Commuting - Attaching Milk Crates

Hey guys,

I was wondering if any of you have some advice for sturdily attaching a milk crate to a rack while keeping it removable. Are bungees really sufficient for a load of groceries? I've also considered drilling a couple of holes in my rack and just using some bolts that I could hand-tighten. A guy at my bike shop suggested hose clamps, but I don't want to have to break out a screwdriver every time I get groceries. Panniers are definitely out of the question, unless you're feeling charitable. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

I don't strap anything with Bungees.... I use nylon straps and buckles (I picked them up at Walmart for less than $2) and velcro. The Nylon straps I picked up near the camping gear... don't remember where the velcro was, but I picked up a package that had like 10 12" lengths in it.

The buckles have quick releases on them, so putting stuff on and off is quick and easy.

I have one strap permanently attached to the rack, another permanently attached to the laptop backpack I use, and 2 extras I can use for securing extra stuff..

Also... I bought my grocery panniers for $35 at Dick's sporting goods... they're awesome for carrying stuff in, and fold flat when I'm not using them.

Define removable? Five minutes?

Depending upon the rack, I'd have a plate (or perhaps some large fender washers) inside the crate and some plates (or washers) underneath the rack. Pass bolts thru the assembly and use a wing nut.

Are bungees so bad? I have been using two bungees, pulled very tightly, to hold my milk crate on. This has worked for two months now. No problems and, very easy to remove and attach. I guess I am just asking for a spilled load or a metal hook through my calf. Should I swap these for something better?

*shrugs* I've heard some very bad stories about what happens when those bungees age...

If you inspect them regularly, you shouldn't have any issues... replace them if they look old.

Then again.... if you hit a big enough bump, is there a possibility of the hooks coming loose? If so, I'd ditch them.

Age... something my experience cannot address. Good point. I am sure nylon straps or bolts with wingnuts would last longer. I think I will replace my bungees with one of those when time takes its toll.

Avoid bungees like the plague...that's all I can say.

This dohickie (http://www.ortliebusa.com/cartgenie/prod-117.htm) + This thingamabob (http://www.ortliebusa.com/cartgenie/prodInfo.asp?pid=116&cid=2) will do the trick.





Yeah, I know I'm a fan of their stuff.
--A

For less than that price, he could pick up a pair of grocery panniers. Wouldn't that be easier?

For less than that price, he could pick up a pair of grocery panniers. Wouldn't that be easier?
Oh god yeah, more overall practical as well.

You could screw some small hardwood blocks underneath the crate to index the crate onto the rack. If you put a hook shape onto the blocks you could slot the crate onto the rack in a quick-release style and use wing nut thingy to stop it coming off.

This dohickie (http://www.ortliebusa.com/cartgenie/prod-117.htm) will do the trick.
Yeah, I know I'm a fan of their stuff.
It's a shame Ortlieb or some other distributer doesn't sell in North America the basket portrayed with the Ortlieb dohickie adapter. I have about 5 of these baskets I brought back from Germany where there are sold in various sizes and all fit on rear racks perfectly. There are loops on the bottom of the basket to hook on to the standard rear racks found on European commuting bikes. Zip ties are all that are needed to keep them from rattling. Bungee cords work as well. The large ones cost about $5 or $6 last time I bought them. Lighter and hold more than milk crates. For light loads, mouse trap rear racks don't even need zip ties to secure the basket. In addition the built in handle makes them very portable and handy shopping baskets for small items.

Kettler (http://www.kettlerdirect.com/) and Biria (http://www.biria.com/parts/baskets/) both do.
--A

Define removable? Five minutes?

Depending upon the rack, I'd have a plate (or perhaps some large fender washers) inside the crate and some plates (or washers) underneath the rack. Pass bolts thru the assembly and use a wing nut.


this is exactly how I attach mine. Two plates (about 6" x 1") with 1/4' threaded bolts and wing nuts w/ washers (locking washers are good). Put one in the base of the milk crate and the other under the rack, drop bolts through and put washers and wingnut on the underside (otherwise the bolts and wing nuts poke through your bags and make holes in back packs and bags). Just tighten as tight as you can and, if you're like me and carry a leatherman, you'll be able to cinch 'em down or undo them if they're a little more than finger tight. Total cost with found milk crate: about $3.

I can easily carry two very heavy grocery bags plus NY kryptonite Lock and cable in my milk crate and have never had a problem- just make sure you've got a substantial rack that it's attached to.

I use lash straps (2) to tie down a milk crate to my rear rack. I am able to snug them up really tight and the crate is attached to the bike very securely. It took a few minutes to figure out the best way for me to attach the crate, but now that I have it figured out, I can attach and remove the crate pretty quickly. Lash straps are readily available at any camping store (REI, EMS etc.) that sells hardcore backpacking equipment and are inexpensive. I paid about $1.50 per strap.

When I first attach the crate to my bike, it change the center of balance so much that it flipped me over (ok, it flipped the bike over, but I was attached to the bike and waiting to cross a major state highway. Needless to say, I ended up on my tail-end beside the road with several honking/waving motorists :D )

Hope this helps:)

I use lash straps (2) to tie down a milk crate to my rear rack. I am able to snug them up really tight and the crate is attached to the bike very securely. It took a few minutes to figure out the best way for me to attach the crate, but now that I have it figured out, I can attach and remove the crate pretty quickly. Lash straps are readily available at any camping store (REI, EMS etc.) that sells hardcore backpacking equipment and are inexpensive. I paid about $1.50 per strap.

When I first attach the crate to my bike, it change the center of balance so much that it flipped me over (ok, it flipped the bike over, but I was attached to the bike and waiting to cross a major state highway. Needless to say, I ended up on my tail-end beside the road with several honking/waving motorists :D )

Hope this helps:)

....

So... he's got a name for them. I call them 1" nylon straps with quick release buckles. :-p

Excellent. Thanks for all the advice. I think I'm going to give the bolts and plates method a shot for starters; we'll see how that goes.

As a follow-up question, do any of you have advice for biking with a high load (eg, groceries in a milk crate on rear rack)? I've never done so, and I'd like to avoid me2's fate. ;)

Keep weight on the front of the bike. Anything that would cause you to do a wheelie could likely cause you to flip.

I haven't had too much trouble, except when walking the bike, then there's a tendency for it to go everywhere.

Just slow down on turns... the bike will feel really wierd the first few times you do it.

Also, if you can strap something heavier to the side of the rack, rather than the top, it will ride a LOT better. Even if the weight is only on one side. I ride with a backpack on one side of the rack, with about 15 lbs of stuff in it. it's not bad at all.

Kettler (http://www.kettlerdirect.com/) and Biria (http://www.biria.com/parts/baskets/) both do.
--A
Thanks Allen. The Biria is close to what I'm looking for and certainly the closest to what I've got. That model on the Biria site is identical to the one that came with my German "Calvin" bike. Not a surprise since it was made by Biria. Switched it out for a more sturdy wire type I and put the metal mesh basket on a different daughter's bike who wasn't likely to carry heavy loads.

The blue Zero Seven has the Biria basket.
http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/7559/zeroseven14rc.th.jpg (http://img227.imageshack.us/my.php?image=zeroseven14rc.jpg) http://img52.imageshack.us/img52/3655/zeroseven36be.th.jpg (http://img52.imageshack.us/my.php?image=zeroseven36be.jpg)

I've used multiple (4-5) velcro straps to hold a crate on. Mind you, I have grocery panniers, and have only used the crate for short trips that I wanted to keep level (e.g. a birthday cake).

If you search the forums, there's been one or two people who have come up with plans for DIY bucket panniers.

As a follow-up question, do any of you have advice for biking with a high load (eg, groceries in a milk crate on rear rack)? I've never done so, and I'd like to avoid me2's fate.

Don't swing the bike back and forth. If you need to get out of the saddle try to move your body forward and bring you knees forward instead of to the sides. The motion is hard to describe but easy to figure out. Once you get used to the weight, you can realy zip though turns with the extra weight keeping the rear wheel firmly planted. (that statement is in need of a disclaimer: zipping through turns at a high rate of speed with a lot of weight over the rear wheel is inherently dangerous and can lead to a serious loss of skin, so do so at your own risk, and don't blame me if you crash :) )

Are bungees so bad?

If they get loose for any reason, can have a devastating effect on your wheel.

If they get loose for any reason, can have a devastating effect on your wheel.



Not to mention your health.

If they get loose for any reason, can have a devastating effect on your wheel.
Same for sticks or stones, shoelaces, panniers or things dangling from panniers, water bottles of pumps, or anything else on the bike if not used/mounted properly.

That's why bungees have hooks and tension.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out how to use 'em correctly or inspect for serviceability.

Same for sticks or stones, shoelaces, panniers or things dangling from panniers, water bottles of pumps, or anything else on the bike if not used/mounted properly.

That's why bungees have hooks and tension.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out how to use 'em correctly or inspect for serviceability.

+1, but I like the idea of using tie-downs better than bungees. Get some cheap cam-buckle tie-downs, they'll work just as well as bungees, and they won't rot. Also, if they snap in half, they'll just fall off, instead of rubberbanding into somewhere they shouldn't be.

+1, but I like the idea of using tie-downs better than bungees. Get some cheap cam-buckle tie-downs, they'll work just as well as bungees, and they won't rot. Also, if they snap in half, they'll just fall off, instead of rubberbanding into somewhere they shouldn't be.
True, a bungee (or a tie down ) that snaps/breaks apart could be a problem, but is one that seldom, if ever happens without showing obvious wear and tear long before any break. I have never experienced a bungee break apart from a hidden defect.

Any load up high will affect the balance of the bike. That said consider
these baskets that clampe to your rack and fold flat when not in use.

http://www.bikeworldusa.com/cgi-bin/quikstore.cgi?store=&search=yes&detail=yes&product=112&category=Baskets&keywords=&hits_seen=&page=search.html&and=&affiliate_id=

A much better solution to your needs while still leaving the top of the rack free for other use.

(P.S. this seller is a good person to buy from. I've found this seller to be honest in all that I've bought
from them. )

I use the same folding racks that Tightwad suggested, and like them. But I got them for $15 each at my LBS, rather than $18.

Any load up high will affect the balance of the bike.
Depends on how heavy the load, and how significant the affect on balance.

I had no problem with balance when biking the 6 miles from the WalMart with yesterday's load of 12 Litres of soda pop, with 2lbs of cheese, 5 rolls of film, and a loaf of bread in the white plastic bag. With my standard tool kit and cold beverages (for on the road refreshment) in the blue bag.

Click to enlarge

http://img111.imageshack.us/img111/1970/vaterlandshopper2jul065rp.th.jpg (http://img111.imageshack.us/my.php?image=vaterlandshopper2jul065rp.jpg)

http://img111.imageshack.us/img111/4262/vaterlandshopperjul066en.th.jpg (http://img111.imageshack.us/my.php?image=vaterlandshopperjul066en.jpg)


For larger shopping needs, I use the trailer/bike combo.
http://img486.imageshack.us/img486/8003/kynastbigrightsidewtrailer25fv.th.jpg (http://img486.imageshack.us/my.php?image=kynastbigrightsidewtrailer25fv.jpg)

http://home.mn.rr.com/goons/kids.jpg

My dr. thunder rides in WAY more style than yours...

I would want to file some notches in the bottom of the milk crate that match the rack it rests on. Once the notches are mated with the rack they will prevent any side slippage when the crate is bolted down. If you were considering stretch cords or straps so you could easily remove the crate, well gee just get standard panniers.

http://home.mn.rr.com/goons/kids.jpg

My dr. thunder rides in WAY more style than yours...
Yes you win in the style points but I can fix that.

Where are the helmets on those helpless passengers? I suspect soda pop abuse.
You drink soda pop from the evil empire? You foist it on others? I heard it might be inferior product bottled by underpaid wage slaves. I suspect abuse by soda pop. Where is my phone? :)

Staying with the grocery theme, what about "borrowing" a supermarket basket and attaching it to the rack? They are smaller/lower profile than a milk crate and have handles for easier removal. I may "research" this endeavor at the local grocery store this weekend.

I tend to overdo things; mine is attached by bolting piece of 1x4 lumber to the rack through the holes in the rack platform, then attaching to the 1x4 a square of quarter-inch perforated hardboard (pegboard), then resting the crate on the pegboard and holding it to the pegboard with zip ties. Very secure, very heavy.

One day I had a load in the crate and was mounting the bike by standing on the left leg and swinging the right leg over, as one normally would. But, the left foot was a bit too close to the bike, and the bike started tipping to the left, toward me. It pushed me to the left over my balance point. I couldn't catch myself with the right leg because it was up in the air over the bike, and I couldn't move my left leg because all my weight was on it, so I fell to the ground to the left, twisting my foot severely. I was limping for a couple weeks.

So now, when I mount my bike with that crate on it. I place my left foot out to the left a bit farther than normal so I can't fall that way, lock both hand brakes so the bike can't move forward or back, and then step over with the right leg.

I chose the milk crate for cargo because I thought nothing defined a "utility bike" better than the classic milk crate, and because I thought a milk crate might "dorkify" the bike enough to reduce the risk of theft. If I were starting over again making a commuter bike, I might not go for the crate because of how it raises the center of gravity. I like the idea of those folding baskets, although I never have used them.

How about making the milk crates into panniers? The college kids here use square buckets that they bolt hardware straps to (to hook over the rack) then a bunge to secure the bottem. I think it could be done with milk crates too. I like the buckets 'cause they are really durable and the center of gravity is lower then with a crate on top of the rack.

Wald baskets work great. I used to have some of the collapsible ones as pictured in a previous post.

These are huge.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Wald-535-Rear-Basket-18-x-7-5-x-12-Silver-101676_W0QQitemZ7208441723QQihZ015QQcategoryZ56198QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItem

I made a set off water proof panniers using hooks bolts and nuts from the hardware store and Kitty litter buckets. Since I buy the kitty litter anyway, my cost was less than $5 ea. You can put large items over the top of them (like a large package of toilet paper) with a bungee or strap. If you are firm about buying rather than making, check it out.... Cobb is the name I think...