Advocacy & Safety - Which are you more afraid of?

Which are you more afraid of on the bike?

# 5...Uptight, unimaginative, all-knowing 'advocates'.

Damn, that's a hard one. I can't pick. It's a toss-up between elderly, inattentive and aggressive. For some reason I'm not as concerned with drunks. I guess it's just experience. I've had bad experiences with elderly, inattentive and aggressive but it's unknown how many of these people were drunk, stoned, on prescription meds or otherwise pharmacologically intoxicated.

# 5...Uptight, unimaginative, all-knowing 'advocates'.

you're right, this one is worst.

You left out #6 Young Drivers.

Lack of experience, not knowing the limits of their abilities, coupled with the age of feeling bullet proof makes them the most dangerous drivers on the road. This is reflected in insurance rates.

Drunks-

The others aren't paying attention or become aggressive. Once they pay attention or settle a bit they probably can avoid you. With a drunk, even if he sees you, he's probably seeing 2 or 3 of you in different places and can't avoid you anyway. I've lost enough mailboxes and reflector markers to count on both hands to them. I'd hate to be on the road when they come through because even if they realize you're there, they're still going to hit you probably. The others at least gain a chance to avoid if they are alerted to your presence.

old, agressive, drunk drivers on the cell phone.

young, distracted, agressive, drunk, cell-phone talking drivers.

any and all of the above.

Definitely would be teenagers.

Young drivers, pumpin music with the girls in the back and 'lean back....lean back....'
The Fast and The Frivilous

They are all dangerous, but for some reason I don't fear any of them.

Aggresive drivers, folks out to get me. The rest I seem to be able to predict.

What about taxi drivers?

old, agressive, drunk drivers on the cell phone.

young, distracted, agressive, drunk, cell-phone talking drivers.

any and all of the above.
And if they're also eating a donut, kiss your sorry ass good-bye. :rolleyes:

I've given up even trying to count inattentive drivers that pull something stupid while I'm riding. They really dont bother me because they are usually stupified by something (cell phone, radio, etc) and stupidity is usually predictable. Someone, for example, that is looking the other way while they pull out in front of me is easy to predict and therefore easy to avoid.

Its the people that are gunning for me that scare me. The poeple who look me straight in the eye and turn left at the last minute right in front of me, or honk at me from behind, pass in front of me and slam the brakes, to give two examples, that bother me. These people for at least a moment are concentrating all their attention on me and could possibly do some damage. I run across this several times a week in my riding.

I guess the only innatentive driver that scares me would be the one that hits me from behind because of innatention, but theres not much you can do in that situation.

Fear... Drunk biker ahead ready to turn your way as you pass...
Fear... Mo-ped (50cc bikes, motorcross, scotter, what ever) trying to pass you with out warning... and pushes you off course...
Fear... Falling a sleep while riding...
Fear...stunt gone wrong
Fear... crossing a red light... (intersections)
Fear... Tiny pebebls on the road that act like ball bearings... and disable you from turning...
Fear... some on jacking my bike/accesories...

I've had more trouble each and every day with drivers on their phones. For some reason being on a phone somehow makes people think they can stop in the middle of the road for no reason, back up, do a 20 minute 3 point turn, drive on the wrong side of the road, blast through red lights, stop at green lights, drive 20 MPH below the speed limit, pull out without looking, turn left without looking, and my favorite - never realize that they almost plowed you into the asphalt. Teenagers and soccer moms are the worst.

Drunk, inattentive, elderly, aggressive, retaliatory, cell phonin', paper readin', donut munchin' cab drivers.

Oh yeah, and Trolls.

D

Hey now, there's some good teenage drivers out there too. ;) I'm a cyclist, triathlete, and teenage driver. I always look for cyclists/peds/runners etc on the road because I've been there myself many times even before being able to drive!

While they all are dangerous, inattentive drivers seem to outnumber all the other groups combined.

all those scare me equally, but i agree- about the worst of all are teenagers, hotrodding in their parent's SUVs. I've had more close calls (that is being nearly creamed) with them than with anyone, and they also tend to be hostile and aggressive. Especially if there's a bunch of them in the vehicle- they're most likely to try and terrorize you or run you off the road or threaten you.

Aggressive drivers are the worst. The ones that you pass, then they speed up really quick and cut you off. Those are by far the worst. They are just pissed they got passed by something that dosent run on $3 a gallon gas.

I've never even thought about it. I figure any car which causes me trouble is going to be the one I'll worry about.

they all have potential for being dangerous.

BUT I really FEAR Inattentive Drivers.

It seems ironic that hardly anybody is afraid of drunk drivers. Maybe even more ironic, is the fact that drunk driving is really the only offense that carries consequences in terms of punishment.

It seems ironic that hardly anybody is afraid of drunk drivers. Maybe even more ironic, is the fact that drunk driving is really the only offense that carries consequences in terms of punishment.


I'm a bit surprised too. I chose drunkeness, myself, but all are indeed dangerous as others have pointed out. I think there was an MSNBC study out recently where inattentive drivers who were on the cell phone or half asleep proved almost as dangerous as drunks on the test course.

Some states have banned certain cell phone uses while driving. I don't know, barring a massive emergency, why the call can't wait until after the drive is done, given how dangerous it can become for everyone on the road.

The elderly. No contest. Just about every time someone squeaks past my handlebars, it's a bluehair.

A drive-by with a shot gun aimed at me, but I guess that falls in the "aggressive" category.

I never seem to notice drunk drivers while I'm on my bike, but seem to see them all the time when I'm driving.
Overall, the distracted mommy, yelling at the kids in the back, smoking a butt, yapping on the phone, putting on make up, swilling a latte. I'm told this is called "multi-tasking."

Damn, I forgot about the elderly. No more bikin' fer me.

# 5...Uptight, unimaginative, all-knowing 'advocates'.
Good one. They scare the bejeezus out of me!

what a buzz kill - sad, pathetic irony mixed with gestaltic moronicism masquerading as blind introspection.

maybe there is nothing to be afraid of. I've read in A&S how you can liberate your soul and free yourself from the fetters of a fear of traffic. I think there was a semi-religious, mental 'clarity' component, kind of like those people tom cruise and john travolta are mixed up with.....

The results of this poll really surprise me.

Drunk Drivers 5 7.81%
Inattentive Drivers. Cell phone users, paper readers, etc. 42 65.63%
Elderly Drivers. 2 3.13%
Aggressive drivers- Retaliatory strike. 15 23.44%

Drunk drivers... less than 8%?
Inattentive drivers... 65+%?

I mean, no driver is ever attentive to everything all at once. That's impossible. So, to some extent, all drivers are inattentive to something at any given point in time. If they're paying attention to something off to the right, they're not paying attention to what's ahead. If they're paying attention to something off to the left, they're not paying attention to what's up ahead and to the right (like you). If they're paying attention to the hamburger they're unwrapping, they're also not paying attention to what's up ahead and to the right either.

So, for those of you who selected "inattentive drivers", what difference does the reason for not seeing you make? As long as he's paying attention to something legitimate, then he's attentive... but if he's paying attention to something "illegitimate", like his cell phone, then he's inattentive? Is that it? Why would the latter scare you, but not the former? Or do you expect all drivers to always be aware of you, and, if they're not, they're "inattentive", by definition?

I ride by the trust but verify principle. I trust drivers to generally be paying attention and to treat me like a driver of a vehicle as long as I act like one, but I never rely on them to be paying attention when it matters without first verifying that they are.

So inattentive drivers don't bother me at all, because I never rely on any driver to be paying attention.

Now, a drunk driver careening across the road from the other side without warning, that scares me.

all of the poll options.

I chose the inattentive one but they still don't scare me much. I guess whoever was saying teenagers feel like they are invincible was right. I am only 15 but I like to think that if I do the right things on the road I should be safe.

I didn't chose drunk drivers as my biggest fear for this reason:, which is based on perception, so it could be wrong...

When I do cycle, it'll normally be between 07:30 and 20:00 hours. I wouldn't particularly associate those hours, especially during the week, with a high incidence of drunken drivers being on the road. Additionally, I'm sure that there are far more inattentitive drivers than there are drunk drivers; mobile phones, ICE etc.

Also, what makes me mad, is that when a drunken driver causes an accident, they rightly get the book thrown at them but should someone wipe out a cyclist or pedestrian due to carelessness etc. they seem more likely to just get away with a slap on the wrist even though they too could have wiped someone out.

yeah, I tend to ride when most drunks are still sleeping it off. Its the "elderly" - some have passed me like they didn't know I was on the road. Very scary.

I ride in the mornings, so the hazard of drunk drivers is somewhat mitigated. That said, in my community a woman was recently killed while walking with her child by a drunk at 9 or 10am, and another driver who was impaired by their medication ran over a teen who was waiting for a schoolbus in the early am.

Like Krispistofferson, I've had a lot of elderly drivers pass me VERY close, but to date they've all passed me.

The people I seem to dodge the most are those who are inattentive to bikes. The usual scenario goes like this: I am riding along and someone is pulling in/out of a driveway or business or cross street, they look at me, then proceed to cut me off or turn in front of me.

I ride aware of others and I try to anticipate what motorists will do, but I can't say that I'm truly scared of anyone pasting me while I'm on the bike. If it happens, it happens. I'm under no illusion that I'm really any safer in my car.

To me someone who would drive drunk is already arrogant, has the mental capacity of the most limited elderly driver, and is already as distracted as a multitasking cell phone user.

roughstuff

I ride in the mornings, so the hazard of drunk drivers is somewhat mitigated. That said, in my community a woman was recently killed while walking with her child by a drunk at 9 or 10am, and another driver who was impaired by their medication ran over a teen who was waiting for a schoolbus in the early am.

Like Krispistofferson, I've had a lot of elderly drivers pass me VERY close, but to date they've all passed me.

The people I seem to dodge the most are those who are inattentive to bikes. The usual scenario goes like this: I am riding along and someone is pulling in/out of a driveway or business or cross street, they look at me, then proceed to cut me off or turn in front of me.

I ride aware of others and I try to anticipate what motorists will do, but I can't say that I'm truly scared of anyone pasting me while I'm on the bike. If it happens, it happens. I'm under no illusion that I'm really any safer in my car.

People who look at you and really see you then procedd to cut you off are not inattentive, they are aggressive, they are ******** with you because they know you will yield. These are the people I fear because for at least a moment, they are trying to kill you, or dont care if they kill you.

It was a very tough decision, by the way. Good poll! :beer: Of course, like most of you, my desire to cycle outweighs any fear that I might have about these groups of inattentive people.

They all make me afraid, I can't pick just one. These are all dangerous, just in different ways.

Watchful, yes. Afraid, no.

It seems ironic that hardly anybody is afraid of drunk drivers. Maybe even more ironic, is the fact that drunk driving is really the only offense that carries consequences in terms of punishment.

The percentage of drunk drivers on the road has dropped considerably over the two decades that MADD has been in business. We now need effective deterrents against careless motoring.

Rotten poll, where are the real risks?

-- pit bulls
-- new drivers
-- type A drivers
-- racing drivers
-- drivers who always drive on the right side of the lane

Drunk drivers... less than 8%?
Inattentive drivers... 65+%?


Not surprising. One of the characteristics of a drunk driver is the inability to focus or pay attention to the task of driving. A drunk driver is just another inattentive driver to me, whether it is caused by alcohol or by yapping on the phone or whatever is irrelevant...it's the actions that should be of concern, not the causes. So, in a nutshell, the 'inattentive' choice may include drunk drivers.

For the time of day I ride, and the location, the most common type of bad driver would be the inattentive driver.

A drunk driver is just another inattentive driver to me, ...



the most common type of bad driver would be the inattentive driver.
Maybe I'm dense, but I don't understand the comparison of the drunk driver with the "inattentive driver".

To start, I understand what a drunk driver is. That's someone who has at least a .08% blood alcohol level and is driving. It's about as cut and dried a definition as one could want.

What the heck is an "inattentive driver"? If I fiddle with my cd player, am I an inattentive driver, period? Or am I an inattentive driver only during the time I'm fiddling? Or am I an inattentive driver at all?

And what is an attentive driver? Do I need to pay attention to every aspect of my driving all the time to be attentive (obviously not, since that would be impossible), or do I need to just be paying attention to some aspect of my driving? So if a driver is paying attention to the road in front of him, the dashboard dials, the light at the intersection he's approaching, etc., and he happens to not notice the cyclist off to his side, who suddenly signals and swerves moments later into the driver's path right as the driver happens to be checking his engine temperature guage, is the driver "inattentive"? Never mind how you define this in law. Do you believe such a driver would be "inattentive"?

Maybe I'm dense, but I don't understand the comparison of the drunk driver with the "inattentive driver".


Yes I believe you are. In the context of this discussion, inattentive is a state - something is distracting and/or impairing you from your task of operating a motor vehicle safely. A drunk driver is a driver who is distracted or impaired due to alcohol consumption. One can be inattentive, but not drunk, but a drunk is most always inattentive. To me it's like comparing peas (drunk drivers) to the pod (inattentiveness).

And what is an attentive driver? Do I need to pay attention to every aspect of my driving all the time to be attentive


YES!!! That is the goal anyway. You are operating a piece of equipment that can cause death, damage and destruction to other people and property...if you think other things are more important while you are driving, you should not be on the road.

YES!!! That is the goal anyway. You are operating a piece of equipment that can cause death, damage and destruction to other people and property...if you think other things are more important while you are driving, you should not be on the road.
But there are countless areas that may require a driver's attention. He can't be paying attention to all of the areas simultaneously.

So if a factor in a collision is that a drivers was not paying attention to a particular area (the one that turned out to be critical), does the reason he was not paying attention to that particular area matter? Assume he's driving along, looks away from the road in front of him because of something to his left, and so doesn't notice the cyclist in front of him suddenly signaling left and then moving left in front of him. By the time the driver looks forward and sees the cyclist moving left, he hits the brakes and swerves, but it's too late, and ends up clipping the cyclist. Is this driver responsible for the collision because he was being "inattentive"?

Say he wasn't paying attention ahead for those critical moments because he was paying attention to a motorcyclist pulling out of a driveway, perhaps right in front of the driver's car, from the left. Is this driver an "inattentive driver"?

Now assume the exact same scenario, except what draws his attention to the left is not a potential conflict with a motorcyclist pulling out, but a pink bikini clad buxomy blonde washing her British racing green Miata.

Finally, again assume the same scenario, except assume the blond is not there washing the car, but calling him on his cell phone, and it's the distinctive ring of her calling his cell phone that draws his attention from looking ahead during those critical moments.

Is the driver in all three scenarios "guilty" of being "inattentive" and causing the collision?

Seeing my ex-wife along my favorite training route would need to be an option for me to respond to this poll.




::: shudder :::