Foo - Wiz wit.

City agency: Cheesesteak shop's English-only policy discriminates
Monday June 12, 2006
By PATRICK WALTERS
Associated Press Writer

PHILADELPHIA (AP) An English-only ordering policy at one of Philadelphia's most famous cheesesteak joints has prompted a city agency to pursue a discrimination complaint.

The city's Commission on Human Relations plans to file the complaint Monday, alleging the policy at Geno's Steaks discourages customers of certain backgrounds from eating there, said Rachel Lawton, acting executive director.

Geno's owner Joseph Vento has posted two small signs at his shop, which is located in a diverse South Philadelphia neighborhood, telling customers, ``This is AMERICA: WHEN ORDERING 'PLEASE SPEAK ENGLISH.''

In doing so, Lawton said, Vento is violating the city's Fair Practices Ordinance, which prohibits discrimination in employment, public accommodation and housing on the basis of race, ethnicity or sexual orientation.

``It's discouraging patronage by non-English speaking customers because of their national origin or ancestry,'' Lawton said. She said her staff would likely serve the complaint to Geno's on Monday.

Vento, whose grandparents struggled to learn English after coming over from Sicily in the 1920s, said Monday that he has no plans to budge.

``I don't think I'm doing anything that's racist or discriminating,'' said the fiery 66-year-old, who says no customer has ever been turned away because of the policy. ``I would say they would have to handcuff me and take me out because I'm not taking it down.''

Geno's and its chief rival across the street, Pat's King of Steaks, form the epicenter of an area described as ``ground zero for cheesesteaks.''

Vento said he posted the sign about six months ago because of concerns over the debate on immigration reform and the increasing number of people from the area would could not order in English. The traditionally Italian community has become more diverse over the decades, with a growing number of immigrants from Asia and Latin America moving in.

After the city serves the discrimination complaint, Vento will get a chance to file a response. Lawton said the agency would hope to reach an agreement with Vento, but eventually he could be ordered to take down the signs or face fines.

If Geno's violates a city order, she said, the matter could end up in court.

``Let them do what they want to,'' Vento said. ``When it comes, then we'll deal with it.''


Geno's Steaks rocks!

This is AMERICA: WHEN ORDERING 'PLEASE SPEAK ENGLISH.''What the? How can that be taken in offense. Yeah its America and speaking the nations major language should be used, which makes things easier. And its not like theyre saying "this is america, speak english (certain ethnic group here)!!" Those Commission on Human Relations people need to lighten up.

I really do not see how this is against someone's race, ethnicity, or sexual orientation.

I am pretty sure if an Irishman came up and started speaking Gaelic, he would be told to get out of line until he follows procedure. After all, English is our national language.

Oh, and if you want fun...wait until you find a restaurant where nobody speaks any english...I was never so pissed off in my life....45mins after ordering my food did not arrive...so I went up to pay for the drink I had....the cashier could not understand that I did not want my food anymore, I wanted to pay for my drink and leave.

I finally ended up just leaving and having the cops called on me....the cop gave up and let me go after he failed to find a single person there that could comprehend anything more complicated than "I want a #2, and hot tea"...

I'm not being racist or anything of the sort....that place really was that bad.

It was also the last time I ever ate there...I was offended that any business could exist here where NOBODY speaks the national language to some degree of competancy.

Um, doesnt this break the First Amendment...Ya know, freedom of SPEECH?

No, not really. The management of Geno's isn't asking for a restriction on what people say, he's just asking them to say it in English. What's so difficult with that?

All this place sells is steak sandwiches, in one size with American, Provolone or Cheese-Wiz and with or w/o onions Do you think that someone who really wants a Geno's steak could construct the phrase "Wiz Wit" without much difficulty?

It's not like they're being asked to order Coquilles St Jacuqes in perfect French :rolleyes:

Im gettin hungry now:D

No, not really. The management of Geno's isn't asking for a restriction on what people say, he's just asking them to say it in English. What's so difficult with that?

All this place sells is steak sandwiches, in one size with American, Provolone or Cheese-Wiz and with or w/o onions Do you think that someone who really wants a Geno's steak could construct the phrase "Wiz Wit" without much difficulty?

It's not like they're being asked to order Coquilles St Jacuqes in perfect French :rolleyes:

You're in Philly? If so...

This is nothing compared to the sign the guys that sell Christmas trees down on Oregon Avenue (a few blocks from my house, no less) used to have up...keeping in mind that this is the holiday season we're talking about... "Anyone caught stealing will be beaten to death with a bat!" Very Christmas-ish, I thought! :)

;)

No, not really. The management of Geno's isn't asking for a restriction on what people say, he's just asking them to say it in English. What's so difficult with that?

All this place sells is steak sandwiches, in one size with American, Provolone or Cheese-Wiz and with or w/o onions Do you think that someone who really wants a Geno's steak could construct the phrase "Wiz Wit" without much difficulty?

It's not like they're being asked to order Coquilles St Jacuqes in perfect French :rolleyes:

And this is true...

You're in Philly? If so...

This is nothing compared to the sign the guys that sell Christmas trees down on Oregon Avenue (a few blocks from my house, no less) used to have up...keeping in mind that this is the holiday season we're talking about... "Anyone caught stealing will be beaten to death with a bat!" Very Christmas-ish, I thought! :)

;)
Quakertown really, but we get the Philly news.

Quakertown really, but we get the Philly news.

Good enough!

Yeah, the sign at Geno's is a little inkling of the tensions between the Italian, Irish, and Black long-time residents of South Philly, and the huge numbers of Korean/Chinese/Vietnamese/Mexican immigrants who have arrived much more recently. It'll all get worked out. South Philly is a true "melting pot", and things move along pretty smoothly overall (maniacal Christmas tree vendors notwithstanding ;)). :)


David

I don't see a problem with it. If someone comes into his shop speaking....Korean for example...and orders a sandwich in Korean...and this fellow Geno speaks English and not Korean....how does anyone expect him to make the sandwich!!!??? It's common sense people. If I walk into a Chinese restuarant and they have a sign that says orders must be placed in Chinese, I'm either going to speak Chinese, which I don't or go find a restuarant where I can order my food using English. Pretty simple if you ask me. Don't want to speak English??? make your own dam philly cheese steak sandwich.

I do think that if you are living here /a citizen of the U.S. you should be able to speak passable english. We shouldn't have to put up multi-lingual signs everywhere to accomodate you. Just my opinion.

:roflmao: Gooooooooooooo, Vento!!!! Aaaaaaaaaaahahahahahahahaaaahhahahahaahaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!

:roflmao: Gooooooooooooo, Vento!!!! Aaaaaaaaaaahahahahahahahaaaahhahahahaahaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!

You startled me! :mad:

bwhahahaha

You startled me! :mad::roflmao:

I really have no problem with any race. I do have problems with all the people who come to this country and don't take the time to learn english. It just makes things really hard. I'm used to it by now though, as the neighborhood I'm in there are way more non english speaking than english speaking.

Doesn't Geno come from behind the counter and kick your ass if you order the following: "May I please have a provolone cheesesteak with grilled onions?"

I agree. If I moved overseas, I would expect to learn the language, not expect people to speak the language of the country I left. I do think that our country should learn more than one language- we do deal with people from other countries regularly, but at the same time.... c'mon. When you move to a new country LEARN THE FRIGGIN LANGUAGE ALREADY. Personally, I'm getting tired of dealing with people who are supposed to be citizens and having to decipher their barely english- it's not up to me to get what they're saying- it's up to them to get what I'M saying.

Well, my rant's over... *sigh*

Koffee

Dude can run his business any way he wants, as far as I'm concerned. Only thing is, I wonder how much of a problem he was actually having with people ordering in another language. It's not like he has a complicated menu. Sounds like he's mostly just a whiney little baby.

Not completely on topic, but what're you "speak english!" folks going to do if, in ~20 years, Spanish becomes the language of the majority?

Spanish shouldn't become the language of the majority. We need to enforce the "speak english" as people enter our country. If that happens, it won't ever be a problem.

Our problem in this country is that we don't insist that people learn english- we enable non-english speaking people to continue their non-english speaking ways by insisting on putting up signage and having people press "numero dos por espanole". There's one thing where people can speak both, but it helps having signage for both languages, and it's quite another when you just have signage up so that they can bypass the english speaking proces.

Uuugh, it's so irritating.

Koffee

Dude can run his business any way he wants, as far as I'm concerned. Only thing is, I wonder how much of a problem he was actually having with people ordering in another language. It's not like he has a complicated menu. Sounds like he's mostly just a whiney little baby.

Not completely on topic, but what're you "speak english!" folks going to do if, in ~20 years, Spanish becomes the language of the majority?


I thank you for your opinon. It was constructed with sufficient grammer and spelling for me to comprehend the intent of your statements. In english.

As far as Vento being a whiney little baby, did you happen to read the part about him being Sicilian?

-YOU- go tell a Sicilian he is a whiney little baby. I'm sure his rebuttal will be something to hear. And feel.


As far as Spanish goes. The only ones who want Spanish to be the language are the illegals. I live in a area that has a large Hispanic population. Hell, one of my ex-wives is a Latina. We have a child together. My daughter is blonde with blue eyes, and speaks flawless Castillian. And -everybody- in my ex-wife's extended family speaks English. When I was married to her, everyone of her relatives who came to visit. they would want me to teach them English.

Stupidity and arrogance cross all lines of destinction. But so do intelligence and good moral codes.

Spanish shouldn't become the language of the majority. We need to enforce the "speak english" as people enter our country. If that happens, it won't ever be a problem.

Our problem in this country is that we don't insist that people learn english- we enable non-english speaking people to continue their non-english speaking ways by insisting on putting up signage and having people press "numero dos por espanole". There's one thing where people can speak both, but it helps having signage for both languages, and it's quite another when you just have signage up so that they can bypass the english speaking proces.

Uuugh, it's so irritating.

Koffee

Really. Why the heck do I have to press 1 for English?

And don't get me started on the ballots. That is what caused all the problems six years ago, and look where we are now......

Doesn't Geno come from behind the counter and kick your ass if you order the following: "May I please have a provolone cheesesteak with grilled onions?"

If you attempt to order in The Queen's English, he will not directly insult you. He will, however, rephrase your order in a streamlined, slang-ish manner, and demand that you affirm it in this form.

Example:

You: "I beg your pardon, sir, but might I order a single cheesesteak with fried onions?"

Geno: "You want one, wit?"

You: "Quite, actually"

Geno: (yelling to the guys at the grill) "ONE WIT!!!!"

You: "Splendid, I say!" :)

Dude can run his business any way he wants, as far as I'm concerned. Only thing is, I wonder how much of a problem he was actually having with people ordering in another language. It's not like he has a complicated menu. Sounds like he's mostly just a whiney little baby.

Not completely on topic, but what're you "speak english!" folks going to do if, in ~20 years, Spanish becomes the language of the majority?


Funny, I seem to recall a national bill in process that seeks to make English the national language.

I was getteting a hair cut. The lady couldn't speak english properly.
I ended up not hearing or understanding a single word she said and she didn't understand a word i said. The absoluytely most ufcking annoying thing in the world is having to pay for something and not getting what you want because somebody can't speak english. This is Anmerica. If you hbold an american citizen card and plan on working in america then you should speak english so that the people whom you are working for and the people whom you work for can comunicate with you properly.

I was getteting a hair cut. The lady couldn't speak english properly.
I ended up not hearing or understanding a single word she said and she didn't understand a word i said. The absoluytely most ufcking annoying thing in the world is having to pay for something and not getting what you want because somebody can't speak english. This is Anmerica. If you hbold an american citizen card and plan on working in america then you should speak english so that the people whom you are working for and the people whom you work for can comunicate with you properly.

Anyone else find TG's numerous spelling and mechanical errors funny in this context? :D

Sorry, couldn't resist! :o



Anyway, my hair cutting lady is Chinese, and she still a little awkward with English after almost 20 years of living here. She's a smart cookie, too. Going from any Asian language to English (or vice versa, as anyone [like my brother] who has tried to learn Chinese will confirm), is a very difficult transition. Hoa gives me the best hair cut I've ever had for under $20, though, so she can speak Martian for all I care! ;)

Anyone else find TG's numerous spelling and mechanical errors funny in this context? :D

Sorry, couldn't resist! :o



Anyway, my hair cutting lady is Chinese, and she still a little awkward with English after almost 20 years of living here. She's a smart cookie, too. Going from any Asian language to English (or vice versa, as anyone [like my brother] who has tried to learn Chinese will confirm), is a very difficult transition. Hoa gives me the best hair cut I've ever had for under $20, though, so she can speak Martian for all I care! ;)

Yes.... TG if your gonna' post a reply like that, at least pay attention to the number of typos in it.;)

Boogs...at least the lady who cuts your hair uses english. :p

She may not speak it well, but she speaks it. There are a HUGE number of people where I work from various nationaliteis that don't speak english, have not desire or intention to learn english and seem offended when someone who speaks english can't understand them and asks them to speak english. Sheesh.

She may not speak it well, but she speaks it. There are a HUGE number of people where I work from various nationaliteis that don't speak english, have not desire or intention to learn english and seem offended when someone who speaks english can't understand them and asks them to speak english. Sheesh.

Yep, no arguments here.

I can't help but wonder, with an all American name like Geno, How would his relatives felt about a sign like that when they first landed in this country?

I used to own a fast food place and I had many ethnicities visit we tried our best to get them what they wanted so we could put their money in my cash register.

According to his television interviews, when his family came to this country they learned the language.

At my old job (I love saying that) we had a lot of immigrants from Mexico and the rest of Central America working there, all who could barely speak any English. Besides the basics like, "yes, no, come here" etc, they didn't know much, and for good reason, they didn't have too. They work with other non-english speaking immigrants (making lousy money, especially for NJ), live with them, and ride together. Enabling them to speak Spanish everywhere and not forcing them to learn English is keeping them in these crappy jobs. I'm sure there are exceptions, like owning a store (I know of a few who are making good money), but most aren't making much, and busting their ass to do so. I'd call it tough love making them learn it, everyone else had to do it, but I guess if there wasn't such a large establish bilingual hispanic population, this probably woudn't be an issue... Eh, but what the hell do I know

what does he charge for one of those sandwhiches?

Funny, I seem to recall a national bill in process that seeks to make English the national language.
For the sake of argument, I agree that people here should speak the language. It's common sense and respectful. But really, at the end of the day, it's a non-issue to me. I have more important things to get pissed off about than what language someone speaks, such as a bunch of wealthy baboons trying to make up yet another pointless law so that they can stir up a dust storm to hide all of the other stupid **** that they're doing from the people who seem to be more concerned about what language people speak or who someone wants to marry or what big block of antiquated god-laws are on what courthouse lawn than they are about the horrific debt these baboons are putting our country into or any of a dozen other absolutely ******** things they're doing...

Sorry about the run-on sentence. My grammar broke earlier this morning.

what does he charge for one of those sandwhiches?
About six bucks. Ever had a Philly Cheesesteak, Merton?

At a local university, I run into students who are from Germany, France, Italy, and Spain. Each of them speaks perfect English. Too perfect. And each of them knows two or three languages.

In contrast, a typical Texan only speaks Texan. Texan has a variety of dialects. There is "East Side Trailer Park". There is "West Texas Small Town". There is "Inner City Public Housing". None of these Texas dialects would be easily understood by someone who speaks correct English, such as a high school student in Germany, Russia, or Hong Kong.

Yet, just about every "red neck" I know is insistent: "...duh, dem Mezkins needa lernum sum English...waz up wit dat speakin Mezkin all de time...we be speakin' English, ya know wat I' sayin, so dem 'all otta be speaking it jus lik us do..."

I have difficulty resisting the temptation to point out to "Bubba" that he, his momma and grandma were all born in Texas, and NONE of them speak English...so their defense of the English language is a bit like a $5 hooker defending virginity.

For the sake of argument, I agree that people here should speak the language. It's common sense and respectful. But really, at the end of the day, it's a non-issue to me. I have more important things to get pissed off about than what language someone speaks, such as a bunch of wealthy baboons trying to make up yet another pointless law so that they can stir up a dust storm to hide all of the other stupid **** that they're doing from the people who seem to be more concerned about what language people speak or who someone wants to marry or what big block of antiquated god-laws are on what courthouse lawn than they are about the horrific debt these baboons are putting our country into or any of a dozen other absolutely ******** things they're doing...

Sorry about the run-on sentence. My grammar broke earlier this morning.
That's pretty insulting to baboons, but I do like it anyway.;)

Seems to me that Geno's is a private establishment, is it not? As long as they obey the ADA, I thought private businesses could refuse service to anyone for pretty much any reason.

I was getteting a hair cut. The lady couldn't speak english properly.
I ended up not hearing or understanding a single word she said and she didn't understand a word i said. The absoluytely most ufcking annoying thing in the world is having to pay for something and not getting what you want because somebody can't speak english. This is Anmerica. If you hbold an american citizen card and plan on working in america then you should speak english so that the people whom you are working for and the people whom you work for can comunicate with you properly.

Uhhh... OK.

I guess even atrocious spelling and grammar does count as english.

For the record, how many of you hold an "American citizen card"? I don't.

By the way, I agree with the sentiments, TG... just find it amusing that when bashing people about communicating, you've managed to mangle the language fairly well yourself.

Those errors have literally nothing to do with "spelling and grammar". They are typo's because of how fast my hands type and how poor my hand eye coordination is. It is the same reason why I cannot play video games or pretty much any game that requires hand eye coordination of what sort. on top of that I don't bother to typo proof my forum postings because it plain and simply does not matter. This is not a business function of any sort. And in almost all cases the typos fall into line with studies done by Harvard and other universities as actually having very little effect on the readability of something due to people's nature to read and etc.

But they do show the people who both don't know the difference between "true grammatical errors" and "true spelling errors" versus typoes and are willing to point them out in a very lame response to something.

last I remember naturalization requirements involved a certain proficiency level of the english language.

That's pretty insulting to baboons, but I do like it anyway.;)

Seems to me that Geno's is a private establishment, is it not? As long as they obey the ADA, I thought private businesses could refuse service to anyone for pretty much any reason.
They are on the east coast.

They are on the east coast.
Yeah, I know. What's your point?

Yeah, I know. What's your point?The east coast is a staunch liberal supporter.

She may not speak it well, but she speaks it. There are a HUGE number of people where I work from various nationaliteis that don't speak english, have not desire or intention to learn english and seem offended when someone who speaks english can't understand them and asks them to speak english. Sheesh.
If you think you have problems with people not speaking english come to ssf, ca. Try walking down the street in china town. :) or even at the mall.

Those errors have literally nothing to do with "spelling and grammar". They are typo's because of how fast my hands type and how poor my hand eye coordination is. It is the same reason why I cannot play video games or pretty much any game that requires hand eye coordination of what sort. on top of that I don't bother to typo proof my forum postings because it plain and simply does not matter. This is not a business function of any sort. And in almost all cases the typos fall into line with studies done by Harvard and other universities as actually having very little effect on the readability of something due to people's nature to read and etc.

But they do show the people who both don't know the difference between "true grammatical errors" and "true spelling errors" versus typoes and are willing to point them out in a very lame response to something.

While we're just picking on you mostly and the typos are pretty obvious, there is one "true grammatical error" in your post.

If you think this ("people whom you are working for and the people whom you work for") is grammatically correct, then you should probably review your grammar text.

And for the record, a typo is a spelling error. Call it what you want, but it's a misspelled word that you published. The cause is a typographical error, the result is a spelling error. Some people recognize that, others use it as a lame form of justification and sorry attempt to flame others.

Obviously several people found amusement and irony in your post not exclusively because of the errors, but because of the context of the errors.

About six bucks. Ever had a Philly Cheesesteak, Merton?


just that subway garbage... they must be good or big one to be costin that much.

just that subway garbage... they must be good or big one to be costin that much.
Yer right, "Subway Garbage". A well made cheesesteak is both big and good. :)

C'mon up for my funeral and I'll buy you one.

your dying? (did i spell dying right?)

There are places in South Philly whose cheesteaks and hoagies (submarine sandwiches, for all you squares ;)) are HUGE. I mean, ridiculously big.

I can't help but wonder, with an all American name like Geno, How would his relatives felt about a sign like that when they first landed in this country?

I used to own a fast food place and I had many ethnicities visit we tried our best to get them what they wanted so we could put their money in my cash register.


If I owned a business I wouldn't care what language people spoke if they were customers. This guy doesn't sound as if he's customer focused.

I don't speak any other languages but I've never been turned away from a shop in a country that is non-English speaking just because I didn't order something in the local lingo.

What would he do if a mute person went in there?

your dying? (did i spell dying right?)
Yeah, I got leukemia and my system can't tolerate the cure.