Touring - Camelbak or no camelbak?

I wanted to know if anybody recommends a CamelBak for a cross country bike tour. Are they feasible for such a ride in the summer? Or will plain old water bottles do? I won't need it for storage since I plan on getting either panniers or a trailer so I'm interested only in water storage. Any suggestions?

--Sina

Hola mi amigo! This summer drove this guy to Portland so he could bike to San Francisco. He seemed to do ok with a camelbak. I was looking at water balders and backpacks yesterday :)

I have done several two week tours. On the first couple, I used water bottles. Then, I got a Camelback (a bladder-only one without any storage). I found that I drink far more water with the Camelback then I did with the bottles on the bike and this is a very good thing.

I also found that reaching for the bottles was a bit risky as it was hard to get and drink from the bottle without swerving. Thus, I feel it is much safer to ride with a Camelback.

Also, the Camelback holds more water than my two bottles and while it is heavy when I lift it, it doesn't seem to be a problem when it is on my back. I also tour with a water bottle, usually filled with a Gatorade-like liquid.

I never ride my bike without the Camelback now.

Ray

I agree about the drinking more and the fact that it's safer than reaching for water bottles. I quit using them because the heat that it causes on your back and the weight of that invaribly tranfers to your sitbones.

As long as you can carry enough water to see you through those long hot dry stretches when touring it doesn't really matter how you carry it. Just be sure you drink it. I carry a camelback on tour and on most days it is folded up and not in use. I prefer to just stop and drink and take a rest. But when the day's route will not include any way to replenish my supply, then I fill it up and carry it early in the day, useing the camelback first. Then fold it up and put it away while using the bottles. Whatever floats your boat.

There's nothing wrong with using a CamelBak for touring. Take a water bottle as well for use around camp. For summer tours when you don't have a lot of extra clothes to stuff in sack you can inflate the CamelBak bladder and use it as a pillow.

I found that I drink far more water with the Camelback then I did with the bottles on the bike and this is a very good thing.


Well actually it only matters if you don't drink enough with bottles. You can drink too much - (probably) it won't do you any harm but you'll be lugging around weight you don't need.

Personally I find carrying something on my back a bit daft given the fact that if your gonna collect sweat and be uncomfortable anywhere it'll be on your back.

Oh it's such a hassle picking up a bottle and drinking from it.

Why not take your fluids it intravenously???????

I have done several two week tours. On the first couple, I used water bottles. Then, I got a Camelback (a bladder-only one without any storage). I found that I drink far more water with the Camelback then I did with the bottles on the bike and this is a very good thing.

I also found that reaching for the bottles was a bit risky as it was hard to get and drink from the bottle without swerving. Thus, I feel it is much safer to ride with a Camelback.

Also, the Camelback holds more water than my two bottles and while it is heavy when I lift it, it doesn't seem to be a problem when it is on my back. I also tour with a water bottle, usually filled with a Gatorade-like liquid.

I never ride my bike without the Camelback now.

Ray

Using the camelback for WATER ONLY keeps it from getting foul from sport drinks too.

Tim

The part about the sweat it causes got me to think (!) about my Camelback knockoff, I got it a REI in Houston and the bladder is actually held up away from your back.
It's made by Deuter,Click here (http://www.deuterusa.com/racexair.html) Haven't used in a tour but works well for day rides. My two cents.... John

My .02:


Never tour your with anything on your back. Better for circulation, posture, saddle pressure. Keep as much weight fixed onto the frame as possible.



edit:

I'm also talking about tours > a few days. Weekend trips could a different animal entirely.

I have been tempted by Camelbacks for years, but so far I have not succumbed. I like the idea of being able to sip water at any time, but the thought of carrying weight on my back gives me pause.

I don't think it is necessary to drink constantly during strenuous exercise, just frequently. While touring, I am not racing. I am fine with stopping to drink... although I do grab the bottle and take a swig while riding if it is safe to do so.

I had never toured with a Camelback until I started touring in the desert SW. This summer I will be going across Nevada, and other remote regions, where there isn't a drop of water for nearly 100 miles in between services. So, I'll be using the Camelback and 3 water bottles, plus an extra liter in each front pannier for cooking, and some for the next morning until I can get to services. I also carry a water filter, but there's usually not a water source out in the Nevada desert. Of course all of these measures are only for extreme circumstances.

So, to use the Camelback, or not to use it, can depend upon where it is you will be touring.

All the best,

Ted Phelps
Central Valley, California

As a 'bent rider, I like the camelbaks with out the storage compartments. I usually place a 100 oz one in the bag on the seat back. Works great. I also carry some water bottles along JIC.
I use some hook and loop (velcrow) fasteners to secure the tube out of the way until I need it. I don't want it to get caught in the spokes of the rear wheel, so I am very careful with it to be sure it doesnt.

When the temps are 90+ deg or very humid, I don't think you can drink 'to much' that it will do you any harm.
One thing I have done is weigh myself before and after a short ride when its hot, to see if I am drinking
enough. "Short" ride is important, not so long so you have to make a "nature call", which will throw off your measurements. Even drinking what I thought was a lot with the bottles, I would loose 2-3 lbs on a 20-25 mile ride when was 95 deg. With the Camelbak, it would be closer to zero loss, but I would still loose some weight. Just not as much. When it is in the 90's, I figure I 'use' about 1 liter every 10-12 miles.

So in my mind (small as it is), the ease of getting to your water while riding the Camelbak a good idea if you have to concern yourself with hydration on your rides.

There's the thing too. When I toured from Tampa to NYC I *did* bring my TransAlp, lashed to the top of the Bob. Worked great as a bladder, daypack, etc.

So I'll amend: CamelBak's are great, just not on yr back. = )

I've used Camelbaks for years both on and off-road and I've never had a problem with them. Sure they can be a bit sweaty but you get used to it after a while. When I did the eastern third of the Lewis and Clark in 2003 and the western third in 2005, I packed the bladder with ice each morning and had ice cold water until at least 3 p.m. every day...and that was in 100F heat on the western end. The ice also keeps your back from getting too cold[edit: hot, I always get those confused ;) ]. I never found weight to be a problem.

I personally do not like using a camelback for riding because it's just too sweaty for me (I sweat a lot). Everywhere that it touches me including the straps over the shoulders just gets totally soaked and I just don't like that when I have such a nice alternative with the bottles. I've never had any trouble reaching down for the bottles and when I'm touring where there is a shortage of water, my touring bike has 3 cages for bottles and then I will just put 1 or 2 or 3 quart size Gatorade bottles in my panniers depending on how much I need. I do have some friends that like riding with a camelback so I think you just have to try both ways and see what you like.

When I climb 14ers here in Colorado, I have to use a backpack so I use one with a bladder and drinking is very convenient, but I don't like not knowing how much I have left and I do get real sweaty underneath.

Ditto the above.

I have three Camelbacks---50 oz, 70 oz (w/ pack), and 100 oz. This weekend, when the temp got up in the 90's here in the South, I carried four water bottles and the 70 oz pack. I never go without a Camelback except for my morning or noon rides that I know will be under two hours. In the winter I wear it under my HiVisisbility windjacket.

I packed the bladder with ice each morning and had ice cold water until at least 3 p.m. every day... ]. I never found weight to be a problem.

And if you do the ice thing, you've got a mini cooler to keep something cold for a bit (a red bull for a big climb, a beer for a reward after the big climb, a frozen snickers for 20 miles down the road, or whatever you crave).

i did a 160 mile single day ride and at about mile 100 my camelpack started to kill my shoulders. i really like having it because it holds a lot of water and a little extra storage. i think im going to try the fanny pack style one, it may be better on the shoulders(may not look as cool though)

One thing I don't like about CBs or bottles is that they are slow to transfer the water. I want a big hole I can drink out of like a glass of water. Nalgeen has a new lexan bottle with just such a top, works for me.

I hate camelbacks. (Maybe that's too strong, but I don't use mine anymore) BUT, when riding across the US, I finally figured out in Colorado that the reason I was starting to feel bad all the time was that I wasn't used to the the dry air and wasn't drinking enough. So I bought one and that helped. By the time we thorugh Oregon, I abandoned it becuase I was drinking too much and stopping to pee way to often. Bottom line - I think they're good for touring sometimes.

Water is heavy. Why carry it on your back when you bike can carry it for you?

Water is heavy. Why carry it on your back when you bike can carry it for you?

My bike does carry water. It has 3 bottles and I fill them every morning. Two are filled with Gatorade (diluted half strength) and one is filled with water. My Camelbak is filled with ice and water (100 oz). By the end of the day, my Camelbak is empty, or nearly so, the Gatorade is gone and the extra bottle has been poured into the Camelbak. Now were else could I put 100 oz of water?

But, but, but.... = )

Who bikes a full day, has oppurtunity to fill up with ice and water and Gatorade first thing in the morning, yet plans on hitting *zero* services throughout the day? (edit: Don't get me wrong here, arguably the most bestest perfect day of touring ever would involve exactly those conditions....)

If you're doing that kind of riding, why would you want to have 6+ pounds of the densest substance possible on your back? If you're planning this far ahead to post and research on the interweb, why not just carry a bladder in a pannier or trailer?

But, but, but.... = )

Who bikes a full day, has oppurtunity to fill up with ice and water and Gatorade first thing in the morning, yet plans on hitting *zero* services throughout the day? (edit: Don't get me wrong here, arguably the most bestest perfect day of touring ever would involve exactly those conditions....)

If you're doing that kind of riding, why would you want to have 6+ pounds of the densest substance possible on your back? If you're planning this far ahead to post and research on the interweb, why not just carry a bladder in a pannier or trailer?

I'm debating whether or not to get a camelbak myself. It's 6+ pounds of a dense substance that you really need. On hot days, 2, maybe 3 water bottles may not be enough. It seems like it boils down to this:

Pros: convenience, can stay cold most of the day, volume, volume, volume, doesn't take up any of your storage space on your bike

Cons: sweaty (that would probably be the biggest con for me), heavy (isn't the bike supposed to carry the load?), possibly redundant for a lot of riding

Unless you are riding through desert, wilderness, unpopulated areas, or Outer Mongolia, water is usually easy to find. I can't count the number of times I have knocked on a farmhouse door and asked the resident to fill my bottles. Nobody has ever refused, and I have gotten into interesting conversations that way.

I carry two water bottles -- none of my trips have taken me into the heart of darkness -- but I refill the bottles every opportunity I get. It has always been enough.

My bike does carry water. It has 3 bottles and I fill them every morning. Two are filled with Gatorade (diluted half strength) and one is filled with water. My Camelbak is filled with ice and water (100 oz). By the end of the day, my Camelbak is empty, or nearly so, the Gatorade is gone and the extra bottle has been poured into the Camelbak. Now were else could I put 100 oz of water?
I refill my water bottles when I stop for lunch. If I need to refill them more often, there are almost always places to do so.

Pros: ....doesn't take up any of your storage space on your bike

I could state this otherwise:


The bike is the machine. Locomotion, storage, etc.

You are the engine.

I refill my water bottles when I stop for lunch. If I need to refill them more often, there are almost always places to do so.

Depends on where you are. There are lots of places where getting water is problematic. For example from the top of Lolo Pass to Kamiah, ID, there are probably only 2 or 3 places to get water. That's around 100 miles. When you are riding with someone who isn't able to do the whole 100 miles in a day (or even 2), you have to carry as much water as possible. From Clarkston to Pomeroy, there are 2 places and a 2000 foot slooooow climb in the middle. From Umatilla OR to Biggs, OR (on the Washington side) there is exactly one place to get water.

I like the Camelbak because it allows me to carry all the water I generally need for the day (plus I get to drink ice water as I've stated before). I don't know where you are or where you have toured but, as a kid of the Southwest, I never go anywhere without as much water as I think I need for the day.

I'm not a member of the Camelbak police, so it doesn't bother me if you use bottles or a Camelbak. I find that the benefits outweigh the liabilites for my use. YMMV.

But, but, but.... = )

Who bikes a full day, has oppurtunity to fill up with ice and water and Gatorade first thing in the morning, yet plans on hitting *zero* services throughout the day? (edit: Don't get me wrong here, arguably the most bestest perfect day of touring ever would involve exactly those conditions....)

If you're doing that kind of riding, why would you want to have 6+ pounds of the densest substance possible on your back? If you're planning this far ahead to post and research on the interweb, why not just carry a bladder in a pannier or trailer?

Me. Often, especially in the western part of the US, you end up jumping from town to town. The length of the day is determined not by how much mileage you can do but where you can lay your head at night. In many places, the towns can be 80 miles apart without any services in between. For example, if you do the Santa Fe Trail, from Trinadad, CO to La Junta, CO is around 85 miles. There are 'zero' services out there. And by zero, I mean absolutely nothing, not a gas station, not a house (easily accessible from the road), not a single town...nothin'! If you want to depend on getting water somewhere along there, you will be disappointed. And it is seldom cool out there so you need the water.

I carry the water on my back because it is easy to get to and doesn't take up valuable real estate in my bags. Additionally, by placing the weight on your back, you have taken 6 pounds of dense liquid (not the densest substance possible by the way. Not even the densest liquid) from being unsprung weight to sprung weight which will actually improve the bike's ride. Not by a lot but still...

Depends on where you are. There are lots of places where getting water is problematic. For example from the top of Lolo Pass to Kamiah, ID, there are probably only 2 or 3 places to get water. That's around 100 miles. When you are riding with someone who isn't able to do the whole 100 miles in a day (or even 2), you have to carry as much water as possible. From Clarkston to Pomeroy, there are 2 places and a 2000 foot slooooow climb in the middle. From Umatilla OR to Biggs, OR (on the Washington side) there is exactly one place to get water.

I like the Camelbak because it allows me to carry all the water I generally need for the day (plus I get to drink ice water as I've stated before). I don't know where you are or where you have toured but, as a kid of the Southwest, I never go anywhere without as much water as I think I need for the day.

I'm not a member of the Camelbak police, so it doesn't bother me if you use bottles or a Camelbak. I find that the benefits outweigh the liabilites for my use. YMMV.

I haven't cycled anywhere where getting water was a problem. Even in India water was readily available. But I haven't toured any desert areas or areas without towns. On tours where it's been really hot, and it's seemed prudent to carry more water, I just strap a couple of large water bottles to my rear rack.

OK, just throwing this out.

I think the real estate might be valuable because there's not enough of it. Plan for the "worst"(/best) and have the space. Have the bike you've planned be able to carry everything you need. Get it right, first. Tour like its all your going to do until you die. You are there to create energy for motion, and to experience it.

Every moment you have weight on your back you are expending energy keeping yourself rigid and upright and balanced. Sprung/unsprung is small fries compared to having mass as low as possible.

OK, just throwing this out.

I think the real estate might be valuable because there's not enough of it. Plan for the "worst"(/best) and have the space. Have the bike you've planned be able to carry everything you need. Get it right, first. Tour like its all your going to do until you die. You are there to create energy for motion, and to experience it.

Every moment you have weight on your back you are expending energy keeping yourself rigid and upright and balanced. Sprung/unsprung is small fries compared to having mass as low as possible.

Real estate is valuable because I carry the smallest volume of bags I can and I try to limit my load to only the stuff I truly need. Any excess space that I have left over is reserved for food. I often travel in places where food is not available each and every day and I carry enough for several days. For example, from Missoula, MT to Kamiah, ID is around 160 miles. Since I was traveling with my daughter on her first tour, I didn't what to try and do 80 miles per day so we broke it up into where we could stay. That meant going from Missoula to Lolo Hot Springs, then Lolo Hot Springs to Jerry Johnson Campground, then to Powell, ID (there was a small grocery store there) and finally Kamiah. That's 3 evening meals for 2 people and 4 days of riding food. That a lot of stuff to pack! Putting water in a pannier rather than carrying it on my back would take up a lot of room which I could use for other stuff.

A Camelbak doesn't cause any balance problems at all. The load is on person who is providing the balance for the bike. It isn't off to one side or hanging off at an odd angle. Why would it cause problems with balance? It is at the center line of your body which is where most of your mass is located anyway. If you can walk carrying a backpack and not fall over why would putting a relatively light load on your back while cycling cause any problems? I would agree if you were trying to carry the whole touring load on your back but a Camelbak is relatively small and light. Having ridden many, many, many miles on a mountain bike on roads and trails that are far more challenging than any touring road I've ever ridden, I've never had a problem with balance caused by the Camelbak.

If you don't like Camelbaks, don't use them. For me, they have many more advantages than they do liabilites.

Oh, I love Camelbaks. = ) I like this thread so far, too.

Six+ pounds of weight (and that's just the water!) is not what I would consider "relatively light".

I agree 100% about anything off road. But touring roads are (generally) not exactly challenging. I'd say we're stereotypically talking about semi-maintained/neglected back county roads.


I guess I'm just saying that comfort ranks pretty high for me, especially on a self-supported tour. I like being able to move around and stretch and have a loose shirt to catch as much breeeeeze as possible, which simply cannot happen anywhere with one (even small) mass on one's back and two straps around the front.


Man I need to get back on the road...

Me. Often, especially in the western part of the US, you end up jumping from town to town. The length of the day is determined not by how much mileage you can do but where you can lay your head at night. In many places, the towns can be 80 miles apart without any services in between. For example, if you do the Santa Fe Trail, from Trinadad, CO to La Junta, CO is around 85 miles. There are 'zero' services out there. And by zero, I mean absolutely nothing, not a gas station, not a house (easily accessible from the road), not a single town...nothin'! If you want to depend on getting water somewhere along there, you will be disappointed. And it is seldom cool out there so you need the water.

I carry the water on my back because it is easy to get to and doesn't take up valuable real estate in my bags. Additionally, by placing the weight on your back, you have taken 6 pounds of dense liquid (not the densest substance possible by the way. Not even the densest liquid) from being unsprung weight to sprung weight which will actually improve the bike's ride. Not by a lot but still...
Cycco - good point about that stretch from Trinidad to La Junta. There is NOTHING out there. I've done it before and I think there IS one house out there, but it didn't look like anyone was home. Luckily, I had scouted it out before and we had a support vehicle on that trip so we provided our own rest stop. For me though, I would only use the camelbak as a last resort because I don't like how they make me sweat so much. I make room in my panniers for extra water or if that still wasn't enough, I might take my camelback and strap it on to the rear rack somehow.

Personally I find carrying something on my back a bit daft given the fact that if your gonna collect sweat and be uncomfortable anywhere it'll be on your back.


That part of the post I agree with. BUT if I was on a multi day tour and water was rare I would carry one. On the sole purpose of not getting dehydrated.

Cycco - good point about that stretch from Trinidad to La Junta. There is NOTHING out there. I've done it before and I think there IS one house out there, but it didn't look like anyone was home. Luckily, I had scouted it out before and we had a support vehicle on that trip so we provided our own rest stop. For me though, I would only use the camelbak as a last resort because I don't like how they make me sweat so much. I make room in my panniers for extra water or if that still wasn't enough, I might take my camelback and strap it on to the rear rack somehow.

I had a greatuncle who managed to get killed near Tyrone (there used to be three houses there in the 60's) around the start of WWII. Flattest most open country in the world, you can see for 25 miles in any given direction and he finds a train to run over him! :eek:

As for the Camelbak, it's all personal choice (and a little bit of acclaimation). I don't mind it, some people do. There's no right or wrong way to do it. But I suggest to anyone to at least give a try. If you don't like it, the Bladder Police won't come and arrest you :D

I use mine when mountian biking, where it's harder to cycle and reach for a bottle and you're certainly more likely to be even farther from services if you're out for the day. But for road cycling, I don't like the weight on my back. The only good I see for a Camelback is that it can aparently (though I've not tried it) be inflated for a pillow, it can keep a good amount of water cold if you stash it someplace, and it's handy if you decide to go for a day hike. Fill it up, stash a map and some snacks in the pocket and you're good for a nice day hike.

I use mine when mountian biking, where it's harder to cycle and reach for a bottle and you're certainly more likely to be even farther from services if you're out for the day. But for road cycling, I don't like the weight on my back. The only good I see for a Camelback is that it can aparently (though I've not tried it) be inflated for a pillow, it can keep a good amount of water cold if you stash it someplace, and it's handy if you decide to go for a day hike. Fill it up, stash a map and some snacks in the pocket and you're good for a nice day hike.

It will keep a good amount of water cold riding in full sun on your back...even when it's bloody damned hot outside! ;)

It will keep a good amount of water cold riding in full sun on your back...even when it's bloody damned hot outside! ;)

Yes, it certainly will. I constructed my sentence poorly. I was just listing the positive attributes of still hauling a Camelbak even if you wouldn't want to wear it due to weight, sweat and/or whatever else.

Hey, for those who like hydration packs, which models do you prefer? I'm thinking about getting a Camelbak Lobo - has a little storage for the essentials, in case you want to leave the bike, but not too large, heavy, or sweaty.

Might be a worthy of a separate thread...


I love my TransAlp for everything below a few hours.

Whnever I tour, I carry a hydrastorm bladder inside of my badlands backpack. Camelback packs have a horrible warranty, and the bladders have broken on me one too many times. Hydrastorm bladders (www.blackhawk.com) do not wear out and make a mess like camelbacks are sure to do, and Badlands backpacks (www.badlandsbackpacks.com) have an unconditional lifetime you break it we fix it warranty, whether you are the 1st owner or the 10th, unlike Camelback who I believe has a conditional one or two year warranty. Water is among my top priorities while touring out in the middle of nowhere, and camelback has betrayed my trust one too many times for me to use their products.

Thanks to everybody who responded to the post. I did not expect such an overflow of responses. The knowledge I gained from your responses helped a lot and I have decided to get a CamelBak after all. Probably the biggest one I can get that holds only fluids (no storage).

Thanks again and stick aroud for my other posts!

--Sina Aboutalebi