Commuting - A scary read - the way the rest commute

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12438812/site/newsweek/
Amazing - a lot of these folks get up at 5 am to drive 50-80 miles each way. The average commute is 25 minutes, 9 out of 10 by car. My commute isexactly 25 minutes - but by bike!
I cannot imagine living like this. Cheers to biking it. :beer:

I probably will live like that after college, can't really afford to live anywhere near where I will probably work.

I grew up in a town in NJ where many parents commuted 1+ hours into NYC each day, mainly by train. The town was decidedly on the rural side of urban and with good school systems, so I can understand why a parent would sacrifice some of their time to make the big bucks that enabled their kids to grow up in a bucolic (but very sheltered) atmosphere.

Then I ended up living home for a bit and doing the NYC commute, prompting me to decide that my kids might have to grow up somewhere not quite 'in a bubble' so that their dad doesn't go nuts and can get home early enough to have a catch with them after work.

Now I live in Arlington VA, a few miles from my job, and in a very good place to raise kids. Should we decide to head back to NJ sometime, my preference would be to live and work in/near Princeton, Red Bank, New Brunswick, etc.

I grew up in a town in NJ where many parents commuted 1+ hours into NYC each day, mainly by train. The town was decidedly on the rural side of urban and with good school systems, so I can understand why a parent would sacrifice some of their time to make the big bucks that enabled their kids to grow up in a bucolic (but very sheltered) atmosphere.

Then I ended up living home for a bit and doing the NYC commute, prompting me to decide that my kids might have to grow up somewhere not quite 'in a bubble' so that their dad doesn't go nuts and can get home early enough to have a catch with them after work.

Now I live in Arlington VA, a few miles from my job, and in a very good place to raise kids. Should we decide to head back to NJ sometime, my preference would be to live and work in/near Princeton, Red Bank, New Brunswick, etc.

We picked our house partially based on proximity to work. It is smaller that what we would be able to afford if we lived further away. Multiple times a week, I am grateful for our choice. We have kids and, although most of the reasons for commuting by bike are selfish, I feel like I'm setting a good example.

Yesterday, I had to pick up our car which was in the shop and drive to an errand in Cambridge. The whole way home, stuck in traffic, with my bike sticking out the back of the car, I'm thinking "how/why to people do this to themselves?"

I grew up with my dad commuting 1+ hrs each way, first in LA and then Houston. We grew up on 2 acres, big house, pool, semi-yuppy protected sheltered neighborhoods. Many of my coworkers do the same thing now. But i think i would have preferred to have my dad around for an extra 10hrs a week. Now that i'm in the same spot (young family) my woman and i've decided that we'd rather have the smaller house closer to work, so i can spend the time with the family.

I guess the topic has been beat to death before, but it's all about choices. No "right" or "wrong", just different choices. I tend to think any way but my way is silly. but as the lone commuter here at work, lemme tell you, a lot of folks here think I'm foolish!

i like living close to work. my commute is 2 miles. i feel like i'm "buying time" when i consider the higher cost of housing close in.

Long commutes completely kill your quality of life. My wife and I's first home was in a rural area. We planned on living/working in the sticks. When I couldn't find work out there I commuted an hour and a half into the city. That lasted a few months before we rented out our house and leased an apartment in the city. We were lucky enough to buy our current house in the burbs a couple years ago, my commute is now a mile by bicycle. My son's school, post office, and grocery stores are all within a mile as well. Life sure is good

I guess the topic has been beat to death before, but it's all about choices. No "right" or "wrong", just different choices. I tend to think any way but my way is silly. but as the lone commuter here at work, lemme tell you, a lot of folks here think I'm foolish!

This lone commuter chooses not to poison the air, trash the landscape, subsidize large, psychotic corporations, kill 42,000 people per year, support criminal wars overseas, or become part of the nation's obesity epidemic. If that makes me foolish, we need more fools!

Our car died on my wife Thursday night, so Friday I didn't ride so I could pickup a rental car for the weekend, had to deal with a sleazeball guy dooing the high pressure sales thing for extra insurance. Then the stop-start traffic for an hour to get home. Monday took a day off to replace the dead car, more driving in traffic, more sleazeball car salesmen, paying out cash to the repair shop for telling us the old car wasn't worth fixing, paying out cash here, there everywhere. Too late to drop of the rental Monday evening, so Tuesday I don't ride and drop off the rental, pay out more cash, transit to work and home. Could have put my wife and I on DA equipped CF road bikes for the cash we spent. All the time I'm thinking "this is the commuting mode of choice for 85% of the workforce, they're insane."

Our car died on my wife Thursday night, so Friday I didn't ride so I could pickup a rental car for the weekend, had to deal with a sleazeball guy dooing the high pressure sales thing for extra insurance. Then the stop-start traffic for an hour to get home. Monday took a day off to replace the dead car, more driving in traffic, more sleazeball car salesmen, paying out cash to the repair shop for telling us the old car wasn't worth fixing, paying out cash here, there everywhere. Too late to drop of the rental Monday evening, so Tuesday I don't ride and drop off the rental, pay out more cash, transit to work and home. Could have put my wife and I on DA equipped CF road bikes for the cash we spent. All the time I'm thinking "this is the commuting mode of choice for 85% of the workforce, they're insane."

I hear that! whenever i have to deal with the auto industry i feel like a money tree, just getting stripped of everything:mad: . Such a racket: sleazeballs wherever you go, just doing their best to chisel you out of your hard-earned money.

Our car died on my wife Thursday night, so Friday I didn't ride so I could pickup a rental car for the weekend, had to deal with a sleazeball guy dooing the high pressure sales thing for extra insurance. Then the stop-start traffic for an hour to get home. Monday took a day off to replace the dead car, more driving in traffic, more sleazeball car salesmen, paying out cash to the repair shop for telling us the old car wasn't worth fixing, paying out cash here, there everywhere. Too late to drop of the rental Monday evening, so Tuesday I don't ride and drop off the rental, pay out more cash, transit to work and home. Could have put my wife and I on DA equipped CF road bikes for the cash we spent. All the time I'm thinking "this is the commuting mode of choice for 85% of the workforce, they're insane."

I hear that! whenever i have to deal with the auto industry i feel like a money tree, just getting stripped of everything:mad: . Such a racket: sleazeballs wherever you go, just doing their best to chisel you out of your hard-earned money.

Our car died on my wife Thursday night, so Friday I didn't ride so I could pickup a rental car for the weekend, had to deal with a sleazeball guy dooing the high pressure sales thing for extra insurance. Then the stop-start traffic for an hour to get home. Monday took a day off to replace the dead car, more driving in traffic, more sleazeball car salesmen, paying out cash to the repair shop for telling us the old car wasn't worth fixing, paying out cash here, there everywhere. Too late to drop of the rental Monday evening, so Tuesday I don't ride and drop off the rental, pay out more cash, transit to work and home. Could have put my wife and I on DA equipped CF road bikes for the cash we spent. All the time I'm thinking "this is the commuting mode of choice for 85% of the workforce, they're insane."

I hear that! whenever i have to deal with the auto industry i feel like a money tree, just getting stripped of everything:mad: . Such a racket: sleazeballs wherever you go, just doing their best to chisel you out of your hard-earned money.

^^^^ wow triple post-age!
does anyone else have issues with the website freezing up, then hitting "refresh", and the post hits more than once??

A round trip of 160 miles is going to cost over $6000 per year for fuel alone at current prices, plus the additional 40,000 miles of wear and tear. I for one would prefer to spend that money to get a place in the city, closer to work and save the commute time for cycling. What kind of math are these people using?

Sadly, I have to admit to living 50 miles from the office. I have multiple reasons for this: going back to school, affordable housing, living closer to relatives, wanting to live on the coast.... Also, I have a great job that just isn't that common, and I have it at a wonderful firm. I'd have to drive 50 miles in the other direction to find the same job.

On the days I work in the office, I will rack-up 2 hours of driving a day. I really don't have a problem with this. I use to live 15 miles from work, and due to traffic, I spent the same amount of time driving. Although I live much further from work now, I have the option of taking mass transit, which was not a reasonable option before I moved. Maybe once or twice a week I take the train and ride my bike from the train station into work.

Of course, I wasn't stupid when I decided to move 50 miles away from work. Work can take me as much as 150 miles away from the office depending on the job site. My work has given me all the job sites between home and the office. Therefore, somedays I telecommute. I'll go visit a jobsite 15 minutes from home for half the day and go back home to work on the computer.

It took a long time to manipulate my situation to the way it works now, but I think it works well. Somedays, I love my commute and other days I wish I could move out of SoCal to some podunk town Idaho where life is slower.

Heh, I used to be an "extreme" commuter in that for one summer job (not what you think -- highly technical and well paid) I had a commute that took something like 90 minutes. However... I would ride to the train station, be on the train 40 minutes, then ride to work. I wasn't complaining! :D It was a reverse commute, to boot (living in the city, working in the 'bubrs).

I commuted by car at around 1 hour each way for probably at least 3-4 years. Thats not counting that sometimes I had to form triangles going inbetween 3 places.

My wife was living in W. Virginia for a while, and she was pulling a 1.5 hour commute one way. :P

You really get used to it. I'm just glad I can start commuting by bike now. Im only around 2.5 miles from work (though kinda urbanish).

This lone commuter chooses not to poison the air, trash the landscape, subsidize large, psychotic corporations, kill 42,000 people per year, support criminal wars overseas, or become part of the nation's obesity epidemic. If that makes me foolish, we need more fools!
No, you must be a dang Saint. Saving the World and accomplishing miracles, all with your lone commute on your bike.

I couldn't do that. Then again, I don't have a degree in a highly specialized field which pays well enough to do that. Even if I could afford it, I doubt I would be able to do it in good conscience against my ideals.

My ideals tend to hold me back from lots of things...I dropped a record deal 3 years ago because they wanted me to sing a way that was not to my liking. Best move I ever made...I love my job!

Mostly the reason why people commute like this is just due to the fact that job availability isnt always in open access close to where you live. I live in Oklahoma, for example. The town I live in is probably one of the only bike friendly towns in the entire state. I can go anywhere in this town on a bike.

But theres a great deal of suburbs here, and at least half of the people who work inside of Oklahoma City actually live outside of it.

Good Job > Long Commute

^^^^ wow triple post-age!
does anyone else have issues with the website freezing up, then hitting "refresh", and the post hits more than once??

If it appears to freeze up during a post, I middle-click on the thread link at the top of the page to open a new tab on the main thread page, and see if it posted before I try again. Most of the time it did post. If so then I just close the posting tab.

(for those using antiquated browsers, replace "middle click" and "tab" with "right click & 'open in new window'" and "other window").

No, you must be a dang Saint. Saving the World and accomplishing miracles, all with your lone commute on your bike.

The world is changed one small step at a time. "Everyone else is doing it, I can't make a difference" does not excuse wrong behavior.

^^^^ wow triple post-age!
does anyone else have issues with the website freezing up, then hitting "refresh", and the post hits more than once??

Oh yeah... thought it was my home computer, but my work comp does it too.

Both run Win 2K and Mozilla... and this is the only web page I frequent that does this. I believe it is a server issue on their end, but I'm here free, so I can hardly complain.

I did the 45 minute commute for a couple of years - you learn to hate it. Thankfully, I was able to pick my hours, so I missed the worse of the traffic or it would have been more like 1 1/2 hours each way.

Better job, better opportunity. What we did was spend all our time in the morning BEFORE work - when I arrived back, I was expected to be dead tired.

It worked, but I have no desire to do it again. What was silly was I could do the same work from home (computer geek stuff) - no need for the drive. So, finally I just went and told them that I was moving to Costa Rica. They asked if I was quiting, I said only if they stopped paying. They asked me where to send the money. (We own another business in Costa Rica)

Two years later, they still are sending money. :) What is so sad about these commutes is that often they just aren't necessary.

This lone commuter chooses not to poison the air, trash the landscape, subsidize large, psychotic corporations, kill 42,000 people per year, support criminal wars overseas, or become part of the nation's obesity epidemic. If that makes me foolish, we need more fools!

Corporations aren't psychotic (out of touch with reality). They're psychopathic (no morals).

My co-worker commutes 180 MILES A DAY! He likes the country living so gets up at 3:30 AM to drive to work! That's totally nuts in my opinion. I couldn't imagine spending so many, literally, weeks a year, sitting in my car stuck in traffic.

My co-worker commutes 180 MILES A DAY! He likes the country living so gets up at 3:30 AM to drive to work! That's totally nuts in my opinion. I couldn't imagine spending so many, literally, weeks a year, sitting in my car stuck in traffic.

Sidetrack...
Mac, do you surf? How's it been in LA lately? My bro is heading out there next week. On the east coast, NJ was surprisingly good this wknd and the water was warmer than I'd expected it to be (and I needed the exercise, since the only other activity I got done was 12oz curls and riding a beach cruiser 1 mile to the local bar...)

Those extreme commuters are complete idiots. Wow, you get a bigger home or larger yard and all you trade for it is time away from your family. Sick. This is just my opinion.

The world is changed one small step at a time. "Everyone else is doing it, I can't make a difference" does not excuse wrong behavior.
"Wrong Behavior"? Does that mean that anyone who uses a privately owned motor vehicle for commuting is "wrong"? Perhaps this thread should be moved to the car-free forum where no excuses are tolerated for such "wrong" behavior and where all such behavior is a black or white, right or wrong decision.

No, you must be a dang Saint. Saving the World and accomplishing miracles, all with your lone commute on your bike.
Not only am I (and all other bike commuters) Saints, we are also very good Ninjas.:D
Strong like bull, quick like cockroach!

"Wrong Behavior"? Does that mean that anyone who uses a privately owned motor vehicle for commuting is "wrong"?

Anyone who uses a privately owned motor vehicle for commuting when less destructive modes would work as well or better. There are jobs and circumstances where commuting by car is necessary and appropriate. You're right, it's not black and white.

BTW, I'm not a saint, just mortally conceited.

Anyone who uses a privately owned motor vehicle for commuting when less destructive modes would work as well or better. There are jobs and circumstances where commuting by car is necessary and appropriate. You're right, it's not black and white.

BTW, I'm not a saint, just mortally conceited.
And honest too. Fair enough as long as you don't consider it the mortally conceited's privilege to determine what are “necessary and appropriate” circumstances for everyone else based on his own unique circumstances.

I got to grow up in a wonderful place in the country because my dad spent two hours each way to a job in NYC. Car-pool, train, subway, elevator and return. I had him on weekends. I was sure of his love for us because of what he put himself through for so many years.

If superfluous car use didn't cause the problems I mentioned above, I wouldn't care if legions of people drove 1000 miles to work. When I'm forced to subsidize a lifetime supply of problems - that is problems for me - brought by others' laziness and delusions, complaining isn't a privilege, it's my right. "Personal choices" that don't affect me are none of my business. Choosing to use 4000 pounds of equipment to haul your lunch two miles to the office is not such a choice.

My co-worker commutes 180 MILES A DAY! He likes the country living.

Too bad he's not experiencing it!

When I'm forced to subsidize a lifetime supply of problems - that is problems for me - brought by others' laziness and delusions, complaining isn't a privilege, it's my right.

It's even more than a right...it's an obligation.

I used to live in Ottawa, Canada and commuted by bike to and from work, roughly an hour each way. Then I moved back to the States. And now I commute by car 184 miles round trip daily in my 38-42 MPG 1990 Honda CRX. I live in the Poconos, PA and work in NJ, 10 miles from NYC. I used to live about half an hour away from work but still couldn't commute by bike as it was all major highways to get to work. The reason we moved was the ability to purchase a 4 bedroom home with full basement and 1.5 acres of property that my kids can play safely on for less than half of what it would cost for the same type of home in NJ. We looked at a considerably smaller house in NJ (3 bedroom cottage type home with barely any property) and the asking price was close to $300,000. With myself being the only one bringing home the bacon, to the Poconos we went. My hours are fairly flexible but I try to keep it to 10am-6pm, thus being able to avoid rush hour traffic to and from work.

Just found out a month or two ago that my company is looking to relocate to NYC, thus making the commute even longer. But, with crazy parking costs and tolls to get into NYC being what they are, I'll park near an NJ Transit or PATH train station and commute into NYC by train. I just recently acquired a folding bike which I converted to fixed gear for my possible ride from the train station to my place of employment, wherever that will be in NYC. There are numerous "extreme commuters" living in the Poconos who work in NYC. The cost of housing plus the lure of getting away from it all is what brings many NYCers to the Poconos. It's too bad the jobs/salaries didn't/haven't followed.

live in the Poconos, PA and work in NJ, 10 miles from NYC. I used to live about half an hour away from work but still couldn't commute by bike as it was all major highways to get to work. The reason we moved was the ability to purchase a 4 bedroom home with full basement and 1.5 acres of property that my kids can play safely on for less than half of what it would cost for the same type of home in NJ. We looked at a considerably smaller house in NJ (3 bedroom cottage type home with barely any property) and the asking price was close to $300,000. With myself being the only one bringing home the bacon, to the Poconos we went.
Been there, done that. Car pooled for four years from my nice affordable home in Stroudsburg, PA in the Poconos to Dover, NJ (80 miles R/T) for the same reasons as progre-ss.

"Wrong Behavior"? Does that mean that anyone who uses a privately owned motor vehicle for commuting is "wrong"? Perhaps this thread should be moved to the car-free forum where no excuses are tolerated for such "wrong" behavior and where all such behavior is a black or white, right or wrong decision.
Not all things are black and white but your extremely defensive. I suspect you feel you are being wasteful, the attacks on those who do bike commute and see benefit in it seem to be out of guilt.

Not all things are black and white but your extremely defensive. I suspect you feel you are being wasteful, the attacks on those who do bike commute and see benefit in it seem to be out of guilt.
I don't suspect anything about your knowledge of my commuting methods. I know. I bike commute all year long except if the road is known to be icy or I have some appointment that I have to get to from work during the work day. Now you know, and can put away your crystal ball/Ouija board.

I used to live in Ottawa, Canada and commuted by bike to and from work, roughly an hour each way. Then I moved back to the States. And now I commute by car 184 miles round trip daily in my 38-42 MPG 1990 Honda CRX. I live in the Poconos, PA and work in NJ, 10 miles from NYC. I used to live about half an hour away from work but still couldn't commute by bike as it was all major highways to get to work. The reason we moved was the ability to purchase a 4 bedroom home with full basement and 1.5 acres of property that my kids can play safely on for less than half of what it would cost for the same type of home in NJ. We looked at a considerably smaller house in NJ (3 bedroom cottage type home with barely any property) and the asking price was close to $300,000. With myself being the only one bringing home the bacon, to the Poconos we went. My hours are fairly flexible but I try to keep it to 10am-6pm, thus being able to avoid rush hour traffic to and from work.

Just found out a month or two ago that my company is looking to relocate to NYC, thus making the commute even longer. But, with crazy parking costs and tolls to get into NYC being what they are, I'll park near an NJ Transit or PATH train station and commute into NYC by train. I just recently acquired a folding bike which I converted to fixed gear for my possible ride from the train station to my place of employment, wherever that will be in NYC. There are numerous "extreme commuters" living in the Poconos who work in NYC. The cost of housing plus the lure of getting away from it all is what brings many NYCers to the Poconos. It's too bad the jobs/salaries didn't/haven't followed.

Thanks for posting that and I'm glad the setup works for you. Having said that, I don't think I could live that lifestyle myself - the 3-4 hours of time lost to driving would be difficult to adapt to. At least if you can ride the train and bike for part of your new commute, it will be more productive time because you can read on the train and get some exercise on the bike.

we live to work
we work to live

we get a job to pay for an apartment and a car
if we didnt have an apartment or a car to pay for we wouldn't work

ITwo years later, they still are sending money. :) What is so sad about these commutes is that often they just aren't necessary.
What is even sadder is the amount of ignorance from people like you who think that these commutes "are not necessarY" because you feel that they are not necessary and not only do you feel they are not necesary YOU KNOW they are not necessary. Without any care or regard to somebody else's beliefs, ideals, or anything else that makes us "human" and not "some mindless robot following what somebody else thinks is right"

You learned how to ride a bike now learn how to either see through other peoples eyes or stfu and stop judging other people.

I used to live in Ottawa, Canada and commuted by bike to and from work, roughly an hour each way. Then I moved back to the States. And now I commute by car 184 miles round trip daily in my 38-42 MPG 1990 Honda CRX. I live in the Poconos, PA and work in NJ, 10 miles from NYC. I used to live about half an hour away from work but still couldn't commute by bike as it was all major highways to get to work. (snip)

Thanks for laying it out. Sounds like you found the optimum solution. I know there are millions of people who work in blighted and/or overpriced neighborhoods for whom driving every day is option one of one. My beef is with house hunters infatuated with some myth about "country living" who can't bear to have the city anywhere in sight, at least initially, and who regard driving hours a day in a car with hundreds of thousands of miles on it as some kind of virtue.

A round trip of 160 miles is going to cost over $6000 per year for fuel alone at current prices, plus the additional 40,000 miles of wear and tear. I for one would prefer to spend that money to get a place in the city, closer to work and save the commute time for cycling. What kind of math are these people using?

Well, to each his own and if someone wants to do it that's his decision, but, I don't get the math either.

Often the costs of commuting outweigh the savings of buying in the suburbs but even more important and something you can't put a price on is the time lost in the commute.

I enjoy my time riding so my commute's a bonus, but I couldn't imagine not only disliking my commute but losing a couple of hours a day I didn't have to. Time better spent with my family, or doing something productive. Life is short. Make it worthwhile.

I currently ride my bike as my commute is only 8 miles. (haven't figured out why it's longer on the way home!) During the school year I drop my kids off at school so I take my truck. I usually go home at lunch and ride the bike back though. Before that I had a 25 mile commute each way and rode a motorcycle. That was fun also! I've also noticed the server issues.

I am very lucky that my commute is a little less than 1 mile. It takes much less time to get to work on the bike than the car, since I have to circle endlessly in the parking garage to find a space when I drive.

Many people here in Miami bought out in the suburbs where you get a good sized home with a pool fairly reasonably. Now, even though they live about 15 miles from downtown, traffic is so bad it takes them 1 to 1-1/2 hours each way to commute. I would slit my wrists.

"Wrong Behavior"? Does that mean that anyone who uses a privately owned motor vehicle for commuting is "wrong"? Perhaps this thread should be moved to the car-free forum where no excuses are tolerated for such "wrong" behavior and where all such behavior is a black or white, right or wrong decision.

Each person must ultimately choose for themselves what is right and wrong. What I ineffectively was trying to say is that the behavior of other people is not an excuse for the individual to do what they would otherwise think of as wrong.

I believe that driving a car for my normal commute is the wrong decision for me. I don't feel it's justified to generate excess pollution just to haul my butt to work when it's really quite easy and enjoyable for me to work bicycle commuting into my daily routine. This is true for me even though there are 450 other people at work, and I'm the only one riding even though half of them live as close or closer than I do. It would be true if I were the only cyclist in a city of 10 million. And it's true for me even though I realize that everything I do to reduce greenhouse emissions in my entire lifetime will not make a difference that is at all measurable.

If I were living 30 miles from work, driving a car would be the right decision, because I couldn't afford the time to commute by bike. However, at that point I'd question the decision to live/work where I did, and look at telecommuting or moving as options. When I left college, I did intentionally choose to live in a part of the country where I can live relatively close to work and still live in small towns for relatively cheap, even though I could have made twice the money in a metro area. Another decision that's mine alone, and not a jab at others who choose differently.

I drive sometimes. Depends on what I'm doing. If I have to haul kids or big/heavy stuff, I drive. If I'm hauling nothing but myself and a small amount of cargo and I'm not in a hurry, I ride. It's not black or white, but for any one person it is more black or white than it is for people in general. Some peoples physical or environmental situation may be such that riding a bike 10 miles is not possible.

Some people have different values. That's fine. I decide what's right for me, you decide what's right for you. But don't use "everyone else does it" as an excuse for doing something that you would not otherwise do. Likewise I hope that people don't use the reverse logic on me; just because "everyone else" is going to The One True Church or abstaining from eating a tub of ice cream every night, don't tell me I should do it too.

Bottom line: Don't be a sheep. To hell with the herd. I am responsible for my own actions regardless of whether they are common or uncommon. I decide what's right for me and I live with the consequences and my conscience.

What is so sad about these commutes is that often they just aren't necessary



What is even sadder is the amount of ignorance from people like you who think that these commutes "are not necessarY" because you feel that they are not necessary and not only do you feel they are not necesary YOU KNOW they are not necessary


What part of "often" did you not understand?