Road Cycling - Re-doing the old road bike

How does this sound?-I could upgrade my excellent condition '86 steel frame (Tange 2) road bike for about $700.00 rather than spend over a grand to buy a new one.
Here's what I've been quoted for parts (I install):
Ultegra 9 spd kit (STI shifters, rear drlr, cassette & chain-$279.00
Ultegra crankset-120.00
Ultegra bottom bracket-40.00
Mavic "Cosmos" wheels-280.00
Or, would I be better off getting all those components as part of a new bike?
Thanks,
Rich

Originally posted by Coaster
How does this sound?-I could upgrade my excellent condition '86 steel frame (Tange 2) road bike for about $700.00 rather than spend over a grand to buy a new one.
Here's what I've been quoted for parts (I install):
Ultegra 9 spd kit (STI shifters, rear drlr, cassette & chain-$279.00
Ultegra crankset-120.00
Ultegra bottom bracket-40.00
Mavic "Cosmos" wheels-280.00
Or, would I be better off getting all those components as part of a new bike?
Thanks,
Rich

You'de be looking at twice the price of the upgrade for a new Ultegra bike. If your steel frame is still in good shape and you like the ride, I'd stick with it and do the upgrade.

I have some 9-spd parts I could give you for a deal...

The dropouts need to be 130mm, and you don't even need the crank.but do need a front derailer,that is STI compatible.If your bike uses 27" wheels,you may have a problem with brake pad reach with 700c wheels,and need new calipers or another soultion.

i thought about doing the same to my bike (early 80's bianchi), only instead upgrading it to 105. I found that in the end, its easier to buy a new bike. With the new bike, you get a new frame along with new components.

Forget it! It's not worth it.

Originally posted by D*Alex
Forget it! It's not worth it.

Absolutely
tange2 ????.... what are you thinking of? its a complete waste of money.
If you want to upgrade your frame use 105 gear or even Campy Sora which is much cheaper and just as good.

Youm are trying to turn a sows ear into a silk purse me thinks.

No offence I understand completely if you want to hang onto that favorite frame that has seen you through years of happy cycling etc but put on some comparable gear.
just my 2penyworth
:)

Originally posted by earleybird


Campy Sora which is much cheaper and just as good.


:) REALLY? Campy Sora? I think shimano would be interested in knowing about the infringement.

Originally posted by D*Alex
Forget it! It's not worth it. It must be wonderful to be so informed.Tange #2 was for all practical purposes the same as columbus SL. Good old school stuff.Plenty of older bikes are worth spending a few bucks on if one is happy with the ride and fit and does not go over the top when doing it.

Definitely keep that old frame. But why put 9 speed stuff on it? That's almost sacriligeous. What's wrong with the parts you have now?

It's your money, spend it as you see best. Nothing wrong with keeping an old frame going.

The only completely valid objections I see here are the wheel size and dropout spacing. A higher line bike from the mid-80s is probably equipped with 700C wheels and short reach brakes so you should be ok but you need to be sure. OTOH I'd be surprised if you have 130mm DOs. Steel frames are "adjustable" but it needs to be done properly. Check with your LBS and add that price to your $ list.

From the "emotional" side of the issue (feel free to ignore) I'd question going all the way to Ultegra, 105 should be fine or, even better IMHO, Campy Veloce or a Veloce/Centaur mix.

I love retro bikes and own a Super Record Basso that I wouldn't change but I'll admit that if I ever acquired a vintage Masi frame set I'd consider a modern Chorus group for it and have a unique ride. (Chorus over Record as that carbon fiber wouldn't look right.)

Good luck.

:beer:

I just measured the dropout spacing in inches-5-1/4+" is what it is now. That should be sufficient to accomodate 130mm shouldn't it? The wheels are 700c. Performance bicycle is now selling 105 and Ultegra 9 spd. upgrade kits at the same price.
I now have 7 spd. but in order to get STI shifters that I can shift from the drops (my main objective), I have to go to 8 or 9 speed anyway. The 600 components the bike came with have performed flawlessly and I see Sora as going down in performance and longevity (you probably could tell that I like holding on to my stuff)
As for the cranks, I was told that the thinner chain would require that change.
Thanks,
Rich

Originally posted by Coaster
I just measured the dropout spacing in inches-5-1/4+" is what it is now. That should be sufficient to accomodate 130mm shouldn't it? The wheels are 700c. Performance bicycle is now selling 105 and Ultegra 9 spd. upgrade kits at the same price.
I now have 7 spd. but in order to get STI shifters that I can shift from the drops (my main objective), I have to go to 8 or 9 speed anyway. The 600 components the bike came with have performed flawlessly and I see Sora as going down in performance and longevity (you probably could tell that I like holding on to my stuff)
As for the cranks, I was told that the thinner chain would require that change.
Thanks,
Rich An 86 frame will not have that kind of spacing.It did not exist.You DON"T need a new crank, or even different rings.But rings might be a good idea since the chain and cassette will be new. Don't forget a front derailer.You likely will not be able to shift sora from the dops anyway.

I'll go find another ruler.
Rich

Yep, 5-1/4" on that one too!
Rich

Originally posted by pokey
REALLY? Campy Sora? I think shimano would be interested in knowing about the infringement.

Oops!:o
remember to put brain in gear before opening mouth:D

I meant to suggest using 105 or Sora alternatively a cheap end campy but I reckon ultegra is way over the top for Tange 2

Originally posted by Coaster
Yep, 5-1/4" on that one too!
Rich

Where are you measuring, inside or outside the dropouts? (You're right, 5 1/4" is 131.2 mm)

That's the measurement on the insides of the dropouts
Rich

If that measurement is of the inside of the dropouts (and not a lame desktop conversion), then something is seriously bent on your frame. A 7-speed bike from that era would have dropout spacing of exactly 126mm. Check your chainstays-I'll be one of them is bent!

Chainstays are straight as an arrow. I never could quite visualize millimeters, but I'm very familiar with inches and we're talking about 5/32" here. Now, can understand that that would be a lot if my wheel were out of true by that much, but does it adversely affect my frame if the dropouts are 5/32" wider than they're supposed to be?
Rich

This might be a good moment to suggest a bike shop.

No, that shouldn't affect you.

Like many others I'm surprised that a bike of that vintage has DOs that wide. There was no need for it back then as I'm pretty sure noone spaced their hubs like that then. 1986 was still the freewheel era not even 7 speed cassettes.

Well then I guess you've got no tech. problems remaining it's just a matter of spending money.

While I have no doubt you can use a ruler I'd still suggest you bring the frame to the shop. For the $ you're going to drop they can pull a Shimano 9 speed rear off a bike and slide it into your frame for a quick check. That will confirm or deny beyond debate.

Good luck and let us know how it turns out.

Walter


:beer:

Thank you Walter, that sounds like sensible advice.
Rich

If you like the frame, particularly the ride and fit, go for the upgrade, but ask yourself whether you really need the 9-speed brake/shift levers, etc. Consider replacing just the wheelset and chain. I ride vintage steel road frames (1959, 1980, and 1982) exclusively, with 7-speed freewheels.

Atually, John, if I could get a set of STI levers I could shift from the drops as well, I'd be a happy camper. I don't like straddling the edge of the road with traffic on my left, holding the bars with one hand and reaching for the downtube shifters with the other. Also, hunkering down to attack a hill and losing momentum to downshift is not my idea of a smooth transition. But, as with many other things in life, it seems that if I want to keep my present bike, I ca'nt make this one change without changing other related parts.
Rich

Originally posted by Coaster
Atually, John, if I could get a set of STI levers I could shift from the drops as well, I'd be a happy camper. I don't like straddling the edge of the road with traffic on my left, holding the bars with one hand and reaching for the downtube shifters with the other. Also, hunkering down to attack a hill and losing momentum to downshift is not my idea of a smooth transition. But, as with many other things in life, it seems that if I want to keep my present bike, I ca'nt make this one change without changing other related parts.
Rich You considered bar ends?

Yeah, I've considered them. Thought I'd try to get what I'd really like first.
Rich

Originally posted by Coaster
reaching for the downtube shifters with the other. Also, hunkering down to attack a hill and losing momentum to downshift is not my idea of a smooth transition.

downtube also makes spriting a bit more tricky as it may be difficult to shift while in sprint (out of the saddle) while you can use sti/ergo fairly easily.

Originally posted by VegasCyclist


downtube also makes spriting a bit more tricky as it may be difficult to shift while in sprint (out of the saddle) while you can use sti/ergo fairly easily. Gotta wonder how poor Eddy handled it.

The same way everyone else did in those days. Only better. :)

Cheers...Gary

Steel's real. keep it and enjoy. It'll last years longer than any replacement in Aluminium.

Originally posted by chewa
Steel's real. keep it and enjoy. It'll last years longer than any replacement in Aluminium. REALLY?

Dude!

If I understand your postings, you mainly want STI? Just buy a set of 105 shift levers that can handle 8 speed, and slap 'em on! 7 speed and 8 speed have the same shift spacing, so it'll work fine! You _may_ need to change your rear derailleur, but not necessarilly. I have done this, and ridden the bike for close to 20,000 miles after making the conversion.

Also, you can change the rear wheel(s) you have to 8 speed without spreading the frame (to go to 130mm), but I'm not sure of the details. I have seen it done.

Good luck!

Originally posted by BikeEngine
Dude!

Just buy a set of 105 shift levers that can handle 8 speed, and slap 'em on! 7 speed and 8 speed have the same shift spacing,

Also, you can change the rear wheel(s) you have to 8 speed without spreading the frame (to go to 130mm), but I'm not sure of the details. I have seen it done.

Good luck! Sure,7 speed spacing is 5.0mm and 8 speed is 4.8mm.Not the same but close enough to work if you fiddle with it. Don't buy an 8 speed DA shifter unless you have a pre 9 speed Dura Ace rear derailer to go with it. Details on the 8 speed on a 7 speed hub.Get a 9 speed cassette,remove a cog and spacer and it will now fit on a 7 speed hub.Get a 9 speed Shimano shifter to shift it.Does not work on a uniglide hub though.

nm

OK, this sounds good! The weather dried up today and I was able to get out for an hour-Felt great to get back out after a weeks worth of rain. I like the bike and I like saving money-I'll look into it
Thanks,
Rich

Originally posted by pokey
REALLY?

I would think so. Ali's easier to damage, harder to repair and (I think) more liable to fatigue.

Originally posted by chewa


I would think so. Ali's easier to damage, harder to repair and (I think) more liable to fatigue. 1)MAYBE....2) Alot of steel isn't worth repairing,if economics are considered....3) maybe if one keeps it long enough,but that is factored into the design....STEEL RUSTs!

RE: steel rusts.

Steel only rusts if it isn't painted. Any good steel bike should last 40 years or more.

Originally posted by cycletourist
RE: steel rusts.

Steel only rusts if it isn't painted. Any good steel bike should last 40 years or more. Yeah,and how about the inside where it is not painted? I have seen neglected steel bikes destroyed by rust.From the inside.Worry about the rust you cannot see.

Originally posted by pokey
Yeah,and how about the inside where it is not painted? I have seen neglected steel bikes destroyed by rust.From the inside.Worry about the rust you cannot see.
Ok now I am paranoid, my road bike is steel. What should I be doing to take care of it, to prevent it from rusting as much as possible?

Originally posted by cyclochica

Ok now I am paranoid, my road bike is steel. What should I be doing to take care of it, to prevent it from rusting as much as possible? Don't be paradoid.I was just making a point,and many experience no rust even after years of use. It's really dependent alot on enviroment,road chemicals and how one uses the bike. An everyday comuter in adverse conditions would have greater issues.People with expensive steel frames,often treat or have them treated internally with products like frame saver or other rust preventives. It's most effective on a unbuilt frame.Otherwise,Try and protect from elements,like keeping inside, and if you do ride when its really wet, give it a good drying and even pull the seatpost and turn upside down to allow water to drain.Many bottom bracket shells have holes drilled in them for drainage,but many do not.Water can get in the frame and forks through vent holes in the stays, and lower fork ends.WD-40 in the vent holes hurts nothing, and may help.Plugging holes is often not recommended as then air cannot circlate and help the drying process..If the BB gets pulled for service,have the insides and lower parts of the tubes areund the BB sprayed with biosieldT-9 or similar product to help prevent rust.Worry more about keeping the seatpost and stem greased so things do not get seized in the frame,Just as preventive maintenance.

I treat the inside of the frames with a rust treating wax during my end of season strip downs.

One of my frames is 38 years old, the other 18, both have been re enamelled and ride great.