on my way home from work tonight, i accidentally wound up harassing a bicyclist for his own safety.
I was bicycling, it was dusk and i passed a chubby guy in Bianchi full kit, a commuter bag, and NO LIGHTS as we climbed uphill past a drawbridge. He was tough to make out, so I call out, half jokingly "I almost hit you cause i couldn't see your lights." or something wiseacre like that. I was moving well faster so dropped him on the uphill.
I crest the hill hundreds of yards ahead of the guy, i can't really see him anyway, because HE HAS NO LIGHTS.
So, a mile or so later, on the hills backside, i can hear or feel the sound of a cyclist trying to suck up and i look back, and its the guy in the Bianchi full kit pulling up.
I drop drop down and pull way ahead of the unilluminated idiot without saying anything. he catches me at a light in another half mile or so.
I think he starts it off by being all serious and stating how "I didn't almost hit him" and "why did i pull out into the middle of the lane" to avoid a pedestrian and wave off a vehicle (he was watching me from behind) - He was all in my face jackactor.
so i got right back at him, and began to flip him relentless shizzle for the next mile or so, about how he can hardly be seen from behind, mabye he should think about some blinkies, and hes' all defensive and telling me to ride away as i continue to harangue the guy for idiotically riding without any lights OR reflectors.
I should have just let him ride, but he was a dipshiz, and then when i continued to point out his lack of visiblity from behind or intelligence, he got all defensive.
whats' with chubby guys in full team kit, , trying to be sooo 'cool' it serves as a detriment to their own safety? When i've had the same type of conversation with other not very visible riders about their lack of visibility (at this spot on the uphill i use a similar line on many darklighters), a lot of them take it in stride and consider blinkies...
Feltup
06-15-06, 12:42 AM
He was like; "fo shizzle.......
Did you think maybe he went for a ride had a flat or got lost and was behind schedule? Instead of harrassing him you should have found out if he would like some assistance with a lead.
divineAndbright
06-15-06, 01:10 AM
I like to go outside and yell at the trees for not having lights. Can't see the trees! Dont get me started on picket fences.
joejack951
06-15-06, 05:21 AM
Bek, I agree with the Bianchi rider. He was in the bike lane where cars don't need to worry about him so he doesn't need lights.
linux_author
06-15-06, 05:43 AM
- hmm... takes guts to offer unsolicited advice...
- i'd be more afraid of getting a frame pump in my spokes - that would end any chance for a relevant conversation, huh?
- btw, i see night-riding behavior like this all the time - especially by youths wearing dark clothing and riding bikes with no reflectors, lights or anything...
cc_rider
06-15-06, 05:55 AM
on my way home from work tonight, i accidentally wound up harassing a bicyclist for his own safety....
Accidentally???
.....I should have just let him ride, but he was a dipshiz...
Sounds like there was more than one on the road that night.
I can see Beke's point, though....
A can see his point, too, and agree with it. B's first comment to the guy was fine. Everything after that was gratuitous.
jeff-o
06-15-06, 05:57 AM
While he probably didn't need a 30W HID strapped to the handlebars, I agree that a set of front and rear blinkies would have been wise.
KrisPistofferson
06-15-06, 06:16 AM
I can see Beke's point, though. It's the wrong-way "ninja riders" and Lance wannabes, (who spend $5000 on a bike but can't afford a $25 LED blinkie, ) that make the average motorist think we're all DUIs or spandex-clad tools. Usually I just let it slide, but sometimes I have a bad day and say something, same as I do with motorists. Seriously, this doesn't seem to be something you can explain to Americans of any social group anymore, but your behavior reflects on your peers, so be good. Now watch me get flamed for stating the obvious.
Oh, and if you ride at night without lights, you're an idiot, not a ninja, not a worm-riding Fremen, and not Today's Tom Sawyer. An idiot. Even more than people who refuse to wear helmets.
MarkS
06-15-06, 06:16 AM
So how late was it? Looks like sunset for your area was after 9 pm.
TeleJohn
06-15-06, 06:27 AM
I gave some guy unsolicited advice and now I feel righteous.
Look at me, everybody!
Look at me!
Love me!
*****
ElJamoquio
06-15-06, 06:32 AM
Last night was the first time I drove on my 'Biking' road after dark. There were three or four cyclists, only one of whom had lights. The lighted guy was visible. The others were almost invisible.
If you're going to be out at night, you need a light. I haven't harassed anyone about it, because it's part of my Darwinian plan...
JohnBrooking
06-15-06, 07:45 AM
Bek, I agree with the Bianchi rider. He was in the bike lane where cars don't need to worry about him so he doesn't need lights.
I can't tell if you're being facetious, trolling, or sincere. In the extremely unlikely case that it's the latter, consider intersections. Consider that the bike lane might end suddenly, or not go where Mr. Bianchi needs to go. Consider if Mr. Bianchi needs to avoid an obstacle in the bike lane. Consider any number of things that happen all the time in the Real World(tm). Consider the law (in most places).
joejack951
06-15-06, 07:51 AM
I can't tell if you're being facetious, trolling, or sincere. In the extremely unlikely case that it's the latter, consider intersections. Consider that the bike lane might end suddenly, or not go where Mr. Bianchi needs to go. Consider if Mr. Bianchi needs to avoid an obstacle in the bike lane. Consider any number of things that happen all the time in the Real World(tm). Consider the law (in most places).
Sorry, I was being facetious. Bek is such a strong proponent of bike lanes and an often used reason for bike lanes is that cyclists don't need to worry about passing motorists when in the bike lane. I should have added my real response to the end of my post.
Actually, I should ask for confirmation that this rider was indeed riding in a bike lane at all. I'm assuming it based on the comments the rider made to Bek about why he was riding in the middle of the road at one point.
powers2b
06-15-06, 08:23 AM
I like to go outside and yell at the trees for not having lights. Can't see the trees! Dont get me started on picket fences.
Baw haw haw
I raff so hard I almost pish my pansh
galen_52657
06-15-06, 08:33 AM
whom harassed whom? Post title reads like you were harassed when it was you who were the harasser...
Nobody likes a busybody....even if it's 'for their own good'....
2manybikes
06-15-06, 10:08 AM
It's wrong to ride after dark without lights, and good reflectors, but lots of people get defensive when a stranger points out they are doing something wrong. It's just human nature. All you can do is tell him and hope for the best. More conversation about his "error" is probably no help. He might have been feeling
" OK I get it, now leave me alone."
genec
06-15-06, 10:53 AM
on my way home from work tonight, i accidentally wound up harassing a bicyclist for his own safety.
Sounds like you harassed him more than for his safety... too bad you didn't just see a brother in need and ride with him... being the light he needed.
chipcom
06-15-06, 11:14 AM
Bek, I agree with the Bianchi rider. He was in the bike lane where cars don't need to worry about him so he doesn't need lights.
You just forgot the little sarcasm smiley, right? Edit: after reading further, nevermind! :)
chipcom
06-15-06, 11:16 AM
Oh, and if you ride at night without lights, you're an idiot, not a ninja, not a worm-riding Fremen, and not Today's Tom Sawyer. An idiot. Even more than people who refuse to wear helmets.
Whew, I am relieved, at least I ain't at the bottom of the barrel. :p
sbhikes
06-15-06, 11:19 AM
Nobody likes to be lectured. But maybe he'll get a blinkie for the next time.
Shimpie
06-15-06, 11:33 AM
He was safer riding beside you! You had the lights.
unkchunk
06-15-06, 12:32 PM
... it was dusk and i passed a chubby guy in Bianchi full kit, a commuter bag, and NO LIGHTS...
That's pretty good. I usually can't make out people's weight or bike manufacture in the dark.
Bikes-N-Drums
06-15-06, 12:43 PM
Here again we see that none are more hated than those offering unsolicited advice.
mechBgon
06-15-06, 12:45 PM
I sometimes wish I had a pocketful of cheap blinkies that I could hand out to the working-poor bicycle commuters I see down on Sprague. Maybe I should change my BF title to "blinkie pimp" :D
Regarding the Bianchi rider... I used to work in a shop that sold Bianchi. The proud new owners of Bianchi road bikes were often asking for the reflectors to be removed, due to the Fred-factor stigma of having reflectors. And they probably don't envision themselves out in darkness in the first place.
Anyway, you have to lay the honey on pretty thick with those people in order to give them advice without getting a defensive reaction. "Hey how's it going? That bike is HAWT, is that a 2006 model? :) Sweet. Hey if you ride at this time of day a lot, I can tell you it'll be worth it to get a small red blinkie like one of them small Cateye ones. They keep people from driving right up your wheel before spotting you, and they unclip when you don't want them on the bike :)"
I have that exact same one. I have to side with Bekologist here, in oregon it is against the law to ride without any type of light. I personally have that cateye one and a nike blinker on my bag at all times, so I wont forget.
gritface
06-15-06, 02:54 PM
chubby guy...whats' with chubby guys
Obviously chubby wasn't a typo. I don't see what the point of mentioning that is unless it makes you feel better about the whole situation.
bentstrider
06-15-06, 04:20 PM
- btw, i see night-riding behavior like this all the time - especially by youths wearing dark clothing and riding bikes with no reflectors, lights or anything...
I see hordes of up to as many as 20 of these guys riding along the streets in the downtown area we have here. You almost don't see them riding opposing traffic until they are 20 feet in front of you.
I suck it up and just think of them as a silent ghost-recon squadron. They're on complete radio-silence and have been instructed to fly blind to avoid detection.
This makes me want to mount a remote switch for my tail-light in the case I'm being pursued by an erratic motorist or cyclist.
Fly into an offroad area and totally lose them to unseen ruts that only I'll be able to take.
kb0tnv
06-16-06, 08:28 AM
I gave up telling people what to do. It isn't worth it! I saw a really cute gal riding a road bike. I was coming up the hill to a stop sign and saw her cross the intersection. She did a quick look see and but didn't do a full stop. That is her decision of course but I at least like to pause and if cars are there I will clip out and put one foot down to show I am stopped. I find this much easier since they don't know if you will go or not. Well to continue on with my story... I ended up going her direction and tailed her for a bit. She got to turn left sooner than I did at the next intersection. I ended up catching her down the hill. She was actually stopped at the light for this intersection. There was a car beside her and I was behind the car because I ride more V.C. I was in the right tire track. To me If I was going to be to the right I would be going right. However since I was going straight I just positioned myself which shows I am going that direction. Plus it is two lanes and the right most lane ahead isn't comfortable or safe to share with a car. Well she got going and I could see she was wearing both a black top and black cycling shorts. Yes it wasn't night but it was after 6pm and who knows how long she would be out riding. I was wearing my lime green cycling vest with my rear blinky in the back for low light conditions and I am going under a tunnel ahead. I wanted to tell her that her choice of colors wasn't very good. At least wear something brighter for the top! But I have learned not to give people instruction because most don't want to hear about it. If I was in a cycling class then I think that is the perfect place to provide it. Otherwise we are just waisting our time. Unless you are a certified instructor (I am not) we don't have much authority to tell these crazy cyclists what to do. There is a small group who I will tell. It is the WRONG WAY Cyclists! If given the oportunity I usually will tell them they are going the wrong direction. But I have to be in the right mood or see someone that isn't wearing headphones!
Keep Cycling and let those who know do and those that don't find their own path! Even if their path leads under a vehicle they can parish in their own ignorance!
Oh and I wouldn't strike up a conversation with a woman cyclist unless they approach me simply because it may be considered "stalking". I have a wife so I should be confronting them anyway! ;o) However looking for a bit isn't wrong! I observe beautiful plants and trees. Women are created and many are outstanding!
I know I am being hard but it just isn't worth it!
Keep Cycling!
Bekologist
06-16-06, 08:36 AM
hey, team kit on a chubby guy riding with a messenger bag just makes me laugh sometimes. I'm not size-elitist or anything like that, it was just painting the picture, why i passed him uphill, and explains his huffing and puffing to catch up to harangue me for making my joke about almost hitting him....
its humorous TO ME how all sorts of people get hyperserious about their road riding, and wear full kit on commutes, and are soooo "GO TEAM, I'M a bike rider but i won't use lights (or a helmet) because they aren't 'cool'.
Yesterday i saw a skinny guy in jeans and a leather hairnet helmet, and i thought that was funny too....
DogBoy
06-16-06, 09:20 AM
As a 'chubby' guy, I must say that cycling clothing is still the best clothing for the task...If I'm not wearing the cycling shorts and cycling jerseys I find that I overheat. I do however have lights (2 5 LED blinkies + 1 NR tail-light, along with a cygolite HID & a 3 LED white light as a backup in front).
Bekologist
06-16-06, 09:28 AM
my apologies for bringing sizism into the commentary. i request striking it from the record. substitute 'slower', but is this may offend the speed challenged ;)
chipcom
06-16-06, 10:06 AM
As a 'chubby' guy, I must say that cycling clothing is still the best clothing for the task...If I'm not wearing the cycling shorts and cycling jerseys I find that I overheat. I do however have lights (2 5 LED blinkies + 1 NR tail-light, along with a cygolite HID & a 3 LED white light as a backup in front).
What's the difference between a $40+ cycling jersey and a $9 poly shirt from xmart?
A rear pocket and maybe a front zipper.
To me, cycling jerseys are a waste of my money.
genec
06-16-06, 11:22 AM
hey, team kit on a chubby guy riding with a messenger bag just makes me laugh sometimes. I'm not size-elitist or anything like that, it was just painting the picture, why i passed him uphill, and explains his huffing and puffing to catch up to harangue me for making my joke about almost hitting him....
its humorous TO ME how all sorts of people get hyperserious about their road riding, and wear full kit on commutes, and are soooo "GO TEAM, I'M a bike rider but i won't use lights (or a helmet) because they aren't 'cool'.
Yesterday i say a skinny guy in jeans and a leather hairnet helmet, and i thought that was funny too....
Yeah, I fall into that catagory with one of my bikes... my vintage 80's Italian road bike. No lights, I prefer to wear jersey and shorts when I ride it, and I had a hard time convincing myself to put a computer on it (just to clock milage).
Until recently it also had vintage bar tape on it.
Now contrast that with my daily commuter... Flat bar, fat tire bike with 3 different headlights, two different tailights, front and rear racks and it looks like it has been to hell and back. (it was only to Cabo and back).
I enjoy both bikes for very different reasons. Hyper serious... nah... I spend too much time grinnin' when riding. :D
maximusvt
06-16-06, 01:53 PM
joejack, I thought that comment about "riding in the bike lane so cars don't have to worry about him" sounded like a joke too. If I trusted drivers to respect the line, I would have been dead or seriously injured years ago. A light in the front and the back is the way to go, it gives me much more peace of mind when I'm riding at night. Oh, and I can see where I'm goin too...
Feltup
06-16-06, 04:33 PM
What's the difference between a $40+ cycling jersey and a $9 poly shirt from xmart?
A rear pocket and maybe a front zipper.
To me, cycling jerseys are a waste of my money.
There is a big difference. I like to save money but some things are worth the extra dough. I have both and the feel is better on a good jersey. The pockets are a big plus when doing a century. Plus I like the style and logos that are avalible on jerseys.
sbhikes
06-16-06, 04:41 PM
What's the difference between a $40+ cycling jersey and a $9 poly shirt from xmart?
A rear pocket and maybe a front zipper.
To me, cycling jerseys are a waste of my money.
I like cycling jerseys just because they have a lot of fun designs. But they stink after one wearing and the smell never comes out in the wash and they aren't all that comfortable or cool. You are right, they are a waste of money, but they look nice.
古強者死神
06-18-06, 11:05 PM
What's the difference between a $40+ cycling jersey and a $9 poly shirt from xmart?
A rear pocket and maybe a front zipper.
To me, cycling jerseys are a waste of my money
here here!, although I do have one jersey and it could not be replicated by an x-mart shirt and thats my marine corps jersy. That and your hard pressed to find a jersy for 40$ anyways, all the ones I see are 60+
I am a person that doesnt like the look of relfectors and things too, so for the rear I use a cateye ld-1000 it unclips wich is great so I dont have to be showing it off in the day, and to a lesser extend because I would be afraid of breaking it with all my aggressive riding.
For the front its that dinotte ultra 5. Its illegal to be in low light conditions without a light here in florida atleast at night it is. As for the comment of the guy being in the bike lane so he doesnt need lights as cars dont need to worry about him, I dont see how the heck you came to that conclusion.
There are several post about people getting right hooked, or almost hit when sombody comes out of a parking lot... the lights prevent (or atleast help prevent) that.
Roody
06-18-06, 11:55 PM
my apologies for bringing sizism into the commentary. i request striking it from the record. substitute 'slower', but is this may offend the speed challenged ;)
Slower? In your OP you say you dropped him twice and he caught you twice. Sounds like you need a rematch to find out who's really slower--Mr. Velocitytransit or some fat guy with tights and no lights. :D
Can we make it 2 out of 3?
Grimmreaper
06-19-06, 10:43 AM
The fact that it was a chubby guy or a really fit rider, if he is in a bike lane or not is irrelevant.
If you are on the road and by yourself (especialy at night or dusk), a rider needs to let his presence be known, (most states require some type of reflector as a state law) A blinking light both front and rear is almost guaranteed to get a motorists attention and avoid an accident and as far as I am concerned the brighter the better.
As far as the statement that started this thread, I am not sure if there was anything to be gained with the back and forth comments. But the guy riding without lights has to be more careful than normal regardless if there is a bike lane or not, from my experiance cars sometimes do go over the bike lane and then the only law I really pay attention to is the law of gross tonnage.
In my opinion if a person can afford a decent jersy and shorts, then that person can also afford a good quality light head light and tail light.
ThatWhichRolls
06-19-06, 02:53 PM
I gave up telling people what to do. It isn't worth it!
Too true. Most people prefer not to listen when you give them any sort of advice about *anything*, not just bike-related matters. For instance, everyone knows how bad most of the food at McDonalds is for one's health, but people will continue to eat there, because it's cheap and fast and (to some) tastes good.
Potentially dangerous behavior like riding without lights or reflectors at night, or, to give another example, riding against traffic, is just the tip of the iceberg. How many folks do you see out there on the streets or on the trails who have got their saddle way too low? They're riding inefficiently because they're not getting a proper leg extension into each downstroke, and they're probably destroying their knees in the process. What about people who don't seem to understand how gearing works, riding in 90F+ weather and are just struggling to keep moving because of the misconception that you have to push against a lot of resistance to get anywhere? Or people who won't carry a multitool, mini-pump, and a patch kit with them no matter where they're going?
I wish there was a good way to get through to people on these issues, but good luck explaining it in two minutes or less and getting anyone to listen. No matter how hard one tries, advice=preaching to most. Willfull ignorance wins out way too often.
Phantoj
06-21-06, 10:04 AM
I get enough of car drivers "educating" me on proper lane position ("get on the sidewalk") and the dangers of cycling. I can understand why a rider would bristle at being told what to do. I'd like to just ride my bike without receiving directives.
FLBandit
06-21-06, 10:29 AM
I'm a chubby guy who sometimes wears full kit. When I see myself in the mirror, I laugh too! I DO look pretty silly, but the gear works, that's why I wear it.
robtown
06-21-06, 09:05 PM
I see a lot of stealth cyclists during the dark months. Once, 50 yards ahead, I was surprised to see one had a bright headlight. After a few seconds I realized it was a reflector and I dimmed my DIY system. No apologies, though, it has the desired effect on cars.
mechBgon
06-21-06, 09:15 PM
A blinking light both front and rear is almost guaranteed to get a motorists attention and avoid an accident and as far as I am concerned the brighter the better. I like the sound of that :beer:
chemcycle
06-25-06, 03:42 PM
I was bicycling, it was dusk and i passed a chubby guy in Bianchi full kit
Did you also give him nutritional advice?
Have you contacted Bianchi? I'm sure they'll get Interpol right on it....
SingleSpeeDemon
06-25-06, 04:09 PM
I'm a chubby guy, so I avoid trying to squeeze into some brightly coloured cycling apparel. To me (and everyone around me) I look like 10lbs of sh*t stuffed into a 5lb sack. I do have a full 7-11 replica outfit made by Descente. Had my senior HS pics taken in that get-up. That was 46lbs ago.
Now I wear whatever moves me that day. Love the camo knickers I made from my old BDUs.
Oh--back in college, my buddy swiped me a VistaLite from Brookstone...still works since 1992! I'm gonna slap it on my POS tonight!
I-Like-To-Bike
06-26-06, 03:52 AM
What's the difference between a $40+ cycling jersey and a $9 poly shirt from xmart?
A rear pocket and maybe a front zipper.