trick . I beg of you, DON'T LET THE CHIROPRACTOR TOUCH YOUR BACK . I would try rest and a Massage Therapist/Physical Therapist first to determine if it's a muscle problem . The Doctor I went to thought it was Back Spasms , the Chiro/Witchdoctor just started "adjusting" things , and did more harm than good .

I ended up having an SI joint injury in my lower back. Pain in the lowerback as well as up in the sholder blade but only on one side. It was first diagnosed as a bulging disk. I didn't have pain while riding but when I got off my bike I could hardly walk sometimes. Electrical treatments to the muscles surrounding the joint, and cold rub, seems to have done the trick. Deep release rubbing on the muscle tissues hurt while being treated but felt awesome afterwards. I absolutely would not let them do adjustments, no way Jose. Core training is recommended as well, as it will help keep your spine aligned properly. A good riding position is key.

Experiment tweaking your bike. Change one thing at a time, see if it has any effect over a few rides. If not, try changing something else.

Example: I had horrible neck pain while riding which led to migranes. I put some spacers on my stem to raise the angle of my handlebars. It allowed me to sit a little more upright (less aggressive). My neck pain went away very quickly. There was now little stress on my neck, trying to look up while riding.

Perhaps your bike is too long for you, you're stretching too much to get to the handle bars (as an example). Or perhaps your bike is too small and you're cramped on it. Etc.

Good advice earlier in the a post, go to your LBS and have them help fit the bike to you.

Good luck.

Having a few herniated discs in my lower back , I speak from expirence . I've been misdiagnosed by both doctor and chiro before the doctor ordered a MRI. This showed the problem , and would never have been fixed by a Chiropractor/Witchdoctor. I didn't need surjury , Just some shots into the spine (very painful) but they did the trick . I beg of you, DON'T LET THE CHIROPRACTOR TOUCH YOUR BACK . I would try rest and a Massage Therapist/Physical Therapist first to determine if it's a muscle problem . The Doctor I went to thought it was Back Spasms , the Chiro/Witchdoctor just started "adjusting" things , and did more harm than good .

It does sound like you went to an inept chiropractor. I'm not trying to defend them as a profession, just saying that the one I went to helped me and a number of other people I know. Maybe he's a fluke, I don't know.

But the main way I got better wasn't from being "cracked" on a table or any other quick-fix, it was by following the exercises and advice he gave me, which included the gym-ball. If you have a weakness in your back (and lots of people do, especially taller people, because we weren't really designed to be bipeds) then the best way for a long-term fix is to strengthen the core muscles around the spine. And even if your problem is more serious, no harm will come of trying this route first (as long as the exercises are appropriate and you do them properly). Given the cost of other treatment, it makes financial sense too.

But the main way I got better wasn't from being "cracked" on a table or any other quick-fix, it was by following the exercises and advice he gave me, which included the gym-ball. If you have a weakness in your back (and lots of people do, especially taller people, because we weren't really designed to be bipeds) then the best way for a long-term fix is to strengthen the core muscles around the spine. And even if your problem is more serious, no harm will come of trying this route first (as long as the exercises are appropriate and you do them properly). Given the cost of other treatment, it makes financial sense too.
Thats what a Physiotherapist's job is.

Thats what a Physiotherapist's job is.

Yup. I just had a bad experience because a physio misdiagnosed me and made me worse, but that doesn't mean most people wouldn't be better off going to a physio.

But anyway, the OP's problem is probably just as much down to bike fit, which is what he should get right first.

It does sound like you went to an inept chiropractor. I'm not trying to defend them as a profession, just saying that the one I went to helped me and a number of other people I know. Maybe he's a fluke, I don't know.

I would be wary of chiropractors, especially with neck adjustments. Someone close to me had an adjustment which caused a tear in an artery which resulted in a stroke and some neurological damage. Further investigation revealed that this isn't a rarity...it's actually quite common, I can't remember what the numbers were but it was a shockingly high incident rate. Lots of lawsuits and even deaths resulting from neck manipulations. Just something to be aware of...because I used to go to chiroprators and wasn't aware of that possibility.

But anyway, the OP's problem is probably just as much down to bike fit, which is what he should get right first.
yep for sure. The only thing i can think of is getting a bike with a shorter top tube, or putting a spacer beneath the stem, just dont go to the extent that NoF3ar did :D

As for the shoulder pain, do you stretch them at all before a ride?



Further investigation revealed that this isn't a rarity...it's actually quite common, I can't remember what the numbers were but it was a shockingly high incident rate. Lots of lawsuits and even deaths resulting from neck manipulations..
Ive seen investigative type tv shows on this, and i remember being pretty shocked at the amount of quack Chiro's that have hurt people real bad, i think in a couple of extreme cases, people have died. I will NEVER go see one.


On a lighter note :D

MD: Your spine is more twisted than Sinbad's take on marriage.

Homer: So, just give me some drugs and surgery.

MD: I'd love to, but to be honest, modern medicine has a lousy record of treating the back. We spend too much time on the front.

Homer: Yeah, there's some neat stuff on the front.

MD: I'm going to send you to my chiropractor.

Homer: Hey, I thought real doctors hated chiropractors.

MD: Well, that's our official stance, but between you and me and my golf clubs, they're miracle workers.


Homer goes to Dr. Steve the chiropractor, lies down on the adjusting table and immediately falls asleep. Dr. Steve awakens him:
Homer: Less yackin,' more crackin.'

Dr. Steve: We don't actually crack backs. It's merely an adjustment...OK, you're going to hear a loud cracking sound.

Homer: Hey, it feels a little better.

Dr. Steve: I thought it might. Now I need to see you three times a week for many years.

I've only had my neck manipulated once. It did what it was supposed to, but thinking about it still makes me flinch, and I wouldn't have it done again.

No one yet has mentioned osteopaths. Are they less controversial?

On a lighter note :D

Great scene. :D It worries me that you can quote it word-for-word. Please tell me you looked up the script on the internet.

Though they do say Guinness is good for the brain ;)

Great scene. :D It worries me that you can quote it word-for-word. Please tell me you looked up the script on the internet.
looked up the script :D I would be pretty close to being able to quote the whole thing, but my good friend rageofthedragon would be able to do it no sweat!


Though they do say Guinness is good for the brain ;)
it certainly is. :D

"Forget it Homer, its chiro-town"

http://www.simpsoncrazy.com/episodeguide/CABF05.jpg

Great scene. :D

That is a great scene!

You should tinker with your set up & try each adjustment out for effect before running off to any doctor (MD or chiropractor)! And, if it turns out that you must go to a doctor, find one who rides!

it certainly is. :D

In my day, it was another, less legal substance that gave students the ability, or rather the inclination, to quote Monty Python verbatim for hours and hours and hours. But at least you can run out of decent Monty Python quotes. If the Simpsons had been around back then, we'd probably still be there. :)

I would be wary of chiropractors, especially with neck adjustments. Someone close to me had an adjustment which caused a tear in an artery which resulted in a stroke and some neurological damage. Further investigation revealed that this isn't a rarity...it's actually quite common, I can't remember what the numbers were but it was a shockingly high incident rate. Lots of lawsuits and even deaths resulting from neck manipulations. Just something to be aware of...because I used to go to chiroprators and wasn't aware of that possibility. the same thing happened to a woman I met in Bend , OR. She got a very nice settlement out of it though. :D The guy who owns the yacht next to mine is a chiropractor , and a very nice person ,but hell would have to freeze over before I would visit his office.

To the OP, get thee to a reputable shop and get yon bike fitteth. If I had to take a guess, I'd say your position on the bike is to blame, and you lack good core stability. This is frighteningly common among adolescents and young adults in this day and age. Time to do some situps!

As to chiropractors, the entire basis of the practice defies logic. They treat the symptoms, not the cause of the ailment. Unless it grew that way [scoliosis], having your spine out of alignment is caused by chronic illness an acute injury or a muscle imbalance [i.e. a muscular or neurological wasting disease, or simply a lack of balanced muscular development/flexibility]. Temporarily treating the problem by forcing the bones into alignment is not efficient. Most of the problems people experience with back/joint pain [aside from arthritis et al.] can be fixed in short order with an appropriate physical therapy program. I cringe whenever I hear of somebody going to a chiropractor and do my best to disabuse them of the notion. [I]Disabuse!

the same thing happened to a woman I met in Bend , OR. She got a very nice settlement out of it though. :D The guy who owns the yacht next to mine is a chiropractor , and a very nice person ,but hell would have to freeze over before I would visit his office.

The person I was referring to also got a nice settlement out of it but it happened at 26 years of age and as a result of the stroke, cannot see out of one eye and will never be able to get a driver's licence again. They'd rather give the money back if they could regain their independence. All that from a neck adjustment.

I just can't stand seeing kids riding around with the seat slapped right down. I know the trials thing is fun but man my back hurts just lookin' at them ride.

strengthen your lower back and core muscles, that may help a bit.

I just can't stand seeing kids riding around with the seat slapped right down. I know the trials thing is fun but man my back hurts just lookin' at them ride.

They get 0 back pain.

Most trials riders hardly EVER sit down, it's just impossible to sit and pedal at the same time. The seat is only there on a trials bike to add some cushioning if you were to fall that low. Many trials riders don't even use seats anymore. They stand the entire time, can't get back pain when you're straight up.

They get 0 back pain.

Most trials riders hardly EVER sit down, it's just impossible to sit and pedal at the same time. The seat is only there on a trials bike to add some cushioning if you were to fall that low. Many trials riders don't even use seats anymore. They stand the entire time, can't get back pain when you're straight up.


Fair enough when doing trials riding, but Urban trials is what I'm speaking of...you know lookin' for a spot to session and then shreadin away. Sorry for not being clear. The competitive trials blow my mind, even more so on the motorcycles. I saw one comp where they to scale a vertical waterfall...insane.

looked up the script :D I would be pretty close to being able to quote the whole thing, but my good friend rageofthedragon would be able to do it no sweat!



Oi, I don't know, my memory is kinda hazy these days. Maybe a little morphine would refresh my memory?...Oh, heh, I don't know, I'm still a little hazy ... oooh, yeah! Now I remember it like it was yesterday ...

RotD...its happening right now.

Hey man, you're harshing my buzz.


Ah good times. One thing I'd say to OP is that strengthening your back also requires strengthening abs, and the other cores. Investing in one of these little swiss balls (do it right, go to a place that will get you the right size) would be very worth your $. The amount of simple yet very effective workouts you can do on these things, and as others have said, in front of the tv, is amazing. (For more entertainment, can also be used in the bedroom? :p )

Back exercises:
Supermans (on belly, lift arms and legs for 2-5 seconds, drop for 1, back up. Do for 30 seconds).
Back Extensions (on ball/simple gym machine, lower torso with body straight, then raise up and slightly hyperextend your back. Add weight as you progress, hold across yer chest)
Good Mornings (if you in gym, and have someone show you proper method)
Airplanes (on ball on belly, legs on floor for balance, arms out to side. Keep the plane of your arms flat, raise one while dropping the other, look to that side, then go other side)

Then Abs, tonnes of exercises:
Crunches (I find best on ball)
Ab Twists (elbow to opposite knee, also on ball is great)
Plank (elbows on ground, toes on ground, make yourself straight in between. hold 30+ sec)
One legged plank on ball (hands on ground, push up position on ball, move one foot off to side and hold it even. hold 30+ sec)
Side Planks. (One elbow on ground, outer side of same foot on ground, keep body straight between. Other hand can rest on hip. hold 30+ seconds)
Tonnes tonnes tonnes more. So many little swiss ball exercise books with lots of variations. Go to town!

On a personal note, when I started toning my abs more hardcore, I noticed a massive increase in my ability to climb and balance in tight spots. I'm still no free_pizza, but still, great for the bike....

damn free_pizza...what with his superior riding skills....I'll mace you good!!!!

-RotD

I saw a thing on the news where they have a kids' classroom using balls instead of chairs. They fidget less and actually work muscles while learning. Sorry for hijack, back to thread.

This looks like it would work well. Nice and simple and it won't take up a lot of time. http://exercise.about.com/cs/abs/l/bl_core.htm But if you do them you gotta make sure you do them right or else you could hurt yourself even more...