They better not make Floyd any madder...

[patentcad]

After Lance humiliated Floyd Landis at the top of Brasstown Bald @ the Tour of Georgia last year by pointing at the clock after Danielson had won the stage to clinch the GC, he gave Mr. Landis something to be pissed off about. Apparently. As evidenced by the scary way Floyd has been KICKING the entire peloton's ass in Europe and back here @ this year Tour of Georgia in any race that has over 5 stages.

Uh oh. You don't think Floyd can win the Tour de France? I do. The last American I said that about was Lance in 1999. That illicited peals of hysterical derision from my other bike weenie pals at the time.

I think Landis is ready for Prime Time. And again, you do NOT want to piss him off. You'll see.

[Jakey]

Landis has a shot, but I would put Basso, Vino, and Ullrich ahead of him.

[Mo'Phat]

He should wear the argyle socks again.

Lots of time between now and July and some might argue that Floyd is at the top of his game now while others will peak for the Tour. My best to him, and he is doing a great job, but the other contenders are biding their time.

Anger can only motivate someone for a short time. Is Floyd racing the Giro or Dauphine? Those will be telling.

[patentcad]

Landis has a shot, but I would put Basso, Vino, and Ullrich ahead of him.

I'd agree. But Flandis is more pissed off than those dudes. In fact Ullrich has NEVER been pissed off.

Anger can only motivate somebody for a short time? Yeah, OK. From all observations it's been motivating Floyd for about 15 years. Ask his Dad. But I do agree: he's GOT to wear those argyle socks. Particularly for the final stage if he has the lead in the GC : ).

Come on you weenies. How could you read Floyd's life story and NOT root for the guy? You can't make this stuff up. Plus he's the ugliest bike racer in American history. That TT position is smack your forehead brutal looking. But it does appear to work, eh?

[Laggard]

I'm indifferent to him.

He's not quite in the same league as Basso, Ulrich and Vino. He's a possible top-10 finisher but not a GT winner.

[merlinextraligh]

I'm indifferent to him.

He's a possible top-10 finisher but not a GT winner.
Not a possible top 10, he's already done that. Good shot at the podium, and possible (although IMHO , longshot) to win the TDF one day.

[USAZorro]

...Plus he's the ugliest bike racer in American history...

Now, now, now. I think you're just trying to further fuel his anger with that comment. Floyd is no Frank Andreau, but ya gotta think - Bob Roll? Levi? - They aren't on the short list to become matinee idols either.

[webist]

Basso and Vino - sure. Ulrich - I don't think he will win again - at all.

[baj32161]

I like Landis alot, but I don't think he has the team to carry him to the top of the podium.
I would also have to lean towards Basso, Vino and Jan. If I had to pick a real longshot I would keep my eyes on Valverde (and that is a REAL longshot!).

Cheers,

Brian

[patentcad]

I'm indifferent to him.

He's not quite in the same league as Basso, Ulrich and Vino. He's a possible top-10 finisher but not a GT winner.


You're oblivious to him. And so was everybody else regarding Lance in 1999. You'll see. All of you.

And in the meantime I'm forwarding your doubts to Floyd via email to rachet up his pissoff meter a few amps. Oh boy, you'll be sorry. I'm telling you weenies, you don't know what you're in for here.

But Holy Hincapie Batman that Landis is friggin UGLY. Ooofaaaaa with that TT position. He looks like a praying mantis taking a crap already.

[daytonian]

I agree I was a doubter thinking he was pack fodder and the terrible mustache, but the guy hung with Danielson and he can TT this year with that mantis arm thing. And he knows how to win.

[Richard Cranium]

Armstrong knows Landis could win the Tour, and is sort of snubbing him not offering any kudos......

Phonak is fielding a 1st-rate team and you can bet they're "going for it" with respect to supporting Floyd at the Tour. But hey, it's a long way to Paris -- it's like a whole new "tour de not-Lance"... We'll see.

[CyLowe97]

It's not like Floyd is sneaking up on anybody this year, but you better believe that Valverde and Basso haven't exactly been quiet in recent weeks. The only one doing any sneaking up on the Tour has been Levi. From what I gather out here is that he's been racing in California.

By the time the Dauphine and Tour of Switzerland are done, we'll have an idea of who's ready for the big time in July. It's WAY too early to say someone's peaking or not.

That said, just have so many contenders from so many teams (Floyd, Valverde, Basso, Ullrich, Levi, Vino, DiLuca, and even Cadel Evens) sets this year's Tour up to be a really sweet match of wits and talent.

[HigherGround]

Anger can only motivate someone for a short time.

True, unless you find new things to be angry about. It seemed to work for most of Lance's career: the European traditionalists, people who got his name wrong (Moreno Argentin), Cofidis management, people who credited his first Tour win to the absence of a former Tour winner in the peloton, David Walsh, French fans, etc.

Aside from all that, I'd love to see Floyd win the Tour at some point. This year, I'd like to see Ullrich win it.

[Laggard]

Not a possible top 10, he's already done that. Good shot at the podium, and possible (although IMHO , longshot) to win the TDF one day.

Possible top ten as in another top 10 finish.

Y'all do realize that he's 31 and thus his prime GT days are coming to an end? He's got maybe two years and his shot at winning are more or less done. Only five riders older than 31 have ever won the TDF and three of them have names like Copi, Armstrong and Zoetemelk.

[jbhowat]

Were there any Bassos, Ullrichs, or Vinokourovs at ToC, TdG, etc? No. No there weren't. Its just like when the announcers said JJ Haedo was one of the fastest sprinters in the world. Um... OK but I'm pretty sure he doesn't stand a chance against an on-form Boonen, Hushovd, McEwen, Petacchi, Zabel. There are only so many sprinters in the world anyway...

[classic1]

Were there any Bassos, Ullrichs, or Vinokourovs at ToC, TdG, etc? No. No there weren't. Its just like when the announcers said JJ Haedo was one of the fastest sprinters in the world. Um... OK but I'm pretty sure he doesn't stand a chance against an on-form Boonen, Hushovd, McEwen, Petacchi, Zabel. There are only so many sprinters in the world anyway...

Actually, I think Haedo would acquit himself quite well against those guys. Maybe not after 220km (not yet anyway), but I think he is the real deal.

[jrennie]

My patriotic side hopes for another american to take the TDF, but in reality I think the only shot landis has is to win the Kid Rock look-a-like contest(who ever posted the comparison pics was dead on)
Basso is going to win this year

[CyLowe97]

Were there any Bassos, Ullrichs, or Vinokourovs at ToC, TdG, etc? No. No there weren't.

If the TdG becomes a UCI ProTour event, you'll see more big names there, but the fact that it conflicts with the Northern Classics means a lot of big names won't make the trip. The race did get bumped up to a higher level of race by the UCI (one step below ProTour categorization), which is a really good sign that it may have a future on the calendar.

Think about it, though, there were some major teams there like Davitamon-Lotto, which does bode well for the race's ongoing importance.

Same for ToC.... after the great crowds and the rave reviews by pros about the organization and accomodations, you may see many big names opting for California instead of Qatar or Tour Down Under. Let's hope so! Boonen v. Valverde on US soil would rock.

[worker4youth]

I'd agree. But Flandis is more pissed off than those dudes. In fact Ullrich has NEVER been pissed off.


Dude, have you read his blog? ;)

[dws5b]

I think Basso is making a big mistake doing the double (Giro-TDf) I think he will falter in the last week of the tour. Jan lost 2:28 in 20K to Evans today and time is running out. Floyd has a shot as it is not really a climbers race this year. Go Floyd Go!

[RockyMtnMerlin]

Landis rode very well in American and Europe this spring. It is going to be a very interesting TdF. More than a couple of guys have a shot at it. It goes without saying that it may well be decided by whose team supports him best. But it may also be decided by something like Valverde's knee, Basso's stomach, Jan following the team car too closely, George's bike etc. It will be fun to watch:D

[patentcad]

Landis rode very well in American and Europe this spring. It is going to be a very interesting TdF. More than a couple of guys have a shot at it. It goes without saying that it may well be decided by whose team supports him best. But it may also be decided by something like Valverde's knee, Basso's stomach, Jan following the team car too closely, George's bike etc. It will be fun to watch:D

Seriously. What makes all you experts so eager to dismiss Floyd's chances? Like any of these other mopes ever WON the Tour de France. And you can take 'but Basso was 2nd twice' stuff and wipe your ass with it. Ullrich did that for what? 5 years in a row? He never won after 1997 either. Guys that WIN the Tour generally ramp up their game to the next level and suddenly they're kicking everyone's ass in July in France. Duh. That's how most Tour winners have 'appeared'.

Did anyone see Floyd match Danielson stroke for stroke on Brasstown Bald? Like ANYONE's going to drop HIM in the Alps this summer. I really don't think so weenies.

We'll see eh? Are they taking money on this in Vegas?

[CyLowe97]

Did anyone see Floyd match Danielson stroke for stroke on Brasstown Bald?

That was AWESOME. Floyd played Tom like a fiddle. They were damn near track-standing all the way up! Other riders were just trying to get to the top and these two were playing mind games. Outstanding.

And they were obviously the freshest climbers by the time they got to Brasstown from the way that Popo would catch them due to the cat/mouse game they were playing, but then they'd pass Popo who would crack again. Not taking away from Popo's climbing talent because he was working for Danielson to keep Tom fresh for the climb.

I think Floyd's got the goods to compete for top spots in the TdF in July, but do you all think Phonak can control a race like Disco, CSC, or T-Mobile could? I don't know the answer to that, yet, but they did get Floyd into the position to hang with the big teams in Georgia, Paris-Nice, and California. France is a different beast, though, which is why July is going to be so cool to see how things unfold.

[Hill Climber]

Are they taking money on this in Vegas?

Latest odds from William Hill:

Basso - 7/4
Ullrich - 2/1
A Valverde - 7/1
A Vinokourov - 15/2
F Landis - 16/1

Landis was 50/1 before the ToC and was 20/1 after to P-N. He dropped again after Georiga. Basso and Ullrich had flip-flopped odds in the past week.

[patentcad]

Latest odds from William Will:

Basso - 7/4
Ullrich - 2/1
A Valverde - 7/1
A Vinokourov - 15/2
F Landis - 16/1

Landis was 50/1 before the ToC and was 20/1 after to P-N. He dropped again after Georiga. Basso and Ullrich had flip-flopped odds in the past week.

Give me some of that 16:1 action on my man Floyd. Sign me up. What is this England odds makers?

We need legalized gambling outside Vegas here in the US so I can place my Tour de France bets : ).

[Laggard]

Here's what they're saying in Europe:

Basso, I 2.85
Ullrich, J 3.50
Vinokourov, A 8.50
Valverde, A 9.00
Landis, F 20.00
Cunego, D 25.00
Popovych, Y 25.00
Menchov, D 30.00
Leipheimer, L 35.00
Mancebo Pérez, F 35.00
Hincapie, G 40.00
Klöden, A 40.00
Rasmussen, M 45.00
Mayo, I 50.00
Beloki, J 66.00
Pereiro Sio, O 80.00
Simoni, G 80.00
Jaksche, J 100.00
Kashechkin, A 100.00
Moreau, C 150.00
Boonen, T 300.00

[patentcad]

I saw an interview with Landis' old man and after thirty seconds I wanted to belt him. Imagine how Floyd feels. His Mom is there with that whole Amish/Menonite getup. Man, it was priceless.

So now his Dad is 'supportive' and showing up at bike races since Floyd is one of the top racers in the world. This after making him ride all night in the sub freezing temps in the dark as a teenager because he disapproved of his cycling. Who wouldn't be pissed after all that?

[2Rodies]

After Lance humiliated Floyd Landis at the top of Brasstown Bald @ the Tour of Georgia last year by pointing at the clock after Danielson had won the stage to clinch the GC, he gave Mr. Landis something to be pissed off about. Apparently. As evidenced by the scary way Floyd has been KICKING the entire peloton's ass in Europe and back here @ this year Tour of Georgia in any race that has over 5 stages.

Uh oh. You don't think Floyd can win the Tour de France? I do. The last American I said that about was Lance in 1999. That illicited peals of hysterical derision from my other bike weenie pals at the time.

I think Landis is ready for Prime Time. And again, you do NOT want to piss him off. You'll see.


If the Tour were only about one rider I'd say the Floyds current level of fittness puts him in the top 5 in the world. However CSC is a better team from top to bottom than Phonak and Basso will have that team at his disposal. Lance was a rider who could take a race on his shoulders and still win when his team wasn't there for him. Floyd has yet to show us he is that type of rider. As well as he rode at the TdG, Georga ain't France and 6 days ain't three weeks.

[patentcad]

If the Tour were only about one rider I'd say the Floyds current level of fittness puts him in the top 5 in the world. However CSC is a better team from top to bottom than Phonak and Basso will have that team at his disposal. Lance was a rider who could take a race on his shoulders and still win when his team wasn't there for him. Floyd has yet to show us he is that type of rider. As well as he rode at the TdG, Georga ain't France and 6 days ain't three weeks.

I'd agree. And the team factor is huge. I'm not basing Floyd's chances on the Tour de Georgia. I'm basing it on two factors:

• Floyd's superior TT skills which have been evident this year compared to the other big boys on the UCI circuit

and

• Floyd's improved climbing. He's lost weight in his upper body (as Phil Ligget pointed out on the OLN coverage) and clearly has ramped it up one notch.

We'll have to see won't we? Which makes it so interesting this year.

[2Rodies]

I'd agree. And the team factor is huge. I'm not basing Floyd's chances on the Tour de Georgia. I'm basing it on two factors:

• Floyd's superior TT skills which have been evident this year compared to the other big boys on the UCI circuit

and

• Floyd's improved climbing. He's lost weight in his upper body (as Phil Ligget pointed out on the OLN coverage) and clearly has ramped it up one notch.

We'll have to see won't we? Which makes it so interesting this year.


No doubt he's a much improved rider, he's now matched his climbing skills to match his TT'ing. I really expected Tommy D to drop him on Brasstown but Floyd showed is new found climbing ability and that he is a better tactician than TD.

All things being equal, luck, sickness, crashes et al, CSC has to be considered the best team at the Tour. I also agree that this will be a very exciting Tour and I hope we see both Floyd and Levi in the top 5. After the terrific start Americans have had this year it's safe to say that we have the strongest group of riders in Europe ever.

[patentcad]

>>All things being equal, luck, sickness, crashes et al, CSC has to be considered the best team at the Tour. I also agree that this will be a very exciting Tour and I hope we see both Floyd and Levi in the top 5. After the terrific start Americans have had this year it's safe to say that we have the strongest group of riders in Europe ever.<<

Yep. That's the interesting part. Nobody's riding as good as Floyd this year - but Basso IS Basso, and he DOES have that CSC powerhouse team to rely upon. Being isolated late in a couple of big stages could really KILL Floyd in the Tour. Look what happend to Tom Boonen @ Paris-Roubaix this year with no team mates to chase down what turned out to be the winning solo breakaway. It's a team sport, and the more I watch it the more apparent that becomes. Which is one reason why Lance won so many Tours - he was instrumental in selecting and nurturing the strongest teams over those 7 Tdf's.

In last year's Tour somebody calculated that out of 2300 miles or so Lance was in the wind for like 90 miles or something like that. THAT is the Blue Train. And you can't be the locomotive for 3 weeks straight.

[Hipcycler]

CSC
Phonak
Disco

In that order.

[patentcad]

CSC
Phonak
Disco

In that order.

You're probably right. But I'm still rooting for Floyd. And NEVER count out Jan Ullrich. Superkraut may have a trick or two up his sleeve yet...

[ZachS]

as far as those odds go, they're based on the guesses of european gamblers - meaning that american racers will all be stronger than their odds indicate.

[patentcad]

as far as those odds go, they're based on the guesses of european gamblers - meaning that american racers will all be stronger than their odds indicate.

Right. Floyd in particular. He's the man this year. Podium or bust. But I'm not sure which : ).

[El Diablo Rojo]

You're probably right. But I'm still rooting for Floyd. And NEVER count out Jan Ullrich. Superkraut may have a trick or two up his sleeve yet...

The only thing up his sleeve is a strudel ;)

[Hipcycler]

Yummm.....strudel.
Could you warm that up slightly in the microwave for me, then place a scoop of vanilla on top please?!

Can you tell I have weight issues? :)

[Veloduo]

I think Basso is making a big mistake doing the double (Giro-TDf) I think he will falter in the last week of the tour. Jan lost 2:28 in 20K to Evans today and time is running out. Floyd has a shot as it is not really a climbers race this year. Go Floyd Go!

Me, too.

[Veloduo]

I saw an interview with Landis' old man and after thirty seconds I wanted to belt him. Imagine how Floyd feels. His Mom is there with that whole Amish/Menonite getup. Man, it was priceless.

So now his Dad is 'supportive' and showing up at bike races since Floyd is one of the top racers in the world. This after making him ride all night in the sub freezing temps in the dark as a teenager because he disapproved of his cycling. Who wouldn't be pissed after all that?

You know, somehow I get the feeling that Floyd isn't pissed at his folks. They accept him, and he deals. Maybe they came to it late, but that stuff occurs all the time.

I think the minimalist existence -- and a double-helping of talent and guts -- helped make Floyd who he is. He's got the working-class mentality, which Lance tried to disguise when his mug was on the tube, but which fueled him his whole life. Yanks have overcome this deficit in their want-to make-up: Lemond, Phinney, Julich, Hampsten, George H, Tyler H all being good examples. But Floyd doesn't try to. He's naturally low-key off the bike. But on it, look out!

Whatever, I'm pulling for him. He's a bit of an underdog, or at least he was. And he does have a narrowing window of opportunity. I hope he can pull it off in the next year or two.

[RockyMtnMerlin]

I saw an interview with Landis' old man and after thirty seconds I wanted to belt him. Imagine how Floyd feels. His Mom is there with that whole Amish/Menonite getup. Man, it was priceless.

So now his Dad is 'supportive' and showing up at bike races since Floyd is one of the top racers in the world. This after making him ride all night in the sub freezing temps in the dark as a teenager because he disapproved of his cycling. Who wouldn't be pissed after all that?
Maybe Floyd is an adult and decided to forgive those things.

[djninjamusic]

Armstrong knows Phonak is fielding a 1st-rate team and you can bet they're "going for it" with respect to supporting Floyd at the Tour. But hey, it's a long way to Paris -- it's like a whole new "tour de not-Lance"... We'll see.

It's certainly true that Phonak will field a strong team to support Landis...but will that team be able to survive THREE WEEKS of racing? Sure, they've proven themselves in one-week stage races...but it's just 5-7 days of racing. The true test is if they can manage 23 days of racing with only two days of recovery...

Phonak is a strong team...strong enough to support Landis to a top 10 in the GC, but not strong enough to put him on top.

I feel the same way about Vino's team.

But that's just my opinion...

[patentcad]

Maybe Floyd is an adult and decided to forgive those things.

Yeah, that figures. I guess you can tell that from the argyle socks at the USCF race story. That must have been Floyd's first big step into Adulthood.

You can 'forgive' your old man and still be pissed about what happened 10-20 years ago. And make it work for you.

Watch him.

Hey, what do I know? Fun to toss around here at the Weenie Roast eh? I could care less if Landis is really the inner Zenmeister of the Peloton. As long as he kicks their Euro asses in France in July.

[roadwarrior]

I'm indifferent to him.

He's not quite in the same league as Basso, Ulrich and Vino. He's a possible top-10 finisher but not a GT winner.

Yeah, I agree with you. While Floyd's had a good spring, and done well in the junior stages races, the tours of CA and GA are not even close to the Giro or Le Tour.

Floyd's a tremendous rider, but not a GT winner.

[CyLowe97]

Yeah, I agree with you. While Floyd's had a good spring, and done well in the junior stages races, the tours of CA and GA are not even close to the Giro or Le Tour.

Floyd's a tremendous rider, but not a GT winner.

Yeah, Paris-Nice is a junior stage race. :rolleyes:

(i know, i know... it's not a grand tour, but it's not exactly an obscure event on the calendar. It'll be fun to revisit this thread in July to see how all these opinions pan out. at this time that's all they are.... speculation... )

[El Diablo Rojo]

Hey, what do I know? .

Well when it comes to the interpersonal relationship between Floyd and his parents, you know absolutely nothing. What he and his father have or haven't resolved is between them, so how the hell would you know?

[Mo'Phat]

Well when it comes to the interpersonal relationship between Floyd and his parents, you know absolutely nothing. What he and his father have or haven't resolved is between them, so how the hell would you know?

Well, his last name is Landis, doncha know.

Or, he read about it in Lance Armstrong's War

Or, he heard from a guy who heard it from a guy who read it on the internets, so it must be true.

[El Diablo Rojo]

Well, his last name is Landis, doncha know.

Or, he read about it in Lance Armstrong's War

Or, he heard from a guy who heard it from a guy who read it on the internets, so it must be true.


Woops I missed that part of his sig 'patentcadlandis'

Internets.....that's classic...

[squeegy200]

I like Landis alot, but I don't think he has the team to carry him to the top of the podium.
I would also have to lean towards Basso, Vino and Jan. If I had to pick a real longshot I would keep my eyes on Valverde (and that is a REAL longshot!).

Cheers,

Brian


I think I am with Brian on this one. Phonak isn't as strong a team as the others. CSC especially has asked all of their big riders to back off on their conditioning to support Ivan. You can already see that in the early classics where CSC dominated much more last year than this one. They were last years ProTour team and the only thing Bjarn Riis has not yet accomplished is a Grand Tour winner. They almost did it last year in the Giro and they are determined to win one this year. Basso will be a favorite.

[patentcad]

Well when it comes to the interpersonal relationship between Floyd and his parents, you know absolutely nothing. What he and his father have or haven't resolved is between them, so how the hell would you know?


It's 30% from Lance's War, 30% speculation and 35% bull****. So that makes it 5% true : ).

Hey that puts it off the charts on the Bike Forum accuracy charts!!