I was not on the ride but what seems to have happened is this: A rider was attempting to cork an intersection when a man jumped out of a van and assaulted him. When another rider came to his aid, another man from the van assaulted him. Only when it started turning into a major street brawl did the two identify themselves as King County Sherrifs. They were under cover and in an unmarked van.
Links to more info and such:
Thread in a Seattle bike club's forum: Point 83 forum (http://www.point83.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2221)
Seattle Post Intelligencer: PI article (http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/276237_sheriff03.html)
The Stranger Blog: Blog (http://www.thestranger.com/blog/2006/07/critical_mass_attack.php)
The sherrif's side (http://www.thestranger.com/blog/2006/07/the_kc_sheriffs_side.php) which seems to be less fact than fiction per eye-witness accounts of people I know and trust.
Another article in The Stranger: http://www.thestranger.com/blog/2006/07/critical_mass_whose.php
marqueemoon
07-03-06, 03:39 PM
I was just ahead of this mess. Craziness.
twahl
07-03-06, 07:40 PM
Gee...illegally blocking an intersection got under someone's skin, and they happened to be a cop? 18 year old with beer in his possesion...etc.
Sounds like the cops may have been overzealous, but they didn't cause the problem, they reacted to it. Even the cyclists accounts sound like they were instigating trouble, then they act all indignant and shocked when they find it. I'm glad there aren't any CM rides where I live, I get to just ride around with traffic without having to deal with anyone that was pissed off by a bunch of bikes last Friday.
marcm
07-03-06, 07:53 PM
According to the witness account I read, it sounds to me like the plainclothes sheriff's deputies, in reacting to the problem (cyclists illegally corking an intersection), caused a problem of their own -- beating people up and provoking defensive violence. That's no way to enforce a law. Damn right I'd be indignant and shocked if I found one or two unidentified men beating up cyclists, even if the cyclists were breaking the law.
CM is whatever its participants make of it. In some places they actually observe the law and generally respect the motorists they encounter, sharing the road rather than hogging it.
Brian Ratliff
07-03-06, 09:56 PM
Perhaps the cyclists blocking traffic should have been ticketed; in the same fashion as a car which is in a long line backed up behind a light and blocking an intersection. But, as many of the other responses to the Stranger blog and other suggested, how is it right that a minor traffic infraction (which cars in rush hour traffic violate daily; I've seen this with my own eyes, intersections blocked up in all directions because a driver or two couldn't make it all the way across the intersection when the light turned) prompts a knuckle dragging, violent takedown of a traveling citizen?
The police, regardless if they identified themselves first, regardless if events unfolded as they told it or as other witnesses told it, were in the wrong because the arrest wasn't warrented for the infraction. Like it or not, antics aside, CM is part of traffic when they travel on the roads. They break minor laws to keep their group together, but they never threaten anybody. Read this! NOBODY IS THREATENED! The only problem anybody can possibly have with CM is at they are an inconvenience, and perhaps a little silly besides.
Reserve the knuckle dragging, violent takedowns for those criminals who actually threaten and hurt people and property. If a cyclist is blocking traffic, the police should calmly walk up with his badge clearly visible and with a calm demeanor, and with his ticket pad, and write a ticket on the spot. That is what they would do to a motorist who didn't clear an intersection and had to stop before the light changed, and that is what they should do for cyclists. It shouldn't matter, the laws should be the same, if there's a lot of cyclists or a single one, or if there is a lot of cars, or just one. In other words, it shouldn't make a single bit of difference whether it is a lone commuter on a bike, or a Critical Mass.
Perhaps a CM group should splinter into groups of 20 or so, and follow all traffic laws to a 'T', riding where ever they like. Break that group of 400 up into 20 groups and protest all the laws which pertain to cyclists in only that they are usually small in number. Like the "two abreast" rule in the city center. Why in the world should be have a law stating "two abreast" for a group of hundreds of cyclists (whether formally riding together or not, who's to say what their intentions are?) on the narrow roads of a city center? Drivers don't want the inconvenience? Give cyclists a road of their own!
bragi
07-03-06, 10:29 PM
I can't say anything about CM events elsewhere, but the recent one here in Seattle, during which "corking" was applied and a couple of cyclists arrested, was appallingly counter-productive and embarrassing. Irritating a lot of people who are trying to make a living just makes all cyclists, whether they took part in the event or not, look like a bunch of immature losers who don't have anything better to do than to mess up traffic, and makes it less likely that the people, e.g., city government, who are in a position to promote bicycle use, will be inclined to do so. The police were probably over-zealous, and over-reacted in the stupidest way imaginable, but they were not the cause of the incident. The whole idea of screwing up traffic to make a point is just idiotic. The net effect is to make the environment MORE hostile to bikes. The people who organize such events should be severely beaten with U-locks, and forced to move to Houston. (My apologies to those of you who live in Houston.)
filtersweep
07-03-06, 10:55 PM
I have never seen a CM that wasn't an exercise in lawless anarchy by bicylists. They are completely counter-productive. I have no issue with heavy handed tactics. If these riders cannot manage themselves (which they cannot), they will likely promote the passing of anti-bike laws and measures. Most of these "riders" are literally asking for trouble.
fthomas
07-04-06, 03:23 AM
Dear Sheriff Rahr:
It is disheartening to read about the possible inappropriate conduct on the part of two King County Deputies in making arrests at a Critcal Mass Bicycle demonstration. If a large group of witness' are correct the Deputies did not properly identify themselves.
None the less, does a traffic violation in Seattle or King County constitute the need for excessive force or would a ticket have sufficed?
Hopefully Sherif Rahr, you will investigate this thorougly and impartially and make your findings public.
Seattle Post Intlegencer reported:
"Treisman saw a man jump out of a van and grab his friend, and he tried to pull the man off. Neither Brien nor Treisman allegedly knew the man was a law enforcement officer. Treisman thought the man was an angry driver attacking his friend, said Charles Redell, a witness reached by phone on Sunday."
I, like many others world wide, learned about this incident via the internet. The cycling community at large is very interested in the King County Sheriff Departments handling of this incident and investigation of the facts.
As a former Aeromedical Evacuation Pilot serving the civillian community in Washington State for three years and a graduate of The University of Puget Sound, I am frankly shocked that this is the Seattle that I know and love. I personally had the opportunity to work with many fine professional law enforcements officers in Seattle and King County and this incident does not reflect on my past experiences.
Sincerely
F Thomas
slagjumper
07-06-06, 09:06 AM
The cops should be tested for 'roids.
catatonic
07-06-06, 09:54 AM
The cyclist corking should be ticketed, since they were obstructing legitimate traffic.
BUT.....the plainclothes cops who assaulted him (if they did not inform him he was under arrest, or to vacate the intersection, that they were police, etc) should be arrested for assault and battery. It is NOT a cop's job to attack people, it's their job to try to maintain order...big difference.
Bikepacker67
07-06-06, 09:54 AM
BUT.....the plainclothes cops who assaulted him (if they did not inform him he was under arrest, or to vacate the intersection, that they were police, etc) should be arrested for assault and battery. It is NOT a cop's job to attack people, it's their job to try to maintain order...big difference.
I've said it before, I'll say it again:
A healthy percentage of the folks that go into law enforcement have precisely the personality defects that should disallow them from positions of power (this also applies to politicians)
chipcom
07-06-06, 10:20 AM
I've said it before, I'll say it again:
A healthy percentage of the folks that go into law enforcement have precisely the personality defects that should disallow them from positions of power (this also applies to politicians)
Since I have experience in both politics and law enforcement, I couldn't agree more...I could be your poster child! :D
Bikepacker67
07-06-06, 11:10 AM
Since I have experience in both politics and law enforcement, I couldn't agree more...I could be your poster child! :D
Ahh c'mon Chipcom, the only personality defect I can see is your addiction to levity.
:D
chipcom
07-06-06, 11:15 AM
Ahh c'mon Chipcom, the only personality defect I can see is your addiction to levity.
:D
Yes, Alfred E Einstein was my hero and his theory of levity was...BRILLIANT!!
Roody
07-06-06, 03:51 PM
Has anybody heard of a motorist EVER being arrested (much less beaten) for delaying or impeding traffic in an intersection?
I didn't think so.
chromedome
07-06-06, 04:15 PM
According to the witness account I read, it sounds to me like the plainclothes sheriff's deputies, in reacting to the problem (cyclists illegally corking an intersection), caused a problem of their own -- beating people up and provoking defensive violence. That's no way to enforce a law. Damn right I'd be indignant and shocked if I found one or two unidentified men beating up cyclists, even if the cyclists were breaking the law.
CM is whatever its participants make of it. In some places they actually observe the law and generally respect the motorists they encounter, sharing the road rather than hogging it.
If I remember correctly, the original point of CM was to show how bikes can be a part of traffic, not take it over.
I agree with twahl, that, aside from the beating that those particular cyclists took from cops, should it be a surprize when drivers get ticked at cyclists, and remain ticked, when they can't get to where they want to go because of the behavior of some cyclists? And what if it was just Joe Average and his buddies that got out of a car and gave them the beating? Any more right or any more wrong?
randya
07-06-06, 04:36 PM
If I remember correctly, the original point of CM was to show how bikes can be a part of traffic, not take it over.
I agree with twahl, that, aside from the beating that those particular cyclists took from cops, should it be a surprize when drivers get ticked at cyclists, and remain ticked, when they can't get to where they want to go because of the behavior of some cyclists? And what if it was just Joe Average and his buddies that got out of a car and gave them the beating? Any more right or any more wrong?
We don't need apologists defending the motorists, thank you very much.
twahl
07-06-06, 04:39 PM
We don't need apologists defending the motorists, thank you very much.
Nor do we need apologists defending "cyclists" that go out of their way to piss motorists off, eh?
Roody
07-06-06, 04:53 PM
If I remember correctly, the original point of CM was to show how bikes can be a part of traffic, not take it over.
I agree with twahl, that, aside from the beating that those particular cyclists took from cops, should it be a surprize when drivers get ticked at cyclists, and remain ticked, when they can't get to where they want to go because of the behavior of some cyclists? And what if it was just Joe Average and his buddies that got out of a car and gave them the beating? Any more right or any more wrong?
Of course it is more wrong for a cop to beat somebody than for a citizen to beat somebody. The basic wrong is that both are needlessly harming a fellow human. The cop has committed two added wrongs. First, he has abused the authority and trust that citizens have placed in him, and second, he is undermining society's respect for legitimate authority.
randya
07-06-06, 05:16 PM
Nor do we need apologists defending "cyclists" that go out of their way to piss motorists off, eh?
But 'club' cyclists never piss motorists off.
:rolleyes:
chromedome
07-06-06, 08:29 PM
But 'club' cyclists never piss motorists off.
:rolleyes:
When club riders piss off drivers, its generally one at a time, and generally doesn't make the news, certainly not national news.
twahl
07-06-06, 09:17 PM
But 'club' cyclists never piss motorists off.
:rolleyes:
They don't go out of their way to piss drivers off. Actually our club, one of the largest in the country with well over 1000 scheduled rides per year, is having discussions as to what the best methods are to obstruct traffic as little as possible because disrupting traffic is hurtful to the peaceful coexistance of cyclists and other road users. Discussions are currently centered around what size groups are easiest for drivers to pass safely.
I don't recall ever seeing any such discussion on any forum that advocates CM.
Roody
07-07-06, 12:21 PM
Obviously the purposes of CM and club rides are very different. However, the efects on car traffic are often similar, and I think, not undesirable. Cars slowing down for bikes is a good thing. It should happen every day.
HardyWeinberg
07-07-06, 01:11 PM
This is becoming a King County Sheriff vs Seattle PD issue in the local papers:
As far as the Critical Mass participants using 'corking' techniques to keep their group together, this is routine with large groups. The police regularly block off intersections for funeral processions.
Recently they blocked of the ENTIRE street in front of our business for over 30 minutes. The street was blocked off for about 4 miles.
There's very little actual evidence to go on in the stories, but from eye witness accounts, it does seem that the police over reacted and failed to announce themselves.
We'll have to keep an eye on it and see how things play out... my guess is that they'll settle, and the defendents will get fairly minor charges for blocking the intersection.
I still have SOME faith in courts, it will probably work out in the end.
HardyWeinberg
07-07-06, 02:53 PM
Does the Sheriff's dept turn their reports over to the same prosecutor the SPD would for determining the final charges?
fthomas
07-07-06, 05:01 PM
This is becoming a King County Sheriff vs Seattle PD issue in the local papers:
This is a great cartoon! Hope Deputy Chennick that I received a response from (see my email above). His response was short and to the point. Which point, I'm not sure, but let's just say that he was a bit biased against the cyclist. Below is the response:
-----Original Message-----
>From: "Urquhart, John" <John.Urquhart@METROKC.GOV>
>Sent: Jul 5, 2006 7:53 AM
>To: f_thomas@mindspring.com
>Subject: RE: 2 bicyclists arrested at Critical Mass get out of jail
>
>Sir:
>
>Sometimes a simple citation or even a verbal warning is all that is
>needed to rectify a situation. However there are many things to
>consider. Things change when violators run off and when Deputies get
>assaulted.
>
>Deputy Rodney Chinnick for
>Sgt. John Urquhart
>Sheriff's Office Administration
>King County Sheriff's Office
>(206) 296-7528
marqueemoon
07-07-06, 05:42 PM
From one of the guys arrested:
"I think that there are some people who apply for jobs in police work in order to live out an adolescent fantasy of legitemized (sic) violence, but that the vast majority who make it through the process and are actually given a badge are there because they honestly want to help people. Last week I met three of the former and many of the latter."
I think that Critical Mass should be planning a Century and not tiring to make a forced statement. Blocking all lanes across a bridge? That’s being an antagonist. Yeah, the local cops were out of line, but Critical Mass has put them selves ALMOST in a class with KKK.
My Two Cents.
marqueemoon
07-07-06, 07:17 PM
I think that Critical Mass should be planning a Century and not tiring to make a forced statement. Blocking all lanes across a bridge? That’s being an antagonist. Yeah, the local cops were out of line, but Critical Mass has put them selves ALMOST in a class with KKK.
My Two Cents.
Funny. Drivers tend to take being stuck in "traffic" (as in other cars) in stride. If Critical Mass has a point, that's it. We are traffic. Is everything that CM riders do legal? No. Is it "nice"? Not always. Do you have to agree with it? Of course not.
What I find hilarious about some of the posts in this thread are claims like "traffic was backed up for 4 miles". Well... At what point are the cars really stuck behind the bicyclists versus being stuck behind other cars? Alternate routes are usually available, and if you can't see over the huge SUV in front of you to see the cyclists up ahead that's not CM's problem. CM is not about making nice and playing by the rules, but if an ambulance pulls up behind us with the sirens on, we're gonna move.
Critical Mass is not an organization. The only "plan" is the meeting place and time. Some of us ride centuries and some don't and have no interest in doing so. I have seen at least as much idiotic and illegal cycling on organized club rides as I have seen in Critical Mass, and besides you do not have to be riding a century to have a right to ride on public roads.
I participate in plenty of "legitimate" cycling activites and the other 29 days of the month I obey the rules of the road more than most drivers do. I have accepted that running a red light or blocking traffic (for the safety of other riders) during CM is breaking the law, and that if the police choose to charge me for it I will have to deal with the consequences. That does not make me a terrorist or a quasi-KKK member. It's a violation of traffic law. Nobody deserves to be beaten up for that.
People who claim that CM hurts the "cause" have never been able to explain to me what the "cause" is or why I should care. If Seattle Critical Mass were consistently violent or destructive I would not do it. I really hope this incident does not bring out the worst in CM's participants this month, and if it does I'm peeling off and riding away. For me personally it's about asserting my right to ride on these street, not provoking confrontations.
chromedome
07-07-06, 10:24 PM
The problem with alternate routes being available in Seattle is that often they are not. I-5 was designed in the early sixties and built just after that. What was the population using the freeway then? Less than half of what it is now. Are there twice as many lanes for travel north/south now as then? One lane, each way. That's it. But there has been a Birke-Gilman trail in place for bikes for what, 20 years? A bike trail across I-90 for bikes all the way to the central district. The Interurban is being put in, piece by piece, to eventually link Everett with Seattle. There's bike lanes all over town. Bikes can use those, surface streets, trails, residential streets to get to where they need to go. The cars quite often have fewer options available to them. If they're stuck in a jam, where do they go? Inch forward.
With Seattle's/King County's/Washngton State's reluctance to create any sort of realistic rapid transit system, people continue to rely on their cars.
Of all the things that a person, or a population, can protest about--especially when it leads to violence--is a person's right to cycle on a public thoroughfare really one of them? Maybe some of the rally avid participants of Critical Masses anywhere could petition state agencies (DMVs) to include questions concerning right of ways related to cyclists on driver's license exams, part of driver's training, etc. CMs aren't really proactionary, nor are they reactionary. They're just a pain in the butt for everybody, and that's not a good diplomacy tool.
CommuterRun
07-08-06, 05:10 AM
While the reported actions taken by King County sheriff's deputies were out of line and deplorable, incidents like this and tactics such as corking only reinforce my belief that CM is the antithesis to effective cycling advocacy.
Bikepacker67
07-08-06, 11:08 AM
The Three Lil' Pigs:
Koby Hamill
Roland Gervacio
Scott McDonald
RobertHurst
07-08-06, 11:49 AM
For me personally it's about asserting my right to ride on these street, not provoking confrontations.
Why do you choose a deliberately confrontational form of expression if it's not about provoking confrontation? Doesn't make sense.
If all you want to do is assert your right to ride the streets, then you can do that anytime you want. Simply go for a ride. Ride down to the store or something, get a bagel. Do it with style. Show everybody how easy and fun it already is. Show people how well adapted bicycles already are for traveling through crowded cities. Why push the notion that cyclists are like some horribly oppressed minority group, that cycling in traffic is a massive pain in the ass for everyone, when it obviously is not the case.
As a cyclist in America you already enjoy more freedom than any other class of road user. As a cyclist in Seattle you already benefit from a much higher level of consideration from drivers than cyclists almost anywhere else in the country. Seattle cyclists should be holding a thank-you parade for the city's abnormally deferential and calm drivers, not protesting them. Go spend a few weeks in Houston, Detroit, Tampa, or almost anywhere else for that matter, then see how you feel about riding in Seattle.
If you want to protest something, protest the idiotic mandatory helmet law which I believe is still in effect there. Instead I see in the pictures all the CMers duly strapped into their mind buckets while getting manhandled and sat on by the cops. The kids are backwards. I find it a sad spectacle.
Robert
HardyWeinberg
07-08-06, 02:10 PM
More local coverage:
King County's highest elected official said Friday the seemingly heavy-handed response by undercover county sheriff's deputies against bicyclists demonstrating through downtown Seattle eight days ago left him baffled and wondering, "Why'd you do that?"
"I wasn't wild about it," County Executive Ron Sims said of his reaction to learning of the arrests of two riders during a recent "Critical Mass" bicycle rally. "I did not see this as a transit-related function. I didn't.
...
Sims added that several months ago, he and his wife were in his car when the Critical Mass rally zoomed past, blocking street access.
"I turned off my car. I talked to my wife," he said. "We waited, let it roll by. It was cool."
"I mean, hey, demonstrations are a part of Seattle," Sims said. "They really are. These things happen here. They might annoy you, but you learn to deal with it."
If it's any consolation to Zachary Treisman, the widely run photo of him being arrested face down on the ground is actually very becoming.
Let's just say his backside is most definitely that of a healthy athlete. The King County sheriff's deputies involved might benefit from a bike ride once in a while.
Unless something has changed in the last two years, helmuts are not mandatory on cyclists within the city limits of Seattle, but are in King County. The Washington Driver Guide doesn't say, just that they are recommended.
cheg
07-08-06, 10:44 PM
From the Seattle city website:
Bicycle Helmet Regulation
As of August 17, 2003 the King County Helmet Regulation mandates:
Helmet use by persons of all ages in all parts of the County, including the City of Seattle.
Helmets meet current U.S. Consumer Product Safety Commission (CPSC) or Snell safety standards.
Helmets be fastened while riding.
An infraction carries a $30 penalty. Courts have the discretion to waive the ticket for a first-time violator who can show proof of purchase of a helmet.
chromedome
07-08-06, 10:50 PM
OK, thank you very much. It has changed!
donnamb
07-09-06, 02:06 PM
This is becoming a King County Sheriff vs Seattle PD issue in the local papers:
I think this issue of police jurisdiction and cultural differences among the 2 forces is a salient point in this particular Critical Mass incident. From everything I could find to read and from what my non-cyclist Seattle friends have told me, there is a major problem in Seattle right now with King County Sherriff deputies running amok in Seattle proper and this Critical Mass is just another drop in the bucket.
The Metro transit police are under the jurisdition of the King County Sherrif. Until recently, the shifts were generally taken by off-duty Seattle police officers. That has mostly stopped and the shifts are now being taken by Sherriff deputies. The Seattle police are given much more training in crowd control, handling mass demonstrations, and dealing with the "downtown scene" more peacefully than the Sherriff deputies. The deputies have very different policing standards. Since the deputies have taken over most of the transit policing within the city, citizen complaints have skyrocketed. A great deal of these complaints have been sustained and apparently one spurred an FBI investigation. Deputies have done things like conduct an undercover drug bust in the city without notifying the Seattle Police until the last minute. In short, you have a group of law enforcement personnel who don't have the same training or awareness of the local culture enforcing laws in an entirely different spirit than the larger police force around them. Naturally, you're going to have problems. Of course, who does the public feel resentment towards as a result? The city police, because that's who are the most visible. It sounds like the Chief and the high-ranking officers are understandably annoyed. They're the ones that get the flak, and they have little control over what the Sherriff deputies do in the city.
It sounds like the Seattle Police have an effective, workable community policing policy towards Critical Mass - as long as they're not doing anything beyond traffic infractions, leave them alone and they'll be done with their ride that much faster. It seems like this has worked out for their community. These 2 Sherriff deputies either didn't know that or didn't care. No matter what your opinion of Critical Mass, or of corking, or of why they're out there, the Seattle Police have a way to peacefully coexist with Critical Mass. They have found something that works for them - except when a group of law enforcement personnel who they have no authority over decides to blow that harmony out of the water.
I certainly hope that that the Critical Mass riders in Seattle remember the difference between the 2 police forces on future rides. It would be very sad to see the Seattle Police change their policy towards Critical Mass because of some hotheaded riders who are too stupid to figure out that they're not all the same.
trackhub
07-10-06, 05:37 AM
The position of county sheriff is an elected office, yes? Wouldn't it be funny if the present sheriff ended up running against a cyclist, the next time the office is up for election? And wouldn't it be funny if some of the "bad apples" ended up with a cyclist as their boss?
Just a thought....
chromedome
07-10-06, 09:43 AM
The position of county sheriff is an elected office, yes? Wouldn't it be funny if the present sheriff ended up running against a cyclist, the next time the office is up for election? And wouldn't it be funny if some of the "bad apples" ended up with a cyclist as their boss?
Just a thought....
You are certainly welcome to come here and run for office.
HardyWeinberg
07-10-06, 09:54 AM
I like the idea of putting those deputies on bike patrol.
donnamb
07-10-06, 11:21 AM
The position of county sheriff is an elected office, yes? Wouldn't it be funny if the present sheriff ended up running against a cyclist, the next time the office is up for election? And wouldn't it be funny if some of the "bad apples" ended up with a cyclist as their boss?
Just a thought....
That's not so far fetched. The Portland metropolitan area has quite a few elected officials who consider themselves cyclists and make an effort to reach out to their constituency who ride. In general, people in the Pacific Northwest tend to engage in outdoor activities fairly heavily.
While I'm sure that Seattle area cyclists would certainly like a sherriff who is a cyclist, perhaps the most important characteristic in a new sherriff should be a willingness to take on the enormous and landmine-fraught task of changing the internal culture of the rank-and-file deputies. It sounds like it's not so much their attitude towards CM or cyclists as it is their inability/unwillingness to handle crowds, demonstrations, & generally weird downtown life in the laid-back manner that is something of a cultural norm in the Pacific Northwest.
Bekologist
07-10-06, 11:31 AM
...King county executive Ron Sims was in Gregg's Greenlake Cycle a few weeks ago picking out a new Specialized 'go fast' bike, i think it was a Sirrus. I talked to him a little bit about cycling becomming an increasingly popular mode of transportation around King County, and the bike accomodations in the suburbs of king county.
Heck, maybe Metro is losing money as more people start bicycling. what if the king county metro baconboys were using a little 'strongarm' tactics to increase bus ridership by scaring bicyclists?
oscaregg
07-10-06, 01:20 PM
I read an article in the Seattle P.I. on Friday and it was more about the metro police vs. county mounties dispute! Cops will be cops, I guess.
trackhub
07-10-06, 05:49 PM
You are certainly welcome to come here and run for office.
Why thank you! Can I count on your vote? :D
Ziemas
07-11-06, 01:24 AM
I can't say anything about CM events elsewhere, but the recent one here in Seattle, during which "corking" was applied and a couple of cyclists arrested, was appallingly counter-productive and embarrassing. Irritating a lot of people who are trying to make a living just makes all cyclists, whether they took part in the event or not, look like a bunch of immature losers who don't have anything better to do than to mess up traffic, and makes it less likely that the people, e.g., city government, who are in a position to promote bicycle use, will be inclined to do so. The police were probably over-zealous, and over-reacted in the stupidest way imaginable, but they were not the cause of the incident. The whole idea of screwing up traffic to make a point is just idiotic. The net effect is to make the environment MORE hostile to bikes. The people who organize such events should be severely beaten with U-locks, and forced to move to Houston. (My apologies to those of you who live in Houston.)
+1
randya
07-11-06, 01:23 PM
They don't go out of their way to piss drivers off. Actually our club, one of the largest in the country with well over 1000 scheduled rides per year, is having discussions as to what the best methods are to obstruct traffic as little as possible because disrupting traffic is hurtful to the peaceful coexistance of cyclists and other road users. Discussions are currently centered around what size groups are easiest for drivers to pass safely.
I don't recall ever seeing any such discussion on any forum that advocates CM.
After two plus years of escalating police violence on Critical Mass rides in Portland, a new mayor was finally elected, participated in the ride, and sent his traffic division commander to negotiate with Critical Mass riders to deescalate the violence. "I don't know what the big deal is, it's just a bike ride" was the mayor's quote at the time. Now, there are open monthly meetings, and the cops have parked their motorcycles and accompany Critical Mass on bicycles instead (although IMO there is not a necessity for any cops on the ride.). The rides are also quite legal now, obeying all traffic control devices and the accompanying officers.
My original point was simply that Critical Mass is no more or less legitimate an activity than any club ride which uses public streets and infrastructure.
donnamb
07-11-06, 09:01 PM
the cops have parked their motorcycles and accompany Critical Mass on bicycles instead (although IMO there is not a necessity for any cops on the ride.). The rides are also quite legal now, obeying all traffic control devices and the accompanying officers.
I don't go on the CM rides, but I'm downtown where they begin just about every month. I've seen the cops go by and I have a strong suspicion that they are actually enjoying the ride. ;) I think Portland CM is stuck with them for more than one reason.
chromedome
07-12-06, 12:04 AM
Why thank you! Can I count on your vote? :D
I need to listen to your platform.