Clydesdales/Athenas (200+ lb / 91+ kg) - Clydesdale. WHEEL THREAD!

Hey all. I have a 60cm Moser M76 frameset. Stiff as hell and for a roadbike, its on the heavier side at 1.8kg (incl. bottle cages). Imp. Note: This bike will be mostly a hardcore trainer/racer bike. I'm a college student so this bike will 'do it all'.

SO, time for a wheelset.

ME: 6' 1"+ and 200lbs. in full riding gear.

I NEED: a Strong, light, and cheap wheelset. I know, I know, but there MUST be an acceptable compromise for wheels among the three categories.

RIDING: Suburban/rural MD roads so lots of road chatter and the occasional roadkill.

What I've found through a little research:
I can pay less for durable but slightly heavier hubs and move that extra $ to more expensive rims that will provide less rotating mass. Best option for me will be a 24h front and 28-32h rear OC rim.

Where you come in: Wheel/spoke/hub options that you guys can advise me on. I know very little of available Off-Center rim options that are acceptable in weight (sub 430g). As far as hubs, I looked briefly at the Ritchey WCS hubs but turned away when I learned of their problems (true?), so I was back at square one for good, low-$ hubs. Also, what spoke patterns are preferable for my weight/riding cond. etc?

BTW: The rims/hubs/whole wheelset doesn't need to really match. I am more interested in performance than looks, so feel free to mix and match.

Thanks a lot and I hope this thread becomes helpful for others too looking for Wheelsets in my weight category.

What I've found through a little research:
I can pay less for durable but slightly heavier hubs and move that extra $ to more expensive rims that will provide less rotating mass. Best option for me will be a 24h front and 28-32h rear OC rim.



If you're really looking for durable wheels that won't break the bank, 24h is NOT the way you want to go.

Ultegra/Open Pro (http://www.performancebike.com/shop/profile_combo.cfm?SKU=19253&estore_ID=&subcategory_ID=&CFID=80255315&CFTOKEN=95197581). It's a classic, for a reason.


Do you have a price range to work off? If we're talking $800, there are many options out there, if we're talking $150, there are still options, just different ones.

i'm 200lbs and 32 hole open pros do the trick. campy migrage hubs. not light. no zoot here, but so far quite tough.


btw... 1.8kg?

your bike weighs like, four pounds.

your bike weighs like, four pounds.


That's not really bad when you consider it is a 60cm Frame with I assume Fork, Headset, and Cages....


Ditto to what is your Price range...

If you're really looking for durable wheels that won't break the bank, 24h is NOT the way you want to go.

Ultegra/Open Pro (http://www.performancebike.com/shop/profile_combo.cfm?SKU=19253&estore_ID=&subcategory_ID=&CFID=80255315&CFTOKEN=95197581). It's a classic, for a reason.

Welcome to 1985...

My 2 cents: for those living in the 21st century, if you want a bulletproof wheelset for cheap, go with 32h Velocity Deep V.

I weigh in at 240lbs and I used to pop spokes all the time with a alex at 450 wheel, I now have a Mavic CXP-30 real wheel, with 14 gauge spokes on the rear and I have never had a problem with spokes popping off.

If you can not find a Mavic CXP 30 then the next best wheel for you would probably be the Velocity Deep V, and I think it will probably cost around $130 tp $150, depending if you have a your own hub.

The front wheel on my bike is still original (Alex ATX 450) so I guess the front wheel is not a big player in the handling department.

Campagnolo Vento G3's, $200.

http://www.totalcycling.com/ProductDetails/mcs/productID/968/groupID/2/categoryID/103/v/5f05517a-e3bf-4060-95b9-22c864a8fc19

Lighter than Velocity Deep-V, bulletproof, semi-aero, not to mention BLING! You WILL get attention with this wheel.

You DO have a Campy drivetrain, right? ;)

Welcome to 1985...

My 2 cents: for those living in the 21st century, if you want a bulletproof wheelset for cheap, go with 32h Velocity Deep V.
Yea but it isn't going to be light...count on >200g heavier wheel set with those rims over an Open Pro.

To the OP - I am 220 and will agree with those that say going with spoke count. You want 32 spokes in the rear for sure but you could get away with less in the font. I can't believe they haven't been mentioned here yet but here is the obligatory oddsandendos.com plug. I ride a set of Mike's wheels and they have been perfect for me so far. 28 spokes front, 32 spokes rear, DT swiss RR1.1 rims (similar design but lighter than Mavic Open Pro) with his SpeedCific hubs. Total weight is 1540g which is only JUST heavier than the CLAIMED weight of the Mavic Ksyrium SL3 (notorious for having higher actual weights), and they cost less than half as much at $389 shipped (remember shipping on a wheelset generally runs $20-$30 due to size).

If you don't go with Mike a local wheel builder can also due the trick...my second set of wheels are tubular and weigh in at 1510g, Sun Venus 19-AII aero rims laced 32 spokes f/r to Campagnolo Chorus hubs...another sub $400 wheelset that will be bomb proof and is relatively light.

Bontrager Race X Lite Aero. Ebay 400.00 with tubes and tires NEW! Havent ridden them yet so I have no feedback as far as performance contact my58VW for testimony.

Personally, I think the "32 spokes for a clydesdale" theory is a bit too conservative. My primary wheel set has 20 in front, 24 in back and they've been just fine after 2000 miles with just a break-in tune up at 500 miles. Newer, "aero" deep V cross section rims are stiffer than the old box section rims like the Open Pro and can work with less spokes, so long as the rim ferrules, hubs and spoke nipples are built for the increased load.

Personally, I think the "32 spokes for a clydesdale" theory is a bit too conservative. My primary wheel set has 20 in front, 24 in back and they've been just fine after 2000 miles with just a break-in tune up at 500 miles. Newer, "aero" deep V cross section rims are stiffer than the old box section rims like the Open Pro and can work with less spokes, so long as the rim ferrules, hubs and spoke nipples are built for the increased load.

I agree. I'm 6' 3" and now 230 lbs. and have been on Mavic Kryserium Equipe's (20 spoke f/r) for two years. I was doubtful at first but they have held up great, still tight and true.

Before that I rode conventional 32 spoke f/r at weights up to 265 (yikes) and never had a problem.

At "only" 200 lbs. you will be fine with almost anything unless you are riding bombed out streets or something. Give some of the newer factory built wheels a try, you will be impressed I think.

I'm 210# and am very hard on wheels, have broken or ruined many over the years. I use Open Pro 36 hole with Ultegra hubs and the rear lasts me a year,(5000 miles).

Wow, thanks for all the replies so soon.

My price range is a maximum of $300.

That's not really bad when you consider it is a 60cm Frame with I assume Fork, Headset, and Cages...

Yup, the -frameset- included the Carbon Moser fork (w/ al steerer tube of course), 2 bottle cages+bolts, and frame.

I ride a set of Mike's wheels and they have been perfect for me so far. 28 spokes front, 32 spokes rear, DT swiss RR1.1 rims (similar design but lighter than Mavic Open Pro) with his SpeedCific hubs.

When I consulted with Mike for my wheel set, his opinion was that the DT swiss RR1.1 rims were the "new" Open Pro's. He said they were like the OP, but with improvements.

BTW, I weigh 230 lbs and he spec'ed 24/28 spoke counts for me, using the Niobium Aero rim he sells. They are on tha way as I speak, so I cannot review them for you yet. I fretted over the low spoke count, and called him 3 times to see if he was sure of the design. He is, and said that if I don't like them to send them back and he'll re-lace them to higher spoke count hubs/rims at no charge.

Campagnolo Vento G3's, $200.

http://www.totalcycling.com/ProductDetails/mcs/productID/968/groupID/2/categoryID/103/v/5f05517a-e3bf-4060-95b9-22c864a8fc19

Lighter than Velocity Deep-V, bulletproof, semi-aero, not to mention BLING! You WILL get attention with this wheel.

You DO have a Campy drivetrain, right? ;)

Lol, actually I'm stuck on whether to go Campy or Shimano. I have big hands (4"x4" palms) so the Campy-hand position is a little more comfy than shimano's, and well, campy also offers bling. But since I'm a college student, I have to really hunt for low-$ parts. I am semi-settled on Ultegra-10.

I'm 6'1', weigh 220 lbs. and ride a variety of wheels from American Classic 420's to the Ultegra/Open Pro's. Variety of rim depths and spoke counts and I've had no trouble with any of them.

Am. Classic 420's
FSA RD400's
Velomax Circuits
CaneCreek Aeroheads
SpeedCific/Aeroheads
Spinergy Xaero Lite's
SG Korso's
Ultegra/OpenPro's
Am. Classic/DT Swiss R1.1 (Newly arrived - maiden voyage this weekend.)

Wow, thanks for all the replies so soon.

My price range is a maximum of $300.

In that range, you might want to try the Neuvation M28 Aero for $289:
Neuvation Wheels (http://www.neuvationcycling.com/wheels/wheels.html)

I talked with the owner, and he said they'd be ok for me at 230lbs. He offered a money back guarantee if I wasn't satisfied.

I bought some Mavic Ksyrium Elites off ebay, basically new. I'm 240 lbs but relatively easy on wheels, if a 240 lb person can say that. No problems so far.They replaced standard 32-hole Sun Mistral sewups. If $1,500 falls out of the sky I'll get some Zipp 404's for duathlon/triathlon.



I was looking at the Forte Titan and Forte Gemini on Performance, do any of you have experience with these wheels. The titan only has 20 spoke in the rear and 16 in the front. Being 256 I worry that might be too much for that to handle. The Gemini is 24/28 which I think would be better. It will be a few months before I purchase and I am hoping to drop about 20 lbs before then. Would I be alright with the titan if I lost 20, or would I need the gemini and would I be able to ride the gemini at my current weight?

I can't really get a good look at the spokes on it. My Ksyrium Elites are 18/20 but the spokes are pretty big. Without seeing it in person I would say go 24/28.

but you are only 200 lb. Get a deep V, 28 X 14-15-14 spoke wheel at the back. go for a lighter rim 24 spoke at the front.

Campagnolo Vento G3's, $200.

+1 for these. I'm 270 and these wheels handle uphill downhill potholes, whatever. Great wheels.

Welcome to 1985...

My 2 cents: for those living in the 21st century, if you want a bulletproof wheelset for cheap, go with 32h Velocity Deep V.


Oh whoop de dip. The Open Pro builds a wheel that's just as strong as a Deep V, is almost exactly the same price, the only difference is that the Deep V will ride stiffer than the Open Pro.

The DT R1.1 is an awesome rim, but I've not been able to find them for less than about $120/pair, though that could be well within the OP's budget depending on the rest of the build.

Campagnolo Vento G3's, $200.

http://www.totalcycling.com/ProductDetails/mcs/productID/968/groupID/2/categoryID/103/v/5f05517a-e3bf-4060-95b9-22c864a8fc19

Lighter than Velocity Deep-V, bulletproof, semi-aero, not to mention BLING! You WILL get attention with this wheel.

You DO have a Campy drivetrain, right? ;)

I have Vento G3s, they are very durable, but they are heavy at 1.9kg. The campy skewers are way too heavy. For better aero I prefer my Easton Vistas.

200lb/61cm frame.

I've got the Vento G3's on my new 'cross bike. ~60 miles on 'em--so far, so good for this 225lbs clyde. the '06 Vento's have been lightened by ~15% if memory serves.

Yep, the '06 Ventos are now just a bit over 1700g (according to website), making it a relatively light 'clyde wheel. But man, who cares about weight- don't tell me you can get another for $200 that looks so sweet!

While browsing for unrelated parts, I hit the Yello Jersey website. They have a nice selection of pre-built Velocity wheelsets for good prices. Check it out:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/velwp.html

Cane creek?
You guys have any opinions on Cane Creek stuff?? I glanced at their Volos line since they offer the durable-yet-light OC rear rim. Now if only I could find their stuff in parts and build my wheelet as I wish intead of buying an $800 wheelset.

So nobody goes the "touring wheelset" route?
Such as a nice pair of 36h A719's?

If $1,500 falls out of the sky I'll get some Zipp 404's for duathlon/triathlon.

Gotta go with the 404 Clydesdale.
(http://zippdnn.onet.net/Products/Wheels/tabid/85/CategoryID/2/List/1/Level/1/ProductID/42/Default.aspx?SortField=ProductName,ProductName)

So nobody goes the "touring wheelset" route?
Such as a nice pair of 36h A719's?
Gave them away in Pelican Rapids, MN.
My touring wheels (700c):
36 Hole Bontrager Mavrick up front/lX hub (came with the bike)
48 hole Bontrager Clyde (best name, ever) with high flange XT tandem hub with shortened axel. i swear this is teh strongest bike part I've ever owned.
MTB(26):
X517/36DT/XT
MTB2(26):
Front: 217/36DT/LX
Rear: Rhyno Lite/36DT/LX

I've killed:
36 hole
the a719s, bontrager mavrick (however, this was a great road set), a 36 hole , 217, x517
32 hole: Everything

So far, I've never killed a rhyno lite or a clyde.
Somewhere between 300-250ish. Loaded touring done with 50 extra lbs.

Mavic rims and Sapim spokes; strong like bull.

My cross wheels are 32 front 36 rear. mavic cxp 33 laced 3 cross to King hubs. Fixed gear 36 front and rear. 3 cross Suzue Promax hus laced to Ambrosio Evolution Rims. I have not any problems with these. My rear road wheel on other hand is 32 hole 3 cross Campy hub laced to a Campy Moskva 80 rim and it comes out of true every four Months.

I've started riding again back in May of this year- back when I used to ride, the wheels you got on your bike were the wheels you used! I'm 6'3" 250. Since I started riding again, here's what I've tried and the results:

Mavic Open Pro/ultegra hubs 32 spoke from Performance- used for 200 miles and were out of true- got them true again, but haven't put them back on for round 2.

Xero xr3's- used for about 100 miles until I got the open pros- stayed perfectly true, but I was uncomfortable with the 20 spoke count rears, so I removed them and sold them.

Gimpiemme T-due 24 spoke Rolf Patent design- used for about 100 miles as well and they are still true as well- removed to upgrade to Kysriums.

2006 Mavic Ksyrium SSC SL's- used for ~100 miles and broke a spoke when trying to catch a light- was told by the shop how rare this was and how they never see broken spokes on these (funny that they would stock the spokes though). I guess I'm just super strong- NOT!

Velocity Deep V 40 spoke- 500 miles with no problems, still perfectly true even after some pretty good hits to them. Weigh about as much as my bike, but I know I'll be able to finish my ride on these.

In summary- I love the Mavic wheels- both the Open Pro and the Ksyriums are great wheels- they accelerate better than the other wheelsets- but so far, they've been the only two to give me problems (granted the Open pros may be a build issue). The deep v's so far are as advertised.

Campagnolo Vento G3's...

^ +1 for this advice! If you're less than 250#, have a Campy drive train, and want FANTASTIC wheels, the Campy Ventos are absolutely great!

My cross wheels are 32 front 36 rear. mavic cxp 33 laced 3 cross to King hubs...

And here's my experience with Mavic CXP-33s:

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=201510

Cane creek?
You guys have any opinions on Cane Creek stuff?? I glanced at their Volos line since they offer the durable-yet-light OC rear rim. Now if only I could find their stuff in parts and build my wheelet as I wish intead of buying an $800 wheelset.

I'm 220 (lost 10 lbs in the last two weeks ;)). I have 3 sets of wheels that I ride regularly and I've had no trouble with any of them.

1. Cane Creek Volos XL. They are cool, not too heavy and provide marginal aero benefit. The rim is VERY strong and the ride is stiff. 3000 miles and no issues.

2. Krysrium (sp?)Elite. 9000ish miles and only one problem (slight out of true) after nailing a rr crossing at 40 mph. These are good light all around wheels.

3. Mavic A719's w/ 105 hubs. These things are HEAVY. I use them in the winter with studded tires. NOT a good setup if you don't want to realize how much your wheels weigh every time you go uphill. DEFINATELY the wheels you want if you ride loaded through ice-rutted roads.

I've also ridden Mavic MA3 rims and they are okay also, but I did notice the weight of them a bit when compared to #1 or #2.

I have a buddy (250 lbs) that swears by the Easton Orion wheelset and another (210ish) that swears by Rolf Viggor. I think those are all out of your price-range though.

I'm 6'6", 260 pounds, and not very polite to my wheels. I'll be truthful: I beat up every part of my bike as though I hate it. Amazingly, I've done well with my wheel choices. The stocker hoops on my bike were Specialized 26 x 1.5 32h 3x laced to DX hubs. I had to replace the front one after being hit by a truck, but it lasted me a long time. The rear didn't hold up so well, but the Mavic XC717 3x laced to an XT hub seems to be doing the trick now. It doesn't go out of true as much as the stocker hoops did, and it doesn't feel as 'flexy' when I'm standing and mashing up hills.

I'm slowly gathering the parts to build a Surly Cross Check ss/fg for my next commuter ride, and I'm looking to go totally bombproof on the wheels since they'll be subjected to my Sasquatch-like bulk stomping and torquing up a 3/4 mile hill on my daily ride to work. I've been thinking that Velocity Deep V hoops 3x laced to 36h Phil Wood Kiss-OFF ss/fg flip-flop rear and matching 36h Phil K-O front would do the trick. My only issue is that the Phil hubs are pretty expensive. I'll spend the money if I need to, but are there other companies that make a 132.5mm spaced, 36h, ss/fg flip-flop?

Ritchey Comp. I weigh 235 and bomb my bike down brick roads just fine with them.....the same roads that made my Campy Sciroccos crack.

I mght try the new sciroccos though, they look a bit tougher this year around.

I have the same problem. I'm 6'1" @ 240 and have just noticed that a few spokes are starting to pull the eyelets from my Ritchey Girder rim after 2300 mi. I had the same problem last year with a Ritchey OCR. I ridw a 28 in the rear usually a gatorskin @ 110psi. What am I doing wrong?? Do they make Titanium rims?

Thanks in advance
John

Oh whoop de dip. The Open Pro builds a wheel that's just as strong as a Deep V, is almost exactly the same price, the only difference is that the Deep V will ride stiffer than the Open Pro..

In my opinion the Open Pro is nowhere near as strong as the Deep V. I've built lots and lots of wheels. Open Pro is a rather old box design with known eyelet issues. The Deep V has got triangulation on it's side along with about 40g of metal. I don't like to spec the Open Pro for riders over 200lb. Yes that's conservative. But I specialize in wheels and have a reputation as a problem solver. Open Pros just aren't stiff enough to give a long stress-affected area with minimal tension change,(tension change breaks spokes) especially when I offer a lifetime truing and spoke breakage warranty on wheels I spec.


The DT R1.1 is an awesome rim, but I've not been able to find them for less than about $120/pair, though that could be well within the OP's budget depending on the rest of the build.

Totally agree. The RR1.1 is a great rim, but in this case I'd probably spec the deeper RR1.2....and that leaves, what, $180 for hubs, spokes and labor? Remember folks, the hub is the heart of the wheel. Whatever you do, don't cheap out on the hubs. When the hub dies, so does the wheel.

...tension change breaks spokes...


Remember folks, the hub is the heart of the wheel. Whatever you do, don't cheap out on the hubs. When the hub dies, so does the wheel.

Just in case someone missed it. Great post.

In addition to budget, the other thing that I think is important to know is what the rider's attitude is about user-friendly serviceability. Do you take your wheel and your Visa card to the LBS when you get a small lateral blip, or do you just take out your spoke wrench? I think the Ultegra/Open Pro still has the most going for it in the weight-to-strength/user-friendliness/price matrix of tradeoffs.
I do like the Cane Creek products, though I haven't ridden on them. It could well be that having the spoke nipples at the hub is a particular advantage for heavier riders. If you can find the Volos for $300, buy 'em. You can probably find a pair of NOS Aeroheads for $200 or so. If you wanted the bladed look and it were a couple of weeks earlier, you could have had a set of Rol SL28's for $199, but they're gone now. You can get a good buy on a Forte Titan set (relabeled Neuvations) at Performance right now, but I have no experience with them.

Campagnolo Vento G3's, $200.

http://www.totalcycling.com/ProductDetails/mcs/productID/968/groupID/2/categoryID/103/v/5f05517a-e3bf-4060-95b9-22c864a8fc19

Lighter than Velocity Deep-V, bulletproof, semi-aero, not to mention BLING! You WILL get attention with this wheel.

You DO have a Campy drivetrain, right? ;)

I am building up a 30 year-old race bike that's all old campy. Those rims would really make it look sharp. I will just be using the bike for training so the extra weight does not concern me, and the price is better than the Ksyriums I was considering. It's difficult to believe the rims could support Clydesdale weight. Thanks for the tip.

They have a lot of lustworthy stuff over at that Irish bike warehouse. Did you notice they have the new Ultegra compact cranksets?

http://www.totalcycling.com/productimages/fullsize/1028.jpg

95kg/210lbs

bomb proof wheels (but stiff as hell)

Hubset – DT Swiss 240S disc 32 hole
Spokes – stainless straight gauge 2.0 laced 3 cross
Rims – Mavic CXP33 black 32 hole

the wheels could be made even stronger if built with twisted and soldered spoke intersections

Campagnolo Vento G3's, $200.

http://www.totalcycling.com/ProductDetails/mcs/productID/968/groupID/2/categoryID/103/v/5f05517a-e3bf-4060-95b9-22c864a8fc19

Lighter than Velocity Deep-V, bulletproof, semi-aero, not to mention BLING! You WILL get attention with this wheel.

You DO have a Campy drivetrain, right? ;)

Just don't expect the rear wheel to be round. I was just at Interbike. Without exception, every rear Campy wheel with that spoke pattern was noticably out of true radially. Fronts seemed OK, but the rears.....yeesh.....

Amazing... Anyway, I just built a new rear wheel for my recumbent. 28 spoke powertap hub and Velocity 650c Aerohead. I've been riding on 650c Uriels for 3000 miles with 0 problems, 24 spoke rear and 20 front. Of course the 650c is going to be slightly stronger at similar spoke counts.

I have Alex X2100 rims. I broke 2 spokes in the first 1500 miles. I recently had the rear relaced with new spokes, and I just broke another one. Argh.

Here's another thought: your front and back wheels don't have to match, and the rear one takes all the abuse. I use a 48 spoke Phil Wood cassette hub with a 700x32 tire on the back of my bike. Works great.