Fast Groups Encountering Slower Riders

[Bikes-N-Drums]

I'm lucky enough to have a bike path under a mile from my house, one that goes out to scenic Stone Mountain. You could say I really enjoy my rides now. I ride a recumbent and the lady rides a touring bike. As far as average speed is concerned we're relatively slow.

Being that our location attracts cyclists are people off all sorts, you can bet there's active cycling groups in the area. There's a particular one that coincides with our after-5pm rides. A rather large pack of roadies. The serious folks evidently as anyone going under 20mph at any point in the ride would get dropped. There's somewhere between 50-100 of them depending on the day. Big group.

Every time we ride we encounter this group. I haven't figured out their route yet but we try to avoid them. No luck - they have always somehow ended up approahing us from behind.

Now, these folks ride fast and there's a lot of them. They sound like a pack of marauding vikings and look like it in the rear view mirror. And here were are ahead of them in the street essentially piddlywinking along from their perspective.

What do we do?

We have been forced to stop or divert our route every time. The lady is a complete novice and she is in training, learning to ride in traffic and still nervous about it. And although I have a lot more experience I must admit I'm stumped by this as I've never ridden in a large group and somehow never encountered one while riding. The one time we tried to stay on our course, the roadies began overtaking us the same way they ride in their group: 2" or less away from us and at double our speed. She gets spooked and gets the nervous wobble going and then I get really scared there's going to be a pile-up on both of us. We pulled out of the road and let them pass. I know they aren't intentionally intimidating but the difference in pace and their style of riding makes it so.

We all have a right to the road, blah blah. But, what's the etiquette for a scenario involving slowpokes with a group of high-speed roadies approaches from the rear? We don't want to stop or change routes whenever these folks come by. And I don't want to give the lady the impression that more bikes in a pack = greater rights of way. Please educate us on the proper way to co-exist on the streets so we don't wipe out 50 Atlanta area cyclists at once. Thanks!

[galen_52657]

At the begging of your post you state that you are riding on a 'bike path', at the end, 'the street'. Which is it?

First and foremost, bike paths should NOT be used for serious training during the normal hours that others may be using the path. Buttcrack of dawn? Maybe. Bike paths are generally are too narrow, too flat and have way too many other users for any sort of fast riding. And a pack? doing speed work on a bike path? That's just nuts! Our club would never do that. All training is on the road, an indoor trainer or the gym. Any path riding is for noodling along with kids or other folks who don't ride much.

Regardless of the location, my advise would be to treat this pack like they are a motor vehicle, hold your line 3' or so off the edge of the road or path, and hand signal them to slow down if somebody is coming the other way. If they act rude, check the club names on some of their jerseys and contact the club and complain of their behavior. Most racing clubs have a website.

[Bikes-N-Drums]

At the begging of your post you state that you are riding on a 'bike path', at the end, 'the street'. Which is it?

First and foremost, bike paths should NOT be used for serious training during the normal hours that others may be using the path. Buttcrack of dawn? Maybe. Bike paths are generally are too narrow, too flat and have way too many other users for any sort of fast riding. And a pack? doing speed work on a bike path? That's just nuts! Our club would never do that. All training is on the road, an indoor trainer or the gym. Any path riding is for noodling along with kids or other folks who don't ride much.

Regardless of the location, my advise would be to treat this pack like they are a motor vehicle, hold your line 3' or so off the edge of the road or path, and hand signal them to slow down if somebody is coming the other way. If they act rude, check the club names on some of their jerseys and contact the club and complain of their behavior. Most racing clubs have a website.

Sorry, I will clarify. We're all riding in the street. The bike path reference was simply to indicate the area is relatively flat and therefore attracts cyclists to the area. Thank you for the advice! We'll give that a try.

[-=£em in Pa=-]

Most 'serious' roadies that I encounter are arrogant and self centered.
Try to relay to your friend the importance of total concentration and focusing
on being smooth should be her only priority in this situation.
Just keep your line. Its not your problem what they do.

[twahl]

What Galen said...and I have one additional tip. Move behind the lady and ride a litte further left than she is, like maybe 18". They'll have to go around you and it will leave her a little more space for her peace of mind.

As the overtaking riders, it is their responsibility to pass safely, but you can create a little extra cushion for the wife.

[catatonic]

Proper form is to get single file, on the right 1/3rd of the road if safe, and let them overtake as if they were a car.

Traffic is traffic....if they cannot figure out how to pass you, they are not skilled enough to be in a club ride. Even the novice club riders can figure out how to deal with slower riders as soon as they see the folks in the lead handle it.

So just treat them like you would a car coming up on you. Give them their due space under "sharing the road", and if they have any manners, they will overtake you in a manner that fits under sharing the road as well.

[CommuterRun]

Hold your line and speed. The onus is on the overtaking to pass safely as individual vehicles or slow until it is safe to do so.

I like Twahl's suggestion of getting behind your wife and riding 18" to 2' to her left, making sure she doesn't crowd too far to the right.

[atbman]

They are in the wrong. Any cyclist, overtaking another vehicle, should give a reasonable amount of room to the vehicle concerned. When the vehicles are slower bikes, this applies even more so, since they are vulnerable

1. Follow Twahl's advice re riding behind and outside her
2. Take a note of the club jerseys, get their secretary's address / club website, etc., and make your views known
3. If their behaviour strikes you as dangerous, report them to the police

Good luck

[supcom]

They sound like a pack of marauding vikings and look like it in the rear view mirror.

So, they ride waving swords and shouting?

Maybe if you weave around when you see their ships in your rear view mirror, they'll mistake you for a poor inexperienced peasant and give you a little more room. No Viking wants to get a scratch on his carbon fiber drakkar.

[UmneyDurak]

So, they ride waving swords and shouting?
Well duh, carbon swords, and viking helmets (also carbon) are standard equpiment that comes with every road bike. :D

[JLauren]

Well duh, carbon swords, and viking helmets (also carbon) are standard equpiment that comes with every road bike. :D

DANG! Back to the LBS! I didn't get mine!

[operator]

Well on the bright side of a crash, if there is a pile up that'll teach em not to pass dangerously.

[2manybikes]

Well on the bright side of a crash, if there is a pile up that'll teach em not to pass dangerously.


Maybe ! :)

[sbhikes]

You could always try one of those flash flag things that stick out the side a little. I'm sure those guys value the paint job on their bikes too much to run into it. Maybe they'd give you a little more room.

[CommuterRun]

^^Thaaat's a good idea. I didn't think of that at all.:)

[jyossarian]

Frame pump in the spokes?

Otherwise twahl and sbhikes' ideas sound more legal and safer for your wife. I'd flip if anyone spooked my wife while riding and I'd take on an army to show my displeasure.

[sgtsmile]

The suggestion of you creating space for your wife is a good one. I know that if a pack of WCC (Waterloo Cycling Club) riders crowded you like that, they could get banned from the club and that means no pack training for races which no one who races is willing to risk.

Good luck

[ken cummings]

A lot of good ideas. I like the ideas of having a chat with the club leaders and riding just outside of her line. I do that myself when I am staying with a slower rider. If you get no sympathy from the club and they are a liceinced (USCF) club contact the State, Regional, or National offices and make a clear, well organized, and formal complaint. The wife and I are both Clydesdale sized and no one messes with us when we go out on our tandem.

[donnamb]

These are all good suggestions. I have a not-so-nice one: get one of those airhorns and use it when they get too close. Flippant suggestion: Get T-shirts made that say on the back "This is not a velodrome.". Wear them. My housemate and I are actually considering this.

[Brian Ratliff]

Jeez. Roadies get a lot of flack from this group. Just let them pass like they were any other traffic. If it is the street, they have just as much right to be there as you do, regardless of the speed they like to keep. Since they are the ones passing, just hold your line (you should shield your wife as well), and let them figure out a way to get past you.

Why all the angst? They're just out trying to have a good time and get some exercise, just as you are. With the some of the posts here calling roadies "arrogant;" why, its just the pot calling the kettle black. It's like some of you don't just want any bicycles to have the right to the road, you just want yourself to have the right to the road, other's be damned.

[fuerein]

Jeez. Roadies get a lot of flack from this group. Just let them pass like they were any other traffic. If it is the street, they have just as much right to be there as you do, regardless of the speed they like to keep. Since they are the ones passing, just hold your line (you should shield your wife as well), and let them figure out a way to get past you.

Why all the angst? They're just out trying to have a good time and get some exercise, just as you are. With the some of the posts here calling roadies "arrogant;" why, its just the pot calling the kettle black. It's like some of you don't just want any bicycles to have the right to the road, you just want yourself to have the right to the road, other's be damned.


I don't think the issue is as much them passing as it is them passing like it was an actual race, just inches apart from the slower riders. This IS a problem because frequently slower riders are not as confident on a bike as a person who has put the time on the bike to be able to ride competitively. Thus having a person pass with just inches between the two sets of handlebars becomes a little unerving for the less experienced cyclist.

[Brian Ratliff]

We have been forced to stop or divert our route every time. The lady is a complete novice and she is in training, learning to ride in traffic and still nervous about it. And although I have a lot more experience I must admit I'm stumped by this as I've never ridden in a large group and somehow never encountered one while riding. The one time we tried to stay on our course, the roadies began overtaking us the same way they ride in their group: 2" or less away from us and at double our speed. She gets spooked and gets the nervous wobble going and then I get really scared there's going to be a pile-up on both of us. We pulled out of the road and let them pass. I know they aren't intentionally intimidating but the difference in pace and their style of riding makes it so.

We all have a right to the road, blah blah. But, what's the etiquette for a scenario involving slowpokes with a group of high-speed roadies approaches from the rear? We don't want to stop or change routes whenever these folks come by. And I don't want to give the lady the impression that more bikes in a pack = greater rights of way. Please educate us on the proper way to co-exist on the streets so we don't wipe out 50 Atlanta area cyclists at once. Thanks!

The last post was not directed at you; it was directed at those folks who seem to dump on roadies. I get real tired of those haters who try to split the bicycling community into fragments. We all have the right to ride our bikes on the road; yes, even roadies.

The folks who make up road rides (I've been on a few) are generally nice, but they want to go fast. They know how to handle their bikes as well and they won't crash into anything unless it is unpredictable. So something that can help is to reassure your wife that they won't randomly crash into her and she doesn't have to dodge them coming up from behind. You can also simply ride beside and a little behind your wife as they are passing. This will shield her from the sensation of having to dodge cyclists coming up from the rear. Realize though, that this is all a sensation. They won't run into you as long as you stay predictable.

You can also try talking with them as they go past. Say hi and ask them to give you a little more room. They are not robots with a bicycle. As they go past, coast down to a slower speed to facilitate their passing, but don't grab your brakes and don't stop outright. Keep a steady speed and a straight line. It's the responsibility of the people coming up from behind to get around you. If you suddenly change speed by grabbing your brakes, then people coming up from behind will all of the sudden have to get around you much more quickly and might pass real close because they are not able to change their line so fast. If you are slowing quickly and stopping as they pass, this would explain their close passes within a few inches. You've gone from coming up on them at 10 mph to coming up on them at 20 mph. That's a big difference and will really affect their ability to get around you with sufficient space.

So, to summarize:

1) Reassure the wife that they will not indiscriminately crash into her and she doesn't have to get nervous as they pass. I know on the rides I'm on, our riders will emergency brake and cause the people behind to crash rather than crash into a rider not part of our group.

2) Shield your wife a bit for her comfort.

3) Coast to a somewhat slower speed but never grab your brakes or swerve sharply. Once you are at the slower speed, stay at that speed and keep a straight line so the riders can smoothly go around you.

4) Don't stop. Stopping involves using the brakes, which involves a sharp deceleration, which involves a panic swerve by riders coming up from behind, which involves you getting passed closely or being involved with or causing a pileup.

5) If they are being rude and you are doing the right thing by keeping a straight line at constant speed, feel free to talk with them right there or call or email their ride leader with a complaint.

Finally, a bit of understanding is in order. It is hard enough for a single cyclist or group of cyclists to share the road with cars. It is tougher for two cycling entities (themselves plus you and your wife) to share the road, turning a roadway meant for a car into a roadway for cars and essentially two lanes of bicycle traffic. Don't take this line that roadies are your enemies because they dare ride on the road in groups at 20+ mph. Understand that they are part of the traffic you are training your wife to deal with.

[-=£em in Pa=-]

Brian I respect a lot of the stuff you write so I dont want to be negative and
inflammatory or get into a prolonged "yes they are-no they arent" type debate
but the OP's description of marauding vikings totally supports the opinion I and
others also have come to in regards to this matter. Obviously it would be foolish to say this
is all roadies but in my opinion there are enuff to warrant the stereotype.
I WANT them on the road...more cyclists can only be better for everyone but by the same
token just as we wish for respect from cars we should expect it from our fellow cyclists.
The OP explains these guys habitually make his wife nervous and lessen the quality of
thier ride for a moment. Thats not an unwarranted dump on roadies, that is a real life
problem to these people. I always come across slower riders, some of them roadies, too.
When I decide to pass them I slow down and do so when I can afford to give them six feet, minimum.
My ride philosophy is to make sure I dont bother anyone or impede anyones forward motion in
any way. I think this should be shared by all people whether on bikes or in cars.

[Tom Stormcrowe]

Brian I respect a lot of the stuff you write so I dont want to be negative and
inflammatory or get into a prolonged "yes they are-no they arent" type debate
but the OP's description of marauding vikings totally supports the opinion I and
others also have come to in regards to this matter. Obviously it would be foolish to say this
is all roadies but in my opinion there are enuff to warrant the stereotype.
I WANT them on the road...more cyclists can only be better for everyone but by the same
token just as we wish for respect from cars we should expect it from our fellow cyclists.
The OP explains these guys habitually make his wife nervous and lessen the quality of
thier ride for a moment. Thats not an unwarranted dump on roadies, that is a real life
problem to these people. I always come across slower riders, some of them roadies, too.
When I decide to pass them I slow down and do so when I can afford to give them six feet, minimum.
My ride philosophy is to make sure I dont bother anyone or impede anyones forward motion in
any way. I think this should be shared by all people whether on bikes or in cars.
Lem, this ONLY applies to the roadies in my area, I can't comment on roadies, say, in San Francisco for example:
The roadies in my area generally either belong to the Wabash River Cycling Club or the Purdue Cycling Club.

The WRCC doesn't peloton, but does group rides and even the "A" rides, which are fast as hell, you DON'T pass close on a slower rider in such a way as to intimidate them. You don't go out with the club if this happens and you are called on it more than once!

The PCC is a bunch of college students and is an extremely safety concious bunch of riders. They do do the paceline thing, practicing for races. In April, 2005, I was just restarting riding, and was still using oxygen. I had overextended myself and was slowly slogging homebound with a strong head wind and several of thise "Vikings" sheathed their carbon fiber swords, left the paceline and provided me with a windbreak. They stayed with me all the way home. Because of this action, roadies will always have a fond place in my heart and you'll find that attitude, I suspect, extends beyond the local clubs in Lafayette, Indiana.

[-=£em in Pa=-]

^^^^ great post, Tom...!
I have to remember the Yin-Yan philosophy when I go off on a rant :o.
Bad stuff is always offset by good somewhere.......
Im glad they were there for you.
I am but a lowly utilitarian cyclist so I labor under the burdon of a huge chip
on my shoulder along with the usual rack mounted stuff :roflmao:

[Bikes-N-Drums]

but the OP's description of marauding vikings totally supports the opinion I and
others also have come to in regards to this matter. Obviously it would be foolish to say this
is all roadies but in my opinion there are enuff to warrant the stereotype.


I used the analogy to more to signify the size of the group rather than their demeanor, and that it was a little scary being ahead of these people. I am not predisposed against roadies in any way. I was one for years! I also said I knew they weren't trying to be intimidating. So I apologize if I inflamed anyone with an inappropriate analogy.

Thank you, everyone, for all the advice. The lady and I shall try growing a set of cajones for a change and safely hold our ground. I appreciate the responses greatly: as I said I've somehow never encountered a group like this in all my years of riding! Once again I apologize for upsetting anyone and thank everyone for the advice.

[San Rensho]

Today on the morning training ride/race (more of a race today, ouch), I remembered reading this post yesterday and made a consciuos effort to observe how close the group was passing slower moving cyclists, and on a couple of occassions, it was really close, too close.

When we approach slower riders, the finger point or "move over" signal starts from the front of the group and moves to the rear, so in general we are pretty safe and give slower riders room.

Not to generalize, but unfortunately, the group ride attracts a lot of racer boy wannabees and OCP's with $5k of gear and no legs who have no manners and/or skills.

So to the roadies out there, PLAY NICE! Cars already hate us, no need to alienate cyclists too.

[SamHouston]

2" clearance is fine for me and lots of people I know. It's no good for strangers because you don't know them or how predictable/stable they are. That the group ride believes in its collective ability doesn't give them the ability to prevent an accident caused by passing too closely.

Most car/motor drivers that pass cyclists too closely follow the same line of reasoning "I'm in complete control of myself and my actions, what could go wrong?"

It's no less flawed for the "competent" cyclist.

They should know not to pass you that closely, because they do not know you or your abilities personally. Say something to them or their ride leader next time.

edit- I do the shielding thing with my wife too, and she doesn't even need it really, just habit.

['nother]

Proper form is to get single file, on the right 1/3rd of the road if safe, and let them overtake as if they were a car.

Traffic is traffic....if they cannot figure out how to pass you, they are not skilled enough to be in a club ride. Even the novice club riders can figure out how to deal with slower riders as soon as they see the folks in the lead handle it.

So just treat them like you would a car coming up on you. Give them their due space under "sharing the road", and if they have any manners, they will overtake you in a manner that fits under sharing the road as well.

++, excellent advice cat. It would be very surprising if a group that large and that "fast" were unable to overtake you safely and efficiently; it happens all the time. By the time they get to you, they will have figured out that you're slower and would most likely have given hand signals to each other or said something like "riders up" to indicate that they're overtaking. Just continue riding along; it's their responsibility to pass you safely. Not that it gives you license to start bobbing and weaving randomly, but you should not be forced to change your route or stop what you're doing just because they're passing you.

[LCI_Brian]

In my area, a cyclist was "run over" by a club ride approaching from behind. Injuries were serious enough to warrant a hospital visit and extensive time off the bike. Last I heard the cyclist was suing the club responsible.

[I-Like-To-Bike]

In my area, a cyclist was "run over" by a club ride approaching from behind. Injuries were serious enough to warrant a hospital visit and extensive time off the bike. Last I heard the cyclist was suing the club responsible.
Happened in Philadelphia too several years ago on the West River Drive. The cycling club members ran down and knocked a woman cyclist down, left her in the street, without breaking cadence and kept going. She was helped by a cycle shop owner who was at the tail end of the group. Nobody from the offending cyclist group ever fessed up and the victim (who had to be admitted into a hospital) ended up suing the good samaritan because he was the only one who could be identified. Don't know the ultimate outcome of the suit.

[DnvrFox]

My wife loves bicycling, except the roadies who act like jerks. She is 68 yo and rides pretty slowly. We recently went on an organized ride. She loves talking to folks and doing her 15 mile ride and that feeling of accomplishment she gets from meeting her goal.

The route was such that roadies returning from the longer 42 and 30 mile rides joined the slower riders for the last 5 miles or so. So we are peddling along and here come the roadies, cutting in front of us, passing the slower folks closely on a narrow portion of the route. It may be safe for them, who knows? I don't know their skills. BUt it does not feel safe to my wife and others. Some of the "family" folks with kids (not us) ended up blocking the trail with their bikes so their kids could ride without the roadies cutting them off and blasting through.

There is a real cultural difference.

Now, I am a sort of "roadie" myself, in a way, I guess. I ride a road bike, and do some other "roadie-type" stuff. BUt I have enough common courtesy to know not to cut off a slower rider because of some need I might have to get somewhere one minute faster. I am also friendly to other folks, another trait that seems to be missing from many roadie types.

Perhaps totally separate routes would be in order? But that may be pretty hard (and expensive) for the ride sponsors to pull off.

[stonecrd]

In my area it really depends on the club. Most of the solo or family riders will ride in the bike lane while the clubs will take a single car lane or single file in the car lane if only two lanes are available. Most will signal and move left to avoid the slower rider giving plenty of room. However, on a couple of occasions that I have been out solo, staying in the bike lane, one particular club has overtaken me and passed on both the left and right. Now I am probably going about 20mph and getting passed by 30 people goin 27mph on both side is extremely unconfortable and irritates the hell out of me. Just pass on the left and all will be fine.

[Olebiker]

Jeez. Roadies get a lot of flack from this group. <snip>

Brian,

I am an old roadie and well past the years when I could do an A group ride. I used to love those fast paceline rides but, back in the old days (oh man, I'm turning into my father), if we were overtaking a slower group we would give them an "On your left" and pass them with at least two feet to spare.

Our local A and B riders come flashing past within inches without the courtesy of making sure we are aware of their presence. It's as if they think they are too cool to be polite and consider the safety of those of us who are not on a training ride/pseudo race.

[sggoodri]

What Galen said...and I have one additional tip. Move behind the lady and ride a litte further left than she is, like maybe 18". They'll have to go around you and it will leave her a little more space for her peace of mind.

As the overtaking riders, it is their responsibility to pass safely, but you can create a little extra cushion for the wife.

I second this technique. By riding just to the left and behind my family members or novices riding with me, I increase the passing distances they experience.

Riding farther left tends to reduce too-close passing by motorists, but has the potential to result in cyclists passing on the right. By staggering yourselves out from the right edge, passing on the right is impossible and close passes are less likely.

-Steve

[galen_52657]

Good advice Steve. I use the same technique when riding with my novice girlfriend. It works for cars so it will work for marauding bands of hooligan roadies.....

[LittleBigMan]

Although I ride alone, I occasionally pass another rider at high speed, such as downhill on my recumbent. When I do, I make sure I give lots of room so as not to spook anyone. I've had individual cyclists fly past me on the path, with inches to spare and no warning, when I was walking there, and let me tell you it can freak me out. It's just inconsiderate to cut it close.

[ghettocruiser]

As a frequent roadie myself, I have to say;

Passing that close to a novice in the middle of a pack is just an expensive, multi-rider pile-up in the making.

I don't get it.

[nova]

2" clearance is fine for me and lots of people I know. It's no good for strangers because you don't know them or how predictable/stable they are. That the group ride believes in its collective ability doesn't give them the ability to prevent an accident caused by passing too closely.

Most car/motor drivers that pass cyclists too closely follow the same line of reasoning "I'm in complete control of myself and my actions, what could go wrong?"

It's no less flawed for the "competent" cyclist.

They should know not to pass you that closely, because they do not know you or your abilities personally. Say something to them or their ride leader next time.

edit- I do the shielding thing with my wife too, and she doesn't even need it really, just habit.

I dont care to much about very close passes if i know your there and you are fully aware of me and act fully predictably. This goes for cars as well as bikes. Ive waved cars past me when they could in no way pass me with more than a foot or so of distance. I put my hand palm back watching for them to understand my meaning and then wave em by. Basically slow down and pass. Ive had many a friendly honk or wave as they pull ahead. Corse ive also had morons on bikes and in cars pass me closely with out me wanting them to and with no signla from them and them speeding up as they pass.

If you feel you need to pass me closly make sure i know your there and im ready for you to pass me closer than normal. Im fine with that just dont pass me when im not ready maybe i need to move left a bit to get around that pothole or grate that is comming up first.

[cudak888]

I'm quite curious as to whether the original poster, Bikes-N-Drums, has had any further encounters with this fast-riding group, and if so, how have the suggestions mentioned here worked out for him?

-Kurt

[The Octopus]

I ride in fast club rides, so here's that perspective:

--As soon as those of us at the front of the horde see slower traffic up the road (cyclists or pedestrians), there's an oral call that goes out: "Riders up! Pedestrian up!" along with the distance ahead to the traffic. This call gets repeated several times.

--As we're within a few hundred feet, the call continues and now the universal signal -- right hand behind back pointing left -- goes out to tell everyone behind us to start moving left. If there's overtaking traffic back (usually a car but potentially another group of riders) that message will be passed up the pack. If we can't get left because we're being overtaken, we're going to slow down, and that message will go out.

--As soon as we're within earshot of the riders being overtaken, the person at the head of the pack will yell out, "On your left!" or "Passing left!" It's important to give as much warning as possible so that the person being overtaken is prepared. Some riders react by swerving or braking, and we want to give them enough time to do that and to get back under control before we overtake them.

--We'll pass as far to the left as is safe and possible. Keep in mind that on a road with a center line, we're not going to cross it. I personally don't have a problem breaking the double-yellow if I have a clear look, but many, maybe even most, riders won't do this. So we're going to have to find a way to fit all these bikes into one lane of traffic. If the overtaken rider, for whatever reason, moves left to claim the lane, then that person is going to get passed very closely and may get passed on the right. Dangerous.

--If, because of safety reasons (going up a hill, riding on a narrow road, passing on a curve, passing a riders who look especially inexperiened, slow, or unsteady) there's not a lot of room to work with, we're going to slow down our group so that the speed differential isn't outrageous. Sometimes you can't avoid a pass in these situations. If it happens, we'll back off the gas.

As the overtaking traffic, ensuring a safe pass is our responsibility. We need to ride safely not only for ourselves, but for those we're passing. The traffic being overtaken, though, needs to ride predictably. Just keep your speed and line. All will be well.

All this communication may not sound feasible to some of you, or it may sound mamby-pamby to some hard-core roadies. It only takes being alert at all times and the communication plays out over just a few seconds. And if we have to slow at all, it's only for a few seconds. Over the course of a 47-mile ride (what we did last night in 2:10), a few seconds is meaningless to us. I can assure you that our group is plenty hard-core. We get the occasional pro to join us and just about everyone has a racing license. Being fast and being a jerk or unsafe don't go hand-in-hand, I'm proud to report.

Probably the best compliment I've ever received about my riding was earlier this year at the start of a group ride that I do every week. One of the women who regularly attends asked to speak to the group before we left the parking lot and she said that she just wanted to thank the "A" riders for their courtesy in passing the "C" group at last week's ride. She wanted to thank us for passing them safely and with a lot of room to spare. (Our group of about a dozen had gone by them, easily doubling their speed, up a steady incline.) It was a huge compliment. I've had RAAM finishers and pros draft me and compliment me on my riding, but this one comment made me feel better about my riding than any I've ever received.

Alright. Everyone get out there and ride togther safely!

[SamHouston]

I
All this communication may not sound feasible to some of you, or it may sound mamby-pamby to some hard-core roadies. !

Only if hard-core means self-worshipping newbie:D

[galen_52657]

Here is a cut-and-past quote from my post in the racing forum about last weekend's race. Pretty much echos what The Octopus is saying...

"On the backside of the course, they (the breadaway) just gave up after being out there for about 35 miles (can't say that I blame them!). With the pack back together, but now down to about 40 from the crash and attrition, we were doing about 35 around the far side when disaster was narrowly avoided. Rounding and easy bend, a car coming the opposite way had pulled over and stopped to let us by. An Amish horse-drawn buggy was going in our direction at about 10 MPH and the pack was doing over 30. The stopped car was taking 3/4 of a lane, the buggy 3/4 of a lane leaving about 5' down the middle for the pack and it was all going to come together at the same spot in the road. The moto tooted and held up his hand, the front guys brake and shouted back. Brakes were squealing and just as it was about time to really hit the binders, the Amish dude finds an open spot to the right and heals his horse and buggy over hard-right off the pavement, bouncing through a drainage ditch and into somebodies front yard!

The entire field said a heartfelt 'thank you' and waved to the Amish guy as we cycled by and got back up to racing speed."

[San Rensho]

Another suggestion. Before you pass someone, announce "on your left" or whatever, well before you come up on them, I would say 5-10 bike legnths behind, in a calm, normal voice.

On those rare (yeah, right) occassions when I get passed by other roadies, many wait until they are 1/2 a bike legnth behind me and scream, at the top of thier lungs, ON YOUR LEFT! I usually have heard them coming but on the rare occassion where they catch me by surprise it scares the bejesus out of me.

[sgtsmile]

I ride in fast club rides, so here's that perspective:

--As soon as those of us at the front of the horde see slower traffic up the road (cyclists or pedestrians), there's an oral call that goes out: "Riders up! Pedestrian up!" along with the distance ahead to the traffic. This call gets repeated several times.

--As we're within a few hundred feet, the call continues and now the universal signal -- right hand behind back pointing left -- goes out to tell everyone behind us to start moving left. If there's overtaking traffic back (usually a car but potentially another group of riders) that message will be passed up the pack. If we can't get left because we're being overtaken, we're going to slow down, and that message will go out.

--As soon as we're within earshot of the riders being overtaken, the person at the head of the pack will yell out, "On your left!" or "Passing left!" It's important to give as much warning as possible so that the person being overtaken is prepared. Some riders react by swerving or braking, and we want to give them enough time to do that and to get back under control before we overtake them.

--We'll pass as far to the left as is safe and possible. Keep in mind that on a road with a center line, we're not going to cross it. I personally don't have a problem breaking the double-yellow if I have a clear look, but many, maybe even most, riders won't do this. So we're going to have to find a way to fit all these bikes into one lane of traffic. If the overtaken rider, for whatever reason, moves left to claim the lane, then that person is going to get passed very closely and may get passed on the right. Dangerous.

--If, because of safety reasons (going up a hill, riding on a narrow road, passing on a curve, passing a riders who look especially inexperiened, slow, or unsteady) there's not a lot of room to work with, we're going to slow down our group so that the speed differential isn't outrageous. Sometimes you can't avoid a pass in these situations. If it happens, we'll back off the gas.

As the overtaking traffic, ensuring a safe pass is our responsibility. We need to ride safely not only for ourselves, but for those we're passing. The traffic being overtaken, though, needs to ride predictably. Just keep your speed and line. All will be well.

All this communication may not sound feasible to some of you, or it may sound mamby-pamby to some hard-core roadies. It only takes being alert at all times and the communication plays out over just a few seconds. And if we have to slow at all, it's only for a few seconds. Over the course of a 47-mile ride (what we did last night in 2:10), a few seconds is meaningless to us. I can assure you that our group is plenty hard-core. We get the occasional pro to join us and just about everyone has a racing license. Being fast and being a jerk or unsafe don't go hand-in-hand, I'm proud to report.

Probably the best compliment I've ever received about my riding was earlier this year at the start of a group ride that I do every week. One of the women who regularly attends asked to speak to the group before we left the parking lot and she said that she just wanted to thank the "A" riders for their courtesy in passing the "C" group at last week's ride. She wanted to thank us for passing them safely and with a lot of room to spare. (Our group of about a dozen had gone by them, easily doubling their speed, up a steady incline.) It was a huge compliment. I've had RAAM finishers and pros draft me and compliment me on my riding, but this one comment made me feel better about my riding than any I've ever received.

Alright. Everyone get out there and ride togther safely!


Fantastic:)