I am currently looking at doing some bicycle related projects. I need to build a bike trailer, and I've got lust for one of these: http://atomiczombie.com/product-wildkat.htm. I WILL build one But, I have no welder. A good friend gave me a copy of The "welders handbook" by Richard Finch and it looks like just about any type of welder will do what I want. I will mostly be working with mild steel tubing, either square or round. Nothing over 2" in diameter/width and nothing too thick. In some cases quite thin, really. I'm tempted to find an oxy/acetelene torch setup and learn to weld that way. The book makes it look pretty simple. But, I am on the cheap, and I don't think that's the cheapest way to go. I can't afford much. I have been looking at cheapo arc welders that run on 110v. The guy at atomiczombie.com says he uses 6013 rods in a cheap arc welder for all his projects, and they usually turn out quite nice from my eyes.
So, what's a guy on a small (<$100, hope and pray) to do? I'm hoping to find something used, and I won't be buying one of those harbor freight wire feed welders. I found out that the consumables (tips, etc) arent' available.
Thanks for any tips!
xfromx
07-01-06, 10:42 PM
You can use any kind of welder really but the only type i would recomend for someone with little to no welding experience would be a MIG. Arc would be the last on the list due to many reasons which would become more than obvious once you had tried to weld something thin-walled like a bike frame. In terms of budget options i don't think there are any other than brazing (using oxy acet), but you need the bottles (is still not a budget options if you don't have any). Why not go hire something for a weekend, will be the only way to get under $100.
Peterpan1
07-01-06, 11:19 PM
What I did was buy a 100 dollar 110 ac arc welder. That's a steepish learning curve for self instruction. At first I couldn't get an arc at all, and then a friend who could do a little arc welding came over and showed me how to strike an arc. With that confidence, I was able to do it also, and made a bunch of small projects. Would I want to take on an Atomic Zombie project with one. Not really. What this welder did was get me jazzed enough I bought a 1500 dollar arch TIG unit, and Moved on from there. THe one bad thing about my small welder other than the limitations of 110 ac, was that it took for eer to adjest the amps. I have to laboriously screw in and out this big stiff wheel. If I had had a spinable dial as mon my Maxstar, yeah, I think I could have done something with it. Probably not a lot more than 50 thou material in a single pass.
I gather our pal at AZ won the prize in his trade welding class. He is pushing the limits of his gear, and I don't really know how far I could take the same thing.
When I bought the maxstar, I sold the arc for what I had bought it for minus a few bills. I hope it has helped out the kid who bought it and he hasn't given up on it in disgust.
rykoala
07-01-06, 11:32 PM
Thank you VERY much, peterpan1. That is the most informative reply on the 3 forums I've posted this question on. You can't get better than first hand experience. Unfortunately, I'll never be able to afford even a $500 welder. I would have to save for a LONG time lol. I'd rather see what I could do with a cheap arc welder. I managed to find one online for $50! I don't know what shipping costs are though. But, I think it'll get me started. If I get really hooked, and get too disgusted with the arc, I might be motivated to spend more on one.
Again, thank you very VERY much for the reply.
Ryan
lyeinyoureye
07-02-06, 07:50 AM
Look for a gasless mig welder to get your hands dirty and learn with. From what I've gathered, the welds are dirty looking because flux core wire isn't as good as having an inert gas blanket the area to keep out air, but they're cheap (usually $50-100 on ebay and flux core wire's like $10 a spool) and provide a nice way to learn the basics cheap. Cheep, cheep. Then, like Peterpan1 said, you should get a nice TIG welder because it's hands down, one of the best welders available. It can do large and small jobs, all very neatly. The only bummer is that argon co$t$, but then again, so does oxygen/acetylene welding.
Peterpan1
07-02-06, 10:26 AM
Glad it helped, have you been to the AZ sight, we started a thread there and I tried to draw out Brad on how he does what he does with his 3/32 arc. Also the description in his book were the best I found.
I personally prefer the stick to MIG, thou I don't MIG, but with cheap arc you can control the process quite well while with cheap MIG the machine has pre-setting, and they maybe a killer on anythign out of th eordinary size wise.
The issue with the dial on my machine was that the amp adkjustment is critical to tuning your results and with my machine I woudn't have wanted to make one adjustment a sesion it was such a pain, with easier adjustment you have soemthing to work with.
For bike size stuff there are some pretty interesting small electrodes you can get that are easy strike, stainless, aluminum, etc...
rykoala
07-02-06, 07:47 PM
I checked out the thread at atomiczombie.com that you spoke of. I can't believe I hadn't read that already. It would've answered my question! Its been answered in another way too. I saw a friend of mine today, who I know has a welder. I asked him what kind he had and he answered "just a cheap 110v buzzbox. Wanna borrow it?". So, I have a welder I can use any time. Plus, another friend of mine works for Washoe County as head of the purchasing dept. He said there are quite a number of used welders just sitting there waiting to be auctioned off in October. I'm going to same some money and hopefully get an inexpensive mig machine.
Peterpan1
07-02-06, 10:54 PM
If they have TIG, hold out for that, much more useful. The only time I wish I had mig is when I am trying to cover some ground, but for careful piecing together TIG all the way. Anyway, you do what you have to do.
Also, I probably wouldn't bother buying a MIG unless I was planing on getting it hooked up to gas, which is expensive. I'd rather have arc if I am not running gas.
AC stick/arc is a little frustrating because the elctrode overheats really quickly when you are starting it up and it also is harder to scratch start without getting it fused to the thing you are welding. ac means that half the electricity is coming back at you (unless it has a dial that freaks with the wave, and it won't on a cheap welder). So for every unit of heat you put into the workpiece you put the same amount back in the electrode. The electrode seems to burn higher off the work. This actually helps you a little (though I prefer DC) because you aren't getting as much heat into the workpiece which you don't want in the thin tube. For really precise work I like to cut the 1/16" and 5/64" electrodes in half, and clean on end to have to short electrodes, they are too floppy as they come. Whether after a buzz or after cutting you need the coating right down to the end or the electrode just seizes.
The biggest hurdle is just getitng the thing to work, once you get to the point where you can run it you will improve your weld quality quickly.
1) If you can borrow a good helmet auto dark is easier to learn with, because you can see what you are doing before you strike the arc. Once you get with it, flip may be better for your eyes, or at least I close my eyes for a split second while it ramps up. Sure it's just a fraction of a second, but when you are learning you have a lot of on off cycles and your eyes feel it.
2) Arc is a fire waiting to happen, be careful
3) YOu might have someone in the area the first few times you do it. unless they have a hood they can't look at the arc, but if the unit you get turns out unsafe, having someone to pull the D could be a lifesaver.
4) Destruction test samples by bending to see how you welds hold up. Make Some coupons and cut them if you can. Like if you want to weld .035 tube, then get some sheet metal the same size and practice on it. Sure you have to practice your movements on actual tube, but practice penetration on stock you can easily disect.
Have fun. With the 110 I made a gas forge; security window bar sets for the workshop (good practice I had to scratch start the arc for every piece of the wire grating I welded to the frame. Some tool bases for things in the shop. By then I was hooked.