Framebuilders - novice

how does one get into frame building? where do i start? how and what kind of welding do i need to learn? help me out here.
thanks.

I would start by learning general welding (Brazing, Tig etc). Get a feel for the torch, materials and gain some knowledge about how to handle and weld.

Then go and bug your local rich man with a frame jig or framebuilder and see, what if anything, you can learn from them.

Or do one of the many framebuilding classes and take it from there. Theres some useful advice on the United Bike Insitute's website as they offer framebuilding classes. Their FAQ has some useful stuff.
http://www.bikeschool.com/framefaq.htm

Or find someone building frankenbikes and help 'em out.

Or see if you can find someone with a copy of the Paterek Manual for framebuilding. Its quite expensive but its pretty detailed.

You want to learn TIG welding if you want to weld frames. You can assemble bikes with stick welding, or MIG, but the results are harder to have confidence in since the processes proceed a at rates that are somewhat more difficult to ****** or advance, when you are faced with some .035 tubes staring you in the face.

Look into fillet brazing, if the new brazes are as good as they say, it may not be that difficult. It is certainly the lowest cost of entry. This guy has made a bunch of interesting bikes with brazing of a low tech variety. The new materials are said to be easier. I have a TIG so that is what I am planing. http://www.sonic.net/~maryking/

A frambuilding project usually starts with a person who has some un-met bike need. I am working on a touring bike. I want to save moeny on custom fit and features that are only available in frames made by a few makers, with long backlogs and high prices. So that is the need.

Next, I drew up the bike based on a bike I already have that has a good position, but too much standover, and not the right features. All you really need is a full size profile drawing, I did it in a simple 2D cad program, but a pencil and a big piece of paper is just as good.

Next you have to ask yourself where the parts come from and what exact tubes are required for a person of one's own size and the intended use, do some online research, bug people who have already built that bike.

Next search out what will be required to cut and fit the parts you need, and how they will be held for brazing, welding etc... There are tons of logs out there with multitudes of pictures. Don't overlook the bikes you actually have. For TIG, existing bikes are probably a better bet than a lot of the high minded twadle on framebuilding forums. For instance how does one TIG dropouts or brake bosses, or does one have to braze them. The answer is more easily found in my garden shed than online.

I think it is much easier to build a bike than become a framebuilder. You are dealing with solving concrete problems one at a time, and you have an actual project to study in minute detail. You don't have to even build the bike in question, just run through all the solutions.

For instance, recently I wanted to figure out how to make my own touring racks for a specific set of paniers. The design on Gordon, or Sackit racks is pretty simple but you need to control some tight radiused bends in precise relationship to each other. I figured out a good method for building a production jig, rather than try to freehand all the bends. I've solved the problem, and I may well build the racks, but working through concrete fabrication and design issue is what it is really about.

Bike frames are simple tube fitting problems the actual difficulty is not that great when you break each step down. There are some pretty sophisticated frames being built out there with little more than straight tubing, you can gain some interesting experiecne without spending too much money, you might scoff at first, but keep your eyes open, and you will see some examples.

You can down load a free tube mitering program from this site: http://www.ihpva.org/people/tstrike/building/tubemit.htm
It will give you a template you can trace on to the tube. It has made my life a lot easier.
I've brazed it is cheaper, and you can use lugs if you want. The lugs might also make things easier your first time.

the search option is down on bike forums, so i'll go ahead and ask.

the bike school page seems to point towards oxy-acetylene cutting, welding and brazing. now, it seems like people are pointing to TIG welding.

is TIG only for working with aluminum? and, can oxy-acetylene be used for steel?