General Cycling Discussion - History of Bicycles and Religion - part 1-8

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Cadillac
02-15-03, 11:13 PM
When the English poet Thomas Gray sat in the churchyard at Stoke Poges, four miles south of Windsor, and searched for the opening lines of his famous "Elegy," it is doubtful whether he let his eyes wander to the stained-glass window above his head. Had he done so he would have seen, among the colored lozenges, a male figure astride an awkward contraption consisting of a saddle connecting two cumbersome wheels.

The window dates from 1642. Two and a half centuries later the machine the glazier had outlined was to be denounced as the invention of Satan himself, at best a snare for the weak and willful, at worst an engine for human destruction. On a Sunday morning in 1896 a Baltimore preacher thundered from his pulpit:
"These bladder-wheeled bicycles are diabolical devices of the demon of darkness. They are contrivances to trap the feet of the unwary and skin the nose of the innocent. They are full of guile and deceit. When you think you have broken one to ride and subdued its wild and Satanic nature, behold it bucketh you off in the road and teareth a great hole in your pants. Look not on the bike when it bloweth upon its wheels, for at last it bucketh like a bronco and hurteth like thunder. Who has skinned legs? Who has a bloody nose? Who has ripped breeches? They that dally long with the bicycle" (Minneapolis Tribune, Jan. 11, 1896).

The preacher was not alone: the bicycle was once regarded as sheer evil by many of America's men of God. They assaulted the machine from pulpits, they swatted it with newspaper columns, and they swooped down on it with street corner sermons. It was altogether a strange attitude.

PART TWO TOMORROW


Raiyn
02-16-03, 02:02 AM
It's sad to see how far we haven't come in the last 107 years.

uciflylow
02-16-03, 02:21 AM
HaHaHa!:D I know lot's of folks who feel the same way about bikes today!:eek:

I hope I don't see that pretty blue dodge dakota those punk teens threw a bottle at me from in the parking lot, it may get scratched!:rolleyes:


RegularGuy
02-16-03, 06:28 AM
Hey, Caddy, cite your source. Robert A. Smith would appreciate the credit, I'm sure.

D*Alex
02-16-03, 07:44 AM
I'm sure that the type of bicycle which the preacher referred to was likely one of the "standard" bicycles of the period (often called a "penny-farthing"). Considering just how difficult these things were to ride, I might actually agree with him.............

Cadillac
02-16-03, 08:34 AM
Whoops, I had intended to include the author in part one, but missed it when I transferred the data. I think I got it this time:blush:


In 1896 not the least of the institutions that had been affected by the cycle was the American church, especially in the small towns and villages where formerly there had been little to do on Sundays except go to listen to the preacher.

The bicycle changed all that, and God's House, as an institution, was in deep trouble. "The churches," wrote J. B. Bishop, editorial writer for the New York Evening Post, "are fast losing their young people and efforts to call them back by appeals to their sense of Christian duty [J. B. Bishop, "Social and Economic Influence of the Bicycle," Forum, Aug, 1896, pp. 680-89.] were falling on deaf ears. Nor were the threats of eternal damnation having any better effect. A generation later, ministers condemned the motor car for having a deleterious influence on church going because it became popular to take a Sunday drive; but long before such recreation became an institution in American life the bicycle had set the example. It was the first big-scale assault of American technology on institutionalized religion.

Smith, Robert A. A Social History of the Bicycle. New York: American Heritage Press, 1972.

Cadillac
02-16-03, 08:53 AM
Whoops,
I meant to include the author and reference to his excellent book

Smith, Robert A. A Social History of the Bicycle. New York: American Heritage Press, 1972.

Feldman
02-16-03, 09:19 AM
Wow! Good stuff about bicycles keeps coming out of the woodwork all the time!

easyrider
02-16-03, 09:20 AM
Originally posted by Cadillac


The preacher was not alone: the bicycle was once regarded as sheer evil by many of America's men of God. They assaulted the machine from pulpits, they swatted it with newspaper columns, and they swooped down on it with street corner sermons.



Has anything changed? Look at all the SUV's in church parking lots on a Sunday morning. They can't wait to run me off the road on their way home to that huge Sunday meal. :rolleyes:

greg360
02-16-03, 09:40 AM
Originally posted by easyrider
... Look at all the SUV's in church parking lots on a Sunday morning... :rolleyes: You mean I'm not the only one to notice that? ;)

cycletourist
02-16-03, 10:05 AM
Religion has been opposed to the advancement of human rights from the very beginning. Churches were against freeing the slaves. Churches were opposed to allowing women to own land. They were opposed to giving women the right to vote. Churches were opposed to rational dress for women.

And churches have been opposed to birth control in all of it's forms. But I think that is because churches are controlled by men and most men are secretly paranoid that "their" women might cheat on them and, even sillier, they are naive enough to believe that fear of pregnancy will keep women faithful to their husbands ;-)

hillyman
02-16-03, 10:12 AM
I thought Cycling was a religion:confused:

RegularGuy
02-16-03, 12:00 PM
Originally posted by hillyman
I thought Cycling was a religion:confused:

I met a nun on a week-long organized ride some years ago. She was wearing a t-shirt with a picture of the mass start of a bicycle race. The caption said "Sunday Mass." :D


Originally posted by cycletourist
Religion has been opposed to the advancement of human rights from the very beginning....

Cycletourist, I think your view is narrow and a bit harsh. Within the Church there has always been a diversity of opinions which can be categorized roughly as modernist/fundamentalist or liberal/conservative. Churches did not universally oppose the freeing of slaves. Denominations divided, as did the country, on the question of slavery. Most of the leading abolitionists spoke and acted out of religious conviction.

Keep in mind that both Gandhi and Martin Luther King, Jr. were relgious figures. Both of them acted out of their own religious traditions to advance human rights.

When the bicycle boom of the 1890s hit the American shores, it was greeted by the churches in the same way that every technological advance and social revolution has been greeted.

Some preachers welcomed the bicycle as a real step forward and praised its healthful benefits. Smith's book, which Cadillac quotes, cites some examples of such preaching.

I'm sure that some religionists simply ignored the bicycle craze.

Some religious folks spoke out against the bicycle and condemned it as a tool of Satan. In the 1890s, the bicycle threatened to undermine the moral fabric of society. It provided young men and women with a form of transportation that carried them away from the watchful eye of their chaperones and provided them with the opportunity for all sorts of mischief. It gave them an alternative to church attendance on a fair Sunday morning. Naturally some preachers felt threatened and spoke out against the supposed evils of the bicycle.

There were also some preachers who tried to capitalize on the bicycle fad. I used to have a copy of a Gospel tract from the 1890s which included a marvelous drawing of a bicycle. Its various parts were labeled as qualities of the Christian life. The crankset was "heart." the grips "faith" and "tenacity," etc. The text of the tract expanded on the analogy. Unfortunately, I wasn't able to find it when I went through my files just now.

At any rate, there was a wide variety of opinion in the churches concerning the bicycle in the 1890s.

RegularGuy
02-16-03, 12:06 PM
I thought I was done when I hit "send" but I guess I wasn't.


Originally posted by Cadillac
Whoops,
I meant to include the author and reference to his excellent book

Smith, Robert A. A Social History of the Bicycle. New York: American Heritage Press, 1972.

Thanks for the reference. I highly recommend this book (if one can find it!). I look forward to the next installment.


Originally posted by cycletourist
And churches have been opposed to birth control in all of it's forms. But I think that is because churches are controlled by men and most men are secretly paranoid that "their" women might cheat on them and, even sillier, they are naive enough to believe that fear of pregnancy will keep women faithful to their husbands ;-)

Once again you paint with too wide a brush. Some churches oppose birth control...not all churches. Even the Roman Catholic Church does not oppose birth control in all of its forms, only artificial methods of birth control. The rhythm method...though it is notoriously ineffective...is allowed in Catholic teaching.



Edited to fix formatting.

Cadillac
02-16-03, 12:20 PM
In the late nineteenth century the working week for most people was six days long, and recreation had to fall on Sunday. But the Sabbath had been set aside for the Lord's use, and a people strongly Calvinistic in orientation had developed strict ideas on what was allowable on Sundays. In most cases families attended church in the morning, went back home to a heavy, starch-filled meal at noon, and then sat around in a state of semi-stupefaction for the remainder of the day. Children were not supposed to play noisy games; and generally nobody was supposed to engage in anything but the most sedate activity.

And then the bicycle came and the Sabbath was defiled -- so some believed -- by crowds of cyclists slipping single file through the streets and along the roads. The worst thing was that they were riding during those hours when they should have been in church. That became the issue. The attack against the cycle as a threat to institutionalized religion really did not reach its peak until the safety bicycle made the sport a public affair.

But as the number of cyclists increased, filling the streets and roads on Sunday mornings, the outcry against the wheel mounted, Evangelists across the nation preached against the practice of cycling on the Lord's Day and followed with dire prophecies about the lack of future for those who failed to fulfil their religious responsibilities. A New Haven clergyman drew a terrifying picture of a long line of cyclists, all without brakes, rolling helplessly downhill to a "place where there is no mud on the streets because of the high temperatures" [Ibid., p. 689]. A colleague said all bicycle riders were in danger of going to hell and virtually certain to do so if they rode on the Sabbath. His sentiments were echoed around the country.

Smith, Robert A. A Social History of the Bicycle. New York: American Heritage Press, 1972.

Cadillac
02-16-03, 12:24 PM
In Chicago some members of the congregation of the Hope Baptist Church attacked the Reverend J. H. Messenger because he rode a bicycle on his pastoral calls. Rather than fight, the minister resigned, although the young people were on his side. In 1896, the Presbyterian Assembly of New York approved a resolution condemning cycling on Sundays. The New England Sabbath Protective League appealed to young people to avoid bicycle meets held on Sunday, events that were roundly condemned as both desecration and secularization of God's Day. In Chicago, the Reverend David Beeton contended that Sunday bicycle meets, parades, and races poisoned the very "lifeblood of American civilization" [Chicago Tribune June 17, 1895]

But the more bicycles the American public purchased, the more did the churches and their spokesmen tend to backpedal -- at least in the cities. In the summer of 1895 the Baptist Young People's Union met in Baltimore and conducted a Sunday bicycle parade! All very decently done, of course, with lead cycles flying the flag of Maryland and the blue and white flag of the Baptists.

Smith, Robert A. A Social History of the Bicycle. New York: American Heritage Press, 1972.

Cadillac
02-16-03, 12:35 PM
CycleTourist makes some interesting comments. As mentioned before, there are always bad apples within the box; but we don't throw out all the apples. Unfortunately, the bad apples seem to require our immediate attention.

Christianity freed women especially. Prior to 2000 years ago, it was required of young girls (age 10-14) to spend a minimum of two years as a temple prostitute. In Greece, for instance, if a woman was not selected for prostitution "duties," she was required to wait another couple years. If she never became involved in this ritual (as she grew older) she ended up as a hagia -- a "holy" woman. This is the Greek word from which we get our English word "hag."

It was the responsibility of people to engage in temple prostitution because the gods would look favorably upon the people who were fertilizing each other and respond by making the land fertile with good crops.

Christianity (and only Christianity) brought an end to that kind of lifestyle. Women can be thankful for it. If women today are still oppressed to some degree, they are much better off than the women of the past or women in some Muslim countries.

RegularGuy
02-16-03, 12:42 PM
Originally posted by Cadillac

Christianity (and only Christianity) brought an end to that kind of lifestyle.

Well....

Christianity began as a Jewish cult and grew in a Greek and Roman culture. Judaism never practiced temple prostitution. Christianity got its opposition to temple prostitution from Judaism. To say that only Christianity brought an end to that kind of lifestyle is a bit of an overstatment.

RegularGuy
02-16-03, 12:55 PM
Originally posted by D*Alex
I'm sure that the type of bicycle which the preacher referred to was likely one of the "standard" bicycles of the period (often called a "penny-farthing").

In 1896, the safety bicycle was well established. Those who still rode penny-farthings were the retrogrouches of the day.

Tree Trunk
02-16-03, 01:55 PM
Wow, we branch out bravely into religious discussion! This one could get nasty if we let it. Just reading through the replies I see so much diversity of belief that it actually makes me chuckle. I guess I chuckle a little because I attend a church that is "liberal" in most respects -- the arts are embraced, birth control is a non-issue, alcohol use (in moderation) is accepted, people aren't expected to dress in a certain fashion, and SUVs & bicycles coexist harmoniously in our parking lots. We have a good group of cyclists who ride together before Sunday morning services and even attend in our sweaty bike clothing after our ride.

It will be interesting to see what future generations will think when they look back at us. I'm certain there are plenty of things they will see as close minded.

Caio.

;)

Tree Trunk
02-16-03, 01:58 PM
It might serve anyone well to check out Focus on the Family (a Christian organization founded by Dr. James Dobson) and the rides they are sponsoring. One of Focus' main contributors even rode his bicycle cross country with his son-in-law. Times have changed!

Giant_racer
02-16-03, 02:24 PM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by RegularGuy
[B]. The rhythm method...though it is notoriously ineffective...is allowed in Catholic teaching.

Well it works for me!!!! (only joking)

I am totally against the pill!!! I will never ever touch it unless I want to die of thrombosis!! when a man takes the pill I might take it seriously

:rolleyes:


The rhythm method...though it is notoriously ineffective...is allowed in Catholic teaching

What about the notorious Magdalene homes in Ireland and Liverpool run by so called Roman Catholic Nuns for girls who got pregnant out of wedlock or who were considered to be a lost soul or just ophaned apparently the last home only closed in 1996!!!!!!!! I couldn't believe this!!!
:eek:
They flogged them to death, took them away from their parents, stole their childhoods and if they tried to escape then they would be taken right back!!! The hypocriticalness of it all!!! The church was supposed to be a haven yet devised torture regimes such as these!!!

iamlucky13
02-16-03, 02:27 PM
Hey guys, we're starting to go on a series of witch-hunts in this thread. Some people have raised some interesting points that are none the less off the original topic: religious views on cycling.

iamlucky13
02-16-03, 02:39 PM
This is an absolutely fascinating thread series. I might have to go find that book now. It would be even more interesting to read an updated version of it, given how much cycling has continued to diversify and grow over the last 30 years. Did the Tour de France even exist in 1972? I know that the Santa Cruz Bullit and the riding style that spawned it didn't. And certainly very, very few people now are opposed to bicycling respectfully.
Interestingly, it seems that the opposition was not to riding the bicycle, as much as it was to riding on Sunday, which was apparently the most conveniant time to do so. Interesting how much the interpretation of the Third Commandment has changed in barely a century of technological advancement.

RegularGuy
02-16-03, 02:57 PM
Originally posted by iamlucky13
This is an absolutely fascinating thread series. I might have to go find that book now. It would be even more interesting to read an updated version of it, given how much cycling has continued to diversify and grow over the last 30 years. Did the Tour de France even exist in 1972?

The first Tour de France was raced in 1903. This year's TdF will be the Centennial edition, thought not the 100th race.

Smith's book chronicles the Bicycle Boom in America in the 1890s. The last chapter touches on later developments, but is really a post-script to the book and beside the point.

The book was reissued under the title "Merry Wheels and Spokes of Steel" though I don't know the year, and have never seen that edition. The earlier edition was a good read. I have no doubt that the later edition was just as good.


Originally posted by iamlucky13
Interestingly, it seems that the opposition was not to riding the bicycle, as much as it was to riding on Sunday, which was apparently the most conveniant time to do so. Interesting how much the interpretation of the Third Commandment has changed in barely a century of technological advancement.

Within my own lifetime, I've seen the Sunday "Blue" Laws gradually done away with. It wasn't that long ago that one could not buy a car on a Sunday in many communities. It may still be illegal to buy alcohol on Sunday in some places.

joeprim
02-16-03, 03:12 PM
With a reccomendation like that from an orginization that I respect so much I'll run out and buy a couple of more bikes. It's no wounder it's so popular.
Joe
:beer:

joeprim
02-16-03, 03:17 PM
What is a safety bike? For that matter what is the something penny bike that came before it?
Joe

RegularGuy
02-16-03, 03:23 PM
The Penny-Farthing is the old fashioned high-wheeled bicycle which had pedals connected directly to the front wheel. The name derives from the fact that the front wheel was so much larger than the rear...as an English penny coin was larger than the farthing.

The safety bike, which sparked the bicycle boom of the 1890s, had two wheels of approximately the same size. It used a chain drive to create a gear ratio so that the huge front wheel was no longer necessary.

Joe Gardner
02-16-03, 03:27 PM
Joe, for images check this site: http://www.bicyclemuseum.com/Html/bike1.html

Cadillac
02-16-03, 05:05 PM
In Chicago, the same year that saw the Hope Baptist Church force its minister to resign, Jenkin Lloyd Jones preached that the bicycle was a good thing, spiritually and morally. Jones had created something of a sensation earlier by allowing cyclists in his congregation to check their bicycles in the church basement. Now he took an even more liberal position on Sunday cycling by saying that while the sport reduced church attendance, he felt that taking a ride through the countryside might put one in closer communion with God than just sitting in the sanctuary. Jones did issue the warning that a young man who "dons his jockey-cap, humps himself like a kangaroo and pumps away for dear life, apparently with no purpose in view except to see how quickly he can roll over fifty miles," was endangering his immortal soul. Evidently the Lord loved a cycler but abominated a scorcher. The Reverend Mr Jones then warned his congregation that "from this time on, if it is the church or the wheel one needs no prophetic eye to see which will win in thousands of lives. All Souls Church of Chicago would fain avert the conflict by becoming the 'church or the wheel'"[Ibid. July 17, 1896]. With such subversion in mind, Jones invited people to ride their cycles to Sunday services, saying the church would provide somebody to care for the machines.

Smith, Robert A. A Social History of the Bicycle. New York: American Heritage Press, 1972.

Cadillac
02-16-03, 05:07 PM
Other ministers likewise rushed to the defense of the bicycle. In New York City the Reverend John Shaw, completely unabashed by his church's condemnation of Sunday cycling, told his Presbyterians that cycling contributed to the spiritual good of the community. Not content with defying the Assembly, he put forth the astounding theological observation that religious agnosticism frequently had its origins in dyspepsia, for which the cycle was a sovereign cure. The Reverend Mr. Shaw proceeded to thank God for the bicycle and said he would canonize the inventor if he knew the man's name.

As a matter of fact, the Presbyterian clergyman was merely echoing a colleague, Madison Peters who had said the year before that cycling would defeat a sour stomach. However, Peters was less permissive and added that under the lights of Central Park "Jezebel spreads her nets and Delilah shears the locks of Samson" [New York Herald, June 24, 1895].

Aside from the condemnation of Jezebels, a chorus of approbation rose from many pulpits. One minister was downright rhapsodical when he described cycling. "How tranquil and happy! How self-poised and self-reliant, how harmonious with nature and art, the cyclist seems as he passes along the highway, street and boulevard, like a bird on the wings of the wind" [Chicago Tribune, June 24, 1895]. In New Jersey, the Reverend John Scudder told a congregation that included two hundred attentive wheelmen that the bicycle was a "revolutionist," the advance agent of heaven, since "it enables us to fly in this life before we get the traditional angelic wings" [New York Herald, June 17, 1895]. He also proposed that a Saturday half-holiday be established that could be used for recreation and so preserve the sanctity of Sunday. Very likely this is one of the few times such a radical proposal came from the pulpit.

Smith, Robert A. A Social History of the Bicycle. New York: American Heritage Press, 1972.

Cadillac
02-16-03, 05:09 PM
In some respects the apotheosis of the bicycle came when the Reverend E. S. Upford told his congregation in Brooklyn's Tabernacle Baptist Church that the machine was a "scientific angel, which seems to bear you on its unwearied pinions" [ibid., June 17, 1895]. He compared the earliest attempts to perfect the cycle with man's primitive state after having been driven from the Garden of Eden. The modern safety bicycle was symbolic of mankind's perfection and regeneration through Christ. The good man ended his sermon by calling on his congregation to be more like the bicycle -- willing to serve mankind. No wonder Brooklyn was a cycle hotbed.

There were those who argued that if the cyclists would not come to the church, the church should go to them. In the summer of 1896 a party of clergymen went along the Merrick Road and held open-air religious services in groves of trees, but few cyclists stopped to participate. Then in Brooklyn a few cycle-riding laymen discussed the building of a portable, lightweight church that could be set up here and there around the country-side, wherever the cyclists were riding at the time. The best location would be near the end of a twenty-mile run, because at that point the cyclists would be stopping to rest. A portable building was regarded with favor because cyclers did not always ride the same route on successive Sundays; they liked a change of scenery.

Tongue-in-cheek, the New York Tribune offered some suggestions of its own. Why not have a bicycle as the bishop's seat, dress the choirboys in knickerbockers and sweaters, and have the stained-glass windows show pedals, brakes, and saddles? The opening hymn could be an adaptation of Cardinal Newman's famous work.

"Wheel, Kindly Light, along life's cycle path,
Wheel Thou me on!
The road is rough, I have discerned Thy Wrath,
But wheel me on" [New York Tribune, July 28, 1895].

Obviously, concluded the paper, the congregation should be watched over by a preacher with wheels -- in his head. With such a reception as that, the portable cycling church never got off the drawing board.

Smith, Robert A. A Social History of the Bicycle. New York: American Heritage Press, 1972.

Cadillac
02-16-03, 05:11 PM
If surrender was the course chosen by the effete big-city parishes, the churches in small towns, the traditional strongholds of Jehovah, fought back. The Methodist Church of Camden, New Jersey, voted to expel any member who rode a bicycle on Sunday, although it must be said that the decision to do so split the congregation right down the middle. The losers publicly said that they would not abide by the vote. The issue seems to have been raised because members of the church had watched cyclists pour across the Schuylkill River from Philadelphia -- somewhere around ten thousand such invaders every Sunday. Not only did jangling bells and blaring horns disrupt services, but out on Whitehorse Pike men sold beer openly over the tailgates of their wagons. Townships that had been "dry" for a quarter of a century were invaded by beer wagons, and roadhouses ran wide open. The church struck back. Seven hundred members, so we are told, of the Epworth League were enlisted against Sunday cycling. Solemnly the young people stood, raised their right hands and swore, "I promise that I will not ride my wheel on the Sabbath, only as it will honor my Master, and as I believe He would like to have me do. I also promise to exert all possible influence to discourage others in the use of the Sunday wheel" [New York Herald, Aug. 3, 1897].

They had help. The Dunkards met in annual session in Covington,
Kentucky, and voted overwhelmingly to excommunicate all members who had their teeth filled with gold or who rode bicycles, a strange juxtaposition of sins.

Smith, Robert A. A Social History of the Bicycle. New York: American Heritage Press, 1972.

joeprim
02-16-03, 05:14 PM
Cadallic

Super series
Thanks
Joe
:beer:

Hawkphoto
02-16-03, 10:29 PM
Where the hell did you stumble across this information?
And, Why the hell did you stumble across this information?

trmcgeehan
02-17-03, 01:47 AM
Thanks, Cadillac, for a very informative series on bikes and religion. I ride my bike to church occasionally (14 miles round trip) when the weather is warmer. In a congregation of 1,000, I am the only one. And I thought I would start a trend! :(

Pat
02-17-03, 08:54 AM
Originally posted by cycletourist
Religion has been opposed to the advancement of human rights from the very beginning. Churches were against freeing the slaves. Churches were opposed to allowing women to own land. They were opposed to giving women the right to vote. Churches were opposed to rational dress for women.

And churches have been opposed to birth control in all of it's forms. But I think that is because churches are controlled by men and most men are secretly paranoid that "their" women might cheat on them and, even sillier, they are naive enough to believe that fear of pregnancy will keep women faithful to their husbands ;-)

Churches were against freeing the slaves? Saint Patrick was the first major figure in western civilization to oppose slavery. Saint Patrick had the benefit of sampling the joys of slavery first hand and discovered that it was not to his taste. You might want to read "How the Irish Saved Civilization" to find out how the monastic movement was a major force for progress in western europe.

As to churches opposing birth control, this is obviously a stretch. Now I am informed that opposition to certain kinds of birth control has been traditional in the Roman Catholic Church. But many other churches think that birth control is not only acceptable but downright prudent.

There are a potload of christian denominations and ranges of belief and practice that range from the sublime to the ridiculous and sometimes are both at once! Any generalizations will almost have to be in error.

Paul L.
02-17-03, 12:28 PM
Utah was one of the first states in the U.S. to give women the right to vote interestingly enough. There are an awful lot of churches in this world, and most of them are different in one way or another. It is very interesting to read the attitude of "some" of them to the bicycle. I try to ride my bike to church once in awhile as well (at least when it's not too hot)!

Pete Clark
02-17-03, 12:35 PM
Originally posted by Cadillac
... they swatted it with newspaper columns...
http://www.solanobicycleclassic.org/twain.htm

:roflmao:

trmcgeehan
02-18-03, 03:58 AM
I think we already covered this a few months ago, but what brand bike would Jesus ride? What was the consensus?

Paul L.
02-19-03, 08:20 AM
Perhaps the king of light would ride a lightspeed?

Inkwolf
02-19-03, 12:58 PM
I'm sure another reason that the churches disliked bicycles was that they made young women behave shamelessly....riding around without a chaperone, and some of them even wearing BLOOMERS!!! :D

Many people have made a convincing case that the bicycle was the deciding factor in the liberation of women.

Cadillac, I read that book last year, and loved it too! :) Doesn't it make you long for the days when the roads were full of bicycles, and they had their own slang terms and hung around badmouthing scorchers?

...and Jesus would have ridden a Huffy. Remember, he rode a donkey into town, a decidedly lower-class animal, as a sign of humility. A visiting king, on the other hand, would have arrived on a horse, or camel, or elephant, or carried on a litter or something. Definitely a rusty old Huffy....

Pete Clark
02-20-03, 09:34 AM
Frankly, I don't see any conflict between attendance at church and riding a bicycle. I do both of them quite effectively.

The same argument can be made for the conflict that sometimes arises between the passionate cyclist and a family that doesn't share his/her enthusiasm. Time spent on the bike alone means time spent away from family, if they don't ride along.

I get all the miles on the bike I could ever need just by using my bike as transportation. That's how I solved the time squeeze. If it takes me 35 minutes to get to work by car, I can cycle there in about an hour.

Frankly, I love cycling so much that I can see how easy it would be
to let it cut into quality time needed with family. That's where one just has to understand priorities, but there should be no confict if one is disciplined.

deliriou5
02-20-03, 09:50 AM
Originally posted by Cadillac
...and voted overwhelmingly to excommunicate all members who had their teeth filled with gold...

Interesting, considering that there are some Pentecostals out there who believe that God sometimes fill's believers' teeth with gold fillings.... ;)

Pete Clark
02-20-03, 10:41 AM
Originally posted by deliriou5
Interesting, considering that there are some Pentecostals out there who believe that God sometimes fill's believers' teeth with gold fillings.... ;)
I've never seen that.

But once during Communion, a good friend of mine who had been deaf in one ear all his life suddenly was able to hear and has never since lost it. I guess that's just about as improbable.

deliriou5
02-20-03, 10:53 AM
http://www.cesnur.org/testi/goXgold_01.htm